Copy Link
Add to Bookmark
Report
Netizens-Digest Volume 1 Number 184
Netizens-Digest Thursday, October 15 1998 Volume 01 : Number 184
Netizens Association Discussion List Digest
In this issue:
[netz] Re: Testimony submitted to Congressional subcommittee hearing on DNS
Re: [netz] Public or private for the future of the Internet?
Re: [netz] Public or private for the future of the Internet?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1998 14:36:38 -0700 (PDT)
From: gds@best.com (Greg Skinner)
Subject: [netz] Re: Testimony submitted to Congressional subcommittee hearing on DNS
In article <705kov$87v$1@apakabar.cc.columbia.edu>,
Ronda Hauben <rh120@columbia.edu> wrote:
>I am trying to understand why there is such a hush about
>this issue online. Why isn't there the needed debate and
>discussion?
There is a lot of discussion and debate on this issue on the IETF
mailing list, the domain-policy mailing list, the IFWP mailing list,
etc.
There is even a Yahoo directory dedicated to Domain Name Controversies.
>It's not as if the transfer of the *policy decisions*
>over what happens with allocation and cost for IP numbers,
>domain names, what happens with the root server system
>and the protocols is a matter that is to be taken lightly
>or to be unexamined. Yet the only folks talking about this
>that I have found in general are those with their hands
>outstretched for a piece of the public pie.
For most of them, at least, the Internet represents their livelihood;
ie., their ability to earn a living. Thus, their interest in the
issue.
- --gregbo
gds at best.com
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1998 15:05:58 -0700 (PDT)
From: Greg Skinner <gds@best.com>
Subject: Re: [netz] Public or private for the future of the Internet?
Ronda Hauben wrote:
>But the new organization will be setting the policy for the registry.
>This is a more immense concentration of power. Not only will the
>new registry for IP numbers be part of this new private corporation,
>the board of directors of this private corporation will be setting
>policy for itself.
>Isn't this the dream of big corporate entities that they are
>responsible *only* to themselves, while protected by the government.
Rather than go through a point-by-point rebuttal, I will refer
interested parties to the URL that documents the proposed new
corporation:
http://www.iana.org/submitted/sub-contents.html
Readers should judge for themselves if this corporation is likely to
act in the public good, or in the interests of a few multinational
corporations.
>Where is the social obligation or computer science expertise in
>this corporation to be in control of such functions of the Internet?
The reference above also contains a listing of intial Board members
and endorsers. People should contact them if they have questions
about their motives.
>And there is a very low cost involved for giving out domain names,
>so where is the competition?
The competition would come from having multple registrars. Everyone
might charge the same price, but some registrars may be able to do the
job in a day, while others might take several weeks, for example.
>And why should there be any competition? This is like setting up
>competition for registering my automobilie or getting a driver's
>license. It is an administrative function and needs to be handled
>responsibly in the way that one can hold government responsible for,
>but *not* some private competitors.
If an administrative government function is what is wanted, than the
users of the Internet will have their usage taxed, just as your tax
dollars pay for the organizations that register your automobile and
driver's license. If the users of the Internet want this to happen,
then it will happen. From what I have heard regarding Internet taxes
thus far, it's not a very popular idea.
>Also, there need to be perhaps better language in the RFC's governing
>domain name registrations so that there is someone verifying the name
>and phone number of who applies for a domain name.
If you recall, an NSI representative posted remarks to the fact that
it was not possible (due to demand and limited resources) for every
applicant to be verified in that way.
>And it seems that it wasn't possible to get multiple domain names to
>hoard, etc. before NSI was allowed to charge for them.
Before NSI was allowed to charge for registrations, no one wanted
multiple domain names for the purpose of hoarding or anything else.
>Also the yearly maintainance fee that NSI (or any registry) may be
>allowed to charge is a toll for no service.
I don't understand. Registries have to cover their costs. They have
salaries and insurance to pay, tax liabilities, infrastructure costs
(office space, capital equipment purchase, etc.), and so forth. The
service that a registry provides costs money.
- --gregbo
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1998 23:10:19 -0400 (EDT)
From: Ronda Hauben <ronda@panix.com>
Subject: Re: [netz] Public or private for the future of the Internet?
Greg Skinner <gds@@best.com> wrote:
>Ronda Hauben wrote:
>>But the new organization will be setting the policy for the registry.
>>This is a more immense concentration of power. Not only will the
>>new registry for IP numbers be part of this new private corporation,
>>the board of directors of this private corporation will be setting
>>policy for itself.
>>Isn't this the dream of big corporate entities that they are
>>responsible *only* to themselves, while protected by the government.
>Rather than go through a point-by-point rebuttal, I will refer
>interested parties to the URL that documents the proposed new
>corporation:
>http://www.iana.org/submitted/sub-contents.html
Greg, what do you think of putting these powers into one
corporate entity?
Do you think this can be something good?
>Readers should judge for themselves if this corporation is likely to
>act in the public good, or in the interests of a few multinational
>corporations.
How can a corporate entity being given all this power be expected
to act in the public good?
Is the purpose of a corporate entity to act in the public good?
Or is it to serve its business interests?
Isn't there a difference between the nature of public and the nature
of private?
The Internet grew up under public control and protection.
Do you think that is *no* longer needed?
>>Where is the social obligation or computer science expertise in
>>this corporation to be in control of such functions of the Internet?
The reference above also contains a listing of intial Board members
and endorsers. People should contact them if they have questions
about their motives.
I am referring to the expertise of DARPA and the NSF to provide
for the research and understanding of the nature of the Internet
that made it possible for the Internet to grow and develop.
There is *no* board that could replace the research capacity
and capability of government entities like DARPA and NSF.
But despite that, look at the folks that have been named to
the board and can you say why you think they can replace
the NSF and DARPA expertise?
The board chosen through some old-boy network and secret
process for the IANA proposal included:
- -------------
GERALDINE CAPDEBOSCQ
Geraldine Capdeboscq is Executive Vice President for Strategy,
Technology and Partnerships, BULL (France). While at BULL, she was
also Finance and MIS Director for the French Network (1988-91),
Finance and Strategic Partnerships Director for the Research and
Development Division (1991-94), and President of Smartcards, Terminals
and Securization (1994-97). BULL is a member organization of SFIB,
Syndicat de l'Industrie des Technologies de l'Information, which
represents the French information technology industry. SFIB is a
member of EUROBIT, the European federation of national information
technology associations.
Mrs. Capdeboscq received her training at the Ecole Nationale
d'Administration in France.
GEORGE CONRADES
George Conrades is a Venture Partner with Polaris Venture Partners. He
had been Executive Vice President and President, GTE Internetworking
since the acquisition of GTE by BBN in 1997. He was also Chief
Executive Officer of BBN (1994-98). Previously, he was with IBM for
thirty-one years, including IBM United States and IBM Asia/Pacific in
Tokyo. At IBM, he was Senior Vice President and a member of IBM's
Corporate Management Board.
He is former Chairman of the Board of Ohio Wesleyan University, a
trustee of The Scripps Research Institute, a trustee of the Committee
for Economic Development, and chair of the subcommittee report on the
importance of basic research in America. Previously, he served as
director for several companies in health care, bio-pharmaceuticals and
high technology, and is a member of the board of CBS.
Mr. Conrades holds a Bachelor's degree in physics and mathematics from
Ohio Wesleyan University (1961) and a M.B.A. from the University of
Chicago (1971).
GREG CREW
Greg Crew is currently Chairman of the Australian Communications
Industry Forum Ltd., Chairman of the Australian Information Technology
Engineering Centre Ltd., and a non-executive director of ERG Ltd.
(Perth) and of Silicon Wireless Ltd. (California). He was Chief
Executive Officer of Mercury Communications Ltd. (UK) (1993-95) and
Chief Operating Officer of Hongkong Telecommunications Ltd. (1991-93).
He was also Managing Director of Hongkong Telephone Co. Ltd.
(1988-91). Previously, he occupied various positions in engineering
and commercial management in Hong Kong, and in Australia with Telecom
Australia.
He is a Fellow of the Institution of Electrical Engineers and a Fellow
of the Australian Institute of Company Directors.
Mr. Crew holds a Bachelor's degree in engineering from the University
of Tasmania (1959), a Master's degree in administration from Monash
University (1979), and was awarded an Honorary Doctorate of Science
from the Open University of Hong Kong for services to
telecommunications and education in Hong Kong.
ESTHER DYSON
Esther Dyson is currently president of EDventure Holdings, a small but
diversified company focused on emerging information technology
worldwide. She is a member of the United States National Information
Infrastructure Advisory Council, where she co-chairs the Information
Privacy and Intellectual Property subcommittee, and a member of the
President's Export Council Subcommittee on Encryption. She sits on the
boards of the Electronic Frontier Foundation, Scala, Poland Online,
ComputerLand Poland, Cygnus Solution, E-Pub Services, PRT Group,
Trustworks (Amsterdam), IBS (Moscow), iCAT, New World Publishing, and
the Global Business Network. She is on the advisory boards of Perot
Systems and the Internet capital Group, and a limited partner of the
Mayfield Software Fund.
Ms. Dyson is also on the boards and executive committees of the Santa
Fe Institute and the Institute for East-West Studies, and on the board
of the Eurasia Foundation. She is a founding member of the Russian
Software Market Association and a member of the (US) Software
Publishers Association. She serves on the advisory boards of The
Software Entrepreneurs Forum (Silicon Valley), the Poynter Institute
for Media Studies, the Russian Internet Technology Center, and the
Soros Medical Internet Project.
Previously, she was a securities analyst (New Court Securities,
1977-80; Oppenheimer & Co., 1980-82), and a reporter for Forbes
magazine (1974-77).
Ms. Dyson holds a Bachelor's degree in economics from Harvard
University (1972).
FRANK FITZSIMMONS
Frank Fitzsimmons is Senior Vice President, Global Marketing for Dun &
Bradstreet, where he is responsible for the implementation of new
global marketing initiatives in the areas of access systems, software
and consulting partner marketing, Internet applications, electronic
markets, and value-added products. Previously, he was Senior Vice
President, Global Electronic Commerce Marketing responsible for
creating a global strategy for partnership marketing, D&B's web
strategy, as well as defining D&B's role in electronic commerce.
Mr. Fitzsimmons was Vice President, Applications Marketing (1994-96),
where he was responsible for the development of new products and new
markets for D&B-U.S. In this role, he managed "start-up" type teams to
develop strategies, products and distribution capabilities.
He was also Vice President, Finance for the Business Marketing
Services Division and Vice President, Strategic Planning for D&B
Information Services, North America. Previously, he held positions in
Finance and Planning for Amerada Hess and the international divisions
of W.R. Grace & Co.
Mr. Fitzsimmons hold a Bachelor's degree in accounting from Ithaca
College and a M.B.A. degree in finance from Columbia University.
HANS KRAAIJENBRINK
Hans Kraaijenbrink is Chairman of the Executive Board of ETNO, the
European Telecommunications Network Operators association, located in
Brussels. He is also Manager, European Policy and Regulation with
Royal KPV N.V., the Netherlands where he is responsible for European
and international regulatory strategic affairs.
Previously, he worked for the Dutch Ministry of Economic Affairs,
responsible for information technology and the services sectors, and
for the Ministry of Transport, Public Works and Water Management. He
was also a member of the management team of the Telecommunications and
Posts Directorate in the initial phase of the Dutch Telecommunications
Regulator.
Mr. Kraaijenbrink graduated from Delft University (1996).
JUN MURAI
Jun Murai is currently Professor, Faculty of Environmental
Information, Keio University (Japan); Adjunct Professor at the
Institute of Advanced Studies, United Nations University; Instructor
at Tokyo University of Art and Music; President of the Japan Network
Information Center (JPNIC); General Chairperson of the WIDE Project (a
Japanese Internet research consortium); Vice Chairperson of the
Japanese chapter of the Internet Society; and Vice President of the
Japanese Internet Association. He is a member of the board of the
Internet Society.
Previously, he developed the Keio Science and Technology Network, and
the Japan University UNIX Network (JUNET). His research has centered
on electronic observation, satellite Internet, multimedia Internet,
and mobile and ubiquitous computing.
Mr. Murai graduated from Keio University (1979), holds a Master's
degree in computer science from Keio University (1981), and a
Doctorate in computer science from Keio University (1987).
EUGENIO TRIANA
Eugenio Triana is an International Management Consultant on telecom
policy, space and satellite systems, copyright and intellectual
property rights in Madrid, Spain. He recently left the European
Commission, where he was Deputy Director General in DG XIII (1994-98),
responsible for the Commission's relations with the Information and
Communications Technology user interests (ICT Partnership), and for
coordinating the Directorate General's policy for space and satellite
development. He has also been closely involved with intellectual
property and Internet related policies. He is a Senior Member of the
IEEE and was President of the Licensing Executive Society (LES-Spain)
from 1983-90.
Mr. Triana was Secretary General of Industrial Promotion and
Technology in the Spanish Ministry of Industry and Energy (1990-94),
with particular responsibilities for inward investment, innovation,
small and medium-sized enterprises, and research and development. He
also represented the Spanish Government in several national and
international enterprises and organizations, including the European
Space Agency.
Previously, he held several positions in Spanish industry. He also
taught physics, engineering, and technology management in several
academic institutions (1965-83). He has been a board member of diverse
public corporations on telecommunications and energy.
Mr. Triana holds a Doctorate in industrial engineering (1963) and a
Master's degree in business administration (1964) from Madrid
University.
LINDA S. WILSON
Linda S. Wilson is currently the seventh president of Radcliffe
College. Previously, was vice president for research at the University
of Michigan.
She is a Trustee of the General Hospital Corporation of the
Massachusetts General Hospital and chairs its Diversity and Human
Resources Committee. She was recently elected to the Committee on
Economic Development. She is also on the Board of Directors for
Citizens Financial Group, Inc.
A charter member of the National Academy of Sciences'
Government-University- Industry Research Roundtable, she recently
served on its Task Force on the Academic Research Enterprise. She
chaired the National Research Council's Office of Scientific and
Engineering Personnel for six years. She also served on the Carnegie
Commission on Science, Technology and Government Task Force on
Science, Technology and the States.
Ms. Wilson served on the National Commission on Research and was chair
of its subcommittee on accountability. She was a member of the
Director's Advisory Council of the National Science Foundation for
nine years. As a member of the Council of the Institute of Medicine,
she chaired its Finance Committee, and served on its Committee on
Government-Industry Research Collaboration in Biomedical Research and
Education.
She is a member of the Institute of Medicine of the National Academy
of Sciences, and a fellow of the American Association for the
Advancement of Science.
Ms. Wilson received a Bachelor's degree from Sophie Newcomb College,
Tulane University, and a Ph.D. in inorganic chemistry from the
University of Wisconsin. She received an Honorary Doctorate in Humane
Letters from Newcomb College, Tulane University, and an Honorary
Doctorate of Letters from the University of Maryland.
- --------------
I'll respond later to the rest. But these folks above are *not*
a research and scientific entity, they are primarily management
minded folks - including finance or entrepreneurship or board
of directors kind of qualifications.
(Does anyone know much about the CED - the Committee on Economic
Development? Two of the U.S. based above are on that.
I thought that was a really influential power structure
activity in the U.S. - something with CEO's of the biggest
multinationals and college presidents of the most influential
private universities.
I thought I once came across how the plan for some government
policy that both the Democratics and Republicans promoted
came from this entity.
I don't understand how the above names can be expected to
to replace the NSF or DARPA and their ability to understand
the public policy issues of scientific processes and their
ability to support and develop the needed research to scale
the Internet.
The above remind me of when I went to an open meeting of the folks
appointed by Clinton to the NII to propose what should be the
future development of the Internet in the U.S. They had
similar backgrounds. At that time, the topic of discussion at
the meeting was how those folks could get online.
And they raised all sorts of pertinent issues of how the Internet
could serve their businesses or finance activity.
They have *no* public purpose or concern and probably wouldn't
have been appointed if they had had such.
To have excluded government people here makes sure that
none of those who are appointed are to have public purpose
or concern.
They are (at least for the U.S. based folks) part of the power
structure and have no basis to be making public policy regarding
the Internet.
But more importantly. Public policy is a government function,
and the U.S. government is inappropriately and without the
authority planning to transfer this public obligation.
I don't know of any part of the U.S. Constitution that allows
or authorizes U.S. government officials to transfer or give
to any private entity their government functions and powers.
And the huge amount of public resources that the govt
claims it is going to transfer to a private entity
are equally unappropriate and contrary to the constitutional
obligations of the U.S. Govt.
Ronda
ronda@panix.com
Netizens: On the History and Impact
of Usenet and the Internet
http://www.columbia.edu/~hauben/netbook/
in print edition ISBN 0-8186-7706-6
------------------------------
End of Netizens-Digest V1 #184
******************************
