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Doom Editing Digest Vol. 01 Nr. 385
From: owner-doom-editing-digest
To: doom-editing-digest@nvg.unit.no
Subject: doom-editing-digest V1 #385
Reply-To: doom-editing
Errors-To: owner-doom-editing-digest
Precedence: bulk
doom-editing-digest Sunday, 20 August 1995 Volume 01 : Number 385
Sky texture warping
An Interesting effect with wind
Re: An Interesting effect with wind
Re: An Interesting effect with wind
Re: Sky texture warping
Re: Sky texture warping
Wind and revenant missles
Re: Wind and revenant missles
Re: An Interesting effect with wind
re: wind + revenant missles
Re: Wind and revenant missles
Projectiles disappearing
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Greg Lewis <gregl@umich.edu>
Date: Sat, 19 Aug 1995 01:39:24 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Sky texture warping
While playing a WAD the other day (SKYCITY I believe) I noticed that
Doom seems to have a warping effect on the sky texture near the edge of
the screen. For example, if a sky texture were made consisting only of
vertical stripes a certain distance apart, I have a feeling that the
stripes would appear to be twice as far apart near the edge of the screen
as in the center. Has anyone else noticed this? Or does anyone have a
clue as to why this might be happening?
Greg
------------------------------
From: "Gabriel A. Cain" <gcain01@mail.orion.org>
Date: Sat, 19 Aug 1995 00:51:32 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: An Interesting effect with wind
The other day I was messing with an editor for heretic (DCK 2.2f ) and I
was able to cause shoots from the hellstaff and the 2 side shots from the
crossbow to fly around a room almost infinitely, its a cool effect to see
100+ crossbolts AND/Or hellstaff shots fly around a room, I'm planing on
making it into a deathmatch level... Just thought this was neat and
wanted to share it... bye now... :)
/-<>-<>-<>-<>-<>-<>-<>-<>-<>-<>-<>-<>-<>-<>-<>-<>-<>-<>-<>-<>-<>-<>-<>-\
| One .sig to rule them all, one .sig to find them; |
| One .sig to bring them all and on the Internet bind them... |
| In the land of 'puters where the hackers lie... |
+----------------------------------------------------------------------+
| C program run C program crash C programmer get drunk... |
| .... C Pascal Programmer laugh at C programmer... |
\>>>>>>>>>> --Gabriel Cain gcain@republic.k12.mo.us <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<</
------------------------------
From: spockto@netdepot.com (Spock To)
Date: Sat, 19 Aug 1995 05:57:00 -0400
Subject: Re: An Interesting effect with wind
>The other day I was messing with an editor for heretic (DCK 2.2f ) and I
>was able to cause shoots from the hellstaff and the 2 side shots from the
>crossbow to fly around a room almost infinitely, its a cool effect to see
>100+ crossbolts AND/Or hellstaff shots fly around a room, I'm planing on
>making it into a deathmatch level... Just thought this was neat and
>wanted to share it... bye now... :)
So are you _gonna_ share it with us? and does it have a comparable hack in Doom?
By the way everyone, I had an interesting experience that may help someone
figure out what makes the revenants missles track...
If you stand just in the opening on Doom][ level 30, in the final boss'
forehead, you will find the following effect, if you got there from the main
room the revenants missles will come at you head on and everything else will
hit at about your feet, if you got to the spot from Romero's closet, the
revenants missles will hit above your head and everything else will be dead on..
This at least proves that the rev's tracking missles don't work on the same
codes as everything else, If someone out there has enough knowledge of
Doom][.exe, they may be able to find and modify the appropriate lines to
make this fabulous technology available to the rest of us. How 'bout it? Is
there soebody out there who can figure this one out?
Geek Code:
GO dgq H+(---) s+. !g !p au- a21 w+ v>++ c+1/2 Udon't ask N++ W+>++ M--
po---@ Y+1/2 t+++ 5++ R tv+ b+++ D++ B-- e+>++ U++(*) h+ f? n-@ y+
------------------------------
From: Matthew Miller <rmiller@infinet.com>
Date: Sat, 19 Aug 1995 10:09:49 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: An Interesting effect with wind
On Sat, 19 Aug 1995, Spock To wrote:
> >The other day I was messing with an editor for heretic (DCK 2.2f ) and I
> >was able to cause shoots from the hellstaff and the 2 side shots from the
> >crossbow to fly around a room almost infinitely, its a cool effect to see
> >100+ crossbolts AND/Or hellstaff shots fly around a room,
[ chainsaw ]
> So are you _gonna_ share it with us? and does it have a comparable hack in
> Doom?
Just in case you don't know, DCK is a level editor, not an exe-hacker
type of program. Wind is an effect that (AFAIK) only Heretic has, not
Doom. Unless it's somewhere in there, just waiting for us to find it... :)
Matthew Miller -- rmiller@infinet.com
------------------------------
From: Matthew Miller <rmiller@infinet.com>
Date: Sat, 19 Aug 1995 10:06:36 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: Sky texture warping
[WARNING--LONG SPAMMY GUESSING AHEAD, PLUS UGLY ASCII DIAGRAMS. SET YOUR
SCREEN FONT TO A MONOSPACED FONT...]
On Sat, 19 Aug 1995, Greg Lewis wrote:
> While playing a WAD the other day (SKYCITY I believe) I noticed that
> Doom seems to have a warping effect on the sky texture near the edge of
> the screen.
[ chink, chink...Wolf3D knife just for nostalgia's sake ]
> Has anyone else noticed this?
This is just a guess on my part, so don't take it too seriously.
My guess has to do with how the engine decides which walls you can or
can't see from a given point. It shoots out rays in all the angles from
your point of view. But if this sort of view was put directly on your
screen, everything would look strangely distorted--straight walls in
front of you would appear to be bent away from you...maybe this diagram
can help you understand what I'm guessing at here...
.___.___. <--straight wall, Projected . . wall's
\ | / three points onto the |~-_._-~| all warped!
\ | / Note! outer lines flat screen | | |
\|/ are longer than center this | | |
* <--viewpoint becomes: *~~~*~~~* <--here's your screen
^viewpoint again
So, this is only half the engine; the other half straightens out what
should be flat walls and corrects the warping.
.___.___. <--wall is straight again
\ | /
\ | /
\|/
~~~~*~~~~ <--here's your screen
So...where do skies come in? I'm guessing that the skies are added in as
flat `walls' when the engine is only finished with the first half.
========= <--sky `wall' _=_ <--warped sky `wall'
. . ==~ ~==
|~-_._-~| <--warped wall .___.___. <--wall is straight again
| | | \ | /
| | | \ | /
*~~~*~~~* \|/
before `correction' ****~**** <--here's your screen
after `correction'
Alright, alright, so much for theory. Anyone have some solid facts to
back this up with?
(And before you ask--no, that is *not* a picture of a parachute!) :)
Matthew Miller -- rmiller@infinet.com
------------------------------
From: LummoxJR@AOL.COM
Date: Sat, 19 Aug 1995 13:26:43 -0400
Subject: Re: Sky texture warping
8/19/95 11:00:44 EDT, Matthew Miller (rmiller@infinet.com) wrote:
>This is just a guess on my part, so don't take it too seriously.
>
>My guess has to do with how the engine decides which walls you can or
>can't see from a given point. It shoots out rays in all the angles from
>your point of view. But if this sort of view was put directly on your
>screen, everything would look strangely distorted--straight walls in
>front of you would appear to be bent away from you...maybe this diagram
>can help you understand what I'm guessing at here...
>
>.___.___. <--straight wall, Projected . . wall's
> \ | / three points onto the |~-_._-~| all warped!
> \ | / Note! outer lines flat screen | | |
> \|/ are longer than center this | | |
> * <--viewpoint becomes: *~~~*~~~* <--here's your screen
> ^viewpoint again
>
>So, this is only half the engine; the other half straightens out what
>should be flat walls and corrects the warping.
>
>.___.___. <--wall is straight again
> \ | /
> \ | /
> \|/
>~~~~*~~~~ <--here's your screen
>
>So...where do skies come in? I'm guessing that the skies are added in as
>flat `walls' when the engine is only finished with the first half.
>
>========= <--sky `wall' _=_ <--warped sky `wall'
>. . ==~ ~==
>|~-_._-~| <--warped wall .___.___. <--wall is straight again
>| | | \ | /
>| | | \ | /
>*~~~*~~~* \|/
>before `correction' ****~**** <--here's your screen
> after `correction'
>
>Alright, alright, so much for theory. Anyone have some solid facts to
>back this up with?
I think your theory is right, mostly.
But the skies aren't added in as flat walls when the other walls are finished
casting; instead, during casting if a ray hits a sky-textured ceiling, it is
told that such factors as distance (and thus some texture scaling) don't
matter; knowing they don't matter, it just draws the sky without correcting
for spherical aberration (like it's doing for the walls).
Lummox JR
------------------------------
From: LummoxJR@AOL.COM
Date: Sat, 19 Aug 1995 13:23:55 -0400
Subject: Wind and revenant missles
Sorry about the multiple forwarding, but I think it's relevant.
In a message dated 95-08-19 06:30:49 EDT, Spock To wrote, in reply to another
message:
>>The other day I was messing with an editor for heretic (DCK 2.2f ) and I
>>was able to cause shoots from the hellstaff and the 2 side shots from the
>>crossbow to fly around a room almost infinitely, its a cool effect to see
>>100+ crossbolts AND/Or hellstaff shots fly around a room, I'm planing on
>>making it into a deathmatch level... Just thought this was neat and
>>wanted to share it... bye now... :)
>
>So are you _gonna_ share it with us? and does it have a comparable hack in
>Doom?
No way. DCK is just a WAD editor, isn't it? If so, then messing with
something like wind (which, lacking experience, I can only guess is part of
Heretic) will not work in Doom or Doom II, because there is no such thing as
wind in either game. A DHE patch is the only way I know of to do unusual
things of that sort, but how you'd do that with even DHE is beyond me.
>By the way everyone, I had an interesting experience that may help someone
>figure out what makes the revenants missles track...
>
>If you stand just in the opening on Doom][ level 30, in the final boss'
>forehead, you will find the following effect, if you got there from the main
>room the revenants missles will come at you head on and everything else will
>hit at about your feet, if you got to the spot from Romero's closet, the
>revenants missles will hit above your head and everything else will be dead
>on..
>This at least proves that the rev's tracking missles don't work on the same
>codes as everything else, If someone out there has enough knowledge of
>Doom][.exe, they may be able to find and modify the appropriate lines to
>make this fabulous technology available to the rest of us. How 'bout it? Is
>there soebody out there who can figure this one out?
I haven't played Doom II either, so I only know what I've seen of them in
Doom I hacks, but here's the deal:
REVENANT'S MISSLES DON'T TRACK.
At least, when the same missles are used in Doom I, the only thing they do is
spurt out little puffs of smoke. But they keep going just like rockets do,
without turning one way or another. Altering other monsters to fire just the
same way the revenant does did nothing to help, either.
You are right, though, about their not working on the same codes as
everything else. The revenant missle is the only projectile that uses a code
pointer of any kind in its frames- but again, I think that code pointer only
creates the smoke puffs.
This is unfortunate, because I'd like to see them do something. Wouldn't it
be great to have a projectile that followed you? The only way I've come close
to doing that is by making projectiles fire other projectiles- that's kind of
sloppy.
Lummox JR
the Doom hacker
------------------------------
From: Greg Lewis <gregl@umich.edu>
Date: Sat, 19 Aug 1995 15:41:19 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: Wind and revenant missles
> I haven't played Doom II either, so I only know what I've seen of them in
> Doom I hacks, but here's the deal:
>
> REVENANT'S MISSLES DON'T TRACK.
OK. Here's the deal. Don't make statements about games you HAVEN'T
PLAYED. Revenanat missiles do track. Ask any Doom 2 player.
The simple proof is in a few easy DHE changes:
Imp's Far Attack Frame = 339
Frames 316-320, change the Sprite Number to 18
Frames 339-442, change the Sprite Number to 0
Frame 442, change Next Frame to 444
In the Text section, change "skeatk" (way down near the bottom) to
something available in Doom 1, such as "cacsit".
Write changes, warp to E3M1, attempt to survive.
Greg
------------------------------
From: "Erwen L. Tang" <etang@pen.k12.va.us>
Date: Sat, 19 Aug 95 15:38:30 EDT
Subject: Re: An Interesting effect with wind
According to Matthew Miller:
>
> On Sat, 19 Aug 1995, Spock To wrote:
>
> > >The other day I was messing with an editor for heretic (DCK 2.2f ) and I
> > >was able to cause shoots from the hellstaff and the 2 side shots from the
> > >crossbow to fly around a room almost infinitely, its a cool effect to see
> > >100+ crossbolts AND/Or hellstaff shots fly around a room,
> [ chainsaw ]
> > So are you _gonna_ share it with us? and does it have a comparable hack in
> > Doom?
>
> Just in case you don't know, DCK is a level editor, not an exe-hacker
> type of program. Wind is an effect that (AFAIK) only Heretic has, not
> Doom. Unless it's somewhere in there, just waiting for us to find it... :)
Hey fellow DCK user. Finally I find someone who uses DCK.
It's awesome!!!!
- --
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Flame Shield operating 24hr. Flames will be deleted so don't bother. |
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Erwen Tang | Tel: (703) 803-8940 | \|/ ____ \|/ |
| Class of 1997 | Add: etang@pen.k12.va.us | @~/ ,. \~@ |
| Thomas Jefferson | etang@capaccess.org | /_( \__/ )_\ |
| High School For | etang@lan.tjhsst.edu | \__U_/ |
| Science & Technology | | |
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
From: hugh.molesworth@almac.co.uk (HUGH MOLESWORTH)
Date: Sat, 19 Aug 95 21:30:00 +0100
Subject: re: wind + revenant missles
- -> I haven't played Doom II either, so I only know what I've seen of
- -> them in Doom I hacks, but here's the deal:
- ->
- -> REVENANT'S MISSLES DON'T TRACK.
they do in Doom II... they (randomly) alternate between tracking +
straight fire. I've never seen the Doom patches for revenant missiles,
but I'd say that the tracking code for revenant missiles is doom
2-specific code which doesn't get called when the Doom 1 IWAD is loaded.
Maybe the new DHE will let Doom 1 emulate the tracking... maybe not.
- ->
- -> At least, when the same missles are used in Doom I, the only thing
- -> they do is spurt out little puffs of smoke. But they keep going just
- -> like rockets do, without turning one way or another. Altering other
- -> monsters to fire just the same way the revenant does did nothing to
- -> help, either.
- -> You are right, though, about their not working on the same codes as
- -> everything else. The revenant missle is the only projectile that uses
- -> a code pointer of any kind in its frames- but again, I think that
- -> code pointer only creates the smoke puffs.
I think the code pointer isn't being used properly, or you've got the
wrong code pointer. Wasn't there something about the code pointer
table being in a different part of the EXE, and the frame table pointers
not actually being used?
- -> This is unfortunate, because I'd like to see them do something.
- -> Wouldn't it be great to have a projectile that followed you? The only
- -> way I've come close to doing that is by making projectiles fire other
- -> projectiles- that's kind of sloppy.
How do you get projectiles to launch other projectiles? That could give
quite a cool effect...
Hugh.
mailto:hugh.molesworth@almac.co.uk
------------------------------
From: "Erwen L. Tang" <etang@pen.k12.va.us>
Date: Sat, 19 Aug 95 17:33:16 EDT
Subject: Re: Wind and revenant missles
According to LummoxJR@AOL.COM:
> I haven't played Doom II either, so I only know what I've seen of them in
> Doom I hacks, but here's the deal:
>
> REVENANT'S MISSLES DON'T TRACK.
This is of course wrong. If you played DOOM ][, you'll know
that Revenant's missiles do track you to a degree.
> This is unfortunate, because I'd like to see them do something. Wouldn't it
> be great to have a projectile that followed you? The only way I've come close
Again, play DOOM ][ (level 16).
- --
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Flame Shield operating 24hr. Flames will be deleted so don't bother. |
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Erwen Tang | Tel: (703) 803-8940 | \|/ ____ \|/ |
| Class of 1997 | Add: etang@pen.k12.va.us | @~/ ,. \~@ |
| Thomas Jefferson | etang@capaccess.org | /_( \__/ )_\ |
| High School For | etang@lan.tjhsst.edu | \__U_/ |
| Science & Technology | | |
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
From: "Erwen L. Tang" <etang@pen.k12.va.us>
Date: Sat, 19 Aug 95 18:59:45 EDT
Subject: Projectiles disappearing
Hello,
Has anybody experienced a bug with their wads where a
projectile (rocket, plasma, bfg) would go right through the
wall withough "dying"(dehacked term)? It seems fine when I
shoot the projectile, however instead of hitting the wall and
exploding or whatever, it just goes right through the wall and
nothing happens.
Does anybody know what causes this bug? Does it have to do
with the design of the level? I'm using BSP v1.2x (within DCK
v2.2) as a node builder; does it have something to do with that?
Help would be greatly appreciated.
- --
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Flame Shield operating 24hr. Flames will be deleted so don't bother. |
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Erwen Tang | Tel: (703) 803-8940 | \|/ ____ \|/ |
| Class of 1997 | Add: etang@pen.k12.va.us | @~/ ,. \~@ |
| Thomas Jefferson | etang@capaccess.org | /_( \__/ )_\ |
| High School For | etang@lan.tjhsst.edu | \__U_/ |
| Science & Technology | | |
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
End of doom-editing-digest V1 #385
**********************************
