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Doom Editing Digest Vol. 01 Nr. 337
From: owner-doom-editing-digest
To: doom-editing-digest@nvg.unit.no
Subject: doom-editing-digest V1 #337
Reply-To: doom-editing
Errors-To: owner-doom-editing-digest
Precedence: bulk
doom-editing-digest Thursday, 6 July 1995 Volume 01 : Number 337
Re: edmap
Re: The Ultimate Doom
Re: The Ultimate Doom
Re: The Ultimate Doom
Re: NWT
Re: MacDewm
Re: DEHACKED and the Archvile
Re: The Ultimate Doom
Re: DOOM -> Heretic WADs?
Re: The Ultimate Doom
Re: MacDewm
Re: NWT
Re: NWT
Re: The Ultimate Doom
Not an editing related post (Vets ignore)
Re: The Ultimate Doom
Re: The Ultimate Doom
Re: DOOM -> Heretic WADs?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Alden Bates <abates@central.co.nz>
Date: Wed, 5 Jul 1995 21:37:07 +1200 (NZST)
Subject: Re: edmap
On Tue, 4 Jul 1995, James Patrick Vernon wrote:
> I am currently using Edmap and will get a texture not found error as I am
> trying to test my WAD. As far as I know, I am not using Doom I textures in
> Doom2 as I haven't applied any new textures except Startran2 and Bigdoor.
> Has anyone had this problem and how can I fix it? Thanks in advance :-(
The full error is "Texture num for name not found." Right?
That's an error peculier to EDMAP which I believe is cause by some extra
sidedefs full of junk floating around. The only way I have found to fix
a WAD with this error is to load it into DEU and perform a check on it.
The "referances" (I think that's the correct name, it's underneath the
check for closed sectors.) check will find the sidedefs which aren't
referanced and allow you to delete them.
Alden Bates.
------------------------------
From: Raphael.Quinet@aachen.eed.ericsson.se
Date: Wed, 5 Jul 95 13:04:02 +0200
Subject: Re: The Ultimate Doom
On Tue, 04 Jul 1995 10:18:21 EDT, Robert Forsman <thoth@cis.ufl.edu> wrote:
> I saw The Ultimate Doom on one of the aisle islands at the local Media
> Play. No way in hell I'm paying $25 for one lousy extra episode with HOM.
> Somebody run those levels through a consistency checker and see what
> the problems are. I don't understand why the id guys can't run one of the
> free editors for 30 minutes to nail down the errors.
I have exactly the same feeling.
A few months ago, I e-mailed Dave Taylor (I had e-mailed Jay Wilbur
earlier too) and suggested that they use the consistency checkers from
some of the publicly available editors (I didn't even push DEU) to test
their levels before releasing the final product. I wrote this for
Heretic II and Strife, because I was a bit disappointed by the bugs in
Heretic. Their replies were "maybe". Obviously, they totally ignored
my suggestion.
Although I could understand that for Heretic II and Strife which would
probably require some modifications to the current editors (different
Things in WAD for Heretic II, different WAD structure for Strife), I
cannot understand why they didn't do it for Ultimate Doom, which is
basically Doom I and which is accepted by almost all Doom editors.
Yes, the design of the new levels may be great, but one or two HOMs are
enough to totally destroy them. While I'm whining, I should add that
it's a pity they didn't change the version number of the Doom EXE: it
displays "1.9" but it is different from the standard 1.9 of Doom 1 and
Doom II.
I hope they will soon release a patch which fixes the bugs in the maps
(it only takes a few minutes to go through all maps with a good editor!)
and increases the version number to 1.999 or something like that.
- -Raphael
------------------------------
From: "C. Sheldon" <sheldonc@acy.digex.net>
Date: Wed, 5 Jul 1995 09:51:43 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: The Ultimate Doom
On Wed, 5 Jul 1995 Raphael.Quinet@aachen.eed.ericsson.se wrote:
>
> Yes, the design of the new levels may be great, but one or two HOMs are
> enough to totally destroy them. While I'm whining, I should add that
> it's a pity they didn't change the version number of the Doom EXE: it
> displays "1.9" but it is different from the standard 1.9 of Doom 1 and
> Doom II.
The version # is different, its 1.9u as reported by Dwango
anyway...and you can play 1.9u with 1.9 as long as you don't use the 4th
episode. It would have been a real shame if 1.9u couldn't deathmatch with
1.9. Also I agree about the HOM's and I disagree about the good "design"
of the levels. Basically i think the 4th episode stinks, they use way too
much lava and acid floors, the levels aren't esthetically pleasing, and
they are too difficult for the "average" player, furthermore, i have
played them in deathmatch and i find them quite annoying, in multiplay
and one on one. It really appears that this whole thing is just a gimmick
to give id an influx of cash until they get their next REAL release
out....but hey....it worked.....hell I bought it.
Later days,
Cliff Sheldon
AKA: DrWu on #Doom "Where the players meet"
------------------------------
From: mustaine@usa.net (Tom Mustaine)
Date: Wed, 5 Jul 1995 08:37:55 -0600
Subject: Re: The Ultimate Doom
>On Tue, 04 Jul 1995 10:18:21 EDT, Robert Forsman <thoth@cis.ufl.edu> wrote:
>> I saw The Ultimate Doom on one of the aisle islands at the local Media
>> Play. No way in hell I'm paying $25 for one lousy extra episode with HOM.
>> Somebody run those levels through a consistency checker and see what
>> the problems are. I don't understand why the id guys can't run one of the
>> free editors for 30 minutes to nail down the errors.
>
>I have exactly the same feeling.
>
>A few months ago, I e-mailed Dave Taylor (I had e-mailed Jay Wilbur
>earlier too) and suggested that they use the consistency checkers from
>some of the publicly available editors (I didn't even push DEU) to test
>their levels before releasing the final product. I wrote this for
>Heretic II and Strife, because I was a bit disappointed by the bugs in
>Heretic. Their replies were "maybe". Obviously, they totally ignored
>my suggestion.
They don't really care. When I visited the ID buliding, I pulled my raggedy
old T-Bird up between two ferrari's and a Dodge Viper. They are having
people write their software for them and making a crackload of money off it.
Its a excellent business idea, but they don't waste their time with reject
rebuilders or HOM testers. If it looks good, Slap it on the mission disk
and sell it for a few million more. What I wouldn't do to be in that
position, people doing my work for me, and all i do all day is design and
play new games and hit lunch in my ferrari.
Yeah, thad be nice.
------------------------------
From: AFree120@AOL.COM
Date: Wed, 5 Jul 1995 10:44:23 -0400
Subject: Re: NWT
What is NWT and where can I get it?
------------------------------
From: AFree120@AOL.COM
Date: Wed, 5 Jul 1995 10:47:44 -0400
Subject: Re: MacDewm
Can you give me more information about this Macintosh DOOM by Lion software
for my DOOM CLUB NEWSLETTER?
------------------------------
From: AFree120@AOL.COM
Date: Wed, 5 Jul 1995 10:47:45 -0400
Subject: Re: DEHACKED and the Archvile
SHAWN:
I'd like to see this ARCHVILE creation of yours! Sounds like what I've been
looking for. When I have the Archvile do is enter a room after you've been
there and respawn everyone. It would be nice if he wasn't killing them half
the time though. He was coming out of the doors so I just made the door line
- -monster no pass.
------------------------------
From: l-sieben@MEMPHIS.EDU (ulasieben)
Date: Wed, 5 Jul 1995 10:03:32 -0500
Subject: Re: The Ultimate Doom
At 01:04 PM 7/5/95 +0200, doom-editing@nvg.unit.no wrote:
>A few months ago, I e-mailed Dave Taylor (I had e-mailed Jay Wilbur
>earlier too) and suggested that they use the consistency checkers from
>some of the publicly available editors (I didn't even push DEU) to test
>their levels before releasing the final product. I wrote this for
>Heretic II and Strife, because I was a bit disappointed by the bugs in
>Heretic. Their replies were "maybe". Obviously, they totally ignored
>my suggestion.
Kudos to Raph! I agree with Raphael....they should have checked them.
I mean, that dude that they let make a couple of levels....couldn't
*HE* have checked the levels if id somehow felt embarrassed that their
editor is obselete or something? (I dint think it is....it seems to always
produce great levels :).
>Yes, the design of the new levels may be great, but one or two HOMs are
>enough to totally destroy them. While I'm whining, I should add that
>it's a pity they didn't change the version number of the Doom EXE: it
>displays "1.9" but it is different from the standard 1.9 of Doom 1 and
>Doom II.
>
>I hope they will soon release a patch which fixes the bugs in the maps
>(it only takes a few minutes to go through all maps with a good editor!)
>and increases the version number to 1.999 or something like that.
The version numbering REALLY pisses me off....I am a programmer and when I
update my product once (in a minor way) I forgot to up the version number....
it gets MONDO confusing. I can kinda see why they didn't update it, but it
needs to be done.....OHH! Someone try this and post pack to the list: try
to DM with someone having Ultimate Doom and other having Doom 1.9 regged. try
ExM1 of 1st 3 episodes. See if you get versions different or consostency errors.
-- Evil Genius (Jimmy Sieben)
------------------------------
From: BonesBro@AOL.COM
Date: Wed, 5 Jul 1995 13:40:53 -0400
Subject: Re: DOOM -> Heretic WADs?
Actually, a friend and I are working on a huge patch that's almost exactly
the same thing. We're calling it DoomTC--Doom I to Heretic. We've gotten all
the textures/flats, and we're working on the items. Unfortunatly, we've
temporarily halted work on it while we're waiting for a Heretic v1.1. Too
many bugs in 1.0 for us...
------------------------------
From: jroberto@on-ramp.ior.com (Jacob Roberto)
Date: Wed, 5 Jul 95 10:38 PDT
Subject: Re: The Ultimate Doom
>On Tue, 04 Jul 1995 10:18:21 EDT, Robert Forsman <thoth@cis.ufl.edu> wrote:
>> I saw The Ultimate Doom on one of the aisle islands at the local Media
>> Play. No way in hell I'm paying $25 for one lousy extra episode with HOM.
>> Somebody run those levels through a consistency checker and see what
>> the problems are. I don't understand why the id guys can't run one of the
>> free editors for 30 minutes to nail down the errors.
>
>I have exactly the same feeling.
>
>A few months ago, I e-mailed Dave Taylor (I had e-mailed Jay Wilbur
>earlier too) and suggested that they use the consistency checkers from
>some of the publicly available editors (I didn't even push DEU) to test
>their levels before releasing the final product. I wrote this for
>Heretic II and Strife, because I was a bit disappointed by the bugs in
>Heretic. Their replies were "maybe". Obviously, they totally ignored
>my suggestion.
>
>Although I could understand that for Heretic II and Strife which would
>probably require some modifications to the current editors (different
>Things in WAD for Heretic II, different WAD structure for Strife), I
>cannot understand why they didn't do it for Ultimate Doom, which is
>basically Doom I and which is accepted by almost all Doom editors.
>
>Yes, the design of the new levels may be great, but one or two HOMs are
>enough to totally destroy them. While I'm whining, I should add that
>it's a pity they didn't change the version number of the Doom EXE: it
>displays "1.9" but it is different from the standard 1.9 of Doom 1 and
>Doom II.
That's because it uses the 1.9 *ENGINE*. Look at doom 1 and doom 2 for
instance: there whole new games, but they still use 1.9, 1.666, ect. Maybe
if Id updated there ENGINE they would have a higher version number.
>
>I hope they will soon release a patch which fixes the bugs in the maps
>(it only takes a few minutes to go through all maps with a good editor!)
>and increases the version number to 1.999 or something like that.
How about if YOU went through with an editer and fixed all the bugs. That
would certainly make it more playable. If someone does this maybe they can
even make a patch that fixes things.
'''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''
' #DEFINE USER "YOU" '*J*ROBERTOSOFT R O '. . '
' MAIN() '*A* O T ' . '
' { '*C* B R '. '
' WHILE INPUTFROM(USER) BEEPAT(USER) '*O* E ' '
' } '*B* ''
'''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''
------------------------------
From: cmacord@fedex.com (Charlie Acord)
Date: Wed, 5 Jul 95 13:42:14 CDT
Subject: Re: MacDewm
>Can you give me more information about this Macintosh DOOM by Lion software
>for my DOOM CLUB NEWSLETTER?
I don't know anything about MacDOOM, but I would love to know
more about your newsletter.
Charlie
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Charlie Acord, "The Green Marine" | "Hey ole buddy, lunch is on me today."
Telecom Div/FedEx, Memphis, TN | "No kidding?"
(Home of BBQ, the Blues, and Elvis) | "Yeah, here's a Rocket Sandwich,
Internet: cmacord@fedex.com | and some ThunderPunch to go with it."
CompuServe: 75143,621 | #include <std_disclaimer.h>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
------------------------------
From: Ryan Drake <nccs1@farside.gsfc.nasa.gov>
Date: Wed, 5 Jul 1995 14:41:12 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: NWT
On Wed, 5 Jul 1995 AFree120@AOL.COM wrote:
> What is NWT and where can I get it?
Well, the author could probably tell you more, but NWT is an interface
that allows you to import/export different entries on your wads. What I
like about it is that it gives you complete control over what goes into
your PWADS, and it includes a NICE scrollable listing of each entry.
You can get it at all the major DOOM-related FTP sites. I notice you are
from AOL. you can probably even get it there... check the DOOM folder or
icon or whatever it is you use to get files.
Hope this helps
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
- ->Ryan Drake<- "The poets talk about love, but
[eMAiL] nccs1@farside.gsfc.nasa.gov what I talk about is DOOM. Because
[URL] --to be announced-- in the end, DOOM is all that counts."
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
From: Denis.Moeller@kiel.netsurf.de (Denis)
Date: Wed, 5 Jul 95 18:08 GMT
Subject: Re: NWT
Hi!
>What is NWT and where can I get it?
Where do you get ALL the stuff for Doom? I hate those questions.
Look at ftp.cdrom.com and its mirrors, it's always the same, with NWT
or with ANY other tool/level/text for Doom/Heretic.
Later...
Denis
[] Denis Moeller, author of NWT v1.3 and TiC's WAD Reviews. []
[] Just play our Doom (2) Add-Ons: Sudtic, Teutic, Obtic. Thanks. []
------------------------------
From: Denis.Moeller@kiel.netsurf.de (Denis)
Date: Wed, 5 Jul 95 18:08 GMT
Subject: Re: The Ultimate Doom
Hi!
>of the levels. Basically i think the 4th episode stinks, they use way too
>much lava and acid floors, the levels aren't esthetically pleasing, and
>they are too difficult for the "average" player, furthermore, i have
>played them in deathmatch and i find them quite annoying, in multiplay
>and one on one.
Naaahhh...
The levels are kinda cool, but some of them are way too small.
And the difficulty-increasing does not fit, the first 3 are hard, the
last one is a joke...
Sadly, they are full of texture misalignments and bugs, that sucks and
is not the quality we expect from our gods.
>It really appears that this whole thing is just a gimmick
>to give id an influx of cash until they get their next REAL release
Exactly.
Personally I rate the 4th episode between the first and the third:
Second, First, Fourth, Third. I hate the third episode, the 4th
contains much more ideas. The second ep. is unsurpassed.
cya
Denis
[] Denis Moeller, author of NWT v1.3 and TiC's WAD Reviews. []
[] Just play our Doom (2) Add-Ons: Sudtic, Teutic, Obtic. Thanks. []
------------------------------
From: John Wakelin <johnw@datametrics.com>
Date: Wed, 5 Jul 95 17:29:18 -0500
Subject: Not an editing related post (Vets ignore)
> What is NWT and where can I get it?
Here's a couple of tips for all you newbies out there:
- --------------CUT HERE AND TAPE TO LEFT EDGE OF SCREEN------------
1. Learn to FTP - Then, FTP to ftp.cdrom.com and take a look around.
95% of all your future questions will be eliminated by this step.
2. If you have a question that is of the form:
What is <fill in the blank> and where can I get it?
STOP - Change the address to be the person in whose post you saw the
neat sounding toy mentioned - NOW press the SEND button.
- -OR-
Go to step 1.
- ------------------------------------------------------------------
This is not meant to be mean. This list is *really* starting to get
clogged up and I for one am not happy about the quality of the posts
doing the clogging. I am not the most active participant in the
discussion (READ:lurker) but that is because I don't believe I often
have anything important to say and/or ask. I remember the last time
we had an influx of beginner questions. That was when Steve set up
the beginner help service. Now it's happening again and noone is
paying any attention to the nice, friendly pointers to the service.
Trust me, that service is much easier to deal with than the full
mailbox message that you are going to receive from your provider (AOL
was it?) when people start to retaliate in mean ways.
I know I am going to get a ton of mail saying that all I am doing is
chewing band-width (I hate that term) myself but I am getting fed up.
I belong to lists where you don't even get a warning. I belong to
lists that .killfile *.AOL.COM. Steve and his predecessors have been
*extreamly* unobtrusive hosts for a long time. I would not like to
think that it was necessary for them to change.
This is not IRC; this is not a newsgroup; this is not a help-desk.
I'll stop now...
johnw
__________________________________________________________
#include <stupidstuff.h>
#define USER "johnw" /* John Wakelin */
/* johnw@datametrics.com */
main() /* (703) 385 7700 */
{
while (isstupid(USER)) ignore(USER);
}
------------------------------
From: Raphael.Quinet@aachen.eed.ericsson.se
Date: Wed, 5 Jul 95 23:17:40 +0200
Subject: Re: The Ultimate Doom
On Wed, 5 Jul 95 10:38 PDT, jroberto@on-ramp.ior.com (Jacob Roberto) wrote:
[huge quote deleted]
> >I hope they will soon release a patch which fixes the bugs in the maps
> >(it only takes a few minutes to go through all maps with a good editor!)
> >and increases the version number to 1.999 or something like that.
> How about if YOU went through with an editer and fixed all the bugs. That
> would certainly make it more playable. If someone does this maybe they can
> even make a patch that fixes things.
I have already done it for all versions of Doom, Doom II and Heretic. It is
really easy indeed: I start DEU 5.3, go to the first level, select "run all
checks" from the menu, then fix any bits that are incorrect. Then I go to
the next level... The whole process takes less than half an hour (on a fast
machine). But nobody is allowed to re-distribute a modified IWAD.
I suggested that they do it because it is too late when the product has been
released. Furthermore, they probably want to make the changes in the DWD
file that their editor uses, not in the WAD file which is generated later.
So it would be better for them to use an editor like DEU to check the levels,
then use their own editor for fixing the bugs in the DWD file. It only takes
a few minutes to understand how to use the consistency checker in most
third-party editors, so anyone working at or for id Software could have done
it.
They make great games, but it's a pity they don't fix some bugs that could
have been found and fixed easily if they had listened to my suggestion. By
the way, I also urged them to forward my suggestion to the people working
on Heretic II and Strife. I also offered to customize DEU for this (I have
been told that Strife will use some slightly different resources in the WAD
files), in order to make it easier for them. Maybe I should e-mail them
again before the new games are released?
Yet I don't want to complain too much. Despite the bugs, the games are fun
to play. And they'd better work on Quake now...
- -Raphael
------------------------------
From: Genesis Krzyzaniak <genesisk@eden.com>
Date: Wed, 5 Jul 1995 18:18:58 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: Re: The Ultimate Doom
On Wed, 5 Jul 1995, ulasieben wrote:
> ...OHH! Someone try this and post pack to the list: try to DM with someone
> having Ultimate Doom and other having Doom 1.9 regged. try ExM1 of 1st
> 3 episodes. See if you get versions different or consostency errors.
> -- Evil Genius (Jimmy Sieben)
E1M1 in Ultimate Doom has changed so i know that level wouldn't work...
I played on a pwad with someone and that worked fine, so as long as the
level is the same it should work...
Oh, in case you didn't know, you can play Doom2 to Doom deathmatch just fine
as long as the level you play is the same... (and of course you both use
the same engine version..)
On a similar note, i made a mod of idBest3 that works with both doom 1 and 2
and is only a few hundred bytes bigger. So when people want to play it
it doesn't matter what game each person uses. If anyone wants to check
it out it's available on my web page... (in the deathmatch wad section...)
- --
Genesis Krzyzaniak - Genesisk@Eden.Com - http://www.eden.com/~genesisk
------------------------------
From: Denis.Moeller@kiel.netsurf.de (Denis)
Date: Wed, 5 Jul 95 23:44 GMT
Subject: Re: DOOM -> Heretic WADs?
>Actually, a friend and I are working on a huge patch that's almost exactly
>the same thing. We're calling it DoomTC--Doom I to Heretic. We've gotten all
>the textures/flats, and we're working on the items. Unfortunatly, we've
>temporarily halted work on it while we're waiting for a Heretic v1.1. Too
>many bugs in 1.0 for us...
So, now there is version 1.2 of Heretic. Go on. :)
cya
Denis
[] Denis Moeller, author of NWT v1.3 and TiC's WAD Reviews. []
[] Just play our Doom (2) Add-Ons: Sudtic, Teutic, Obtic. Thanks. []
------------------------------
End of doom-editing-digest V1 #337
**********************************
