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Doom Editing Digest Vol. 01 Nr. 280
From: owner-doom-editing-digest
To: doom-editing-digest@nvg.unit.no
Subject: doom-editing-digest V1 #280
Reply-To: doom-editing
Errors-To: owner-doom-editing-digest
Precedence: bulk
doom-editing-digest Wednesday, 17 May 1995 Volume 01 : Number 280
Re: Announce: GRINDER1.WAD
Re: WAD Error
hanging sector
RE: Re: Announce: GRINDER1.WAD
Re: Announce: GRINDER1.WAD
Re: Another WAD Error
RE: Re: Announce: GRINDER1.WAD
Re: WAD Error
NEW weekly reminder: beginners' questions
looking for "normal" graphics
Re: Announce: GRINDER1.WAD
Re: Announce: GRINDER1.WAD
Re: People on list creating 32 levels
WQ: Save Game and Other File Formats!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Feid Gerald <ugfeid@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu>
Date: Tue, 16 May 1995 02:15:27 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: Re: Announce: GRINDER1.WAD
For ALL DM ONLY wimps:
Oh, Jeez. Yet ANOTHER useless friggin deathnatch level.
C'mon folks - if you can't program a complete level, leave the damn
things alone!!!!!
Deathmatch programming is for those who have neither the brains nor the
balls (not to mention seriously deficient programming skills) to do a
FULL level.
Who gives a flying fig if you can blow a buddy away. WWWWHHHHHEEEEEE.
99% of the people who play the game have better thing to do than plan
their day around 'Doomin' their Buds.' Like work and families.
If these levels are so damn good, PROVE IT! Create levels
ALL players can use, not just that 1% who haven't got anything better to
do. Jeez. Do it right or get a life.
Signed,
Had enough of those useless, half-baked levels that put any sane player to
sleep!
(not to mention wasting time and money downloading them, because most of
the people who make them can't be bothered to tell you the levels are
only half done. And don't bother pointing out the few who do - they are
the exceptions, NOT the rule.)
------------------------------
From: l-sieben@MEMPHIS.EDU (ulasieben)
Date: Sun, 14 May 1995 13:32:32 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: Re: WAD Error
>ulasieben wrote:
>>
>> Don't worry, this thread wont spark another 32 level creation :).
>> Thanks for all your help.
>>
>Sounds like the same error message we used to get when using the
>you reexamine them if so.
>
>Steve.
This is weird. I appreciate all the help, but the error wasn't about
textures at all!. In the new area if my level, there were new textures.
The level had a hallway split up into 6 sections (it was about 768 long).
Now, because I am so lazy, I simple make the different sections of the
hall disjoint sectors. Now, the problem came when opening the last door,
revealing a round section (still the same hall way sector!). Doom bombed
out with the error. To fix the error, I made the bubble part its own
sector. Upon opening the last door, some new textures were visible, however
when I fixed the error, I didnt touch the part with new textures (it was
around a corner in a separate sector). Why did this occur?
MOO
The Tuesday Terror,
-- Evil Genius (Jimmy Sieben)
l-sieben@sieben
"Forever Fragged,
Forever Fragging"
====================================================================
MAIL HAD TO BE APPROVED BY CARETAKER (bounced for some reason)
====================================================================
------------------------------
From: D.Casali@rea0808.wins.icl.co.uk
Date: Tue, 16 May 1995 09:52:44 +0100
Subject: hanging sector
Dear best-editor-around - please tell me how to make a sector
hang in mid air. I know it is possible because I heard it on
here a while back. I know how to make an invisible platform, but
I want a rectangular sector to have the MARBFACE texture on it
hanging in a deep, wide shaft (that you can't walk into). I can
get the bottom to disappear but not the upper sidedefs. DC
------------------------------
From: D.Casali@rea0808.wins.icl.co.uk
Date: Tue, 16 May 1995 10:19:52 +0100
Subject: RE: Re: Announce: GRINDER1.WAD
- --KKa5429kiCmnBgi2BZcJm1z1GTEy9V7Y
Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
OK, who was the joker who sent this message? PLEASE, you
insulted me beyond redemption with your accusation of my having
no life - I deathmatch whenever I get the chance and I can
assure you I have a very active, healthy social and love life,
more so, probably, than you :) quality Deathmatch programming
actually takes quite considerable talent - as you will no doubt
- --KKa5429kiCmnBgi2BZcJm1z1GTEy9V7Y
Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
appreciate if you ever had the "balls" to give it a go. I'll admit
that I sometimes make a deathmatch level if I can't be f***ed to
plan out and construct a full function single player level, but
that doesn't mean I bung the DM level together with sticks and
glue, architecture, playability and weapon placement are even more
important in a DM level than a single player level if people are
going to come back and play again and again.
And one other thing - you have to be totally antisocial to prefer
playing a computer than other human beings, as playing with other
people also involves mixing with those people, and that mixing can
sometimes be called socialising :)
The thing about really good deathmatch levels is that they are
small and look the part, not so with single player levels - they
are at their best when they are intricate with secrets, surprises
and clever use of key areas - useless if you're trying to find
your opponent. That's why you need to decide a target audience -
deathmatch freaks or single player freaks - not both.
Lastly, Ok, I am also fed up with those halfbaked piles of s**t we
see appearing all over, they shouldn't be uploaded unless they are
good and ready, and then the author has no business raving about
them and wasting others' time unless he has had enough praise to
justify his rantings.
The Doom lord has spoketh
Dario Casali
- --KKa5429kiCmnBgi2BZcJm1z1GTEy9V7Y--
------------------------------
From: helmberg@li01.ad.or.at (Florian Helmberger)
Date: Tue, 16 May 1995 14:17:36 +0200
Subject: Re: Announce: GRINDER1.WAD
>
>For ALL DM ONLY wimps:
>
>Oh, Jeez. Yet ANOTHER useless friggin deathnatch level.
>C'mon folks - if you can't program a complete level, leave the damn
>things alone!!!!!
>
>Deathmatch programming is for those who have neither the brains nor the
>balls (not to mention seriously deficient programming skills) to do a
>FULL level.
>
>Who gives a flying fig if you can blow a buddy away. WWWWHHHHHEEEEEE.
>99% of the people who play the game have better thing to do than plan
>their day around 'Doomin' their Buds.' Like work and families.
>
>If these levels are so damn good, PROVE IT! Create levels
>ALL players can use, not just that 1% who haven't got anything better to
>do. Jeez. Do it right or get a life.
>
>
>Signed,
>
>Had enough of those useless, half-baked levels that put any sane player to
>sleep!
>(not to mention wasting time and money downloading them, because most of
>the people who make them can't be bothered to tell you the levels are
>only half done. And don't bother pointing out the few who do - they are
>the exceptions, NOT the rule.)
>
Sorry, I could'nt stand this muddled opinion! So, Mr. Feid Gerald, maybe
you should start banging your head on the table - thats a thing you can do
alone!
Look: the most interesting thing about DOOM is that you can play it with
enemys who are REAL. So if you don't like this - or even have no
friends to play with (maybe thats the reason for this strange
message) - go and play something different - nobody force you to
play Deathmatch!
- -Florian
___________________________________________________________________________
Florian Helmberger e-mail : helmberg@email.ad.or.at
Himmelpfortgasse 10/6 KaraNet : DOOM Maniac
1010 Vienna Voice : +43-1-513 11 36
Austria, EU Fax : +43-1-513 11 36
- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Barbarus hic ego sum, quia non intelligor ulli!
------------------------------
From: S.Benner@lancaster.ac.uk (Steve Benner)
Date: Tue, 16 May 95 14:11:11 +0100
Subject: Re: Another WAD Error
At 8:52 pm 15/5/95, ulasieben wrote:
> Ok. I am full of WAD errors these ays :). Here is this one:
>I have a level I am maing that spans a lot of coordinates. The
>leftnost X coordinate is in the -6000s and the right most is in the
>+4000s. Top most y is about +2000, bottom most y is like -3000s.
>The problem is that now I cannot play the level. I evidently did
>something, but I don't think it is size realted because the level
>was structured like this before the error. Now, this error I get is
>unlike any other error I have seen. DOOM II 1.9 does't bonb out
>"neatly" and say something like Vivplanes overflow....instead, upon
>starting the level, it immediately enters a half text, half video
>mode that resembles the screen that appears when you have a linedef
>without sidedefs. I cannot track the error down. 1) What is causing it
>and 2) What do I do to fix and avoid this error in the future? Thanks!
> MOO
You've run DOOM out of memory and crashed the DOS extender. It could be
virtually anything from a scrambled nodes tree up (or is that down??). My
guess is the same as Raphael's: the blockmap is too big.
- -Steve
------------------------------
From: S.Benner@lancaster.ac.uk (Steve Benner)
Date: Tue, 16 May 95 14:23:20 +0100
Subject: RE: Re: Announce: GRINDER1.WAD
At 9:19 am 16/5/95, D.Casali@rea0808.wins.icl.co.uk wrote:
>OK, who was the joker who sent this message?
Rest assured the joker has been reprimanded. Consider this topic over, now,
please!
>
> The Doom lord has spoketh
>
And now one of the DOOM-editing list lords hath spoken ;) (note the
grammar, Dario: don't they teach them anything in school these days??? :-)
You'll tell me next that cold showers are no longer compulsory...)
- -Steve
------------------------------
From: CalvnHobs1@AOL.COM
Date: Tue, 16 May 1995 09:45:39 -0400
Subject: Re: WAD Error
Hello guys...
Please don't say "Oh no ! Not a fraggin AOL'er on the list !?" because I'll
smash your friggin face in. As soon as I get around to buying a real Internet
server I will and probably save a lot of money and get away from all these
homo's.....
Anyhow I'd like to give you guys a little tip I use with WinDeu32 ( the best
editor by far ). Ok when I'm making a huge useless Deathmatch level I start
off by naming the first part New01.wad, every time I make a good size change
I just save the level as New02.wad and so on. I don't rebuild everytime when
the level gets huge because it takes to long on my system. This way of saving
levels helped me learn how to fix my own mistakes like "num-lumps" or
"Visplanes overflow". I even zip the older ones and store them in case I end
up hating what I've made for the last three days.
------------------------------
From: S.Benner@lancaster.ac.uk (Steve Benner)
Date: Tue, 16 May 95 15:20:22 +0100
Subject: NEW weekly reminder: beginners' questions
FROM: the list caretaker; *** A REMINDER ***
The purpose of this list is to discuss *advanced* DOOM editing techniques.
If you have a question but don't know whether it's advanced or not, and
would like to avoid the extreme embarrassment of demonstrating the extent
of your ignorance in front of your peers, you are encouraged to mail it in
the first instance to:
Steve Benner : S.Benner@lancaster.ac.uk
Your question will either be answered or, if deemed suitable, forwarded to
the list. This service is offered as a potential red-face saving and
list-annoyance abatement service. Feel free to send questions at any level
on any topic of WAD editing.
**NOTE: If your questions are prefixed with the code WQ: in the subject
field (e.g. Subject: WQ: Sprites), they will be processed quicker because
they will be brought to light sooner!**
Remember also that if you want any general info about this list, you should
send mail to the list-server, thus:
To: majordomo@nvg.unit.no
Subject:
Body: info doom-editing hint
=====================================================================
This reminder will be posted here weekly, with the same subject title.
==
- -Steve Check out: http://cres1.lancs.ac.uk/~esasb1/doom/index.html
and "Tricks of the DOOM Programming Gurus" (SAMS: ISBN:0-672-30717-0)
------------------------------
From: Khat <ssalter@silver.ucs.indiana.edu>
Date: Tue, 16 May 1995 11:47:27 -0500 (EST)
Subject: looking for "normal" graphics
hiya,
I'm working on a series of levels that will be set in this day and
time, more or less. I wanna replace a lot of graphics with "normal"
things like tables and chairs and maybe a car or few. I am trying to
decide the best way to do this. Should I draw 3D models and render
them and capture diff rotations of an object like a table and replace
some sprites I am not using, like the Wolf3d ones? OR shall I search
other wads to rip graphics from if it has already been done? OR shall
I finagle with flats and such to fake such objects?
any opinions?
thanks,
Steve
------------------------------
From: avatar@widomaker.com (Mackey McCandlish)
Date: Tue, 16 May 95 15:43 EDT
Subject: Re: Announce: GRINDER1.WAD
>
>Had enough of those useless, half-baked levels that put any sane player to
>sleep!
>(not to mention wasting time and money downloading them, because most of
>the people who make them can't be bothered to tell you the levels are
>only half done. And don't bother pointing out the few who do - they are
>the exceptions, NOT the rule.)
>
I find this post extremely perturbing.. I'll put it to you like
this: I spent some 7 months making a TC patch for DOOM, which was all good
and well, but what you have to realize is that DOOM is now most used for
DeathMatch! Who wants to DL big "full" (in your opinion) levels just to
fight against a bunch of monsters they've seen heavy-knows how many times
before? Meaning that I had to customize a couple of my levels to be more
dmatch friendly, because I knew that that is the thing keeping DOOM alive.
Hey, I think it's fine that you enjoying walking around in a level by
yourself checking out the nifty invisible staircases and "full" rooms, but I
don't seriously enjoy it unless I can take a friend in there and pull some
technique out of it! I've spent the last month or so really into DOOM2
deathmatch, but got quickly bored of map7 (I can only take the same frag
over and over so many times). So I started making simple dmatch levels that
focused on technique or actual dmatch skills: Places you'd have to slide run
to reach, sectors leveled in certain ways to permit rockets to hit over used
areas, etc. The result, which'll soon be released in a collection as
Avatar1.zip, is 5 very-tested levels with extensive texture alignment and
choices, and lots of dmatch architechture to make it more frag intensive.
Are these levels fun by yourself? Not really, and they aren't supposed to
be. Are they fun with a friend? Definitely, moreso than one of your "full"
levels. What does this boil down to? One of us likes to play by ourselves,
one likes to practice his skills on a living opponent. This is mearly a
difference in opinion, not a justification for trashing the entire other wad
type. Think about it.
-*The Avatar*-
http://www.widomaker.com./~avatar
(Nifty pics of DMF there, too).
ftp: ftp.widomaker.com in pub/avatar
The key to ONE MUST FALL is knowing who the 17 hit combos
work on..
DOOM MUST FALL IS OUT! Get it from my home page or ftp site!
------------------------------
From: Brad Spencer <spencer@ug.cs.dal.ca>
Date: Tue, 16 May 1995 17:47:08 -0300
Subject: Re: Announce: GRINDER1.WAD
On Tue, 16 May 1995, Feid Gerald wrote:
> For ALL DM ONLY wimps:
>
> Oh, Jeez. Yet ANOTHER useless friggin deathnatch level.
> C'mon folks - if you can't program a complete level, leave the damn
> things alone!!!!!
>
> Deathmatch programming is for those who have neither the brains nor the
> balls (not to mention seriously deficient programming skills) to do a
> FULL level.
>
> Who gives a flying fig if you can blow a buddy away. WWWWHHHHHEEEEEE.
> 99% of the people who play the game have better thing to do than plan
> their day around 'Doomin' their Buds.' Like work and families.
>
> If these levels are so damn good, PROVE IT! Create levels
> ALL players can use, not just that 1% who haven't got anything better to
> do. Jeez. Do it right or get a life.
>
>
> Signed,
>
> Had enough of those useless, half-baked levels that put any sane player to
> sleep!
> (not to mention wasting time and money downloading them, because most of
> the people who make them can't be bothered to tell you the levels are
> only half done. And don't bother pointing out the few who do - they are
> the exceptions, NOT the rule.)
>
Every Doom archive I've ever seen separates the Deathmatch wads from the
"regular" ones, so I don't see how you can waste time downloading them...
And if you have to pay for your Internet access, you should be a bit more
discriminating in your choice of transfer (perhaps read the text files
first?!?!) instead of yelling at people because they don't make things
exactly the way you like it.
- ------------------------------------------------------------------
Brad Spencer - Bilbo - spencer@ug.cs.dal.ca - Dalhousie University
"Everybody is Kung-Fu Fragging. . ." http://ug.cs.dal.ca/~spencer/
------------------------------
From: Andrew Morton <amorton@nsn.scs.unr.edu>
Date: Tue, 16 May 1995 16:07:43 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Re: People on list creating 32 levels
Count me in even if only as a play tester.
+-----------------------------------------------------------------+
| /\ |\ /| | amorton@nsn.scs.unr.edu |
| / \ | | \/ | _|_ |
| |--| |^\ /\| \_/ | | /\ |\ | /\ |^\ IRC Nick : Gomer |
| | | | | \/| / | | \/ | | \/ | | |
+-----------------------------------------------------------------+
------------------------------
From: jeffj@mcs.com
Date: Tue, 16 May 1995 18:19:45 -0500
Subject: WQ: Save Game and Other File Formats!
Grabbed this mailing list by mistake, and decided it's time to use it...
We are working on about 5 or 6 new projects for DOOM/DOOM2/HERETIC. I need to
get my
hands on the file formats for the SAVED GAMES (mainly at this point).
I have all else at the moment... PLEASE do not refer me to DMSPEC16.ZIP, as
it does
not contain this info...
Also, if I pull the WALL or FLOOR textures out of DOOM / D2 and add them to a
WAD for
HERETIC, is there a Palette problem? If so, do we know the discrepancies???
Thanks a lot... PS.. The program is not to be mentioned in great detail,
otherwise
someone else will beat us to the punch. Also look for our new 16 node fial in
BBS
for multi-play of DOOM/DOOM2/HERETIC and the crappy DESCENT and ROTT!
TATA! Jeff Jones ... aka. pfalcoln
------------------------------
End of doom-editing-digest V1 #280
**********************************
