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Doom Editing Digest Vol. 01 Nr. 221
From: owner-doom-editing-digest
To: doom-editing-digest@nvg.unit.no
Subject: doom-editing-digest V1 #221
Reply-To: doom-editing
Errors-To: owner-doom-editing-digest
Precedence: bulk
doom-editing-digest Tuesday, 28 March 1995 Volume 01 : Number 221
Re: stair linedefs
UDS 1.666 errors
Re: stair linedefs
Re: That max lines thing...
DEBUNK alert
Re: DOOM 1 -vs- DOOM 2
Re: DOOM 1 -vs- DOOM 2
Re: stair linedefs
Re: DOOM 1 -vs- DOOM 2
a staircase with differing floor textures!
Re: stair linedefs
Re: Tag 666
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: fenske@rocke.electro.swri.edu (Robert Fenske Jr)
Date: Mon, 27 Mar 95 13:49:04 CST
Subject: Re: stair linedefs
Remember that you can make stairs that descend instead of the normal
ascend. I don't know how the linedef ordering of descending stairs differs
(if any) from the ascending stairs.
The 1.666 UDS states that the turbo stairs are crushing. Is this
really true?
Robert Fenske, Jr. rfenske@swri.edu Sw | The Taming the C*sm*s series:
Electromagnetics Division /R---\ |
Southwest Research Institute | I | | "The Martian canals were the
San Antonio, Texas USA \----/ | Martians' last ditch effort."
------------------------------
From: fenske@rocke.electro.swri.edu (Robert Fenske Jr)
Date: Mon, 27 Mar 95 14:04:38 CST
Subject: UDS 1.666 errors
Perhaps a list of the errors in the current UDS would be helpful.
The ones I currently know about are:
line types 105 and 111 descriptions are switched
only the cycling crushing line types lock out further sector actions
(just mentioned by Steve Benner)
creatures will not attack through 2-sided lines that do not have
the 2S bit set; they did in v1.2 but do not in v1.666 or higher
Robert Fenske, Jr. rfenske@swri.edu Sw | The Taming the C*sm*s series:
Electromagnetics Division /R---\ |
Southwest Research Institute | I | | "The Martian canals were the
San Antonio, Texas USA \----/ | Martians' last ditch effort."
------------------------------
From: mneves@eros.rdc.puc-rio.br (Marcus Vinicius de A.B. Neves)
Date: Mon, 27 Mar 1995 17:23:39 -0300
Subject: Re: stair linedefs
> Yep, this much at least I knew. (Check out Tree2.WAD, released last
I have 2 questions:
1) How can I build a "circled-stair" (that rounds a pillar, for example)?
2) Is there a .wad that implements one stair like this?
Thanks in advance.
Marcus Vinicius Neves.
------------------------------
From: fenske@rocke.electro.swri.edu (Robert Fenske Jr)
Date: Mon, 27 Mar 95 13:46:22 CST
Subject: Re: That max lines thing...
>I have a WAD with 65 sectors in a grid: from one corner, all sectors are
>visible at once. I have set all floors and ceilings such that there is a
>step between every adjacent sector. I have not managed to obtain the "No
>more visplanes" message yet!
I experimented (but never finished) with this recently. I set
up a a long hall of sectors instead of a grid. My tenative conclusion is
that the visplanes error come from viewing more than 64 subsectors at once.
Since each subsector has a floor and a ceiling plane, the actual fault comes
from having more than 128 planes. But I was still missing something since
I could not 100% predict what would cause the error. Or for that matter
what the difference is between the "no more visplanes" error and the "visplane
overflow (#)" error. Part of my confusion may have stemmed from the fact
that I assumed that you could always see the (sub)sector you are standing in,
but that is not always true so it doesn't get counted.
Robert Fenske, Jr. rfenske@swri.edu Sw | The Taming the C*sm*s series:
Electromagnetics Division /R---\ |
Southwest Research Institute | I | | "The Martian canals were the
San Antonio, Texas USA \----/ | Martians' last ditch effort."
------------------------------
From: Robert Forsman <thoth@cis.ufl.edu>
Date: Mon, 27 Mar 1995 15:01:07 EST
Subject: DEBUNK alert
Greg Lewis <gregl@umich.edu> ,in message <Pine.SOL.3.91.950327123648.14211A-100
000@pong.rs.itd.umich.edu>, wrote:
> They
> can also branch into two sets of stairs, if one stair is not a precise
> rectangle. Doom just regards any linedef that's oriented correctly as a
> "next stair". Note: no official testing on any of this, just my
> observations.
Well, I just tested it, and NO you can not cause stairs to split. I was
skeptical of this from the outset because I remember somebody's post from a
long time ago about how much difficulty the person had creating a staircase
that split.
His solution was to tag multiple sectors to the linedef, thereby creating
several chains at the outset.
The other "solution" is to use disjoint sectors. I can also see techniques
that use disjoint sectors whose adjacency is "behind the curtain", using
linedefs completely outside the playing field to affect the course of events.
If anyone is interested in an illustration of this technique, email me and
I'll post a sample wad as soon as I implement my MakeHiddenStaircase.
Reaffirmation of old info:
+ the linedef joining the two sectors MUST be Shoot-Through (2S) to
propagate a chain.
+ a difference in sector height does NOT halt the chain
+ a difference in floor texture DOES halt the chain
ALSO, new info:
+ a difference in sector special type does NOT halt the chain
+ (possible rehash/clarification) If the lowest numbered 2S linedef pointing
into a stair sector points out (left) into a lower stair sector from the same
chain, then keep searching for another linedef. It doesn't stop the chain
right there. This makes construction of switchback staircases easier than I
had originally thought.
In case that last paragraph was too opaque, here's something even MORE opaque,
code for my secondary highlights. Feel free to add this to your editor, or
derive code from it, just make sure you credit me.
case line_table::Stairs:
{
BitSet prev;
for (i=0; i<context->sectors.len(); i++) {
const sector &curr = context->sectors[i];
if (curr.tag == focus.tag)
prev.add(i);
}
while (prev.card()) {
rval = Union(rval, prev);
BitSet next;
for (i=0; i<context->linedefs.len(); i++) {
const linedef &curr = context->linedefs[i];
int s[2] = { curr.sect_on_side(0, *context),
curr.sect_on_side(1, *context) };
if (s[1]<0 || s[0]<0)
continue;
const sector & secta = context->sectors[s[0]];
const sector & sectb = context->sectors[s[1]];
if (prev.contains(s[0]) &&
!rval.contains(s[1]) &&
(curr.flags & linedef::ShootThrough) &&
secta.floor_txt == sectb.floor_txt) {
next.add(s[1]); // make sure we don't infinite loop
prev.del(s[0]); // we've dealt with this one
}
}
prev = next;
}
}
return rval;
------------------------------
From: fenske@rocke.electro.swri.edu (Robert Fenske Jr)
Date: Mon, 27 Mar 95 15:49:01 CST
Subject: Re: DOOM 1 -vs- DOOM 2
From v1.666 on DooM I and II can use the new line types. I know
v1.2 DooM I will ignore (i.e., do nothing) the new types so I would not
worry about any line type differences between any of the game versions.
For DooM I v1.666 on, you can have the new DooM II things in the
WAD without the game crashing; it's just that the game quits loading in
any more things when it hits a DooM II thing that it doesn't have a sprite
for.
Robert Fenske, Jr. rfenske@swri.edu Sw | The Taming the C*sm*s series:
Electromagnetics Division /R---\ |
Southwest Research Institute | I | | "The Martian canals were the
San Antonio, Texas USA \----/ | Martians' last ditch effort."
------------------------------
From: Genesis Krzyzaniak <genesisk@eden.com>
Date: Mon, 27 Mar 1995 16:04:27 -0600 (CST)
Subject: Re: DOOM 1 -vs- DOOM 2
On Mon, 27 Mar 1995, Robert Forsman wrote:
> What happens if you use one of the linedefs that was introduced with 1.666
> in a normal DOOM 1 wad?
Works perfectly, see: rrward02.wad...
> Are they used anywhere in the DOOM 1 missions?
I doubt it...
> Should we allow users with only registered DOOM 1 to easily use these
> linedefs which were obviously added to support DOOM 2?
I don't have doom 1 but if i did i would definitely want to be able to use
the new linedefs...
- --
Genesis Krzyzaniak - Genesisk@Eden.Com - http://www.eden.com/~genesisk
------------------------------
From: Ethan Brodsky <ERICBRODSKY@psl.wisc.edu>
Date: Mon, 27 Mar 95 16:14 CST
Subject: Re: stair linedefs
Marcus Vinicius Neves wrote:
>I have 2 questions:
>1) How can I build a "circled-stair" (that rounds a pillar, for example)?
>2) Is there a .wad that implements one stair like this?
I've forgotten most of my WAD building knowledge, but I remember struggling
with rising staircases when I was building Crusher. You can find it at my
WWW page or at ftp.cdrom.com (It may not be on other sites, since someone
named their one-room level Crusher and uploaded it) I remember that the
linedef numbers had to be in a certain order and the first sidedef had to
be on a certain side. The rising staircase is near the coords -3000,-350.
You can download crusher at:
ftp.cdrom.com /pub/doom/levels/doom/a-c/crusher.zip
http://www.xraylith.wisc.edu/~ebrodsky/other/doom.html
Ethan Brodsky
------------------------------
From: Brad Spencer <spencer@ug.cs.dal.ca>
Date: Mon, 27 Mar 1995 17:55:24 -0400
Subject: Re: DOOM 1 -vs- DOOM 2
On Mon, 27 Mar 1995, Robert Forsman wrote:
> For those not interested in the stairs question, here's one for you.
>
> What happens if you use one of the linedefs that was introduced with 1.666
> in a normal DOOM 1 wad? Are they used anywhere in the DOOM 1 missions? Are
> the necessary sounds in the WAD? Will they work? Should we allow users with
> only registered DOOM 1 to easily use these linedefs which were obviously added
> to support DOOM 2?
>
I use blazing doors and lifts and everything all the time in Doom. All
I do is type the number from Romero's list into DEU's "Enter a decimal
number" and it works, sounds and all. As far as I know, all of the 1.666
linedefs work with the original game.
- ------------------------------------------------------------------
Brad Spencer - Bilbo - spencer@ug.cs.dal.ca - Dalhousie University
"Everybody is Kung-Fu Fragging . . ." Remember... God plays Doom
------------------------------
From: Robert Forsman <thoth@cis.ufl.edu>
Date: Mon, 27 Mar 1995 17:07:21 EST
Subject: a staircase with differing floor textures!
I did it. I created a "single" staircase with two different floor
textures. It uses the behind-the-scenes linedefs I mentioned in my
earlier post. Basically there are two separate chains of staircase, one
for each floor texture. The user never sees the sectors that glue the
mess together.
The whole mess was created in about 30 minutes with the PFME's new
MakeHiddenStaircase option. One thing I have discovered is that
creating staircase chains that abut is a tricky business. In the
process of rearranging linedefs, you can introduce a lower numbered
linedef into an environment where it interferes with the functioning of
a previously arranged chain.
Sorry about the size (18K). Flame me personally if you think it's too
big. Just walk through the teleporter and then walk forward to activate
the stairs.
begin 644 funkystair.zip
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M%Q<"B&N>TKB9)?D34$L!`A0`%`````@`F89['OA7-J!Q-```Y:X```P`````
M`````````````````$953DM94U1!+E=!1%!+!08``````0`!`#H```";-```
"````
`
end
------------------------------
From: Dave Worth <mbworth@argo.unm.edu>
Date: Mon, 27 Mar 1995 16:12:01 -0700 (MST)
Subject: Re: stair linedefs
The best way is to make the gap as was suggested then to move the
verticies together, this is how I have done it in the past.
hope to have helped. :)
------------------------------
From: fenske@rocke.electro.swri.edu (Robert Fenske Jr)
Date: Mon, 27 Mar 95 13:34:43 CST
Subject: Re: Tag 666
My understanding was that the 666 tag gets activated when the last
"boss" creature is killed, with the DooM I bosses being the baron, cyberdemon,
and spider demon. I don't know which DooM II creatures would be considered
"bosses". I also thought that the 666 tag only worked on E?M8 levels. On
the other hand I don't know of anyone who ever really experimented with the
666 tag.
Robert Fenske, Jr. rfenske@swri.edu Sw | The Taming the C*sm*s series:
Electromagnetics Division /R---\ |
Southwest Research Institute | I | | "The Martian canals were the
San Antonio, Texas USA \----/ | Martians' last ditch effort."
------------------------------
End of doom-editing-digest V1 #221
**********************************
