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Doom Editing Digest Vol. 01 Nr. 199
From: owner-doom-editing-digest
To: doom-editing-digest@nvg.unit.no
Subject: doom-editing-digest V1 #199
Reply-To: doom-editing
Errors-To: owner-doom-editing-digest
Precedence: bulk
doom-editing-digest Wednesday, 8 March 1995 Volume 01 : Number 199
List name for THE WAD?
Re: Maximum 2 sided LineDefs
Re: Deathmatch uniform colors
Re: Deathmatch uniform colors
Re: Maximum 2 sided LineDefs
Re: Maximum 2 sided LineDefs
Re: Maximum 2 sided LineDefs
Re: Proj: non-hostiles...
Re: Weird WAD Problems
Engine speed comparisons (was Re: The Wad)
Re: Deathmatch uniform colors
Re: Maximum 2 sided LineDefs
Re: Deathmatch uniform colors
Re: Deathmatch uniform colors
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: BonesBro@AOL.COM
Date: Mon, 6 Mar 1995 20:49:38 -0500
Subject: List name for THE WAD?
Could someone e-mail me the list name for THE WAD? It was posted here about a
week ago, but I lost the name. Thanks...
------------------------------
From: Mike Duggan <mduggan@ram.ramnet.net>
Date: Mon, 6 Mar 1995 22:43:33 -500 (EST)
Subject: Re: Maximum 2 sided LineDefs
On Sun, 5 Mar 1995, William D. Whitaker wrote:
>
> Hey all-
>
> What are the maximum number of two sided linedefs
> that DOOM can draw in one view? Last time I RTFM
> it was "around 62". Is this true for v1.666? what
> about v1.9?
According to the DEU(tm) documentaries, it's about 16.
------------------------------
From: Mike Duggan <mduggan@ram.ramnet.net>
Date: Mon, 6 Mar 1995 22:41:25 -500 (EST)
Subject: Re: Deathmatch uniform colors
On Mon, 6 Mar 1995, Ray Morford wrote:
> Sorry, a little off topic, but most of the doom utility writers
> seem to be on this mail list:
>
> I think everyone will agree that the uniform color has an effect on
> the deathmatch results - green is just too easy to see.
>
> There used to be a utility called DOOMCC that was supposed to change
> the uniform colors to make thing more fair. I tried it and it doesn't
> seem to work - probably because I'm running 1.9 and it was written for
> 1.2.
>
> Anyway, what I'm looking for is a utility that will allow me to make
> the uniform colors fair: change them to be similar - change them to be
> random (as it is now on our IPX network, one guy always gets green due
> to his network ID).
>
> Got anything?
If I remember correctly, there are some blocks of color among the sprites
of doom near the beginning of the Wad File that are used for the palette.
Try replacing these colors with desired ones with DMGRAPH(tm)
------------------------------
From: Shawn L Hawkins <SLH3622@tntech.edu>
Date: Tue, 07 Mar 1995 02:08:29 -0600 (CST)
Subject: Re: Deathmatch uniform colors
I was playing with DeHacked the other day (the one that works with 1.9) and
set the Troopers, Sergeants, Imps, and Chaingun Dudes to Green, Indigo,
Brown, and Red Marines. I'd love to play this sometime in a CO-OP game...
It also makes the Imp's fireballs *look* like rockets.
Shawn
------------------------------
From: S.Benner@lancaster.ac.uk (Steve Benner)
Date: Tue, 7 Mar 95 09:42:48 GMT
Subject: Re: Maximum 2 sided LineDefs
At 3:43 am 7/3/95, Mike Duggan wrote:
>On Sun, 5 Mar 1995, William D. Whitaker wrote:
>
>> What are the maximum number of two sided linedefs
>> that DOOM can draw in one view?
>According to the DEU(tm) documentaries, it's about 16.
More myths. This topic has been done to death here guys. The limit is on
"edges" in view -- it is supposedly 256, but no-one seems to know how
"edges" are calculated. Go over the limit and DOOM stops refreshing the
excess surfaces. This produces HoM. If you have too many sectors in view,
you run the risk of exceeding the number of floor and ceilings that can be
rendered in one view. If you have more than 128 of these surfaces, DOOM
crashes to DOS with a "No more visplanes" message.
- -Steve
------------------------------
From: bennes@rpi.edu (Scott Benner)
Date: Tue, 7 Mar 1995 09:38:25 -0500
Subject: Re: Maximum 2 sided LineDefs
From: Mike Duggan <mduggan@ram.ramnet.net>
>On Sun, 5 Mar 1995, William D. Whitaker wrote:
>> Hey all-
>>
>> What are the maximum number of two sided linedefs
>> that DOOM can draw in one view? Last time I RTFM
>> it was "around 62". Is this true for v1.666? what
>> about v1.9?
>According to the DEU(tm) documentaries, it's about 16.
Ok. Let's get this straight for once and for all.
You can have a maximum (and by this I mean it) of 128 linedefs in a row at
once. Any more will cause a visplane overflow. Boom. Back to the OS of your
choice.
------------------------------
From: setc@together.net (Ross Carlson)
Date: Tue, 7 Mar 1995 11:17:43 -0500
Subject: Re: Maximum 2 sided LineDefs
>> What are the maximum number of two sided linedefs
>> that DOOM can draw in one view? Last time I RTFM
>> it was "around 62". Is this true for v1.666? what
>> about v1.9?
>According to the DEU(tm) documentaries, it's about 16.
>
I'm no guru, but I'm sure that I've written levels with staircases with MANY
more than 16 DSLD's, and it slowed down the frame rate just a LITTLE when
that area was in view. Maybe we should run a test.
- -Ross
******************************************************************************
* Ross Alan Carlson * "It will be a great day when our *
* setc@together.net *schools have all the money they need,*
* "Trials & Tribulations" Home Page: *and the Air Force has to hold a bake *
*http://together.net/~setc/thewad.html * sale to buy a bomber." *
******************************************************************************
------------------------------
From: S.Benner@lancaster.ac.uk (Steve Benner)
Date: Tue, 7 Mar 95 16:28:57 GMT
Subject: Re: Proj: non-hostiles...
At 6:52 pm 24/2/95, Paul Francis Turnbull wrote:
>On Thu, 23 Feb 1995, Scott Benner wrote:
>
>>
>> My question is: can you remove the hostility from the monsters? I'm looking
> <snip>
>>
>>
>I've done this for my non-violent Doom patch (a repulsive idea, I know) for
>my son. Just remove the far and close attack frames using dehacked and you
>get monsters that just follow you around. I made friendly ghosts using
>semi-invisable, no clipping troopers with no attack frames. They walk
>through walls (and you) and are kind of funny for a while (well, my son
>likes them). You can still shoot them if you like also.
>
>
Another fun trick is to tweak the REJECT map -- grab yourself a copy of RMB
if you haven't got it. The beauty of this is that you can make areas where
monsters suddenly change their behaviour and go from following you around
threateningly to suddenly attacking you. The demo WAD that comes with the
latest RMB has a beautiful little level which uses a reject map tweak to
produce some pretty scary effects the first couple of times you play it --
even though I says it as shouldn't.
- -Steve
------------------------------
From: S.Benner@lancaster.ac.uk (Steve Benner)
Date: Tue, 7 Mar 95 16:58:06 GMT
Subject: Re: Weird WAD Problems
At 9:48 pm 1/3/95, ulasieben wrote:
>>> Hey there. I am having an error I have never heard of or seen before:
>>> Fisrt, my level is HUGE! Over 700 sectors, over 4000 sidedefs, etc... It's
>>> big.
[snip]
> When Doom
>bombs me, I get a screen that is still in gfx mode, but has red, yellow, and
>orange bars running down it. Looks like a screen you get if your level has a
>line without sides in it, but this isn't the problem (my level runs until I
>reach
>these certain areas). Weird problem, eh?
No, not weird. DOOM just screwed up on RAM, is all. Happens all the time to
some of us, even with id's own levels. :-( If you stand way back from your
machine, you'll probably be able (just) to make out the register dump that
the DOS extender has given -- it's this that's crashed, not DOOM.
Take out as many TSR's as you can -- you'll find the problem moves.
- -Steve
------------------------------
From: S.Benner@lancaster.ac.uk (Steve Benner)
Date: Tue, 7 Mar 95 17:06:58 GMT
Subject: Engine speed comparisons (was Re: The Wad)
At 3:39 am 25/2/95, Greg Lewis wrote:
>> Doom 2 has a heck of a lot more features and a faster engine
>> than Doom.. I have clocked proof of this.
>
> That's funny... as of 1.8 and 1.9 Doom and Doom 2 are identical.
>Strange that identical programs are different speeds.
>
>:)
>^--for the caustic-and-biting-wit impaired
>
Actually, Greg, caustic wit apart, different timings for the two is quite
possible. Take this scenario: I load my editor and snip a level out of DOOM
II. I run this through my trusty level converter and try it out in DOOM 1.
I can then compare like with like, right?
Wrong, of course -- my editor has scrubbed the reject map. The copied level
may play like shit! You'd have to load the copied (but unconverted) level
into DOOM II to compare like with like. THEN, there should be no
difference.
- -Steve
------------------------------
From: cmacord@fedex.com (Charlie Acord)
Date: Tue, 07 Mar 1995 11:11:47 -0600
Subject: Re: Deathmatch uniform colors
>>I think everyone will agree that the uniform color has an effect on
>>the deathmatch results - green is just too easy to see.
>
>I beg to differ! I'm always green, and I win 90% of the time! But, we play
>on levels where you pretty much keep moving, or risk dying a grisly death,
>and no matter what color you are, you are esay to spot if you are moving. I
>can see how it would be a problem on the "hide and seek" levels.
When I play two-man DeathMatch, the green player is far easier to see
against most textures and thus is picked up much faster by the eye, whereas
the gray player blends in more and it usually takes slightly longer to pick
him up. If you don't think a split second can make a major difference in a
DeathMatch, even when one or both players are running at full speed, you are
woefully mistaken, and I would love to prove it to you with a rocket
sandwich or two <grin>. It's kinda like the white outline they put on
handgun sights to help you acquire a sight picture under poor lighting
conditions....it's not a huge deal, but it adds a split second in a
situation where a split second *might* be the differece between living and
dying (one real, one virtual, of course).
Actually, I don't think it matters whether you're running as fast as you can
or hiding somewhere....I just know that when I'm green, I feel like I'm
wearing a neon suit. It hampers my confidence and therefore my daring and
my manuverability if I know I am more visible than my opponent(s).
Especially if my opponent knows it, and most good opponents will.
The easiest way to eliminate all disadvantages and mental anguish is to make
all players the same color in DeathMatch. Obviously, some accomodation
would have to be made for team DeathMatches, but that could be done easily
by affixing a highly visible number to each guy's suit.
Charlie
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Charlie Acord, "the Green Marine" | "Wow, I just found the BFG-9000!!!!"
Telecom Div/FedEx/Memphis/TN | "No kidding?"
(home of BBQ, the blues, and Elvis) | "Yeah"......<click> <whoooooosh>
Internet: cmacord@fedex.com |
CompuServe: 75143,621 | #include <std_disclaimer.h>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
------------------------------
From: Ian Springer <ips@romulus.rutgers.edu>
Date: Tue, 7 Mar 95 13:02:25 EST
Subject: Re: Maximum 2 sided LineDefs
> >> What are the maximum number of two sided linedefs
> >> that DOOM can draw in one view? Last time I RTFM
> >> it was "around 62". Is this true for v1.666? what
> >> about v1.9?
> >According to the DEU(tm) documentaries, it's about 16.
>
> Ok. Let's get this straight for once and for all.
> You can have a maximum (and by this I mean it) of 128 linedefs in a row at
> once. Any more will cause a visplane overflow. Boom. Back to the OS of your
> choice.
>
BOOM! Wrong! :> any version of Doom/Doom2 higher than v1.2 allows
192 linedefs in view. I believe Heretic also has a maximum of 192
linedefs in view.
(=====----------< Ian P. Springer (ips@remus.rutgers.edu) >------------=====)
\___________/ LCSR Systems Operator (help@remus.rutgers.edu) \____________/
/===========\------------------------------------------------/============\
(=====---------------< http://remus.rutgers.edu/~ips >-----------------=====)
------------------------------
From: mneves@eros.rdc.puc-rio.br (Marcus Vinicius de A.B. Neves)
Date: Tue, 7 Mar 1995 16:33:08 -0300 (BSC)
Subject: Re: Deathmatch uniform colors
> >I beg to differ! I'm always green, and I win 90% of the time! But, we play
> >on levels where you pretty much keep moving, or risk dying a grisly death,
> >and no matter what color you are, you are esay to spot if you are moving. I
> >can see how it would be a problem on the "hide and seek" levels.
I had done a pwad all in red, cause with this color this problem with uniform colors
is nonexistent, and (i like to do pwads with only super shotguns - the best!), so when ya
take a shot near ya, all the screen turns red, so much more difficult to see, turning this in
a " crazy-run". That's funny!!!!
Bye,
Marcus.
(internet: mneves@eros.rdc.puc-rio.br)
------------------------------
From: setc@together.net (Ross Carlson)
Date: Tue, 7 Mar 1995 19:52:42 -0500
Subject: Re: Deathmatch uniform colors
>>>I think everyone will agree that the uniform color has an effect on
>>>the deathmatch results - green is just too easy to see.
>>
>>I beg to differ! I'm always green, and I win 90% of the time! But, we play
>>on levels where you pretty much keep moving, or risk dying a grisly death,
>>and no matter what color you are, you are esay to spot if you are moving. I
>>can see how it would be a problem on the "hide and seek" levels.
>
>When I play two-man DeathMatch, the green player is far easier to see
>against most textures and thus is picked up much faster by the eye, whereas
>the gray player blends in more and it usually takes slightly longer to pick
>him up. If you don't think a split second can make a major difference in a
>DeathMatch, even when one or both players are running at full speed, you are
>woefully mistaken, and I would love to prove it to you with a rocket
>sandwich or two <grin>.
Oh, don't tempt me! =8)
For me, when I am green, which I usually am, knowing that I stick out like a
sore thumb puts me that much more on my toes.
Also, the idea of making everyone's uniforms the same color seems ridiculous
to me, because within the first few moments of a game, I have associated my
friends names with the colors they are controlling. Granted it's usually
the same for each match, but the point is that I can tell who I am killing.
Also, each of my targets has a different pattern for dodging, and I take
advantage of that. One guy always runs in clockwise circles, so he's easy
to lead, and another guy always strafes to my left when I fire a rocket, so
again, I just lead him to his, right, and then number two goes to his left,
in case number one misses. (babble) Anyway, these techniques would be
voided if the colors were all the same. amd what about the end level
screens? Wouldn't they all be the same color too?
We usually play on well lit levels, so it doesn't make mush difference, and
the dark levels are usually small enough that everyone is always moving,
which makes you stick out no matter what color you are. We only play on
custom levels that we wrote, and 1 or 2 awesome ones we found on the net.
MHO, -Ross
_______________________________________________________________________
| |
| Ross A. Carlson - setc@together.net |
| "Trials & Tribulations" Super-Wad Home Page: |
| http://together.net/~setc/thewad.html |
|______________________________________________________________________|
| |
| It will be a great day when our schools have all the money they |
| need, and the Air Force has to hold a bake sale to buy a bomber. |
|______________________________________________________________________|
------------------------------
End of doom-editing-digest V1 #199
**********************************
