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Doom Editing Digest Vol. 01 Nr. 079
From: owner-doom-editing-digest
To: doom-editing-digest@nvg.unit.no
Subject: doom-editing-digest V1 #79
Reply-To: doom-editing
Errors-To: owner-doom-editing-digest
Precedence: bulk
doom-editing-digest Thursday, 8 December 1994 Volume 01 : Number 079
Re: DOOM ][ MIDI Soundtra
Re: DOOM ][ MIDI Soundtra
deletion, how and why?
Re: DOOM II WADS
WAD Editors... (non PC based?)
Re: deletion, how and why?
Operation of lighting level triggers
Re: deletion, how and why?
Doom 2 sound editor?
Re: WAD Editors... (non PC based?)
Teleporting cyberdemon
Current Scheme
Re: Teleporting cyberdemon
Re: Teleporting cyberdemon
Re: WAD Editors... (non PC based?)
Re: Teleporting cyberdemon
Re: Teleporting cyberdemon
Re: WAD Editors... (non PC based?)
Re: WAD Editors... (non PC based?)
Re: Teleporting cyberdemon
.DXF and .DWG files
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: mdrechsl@gpu.srv.ualberta.ca (Mike Drechsler)
Date: Wed, 7 Dec 1994 23:12:50 -0700
Subject: Re: DOOM ][ MIDI Soundtra
>well, look at Zamboni. It's a 3d preview for doom levels, not as fast as=
=20
>Doom, not as smooth as Doom, but I was damned impressed by it...
>
>I think if the Zambony code were released and optimized, we'd see some=20
>incredible editors out there...
Hmm, yes but still like he said. The perfect editor. since there could=
never be a perfect editor, all we could hope for is something that would=
have as many features as possible. And sure it's a huge feature but not=
really unreasonable. Since nobody would demand speed from it. Just=
something to get a sense of what things look like. I especially think that=
if you make it with blank walls and have a hotkey to render the textures=
into the current view would simplify things.
------------------------------
From: sb@SCRUZNET.COM
Date: Wed, 7 Dec 94 21:31:16 PST
Subject: Re: DOOM ][ MIDI Soundtra
FYI
The doom Midi files are in the directory
ftp.orst.edu /pub/doom/wad_edit/misc/doommidi.zip
/////////////////////////////////////////////
- ---------
Darrin Chambers
Somewhere just north of San Jose, CA, USA
You know... wherever you go... there you are!
sb@scruznet.com
/////////////////////////////////////////////
------------------------------
From: matt.tagliaferri@pcohio.com (Matt Tagliaferri)
Date: Wed, 07 Dec 1994 19:54:00 -0500
Subject: deletion, how and why?
DO>Message-ID: <199412070228.VAA17599@aviator.cis.ufl.edu>
DO> 2 questions for mission editor authors...
DO> When you're deleting an object (vertex, sidedef, etc) do you fill the
DO>empty space by rotating in the last object, or do you renumber all the
DO>ones that follow the deleted object (the "tasmanian devil eating tree
DO>trunk" method)?
Rotate in the last object.
DO> Why do you do it that way?
It's faster. Either way, you have to do some type of remapping.
DO> The tasmanian devil method recommends itself to me since it preserves
DO>order of linedefs (which is important for several triggers).
I don't see why the order of LineDefs is important. Is there something
I'm missing?
matt tagliaferri
author: DoomCAD
- ---
þ OLX 2.1 TD þ I still miss my ex-wife, but my aim is getting better
- ---------------------------------------------------------------
PC-Ohio PCBoard PO Box 21411
The Best BBS in America South Euclid OH 44121
DATA: 216-381-3320 pcohio.com FAX: 216-291-2685
- ---------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
From: "C. Sheldon" <sheldonc@acy.digex.net>
Date: Thu, 8 Dec 1994 04:18:19 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Re: DOOM II WADS
On Wed, 7 Dec 1994, Pete DiMauro wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Now that I've bought my copy of DOOM II I forgot how to run old wads in
> the new game. I seem to remember a utility that removed the needed items
> from the DOOM I wad and save them in a seperate wad file. When you wanted
> to run 'old' wads you would include the patch wad also. Would someone
> please tell me the name of the *best* utility (or pre written program just
> for this).
>
> Thanks,
>
> Pete
>
THE best utility that I've come across for using Doom1 pwads with
Doom][ is D!, the Doom/Doom][ Shell by Silly Soft, You don't need to have
doom1, as it converts the Pwad to doom][, replacing any doom1 specific
stuff, with corosponding Doom][ stuff.
The other way to do it, is to get Doom3gen, that uses your Doom
and Doom][ Iwads to make a huge iwad.
Later Days,
Cliff Sheldon
AKA: DrWu
------------------------------
From: jim@jimcal.dialup.access.net (Jim Callahan)
Date: Thu, 8 Dec 1994 06:40:02 -0800
Subject: WAD Editors... (non PC based?)
This talk about 3D previewing of WAD's got me thinking that a WAD preview-
editor written in OpenGL might be a nifty thing. Being a user of a SGI and
not a PC has left me out of the loop for DOOM editing so if DEU or Zamboni
or something else already is in the works for UNIX let me know...
Its looking like OpenGL cards for the PC (the GLint for instance) are coming
out just as cheap as the better PC gfx cards now and GL performance could make
non-textured WAD previews very close if not faster in speed to actual DOOM
playing. Could be pretty useful for previewing animated sectors and the idea
about "on demand" texture rendering is certainly possible.
I guess what I want to know is if this would be a generally useful thing
or if it would only be relevant to fellow SGI users (surely a real minority
as far as DOOM players and authors go)?
I'm really itching to get my hands dirty making some of my own WADS but I
don't want to try and duplicate the efforts of these original editors which
seem to work quite well considering the vast quantity of PWADS out there...
I've heard rumors that DEU was coming out for Linux and I guess a port to any
other X/Unix system after that would be a much smaller step.... Any truth to
this? Hope so...
- -- Jim Callahan ---------------------------------------------------------------
CYGNUS FEEDBACK: Animation, Custom 3D Programs & GUI Design [jimcal@panix.com]
POLARIS NETWORK: Dial-up Internet Access & WWW Services [jim@polaris.net]
- -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
From: Robert Forsman <thoth@cis.ufl.edu>
Date: Thu, 08 Dec 1994 09:16:19 EST
Subject: Re: deletion, how and why?
matt.tagliaferri@pcohio.com (Matt Tagliaferri) ,in message <24.85870.5@pcohio.c
om>, wrote:
> DO> The tasmanian devil method recommends itself to me since it preserves
> DO>order of linedefs (which is important for several triggers).
>
> I don't see why the order of LineDefs is important. Is there something
> I'm missing?
From section 4-3-2 of the prerelease of the 1.666 DMSPEC doc:
> T Trigger model, see note 11 below.
> N Numeric model, see note 11 below.
...
> sector. The TRIGGER model gets the info from the sector that the
> activating line's right side faces. The NUMERIC model gets the info
> from the sector on the other side of the lowest numbered two-sided
> linedef that has one side in the tagged sector.
...
> 37 Floor W1 mover slow - NXP down to LEF
> 84 Floor WR mover slow - NXP down to LEF
> 9 Floor S1 mover slow - NXP donut (see note 12 above)
There are 3 linedefs that depend on the order of linedefs. The donut is
the real kicker. I had a pit of goo surrounding the BFG, but the lowest
numbered linedef around the secondary sector was a 1S linedef. I forget what
the exact fuckup mode was, but it definitely was not tranferring the floor
texture and property because there was nothing to transfer from.
Because of this I plan to implement a "reorder marked linedefs" option.
This will allow you to pick any linedef and ensure that it's the lowest
numbered one out of a marked set.
------------------------------
From: S.Benner@lancaster.ac.uk (Steve Benner)
Date: Thu, 8 Dec 94 14:37:45 GMT
Subject: Operation of lighting level triggers
Ok, I give up. Can some-one please point me at the right documentation for
the way linedef lighting level triggers REALLY work? I know some-one posted
to this list some time ago that they were looking at the texture-changing
triggers but I have never seen any findings posted.
My particular problem concerns line type 12 (lights to highest nearby
level). I have a WAD with rooms like this (sort of, allowing for
simplifications and ASCII art limitations):-
o-----o----o o----o-----o
| : | | : | Sectors A, B, D, E have
| A : B o-----------------o D : E | lighting levels of 48
| : : C : : |
| : o-----o o------o : | C has lighting level 128
| : | | | | : |
o-----o----o etc o----o-----o
|
V
Linedefs between A/B and D/E are triggers of linetype 12
Linedef A/B is tagged to sectors A & B;
Linedef D/E is tagged to sectors D & E;
Linedef D/E works fine: lights come up to the level of sector C in D & E
Linedef A/B does nothing!
As far as I can tell from my WAD, each "half" is an exact mirror image of
the other in implementation, EXCEPT for linedef and sector NUMBERING (A and
B were added in a funny order: A is sector 5, B is sector 57, C is sector
35, D is sector 36, E is sector 34 - well, something like that anyway).
Should this matter?
Help, any-one?
[I feel that I should probably be mailing this to "beginners' corner" but I
don't know the answer so wouldn't be able to help!!]
- -Steve
------------------------------
From: S.Benner@lancaster.ac.uk (Steve Benner)
Date: Thu, 8 Dec 94 14:54:53 GMT
Subject: Re: deletion, how and why?
Roberts Forsman wrote:
>
> From section 4-3-2 of the prerelease of the 1.666 DMSPEC doc:
>
[snip]
where do I get a copy???? Please, please, please....
- -Steve
------------------------------
From: andrewb@expert.cc.purdue.edu (Andrew Buettner)
Date: Thu, 8 Dec 94 12:00:40 -0500
Subject: Doom 2 sound editor?
Is there a doom2 sound editor out there? If so, tell me where I can pick]
it up
------------------------------
From: tedv@geom.umn.edu
Date: Thu, 8 Dec 94 11:48:50 CST
Subject: Re: WAD Editors... (non PC based?)
> I've heard rumors that DEU was coming out for Linux and I guess a port to any
> other X/Unix system after that would be a much smaller step.... Any truth to
> this? Hope so...
There is already a working version of DEU 5.21 that runs in X on a Sun or SGI.
I heard about 3 weeks ago that they were trying to get the Linux X working,
and I believe that works now (I can't test because I don't have X up myself.)
Right now Raphael is working on cleaning up the DEU 5.3 code so that it's
much cleaner (==> easier to port DEU 5.3 to X). Again, no known release
date... Raphael saus DEU 5.3 will make a nice Christmas present. Lets hope
it's out before that.
- -Ted
- --
Ted Vessenes | "The only force stronger than fate is dramatic irony."
tedv@geom.umn.edu | "[William] Shatner couldn't direct his way out of the
tedv@cs.umn.edu | bathroom with both hands and a map!"
tjvessen@midway.uchicago.edu -Ryan Ingram (1st), -Kibo's .sig (2nd)
------------------------------
From: Paul Francis Turnbull <stenger@engin.umich.edu>
Date: Thu, 8 Dec 1994 13:02:19 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Teleporting cyberdemon
One of my favorite tricks in PWAD editing is to have monsters teleport
into unexpected places to surprise the player. Doom2 uses this trick
extensively in much the same way that I have used it. However, I was
playing map10 last night and I was facinated at how the cyberdemon at
the end teleports in and out of his cage. The player (me in this case)
runs over the same line defs without teleporting! Has anyone looked
at how this is done? I'd do it myself but I've been procrastinating on
my PWAD projects until the release of DEU5.3.
Paul Turnbull
stenger@engin.umich.edu
author of mayan666.wad (and mayan2 after DEU5.3 is released)
------------------------------
From: dethlejd@galt.osd.mil
Date: Thu, 08 Dec 94 13:24:17 -0500
Subject: Current Scheme
Hello fellow editors:
I'm new to the list, and I want to let you know what I'm up to: I am
currently converting the .DXF files I have of the building I work in to
Doom II levels. I and using DEU2C and BSP1.0. I am editing (creating)
new textures and wallmaps on a Sun and a Mac (I can't find a decent
editor for the PC) and moving them over as .PPM files.
I am looking for a sound import utility (for either .AIFF, .AU, or .SND
files) so I can add new sounds.
I am looking for a sprite editor so I can add new beasties.
I am looking for a "doom palette" of colors in either .PPM or .GIF
format, so all my screen colors om out right.
I need to find out how to bind multiple levels into a single .WAD file.
TAFN, thanks,
____________________________________________________________________________
| | |
| Jim Dethlefsen | #include std_disclaimer.h |
| Systems Engineer | |
| Electronic Data Systems, Inc. | (703)695-1312 dethlejd@galt.osd.mil |
| OSD Backbone Services | |
|________________________________|___________________________________________|
| |
| "We really don't know many of the blasted things we sold; |
| we were keeping track on one of them..." - Unnamed Pentium Engineer |
|____________________________________________________________________________|
------------------------------
From: Robert Forsman <thoth@cis.ufl.edu>
Date: Thu, 08 Dec 1994 13:55:31 EST
Subject: Re: Teleporting cyberdemon
Paul Francis Turnbull <stenger@engin.umich.edu> ,in message <Pine.3.87.94120813
19.A8495-0100000@auto2.engin.umich.edu>, wrote:
> However, I was
> playing map10 last night and I was facinated at how the cyberdemon at
> the end teleports in and out of his cage. The player (me in this case)
> runs over the same line defs without teleporting! Has anyone looked
> at how this is done? I'd do it myself but I've been procrastinating on
> my PWAD projects until the release of DEU5.3.
Several times. It's a monster-only teleport linedef. Matt. Finish those
specs. There are also W1 teleport linedefs for players...
------------------------------
From: John Wakelin <johnw@datametrics.com>
Date: Thu, 8 Dec 94 13:58:50 -0500
Subject: Re: Teleporting cyberdemon
> From: Paul Francis Turnbull <stenger@engin.umich.edu>
> Reply-To: doom-editing@nvg.unit.no
>
> One of my favorite tricks in PWAD editing is to have monsters teleport
> into unexpected places to surprise the player. Doom2 uses this trick
> extensively in much the same way that I have used it. However, I was
> playing map10 last night and I was facinated at how the cyberdemon at
> the end teleports in and out of his cage. The player (me in this case)
> runs over the same line defs without teleporting! Has anyone looked
> at how this is done? I'd do it myself but I've been procrastinating on
> my PWAD projects until the release of DEU5.3.
>
> Paul Turnbull
> stenger@engin.umich.edu
> author of mayan666.wad (and mayan2 after DEU5.3 is released)
>
There is a line-def type for teleporting monsters only. I would look
it up for you but I am at work and the "lab" is at home.
It is in the *new* list. (The one John posted)
Have a good day,
John
__________________________________________________________
John Wakelin | johnw@datametrics.com
Datametrics Systems Corp. | Ph. 703 385 7700 x341
12150 East Monument Dr. Ste 300 | Fax 703 385 7711
Fairfax, VA. 22033 USA |
------------------------------
From: Damian Frank <damianf@diamond.res.wpi.edu>
Date: Thu, 8 Dec 1994 13:55:55 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Re: WAD Editors... (non PC based?)
> There is already a working version of DEU 5.21 that runs in X on a Sun or SGI.
> I heard about 3 weeks ago that they were trying to get the Linux X working,
> and I believe that works now (I can't test because I don't have X up myself.)
I don't know about the X version, but I DO know that DEU 5.21 was ported to
Linux running under SVGALIB some months ago. It ran quite decently.
(SVGAlib is a non-X graphics library.)
- --
________________ _______________________________________________
/ Damian Frank \ / "In order to make an apple pie from scratch, \
| damianf@wpi.edu | you must first create the universe." |
| WPI ECE '97 | -- Carl Sagan, Cosmos |
\________________/ \_______________________________________________/
------------------------------
From: fenske@rocke.electro.swri.edu (Robert Fenske Jr)
Date: Thu, 8 Dec 94 13:09:39 CST
Subject: Re: Teleporting cyberdemon
LINEDEF types 125 and 126 are teleport-monster-only triggers.
Robert Fenske, Jr. rfenske@swri.edu Sw | The Taming the C*sm*s series:
Electromagnetics Division /R---\ |
Southwest Research Institute | I | | "The Martian canals were the
San Antonio, Texas USA \----/ | Martians' last ditch effort."
------------------------------
From: tedv@geom.umn.edu
Date: Thu, 8 Dec 94 13:15:21 CST
Subject: Re: Teleporting cyberdemon
> One of my favorite tricks in PWAD editing is to have monsters teleport
> into unexpected places to surprise the player. Doom2 uses this trick
> extensively in much the same way that I have used it. However, I was
> playing map10 last night and I was facinated at how the cyberdemon at
> the end teleports in and out of his cage. The player (me in this case)
> runs over the same line defs without teleporting! Has anyone looked
> at how this is done? I'd do it myself but I've been procrastinating on
> my PWAD projects until the release of DEU5.3.
DOOM 1.6+ has monster only teleport linedef trigger types.
- -Ted
- --
Ted Vessenes | "The only force stronger than fate is dramatic irony."
tedv@geom.umn.edu | "[William] Shatner couldn't direct his way out of the
tedv@cs.umn.edu | bathroom with both hands and a map!"
tjvessen@midway.uchicago.edu -Ryan Ingram (1st), -Kibo's .sig (2nd)
------------------------------
From: dethlejd@galt.osd.mil
Date: Thu, 08 Dec 94 14:18:50 -0500
Subject: Re: WAD Editors... (non PC based?)
You spoke of a Sun based DEU? Where can one find it?
____________________________________________________________________________
| | |
| Jim Dethlefsen | #include std_disclaimer.h |
| Systems Engineer | |
| Electronic Data Systems, Inc. | (703)695-1312 dethlejd@galt.osd.mil |
| OSD Backbone Services | |
|________________________________|___________________________________________|
| |
| "We really don't know many of the blasted things we sold; |
| we were keeping track on one of them..." - Unnamed Pentium Engineer |
|____________________________________________________________________________|
------------------------------
From: quinet@stud.montefiore.ulg.ac.be (Raphael Quinet)
Date: Thu, 8 Dec 1994 20:48:29 +0100
Subject: Re: WAD Editors... (non PC based?)
> This talk about 3D previewing of WAD's got me thinking that a WAD preview-
> editor written in OpenGL might be a nifty thing. Being a user of a SGI and
> not a PC has left me out of the loop for DOOM editing so if DEU or Zamboni
> or something else already is in the works for UNIX let me know...
There is already a version of DEU for X Window, but it is in beta-testing
and it is not publicly available (sorry). As I wrote on r.g.c.d.editing
a few minutes ago, there are also two MS-Windows versions (16 and 32 bits),
but they are not available either. Please do not ask any questions about
these programs: the more questions I get, the longer you will have to
wait for the official release. :-)
> Its looking like OpenGL cards for the PC (the GLint for instance) are coming
> out just as cheap as the better PC gfx cards now and GL performance could make
> non-textured WAD previews very close if not faster in speed to actual DOOM
> playing. Could be pretty useful for previewing animated sectors and the idea
> about "on demand" texture rendering is certainly possible.
Well, this would only be a good thing for the minority of users who have
a GL card. It would be better to have a previewer which works on all
machines (PC's, worksations, etc.), even if it is slower. That is what
I was working on for DEU. Unfortunately, I dropped this project because
I don't have enough time to do everything. So this previewer will not
be in DEU 5.3 (but probably in 6.0 or 6.1). There will be two modes for
the previewer: one with solid walls (to get an idea of the shape of the
rooms) and one with full textures (a lot slower: several seconds for one
frame, but very useful to check texture alignment).
> I guess what I want to know is if this would be a generally useful thing
> or if it would only be relevant to fellow SGI users (surely a real minority
> as far as DOOM players and authors go)?
This will be useful if everybody can use it...
> I'm really itching to get my hands dirty making some of my own WADS but I
> don't want to try and duplicate the efforts of these original editors which
> seem to work quite well considering the vast quantity of PWADS out there...
This is the only reason why I mentioned DEU for X Window: normally, this
is a secret and I shouldn't have told you about it. But I don't want to
have people wasting their time on something that has already been done. So
now you know that you will just have to wait until DEUX is released...
> I've heard rumors that DEU was coming out for Linux and I guess a port to any
> other X/Unix system after that would be a much smaller step.... Any truth to
> this? Hope so...
DEU 5.21 for Linux was released some time ago. But this version works with
SVGAlib, which is totally different from the standard X Windows interface.
Porting DEU to X11 required more changes, but now it works (thanks to
Mike Thomas who did all the hard work). This was a great step...
Remember: please don't ask any questions about these versions of DEU. Nobody
should know that they exist. Even some of my beta testers are still ignoring
it...
- -Raphael
------------------------------
From: Matthew Ayres <ayres@cdrom.com>
Date: Thu, 08 Dec 94 12:26:32 -0800
Subject: Re: Teleporting cyberdemon
Paul Francis Turnbull <stenger@engin.umich.edu> said...
>One of my favorite tricks in PWAD editing is to have monsters teleport
>into unexpected places to surprise the player. Doom2 uses this trick
>extensively in much the same way that I have used it. However, I was
>playing map10 last night and I was facinated at how the cyberdemon at
>the end teleports in and out of his cage. The player (me in this case)
>runs over the same line defs without teleporting! Has anyone looked
>at how this is done? I'd do it myself but I've been procrastinating on
>my PWAD projects until the release of DEU5.3.
There are linedef specials that teleport players, and different ones
that teleport monters. It's that simple :)
-Matt A.
------------------------------
From: "Chris Campbell (ME)" <ccampbel@suntan.eng.usf.edu>
Date: Thu, 8 Dec 1994 15:30:47 -0500 (EST)
Subject: .DXF and .DWG files
Does anybody know of an editor that will allow importing of .DXF files
(for nodes and lindefs) to be used as the floorplan for a PWAD?
It would be much nicer to be able to draw a map in AutoCAD and then
import it into an editor for touch up (textures, floor & ceiling heights,
etc....).....
If anybody can help, please do.
Later,
C. S. Campbell
------------------------------
End of doom-editing-digest V1 #79
*********************************
