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HOMEBREW Digest #5082
HOMEBREW Digest #5082 Wed 01 November 2006
FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
Digest Janitor: pbabcock at hbd.org
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Contents:
Golden Promise Malt ("Rich Beecher")
Golden Promise malt (Randy Ricchi)
!! ("A. J. deLange")
RE: Golden Promise Malt (Steven Parfitt)
Re: Golden Promise Malt ("Scott D. Braker-Abene")
Golden Promise (leavitdg)
Dubbel Trubbel? (JSC-NS\)[AND]" <steven.j.daniel@nasa.gov>
RE: no pumpkin in pumpkin ale? ("Doug Moyer")
Samichlaus clone ("Steve Dale-Johnson")
'first press wort' and Kirin ("Steve Dale-Johnson")
Re: 'first press wort' and Kirin ("Kevin Gray")
pumpkin (Nate & Brenda Wahl)
re: kirin beer, first press ("Ben Dooley")
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Date: Wed, 01 Nov 2006 07:20:40 -0500
From: "Rich Beecher" <rbeecher at hotmail.com>
Subject: Golden Promise Malt
1 Nov
Michael Eyre asks about "Golden Promise" malt. It is a British two-row
pale ale malt. Thomas Fawcett Maltings, for example, is one maltster who
produces it. It can be found at North Country Malt here in the US.
I currently use it as my base malt. Except for being more difficult to
mill than my other malts, I have been happy with it.
Rich Beecher
Chattanooga, TN
http://www.AChattanoogaWhig.com/theconfederateceltbrewery/
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 01 Nov 2006 08:12:46 -0500
From: Randy Ricchi <rricchi at houghton.k12.mi.us>
Subject: Golden Promise malt
I believe Golden Promise is basically an English pale ale malt.
- -----Original Message-----
I came across a 50# sack of Golden Promise that my shop was blowing out
for real cheap.. so I bought it, couldn't pass it up at that price. My
question is, I'm not that familiar with this malt, though I've heard
it's an old 'distillers malt'. can it be used for beer? Let me rephrase.
what other malt that is more of a 'beer malt' is it similar to so I can
sort this out for recipe work?
Mike
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 01 Nov 2006 13:15:52 +0000
From: "A. J. deLange" <ajdel at cox.net>
Subject: !!
I use Sankey kegs exclusively these days and don't miss the old Corny's
one bit. What I mainly don't miss is having to have gas and liquid
fittings for two types of keg and never having the proper fitting on
hand when I needed it. Plus I am convinced that ball lock fittings come
in a couple of types (at least) because I remember trying to get liquid
fittings on liquid ports and they just wouldn't go. A fellow brewer told
me that he thinks connectors and ports grow together after much use so
that only one particular fitting will go with one particular keg.
But enough negativity! I've been using 1/4 bbl (7.5 gal) Sankey's from
Sabco. They are made by Franke in Germany and cost about as much as a
new Corny which, as stainless is in short supply these days, is a bunch.
As mine came new I haven't had to give them the lye treatment yet. If
you do mess with lye please be very, very careful. It is nasty stuff.
Find an MSDS for the stuff and read it. You can't even buy it in
hardware stores around here any more (how did those hardy pioneer women
ever manage to keep their families in soap). Pay particular note of the
interesting ability of it to act as an anaesthetic to the cornea so that
you don't feel anything while your eyeballs are being eroded. The proper
mix is, according to an old Dave Miller article, 2.5% w/w (about 3 - 1/3
Oz per gallon). Probably the safest way to clean the thing is to
disassemble it, add some hot water, add the lye, stir with a stick and
top up with hot water with more stirring. Note that a lot of heat is
evolved when lye dissolves so keep your face (upon which you should have
a full shield or at least goggles with side panels) to the side as
boiling may occur. Also wear rubber gloves. Let it soak then dump the
lye down the drain followed by tons of water. Rinse, rinse, rinse. Lye
is hard to get off to the point that the pro's follow the lye wash with
an acid rinse (followed by a water rinse). If it's relatively clean on
inspection I'd skip the lye altogether. When disassembling keep in mind
that "spear" is a fairly accurate description of the dip tube assembly
if you try to remove it when the keg is pressurized. There is a tool
(available from Sabco for relatively big bucks) which allows the spear
to be removed safely and under control. Jeff Renner has posted a scheme
using a levering principal which works but be careful. Even without gas
pressure that spring is pretty hefty,
You'll need a coupler with the check ball removed to fill the keg and
clean and sterilize it subsequently. To remove this ball remove the
plastic retainer from the beer outlet port and tip it out. It is an
excellent idea to obtain a stainless steel shutoff valve from Micromatic
for this coupler. It will make your life much easier in filling and
cleaning. If you are filling against counter pressure you'll also want a
"filling device" which is a tee with a pressure gauge on one leg, a
needle valve open to the ambient on a second an a hose to the coupler's
gas port on the third. If you've been counterpressure transferring with
Corny's you already know about this - the use is exactly the same. Only
the gas connector is different.
When the keg is clean and rinsed reassemble it (send me your snail mail
address and I'll mail you a retaining ring) and sanitize it. This can be
done in several ways. I put the keg upside down on a stand I made and
push steam up the spear letting the condensate drain from the gas port
for 15 minutes, take off the steam and put on CO2 before the steam has a
chance to condense (and collapse the keg). The CO2 replaces the steam
and there is, thus, no air in the keg at the conclusion of this process.
Iodophor can be used followed by draining and filling the keg completely
(upright) to the point that water (which should be boiled) comes out the
gas port. Then invert and push the water out with CO2 (again no air).
When the beer is finsished, let the pressure off (don't stand over an
upright keg with coupler in place but no hose while you engage the
coupler) then invert it and run water from a hose (make a hose to
tailpiece adapter) up the spear using the coupler. It should exit at the
top of the spear with enough force to hit the bottom of the keg hard
enough to loosen any sediment and cascade down the sides to exit the gas
port. When this water runs clear the keg is pretty clean and ready to
be sanitized and used again. If you have a suitable pump you can force
iodophor (or another sanitizer) up the spear and be pretty sure it will
cascade down the sides and get everything covered. Follow by rinse water
(boiled) and the air displacing water (also boiled) and you are ready
for the next fill. With a pump you can do the lye treatment without
disassembly in the same way,
I've sketched how I do it and there are doubtless other good ways as well.
A.J.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 1 Nov 2006 05:37:27 -0800 (PST)
From: Steven Parfitt <thegimp98 at yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: Golden Promise Malt
IN HBD 5081 Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2006 11:52:53 -0800
From: "Michael Eyre" <meyre at sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Golden Promise...
>I came across a 50# sack of Golden Promise that my
>shop was blowing out for real cheap.. so I bought it,
>couldn't pass it up at that price. My question is,
>I'm not that familiar with this malt, though I've
>heard it's an old 'distillers malt'.
Yes this is true, and Bock is beer that comes from
cleaning out the vats at the end of the year.
>can it be used for beer? Let me rephrase.
>what other malt that is more of a 'beer malt' is it
>similar to so I can sort this out for recipe work?
>Mike
Best to just ship it to me and let me dispose of it
since I have switched to Golden Promise in place of
Marris Otter in all my ales. ;>)
Steven
JC-TN
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 1 Nov 2006 06:05:19 -0800 (PST)
From: "Scott D. Braker-Abene" <skotrat at yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Golden Promise Malt
Mike Eyre asks:
can it be used for beer?
Let me rephrase. Whatother malt that is more of
a 'beer malt' is it similar to so I can sort
this out for recipe work?
I say:
Hell Yea... It is about the greatest Pale Malt
on the face of the planet. It will make the most
amazing wee heavy that you have ever had.
more on the malt:
Golden Promise, an early-maturing spring barley,
is the Scottish equivalent of Maris Otter. Though
brewers north of the English borderclaim that its
sweet, clean flavor is superior to Maris Otter.
Golden Promise malt has a depth of flavor that makes
it the ideal base malt for both UK and USA-style IPAs.
Golden Promise is also used extensively by premium
whisky distilleries such as The Macallan.
What I would brew:
Traquair house Clone:
http://www.skotrat.com/skotrat/recipes/ale/scottish/recipes/10.html
-Scott
"I can't help it... I love being a fart machine"
- Heather
Braker
http://www.skotrat.com/skotrat -
Skotrats Beer Page
http://www.brewrats.org - BrewRats HomeBrew Club
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 01 Nov 2006 09:22:57 -0500
From: leavitdg at plattsburgh.edu
Subject: Golden Promise
I use Golden Promise regularly as my base malt.
You can find info on it at Northcountrymalt.com
Darrell
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 1 Nov 2006 09:55:19 -0600
From: "Daniel, Steven J. \(JSC-NS\)[AND]" <steven.j.daniel at nasa.gov>
Subject: Dubbel Trubbel?
Howdy,
I'm planning a 5 gallon Dubbel and I have a few questions.
First, I'd like to know if any of you have made your own dark candi
sugar, and if so, what did you think of the results? I have read the
recipes that explain how to invert and caramelize table sugar, and this
sounds like an interesting process that I'd like to try, but only if it
gives good results.
Second, I have acquired some recipes, and the following one by Gordon
Strong looks interesting, but many of the other recipes call for biscuit
malt, and this one has none. I'd appreciate your feedback on what
effect this might have, and if you think I should add it. The same site
also had recipes by Keith Chamberlin and Andy Anderson, both of which
called for biscuit. You can look at them here:
http://www.specialtymalts.com/tech_center/dubbel.html
Third, I plan to use either 1762 or 3787 yeast. Does anyone know what
New Belgium uses in their Abbey Ale and at what temperature they
ferment?
5 lbs Dewolf Cosyns pils or pale ale malt (2.3 kg)
3 lbs Durst Munich malt (1.4 kg)
2 lbs Weyermann Dark Munich malt (908 gr)
1.5 lbs Dewolf Cosyns Aromatic malt (681 gr)
0.75 lbs Dewolf Cosyns Carapils malt (341 gr)
0.25 lbs Caramunich malt (114 gr)
0.33 lbs Dewolf Cosyns Special B malt (150 gr)
1 oz Weyermann chocolate wheat malt (28 gr)
1 lb dark candi sugar (454 gr)
1 oz Styrian Goldings hop plugs, 5% alpha acid (28 gr) (1 hour)
0.25 oz Saaz hops, 3.9% alpha acid (7 gr) (15 minutes)
0.25 oz Saaz hops, 3.9% alpha acid (7 gr) (2 minutes) - NOTE: I'll
probably forgo this addition
I hope this message appears in the right format. I applied the text
settings per the FAQ.
Steve Daniel
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 1 Nov 2006 12:35:58 -0500
From: "Doug Moyer" <shyzaboy at yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: no pumpkin in pumpkin ale?
Aaron Linder sez:
================================
maybe most vegetables don't have much place in a good-tasting beer?
================================
No problem, then, mate! Pumpkin is actually a fruit...
And if you just use the spices, maybe you can call it a pPumpkin Ale (for
pseudo). The first "p" is silent, of course...
Brew on!
Doug Moyer
Troutville, VA
Star City Brewers Guild: http://www.starcitybrewers.org
Beer, brewing, travel & kids: http://shyzaboy.blogsome.com
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 01 Nov 2006 11:36:10 -0800
From: "Steve Dale-Johnson" <sdalejohnson at hotmail.com>
Subject: Samichlaus clone
<snip>
Hey Now,
Does any of youse guys have a tried and true just plain fantastic
"Samichlaus" recipe?
Allgrain please.
Thanks
-Scott
<snip>
Scott, you may be more successful in searching the archives for
"Sedamichlaus", named in honour of Marc Sedam. You may also want to touch
base with Marc to see if he's done any tweaking of late.
Steve Dale-Johnson
Brewing at 1918 miles, 298 degrees Rennerian
Delta (Vancouver), BC, Canada.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 01 Nov 2006 11:41:28 -0800
From: "Steve Dale-Johnson" <sdalejohnson at hotmail.com>
Subject: 'first press wort' and Kirin
Kevin,
A better term for this is "first runnings". Kirin does not sparge, they
simply dilute first runnings to the gravity desired. This tends to
concentrate malty flavours and to limit tannic and astringement flavours,
and is understandably a more expensive process. Too bad that they start
with such good technique yet make such insipid beer, although one could
surmise that the technique is actually necesary as there is so little other
flavour in the beer that any astringency would be devastating to the flavour
profile
Steve Dale-Johnson
Brewing at 1918 miles, 298 degrees Rennerian
Delta (Vancouver), BC, Canada.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 1 Nov 2006 16:23:34 -0500
From: "Kevin Gray" <kevin.gray at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: 'first press wort' and Kirin
Thanks Steve--that makes sense. I had never heard first runnings
referred to as a "pressing" before. I agree with your assessment,
though. Seems like an awfully expensive process for mediocre beer.
Kevin
http://kevbrews.blogspot.com
On 11/1/06, Steve Dale-Johnson <sdalejohnson at hotmail.com> wrote:
> Kevin,
>
> A better term for this is "first runnings". Kirin does not sparge, they
> simply dilute first runnings to the gravity desired. This tends to
> concentrate malty flavours and to limit tannic and astringement flavours,
> and is understandably a more expensive process. Too bad that they start
> with such good technique yet make such insipid beer, although one could
> surmise that the technique is actually necesary as there is so little other
> flavour in the beer that any astringency would be devastating to the flavour
> profile
>
>
>
> Steve Dale-Johnson
> Brewing at 1918 miles, 298 degrees Rennerian
> Delta (Vancouver), BC, Canada.
>
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 01 Nov 2006 17:50:48 -0500
From: Nate & Brenda Wahl <cruiser570 at verizon.net>
Subject: pumpkin
Its been an interesting, and usually annual, discussion on pumpkin in
beer. Here's a few more thoughts and things learned along the way after
making quite a few pumpkin beers.
I've make a pumpkin beer for 8 years running now, but the last 5
iterations have been a lager version! Its very popular; we went through
6 gallons of it at our annual Halloween party last weekend! BudMilCo
drinkers seem to really like it a lot "for a dark beer"!
First, if you are even going to use any pumpkin, roasting is the way to
go. There aren't too many boiled pumpkin or other gourd recipies for a
reason! From my candy-making hobby I know that cooking sugar has
parallels brewing's mash temperature range effects; sugars start to
lightly carmelize at around 300 degrees, and by 350 or so sugar turns
the classic "golden brown" along with the associated caramel flavor it
brings. Which is why most baked things are done at 350, ever though
about that? Things brown on the outside, but don't really burn, and
what's inside gets done depending on how long its in the oven!
Taking things much over 350 degrees results in more and more burned
flavors, which is a desirable result of using high-kilned dark grains.
Starches also seem to undergo additional transformations beyond their
gelatinization temperatures. They may re-solidify, but in a less sticky
fashion, and some may actually break down ito complex sugars; think
about poking a starchy, soupy pumpkin pie with a toothpick as it cooks,
and it eventually comes out clean, firm and glistening, tasting sweet.
But the starches left are still available for conversion and seem
somewhat soluble, hence mashing the pumpkin is a good idea. FWIW, I use
a Potential SG of 1.015/lb and it seems to work out well in the calcs.
I think that this carmelized pumpkin, or at least its combination of
flavors, is what we want to impart in this type beer. There is also
some color contribution. Notice that you could probably come close with
some grains such as some of the medium to darker crystals.
The recipe is basically pils base malt, with some biscuit, caramel pils,
and caravienna malts, mashed low in the sac range, along with about 5#
of roasted cooking pumpkin for 10 gallons. And rice hulls; lots of rice
hulls! The pumpkins are first cut into wedges and roasted at, you
guessed it, 350 degrees for about 90 minutes. Try slicing across the
golden brown wedges every half inch, and then use a spoon to roll the
meat off of the rind much as cubing an avacado. The rind is pretty
gnarly stuff, very bitter, as are the "pan juices," stay away!
Its then boiled with spice additions at the beginning and at the end,
but both done at subtle levels. Only fresh ginger, fresh ground nutmeg,
cinnamon sticks (or cassia bark if you can find it) and maybe one or two
cloves are used. Mace is OK for pies, but just doesn't seem to work in
the beer for some reason. If you can smell something during the boil,
its probably boiling away, so the initial additions are probably
unnecessary. The hopping is equally subtle to match, with a touch of
noble hops for flavor, and I've found Strisselspalt hops at the end of
the boil nicely complement the spices. Its then fermented with Munich
yeast at about 50 degrees, which has a rich but not too sweet flavor
profile that blends very well with the ingredients. A diacetyl rest is
defenitely recommended, mine sits at room temperature for three days
before taking it to lager temperatures.
Most folks say they can taste the pumpkin, and some don't! Either way,
its a really nice beer to serve this time of year.
For what its worth!
Cheers,
Nate Wahl
Oak Harbor, Ohio
64.3, 145.8
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2006 09:36:11 +0900
From: "Ben Dooley" <bendooley at gmail.com>
Subject: re: kirin beer, first press
Kevin asks about the mysterious phrase "first press", as related to kirin beer.
Kevin, I work as a Japanese to English translator and can attest to
the fact that the quality of translation is usually abominable. My
guess is that they hired a translator who knows nothing about beer,
and this is the translation he came up with to express the idea that
they only use the first runnings of the wort.
Hope that helps.
Best,
Ben
------------------------------
End of HOMEBREW Digest #5082, 11/01/06
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