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HOMEBREW Digest #3387
HOMEBREW Digest #3387 Wed 26 July 2000
FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
Digest Janitor: janitor@hbd.org
Many thanks to the Observer & Eccentric Newspapers of
Livonia, Michigan for sponsoring the Homebrew Digest.
URL: http://www.oeonline.com
Contents:
re:Can You Over Hop A Beer. (Alemantoo) (Scott Morgan - Sun On-Line Telesales Representative)
Lable removing goof (Aaron Perry)
re: relief valves (John_E_Schnupp)
DUI (Ant Hayes)
The Jethro Gump Report ("Rob Moline")
re:no-sparge foam/haze / Weiss ("Campbell, Paul R SSI-ISEP-3")
Cooperstown, NY (PVanslyke)
re: mash parameters .../re:no-sparge foam/haze ("Stephen Alexander")
Package (Dave Burley)
(Jim Bermingham)
Re: Sooky sooky la la. (Cat. 5) -> Cat. 6 (Deadly Serious) ("Sweeney, David")
part-time drunk reply ("Czerpak, Pete")
more no sparge and Gott info ("Czerpak, Pete")
British ale yeasts ("G. M. Remec")
Phenols vs. esters in Weizen ("Michael J. Westcott")
HBD search on hiatus ("Spencer W. Thomas")
re: Gott coolers ("Paul Kensler")
Wyeast 1275 or 1318 ("Czerpak, Pete")
Homebrew vs Coors Light (woodsj)
Re: Sooky sooky la la (whatever that means) (Matthew Arnold)
No such thing as too much hops.... (Eddie Kent)
HOP Goddess ?? (hal)
gott cooler mash tun ("Kevin Jones")
ADVANCED TEXTS ("George Krafcisin")
Dry-hopping a cause for infection? (Marc Morency)
* JULY IS AMERICAN BEER MONTH! Take the American Beer
* Pledge of Allegiance! Support your local brewery...
*
* Beer is our obsession and we're late for therapy!
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----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2000 14:46:55 +1000 (EST)
From: Scott Morgan - Sun On-Line Telesales Representative <Scott.Morgan@Aus.Sun.COM>
Subject: re:Can You Over Hop A Beer. (Alemantoo)
Whilst some may argue about hopping, i'm thinking, can you ever
over paragraph??
shit ey, what are the young american kiddies being taught about
writing these days.
struth!
scotty
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 2000 20:33:22 EDT
From: Alemantoo@aol.com
Subject: Can You Over Hop A Beer.
The question was raised, can a beer be over hopped? Most wrote in responses
that indicated that they cannot imagine a beer being over hopped (or at least
not saying so) and started a chain of posts about beers with super high
hopping rates. This subject has been a pet peeve of mine for many years, but
especially in the last few when the attitude of "more hops" seems to have
become an epidemic. I got into brewing many years ago because I was actually
looking for a less bitter beer. What I found was a more bitter beer, but beer
with more flavor. The light flavored American Pilsner style beers to me just
tasted bitter. Bitterness was the only flavor I could detect. So when I read
an article on home brewing in Easy Riders (in 1973) I started brewing. My
flavor experience did not come from my own beers at first, but I started
finding and trying beers like Bass, Guinness, Whitbread and Whatneys. Beers
with flavor that balanced the bitterness. As I became a better brewer and was
able to find better ingredients (especially hops) I was able to make my own
flavorful beers. What I am finding now is that many of my beer recipes that I
have been making for years and have always been appreciated are getting
comments like "it could use more finishing hops". I have always worked at
balancing the flavors of my beers and keeping the flavors appropriate to the
style and now to get a comment like "needs more hops" especially in styles
that should be lightly hopped or that shouldn't have any finishing hops at
all, strikes a nerve with me. To go to a micro or a brew pub and pay for a
bock that is over the hill bitter or a Scottish Ale loaded with finishing
hops ticks me off. It's one thing if you're a hop head and just want to brew
a hoppy beer, I'm not trying to tell a home brewer how to brew his home brew,
but a I hate to see the results of a competition and see a winner in the ale
category using a lager yeast or a traditionally unhoppy beer category
dominated by overly hoppy beers that don't belong in that category. In
closing I want to say that if you like it, it is not too hoppy for you. If
you're entering it into a competition or trying to brew to a certain style,
it may be too hoppy. But can a beer be too hoppy - yes. I have read on more
than one occasions about hops having an adverse effect on sexual desire.
Jethro Kloss wrote a book, considered by many to be the bible of the health
food set, called Back To Eden. He claims hops produce sleep when nothing else
will and says they are an excellent treatment for excessive sexual desires.
So if things are pointing south when they should be pointing north, you may
be a hop head and that beer just may be too hoppy. Imagine how much beer
Miller would sell with a commercial filled with big macho athletes saying
"more hops, less sex". By the way, you fans of aluminum in brewing ware
should read the part of his book dedicated to aluminum cook ware.
Tom (not a hop head) Logan
alemantoo@aol.com
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2000 01:18:11 -0400
From: Aaron Perry <vspbcb@earthlink.net>
Subject: Lable removing goof
In HBD #3386 I wrote:
> I just throw a bunch of bottles in a big 20 gal. trash barrel. The
> barrel is filled with around 15 gal. cold water and a 1/3 of bleach.
That's 1/3 CUP of bleach :-0
AP
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 24 Jul 2000 22:40:33 -0700
From: John_E_Schnupp@amat.com
Subject: re: relief valves
From: Prestoniam@aol.com
>I have just received a gift of 10 "dirty" coke kegs ( 5 gal size), which have
>a relief valve on the lid, but no ring to pull up, like on my pepsi kegs. Can
>some one email me and let me know if these are an automatic only type valve,
>or is there some way I can manually releave the pressure using this valve?
You can vent the keg by pressing the in connection. You could also just
hook connector to the in connection that is not connected to anything.
Pretty simple. Just don't do it on the out side. If there is any pressure
and liquid in the keg, you'll get a face-full.
John Schnupp, N3CNL
Dirty Laundry Homebrewery
Georgia, VT
95 XLH 1200
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2000 09:25:23 +0200
From: Ant Hayes <Ant.Hayes@FifthQuadrant.co.za>
Subject: DUI
Today I woke to the news that our DUI limit has been dropped from 0,08 to
0,05. A problem that I have been battling with is that our brewing club
meetings generally result in a whole bunch of blokes driving home over the
limit. We serve food, and keep the tasting part of the evening relatively
short - but it does not take much tasting to go over 0,05. Our members live
anywhere within a 100 km radius of our meeting place - so a shuttle service
is out of the question. A club I belonged to before met in a library and had
very restricted tastings - but I find tasting other brewers' beer the best
way to learn. How do other clubs deal with this issue?
Dave Edwards asked, "..would you honestly brew beer with no alcohol in it."
My "holy grail" is to get my mild ale right. I drink a lot of beer,
particularly standing around the braai after the Wallabies have thumped the
Boks - but I don't really enjoy slurring in front of my family and friends.
Trying only to drink 2 or 3 beers takes the fun out of it (and is
difficult)- so I brew very low alcohol mild ales. However, if I could brew a
low (or no) alcohol porter - that would be great.
Oddly enough, I was rereading CJJ Berry's book published in 1963 at the
rebirth of homebrewing in UK, and he expressed the view that true
homebrewers were after flavour and aroma - not alcohol. His reasoning being
that your darts game is best served by drinking milds.
Ant Hayes
Brewing where beer was invented.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2000 02:45:54 -0500
From: "Rob Moline" <brewer@isunet.net>
Subject: The Jethro Gump Report
The Jethro Gump Report
>From: Alemantoo@aol.com
>Subject: Can You Over Hop A Beer.
>The light flavored American Pilsner style beers to me just
>tasted bitter. Bitterness was the only flavor I could detect. So when I
read
>an article on home brewing in Easy Riders (in 1973) I started brewing.
Light American Pilseners are too hopped for you? I guess you hate
hops....
Easy Riders had an article on HomeBrewing in '73? KEWL!
>My
>flavor experience did not come from my own beers at first, but I started
>finding and trying beers like Bass, Guinness, Whitbread and Whatneys. Beers
>with flavor that balanced the bitterness. As I became a better brewer and
was
>able to find better ingredients (especially hops) I was able to make my own
>flavorful beers.
Balance is a wonderful thing...but it depends on what the brewer is
trying to achieve...perhaps he wants a more flavourful, in the hops
direction, brew? Perhaps not? Would you allow that he wanted more hops? More
body? More sweetness?
Would you allow any brewer his concept?
I could recommend Zima.......Now, there's a malt bev, with no
bitterness...yes?
>What I am finding now is that many of my beer recipes that I
>have been making for years and have always been appreciated are getting
>comments like "it could use more finishing hops". I have always worked at
>balancing the flavors of my beers and keeping the flavors appropriate to
the
>style and now to get a comment like "needs more hops" especially in styles
>that should be lightly hopped or that shouldn't have any finishing hops at
>all, strikes a nerve with me.
As obviously, it has struck the nerve of the judge? This is not to say
that the judge is not full of Proserpines.....or, in, fact that even you are
able to judge your own beers yourself....
This is the fatal flaw...and the elegant benefit of entering comps.....
You get to hear from others.....
And yet retain the use of the term...YMMV!
I am reminded, here and now, of the brewer that brews and drinks his
own beer...day after day...
He doesn't see the incremental problems that creep up into his beers
(or were ALWAYS there) ...like the slight infection problem that is growing,
from an ever increasing volume of mold trapped in his Heat
Exchanger....simply 'cos he drinks his beer every day....
By the time he notices it, it will be in ALL of his beers, not just
those in serving, but those in secondary, primary, and the one he is gonna
brew tomorrow! He is simply accustomed to his brews...and will miss the
first signs of a prob...more crucially, the next ones as well...
Or that your brews might even be, year after year, not hoppy enough for
the style? Or have too much(/not enough?) malt that might be masking your
intentions of delicate hoppiness? Maybe this IS a prob that is weighted by
United States judges? (Time to enter the European comps? Or the "No Hop
Challenge?")
>To go to a micro or a brew pub and pay for a
>bock that is over the hill bitter or a Scottish Ale loaded with finishing
>hops ticks me off.
This is easy...anytime you enter a new brewpub, ask for..or buy a
sampler....then buy a pint of what you like....
I too, have sympathy for someone troubled by a brew with a mislabeled
style...
But, ultimately, I have respect for the brewer that makes his own
style...his way...no matter the label...
Otherwise, we are all just back to another argument over lagers....
VIENNA: "Dreher did it FIRST!!!"
MUNICH: "Sedlmayr did it FIRST..Dreher COPIED HIM!! And the COLOUR is
DIFFERENT!!!!!!"
Personally, I agree with Vienna, but are we now gonna nit pick over
their hop-rates? (Sedlmayr was always a piece of Euro-trash anyway, always
spending his family's money bouncing about! Lord Know's he was always an
easy target for any bint with a stash of Hallertauer! ;-) )
>It's one thing if you're a hop head and just want to brew
>a hoppy beer, I'm not trying to tell a home brewer how to brew his home
brew,
>but a I hate to see the results of a competition and see a winner in the
ale
>category using a lager yeast or a traditionally unhoppy beer category
>dominated by overly hoppy beers that don't belong in that category.
Now, we head into rarefied lands.....an ale category using a lager
yeast? I'd say...Good Luck to Him! And as for an unhoppy
category...dominated by hoppy examples....
Sir, I guess you would be one of those on the docks...SCREAMING..."SAVE
The INDIANS", as Hodgson initiated and commenced to monopolize the trade to
the sub-continent...(It's hard to climb up and live in a Hop Bine for a few
month's..eh, Sunshine?)
I guess the point is that he was doing something different....and it
lingered.....thrived...
>In
>closing I want to say that if you like it, it is not too hoppy for you. If
>you're entering it into a competition or trying to brew to a certain style,
>it may be too hoppy.
HUH?
> But can a beer be too hoppy - yes. I have read on more
>than one occasions about hops having an adverse effect on sexual desire.
>Jethro Kloss wrote a book, considered by many to be the bible of the health
>food set, called Back To Eden. He claims hops produce sleep when nothing
else
>will and says they are an excellent treatment for excessive sexual desires.
>So if things are pointing south when they should be pointing north, you may
>be a hop head and that beer just may be too hoppy. Imagine how much beer
>Miller would sell with a commercial filled with big macho athletes saying
>"more hops, less sex".
Just keep yer comments on yer sex life to yerself, eh?
"Jethro Kloss"...OBVIOUSLY a PSEUDONYM!! JUST cos you and Master Kloss
can't keep it up...well...I won't go into it...except to say....
Maybe some of us need some extra hops in our beer to 'keep it
down'...and limit the damage we would do otherwise???? Hmmmm? (You think my
palms being free of hair is just genetic?...No! It's the HOPS!)
And "sleep when nothing else will"...??? I have some anaesthetist mates
that will be happy to consult with you! (And Al Gore was banching on the
Pharmaceutical industry!... hmmmmmmm....If you are a LOBBYIST.....YOU need
to Register with Babcock!)
You did say "The light flavored American Pilsner style beers to me just
tasted bitter. Bitterness was the only flavor I could detect."
Truly, and this is the ONLY TRUTH I claim in this whole bit of
Banch....If those beers are too bitter for you...Sir, your tastebuds need
adjusting! (You might be a Super Taster! ANYONE that can taste any hops in
those beers deserves an integrated Media Campaign.... OPRAH??? Can YOU
Help?)
Strewth! Next thing, you will claim aluminium cause Alzheimers!?
>By the way, you fans of aluminum in brewing ware
>should read the part of his book dedicated to aluminum cook ware.
DOH?
Cheers!
Jethro Gump (Obviously a Pseudonym!)
The Jethro Gump Institute Of Practical Brewing & Banch!
(All Of The Above Is An Example of Parody....I LOVE Tom Logan...I Expect He
Would Taste Great Broiled....IF He Consumed More HOPS?)
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2000 09:49:40 +0200
From: "Campbell, Paul R SSI-ISEP-3" <Paul.R.Campbell@is.shell.com>
Subject: re:no-sparge foam/haze / Weiss
Del Lansing made the following comment which set my reluctant brain cell
(sic)
into speculation mode....
>Lower sweet wort levels of tannins would affect hot-break, but how much it
>affects haze reduction would depend on the S/T protein levels in the malt.
I wonder if a deliberate addition of tannin to the sweet wort may perhaps
help
to eliminate one variable from the problem? I recall old homebrewing books
from
the '60s recommending the addition of a "strong cup of cold tea" to extract
brews
at the time. Other than for flavouring (why?) I've never been sure of the
reason for
this, however it now occurs to me that perhaps it would help in clearing
down high
protein(?) levels from (the then) pretty poor quality extracts?
An alternative could be to simmer up some of the spent grains in some water
of a
suitable pH and extract some tannins that way?
- --------------------------
I've recently turned my interest to brewing a wheat beer and came across the
following article on the web which may be of interest to others. It gives a
good insight into a brewery adapting a technique to produce a different brew
on existing equipment. Pretty much the challenge we all face, I guess. I
couldn't help but laugh at the comment about the brewer initially
overpitching ;->
http://www.breworld.co.uk/the_grist/9804/gr2.html
Regards,
Paul
Almost brewing again in Glen Esk, Scotland
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2000 05:32:21 EDT
From: PVanslyke@aol.com
Subject: Cooperstown, NY
Good Morning,
If you get to Cooperstown, NY and the Ommegang brewery, take the short
drive (about 10 minutes) to the Cooperstown Brewery at Milford. They brew
some fine ales there starting off with "Old Slugger" pale ale.
Cheers,
Paul VanSlyke >> brewin' and relaxin' in Deposit, NY
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2000 05:57:59 -0400
From: "Stephen Alexander" <steve-alexander@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: re: mash parameters .../re:no-sparge foam/haze
I agree (tho with different emphasis) with much of Del's post but feel
the need to pipe up on one point.
> Once the iodine says "no starch" in the free run liquor, [...]
It's important to understand exactly what the iodine is really telling you.
Iodine ceases to color oligosaccharides when you get down to about
10 or 15 glucose units (can't recall). At 10G's you are talking about
v.large dextrins. If you are shooting for a well attenuated ale you don't
want to stop as soon at the iodine ceases to color - that's just an early
warning that the end is approaching. OTOH for a bock you may well
be finished.
Also iodine doesn't reliably color amylopectins - only the straight
chained amylose that represents a small fraction of the carbs in
malt.
If I wasn't so busy I could estimate the %age of 1-4 bonds busted by
alpha-and beta-amylase for a given degree of fermentability and also
the %age that must be broken to get a negative iodine. That would tell
us something more precise about what the negative iodine means.
The Luddites would be up in arms tho'.
Iodine is a good proxy indicator - but it is not really measuring what
we would like to know and control.
==
Del also writes ...
>If 164 is being reached I'd expect that there shouldn't
>be any unconverted starch carryover, but an iodine test
>would say for sure.
Iodine tests were performed on all brews before mashout which was
universally above 164F.
>Lower sweet wort levels of tannins would affect hot-break, but how much it
>affects haze reduction would depend on the S/T protein levels in the malt.
>The S/T figures I've seen for some German malts or pretty low, 36 or 37.
>These may need a bit more tannins for full coagulation.
Same difference appeared w/ Durst Pils and Crisp & Scotmalt PA malts.
Tho' I don't see why you think LOWER soluble protein malts would require
more tannin for precipitation.
>If wort pH hits 5 or below then hot break is affected
>negatively.
The mash-in pH was between 5.2 and 5.3 at temp. Sparge
water was pretreated and had a pH no higher than 6.0.
I don't see why the haze is any mystery - enough tannins to create haze
but not enough to precipitate it in the no-sparge. The foam is another
matter. There are a number of references to using added phenolics to
precipitate haze.
-S
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2000 08:40:20 -0400
From: Dave Burley <Dave_Burley@compuserve.com>
Subject: Package
Brewsters:
Chris Barrs ( nice name!) asks for our opinion on his homebrew display
"slick pak" (R?) . I suspect knowing all but the richest of us would shy
away from a package that cost us $2.00 or so to give away 6 beers makes
your pricing seem incredibly high. I know I would have trouble with
something like that. I'm pretty sure the microbrewers would have no
interest at that price. Makes my brown paper bag from the grocery store
seem well... cheap, I guess.
Have you done your research and seen and priced the existing plain
cardboard six pack holders which already exist for the microbrewery trade?
These do a pretty good job of displaying the labels and are easy to fill.
These can be laminated and printed as well.
Keep on Brewin'
Dave Burley
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2000 07:43:45 -0500
From: Jim Bermingham <bermingham@antennaproducts.com>
Subject:
Dave,
Don't know about down under, but most of the world doesn't give awards for
being a drunk. I agree with Pat. I'm a home brewer, not a drunk and don't
want to be called one.
Jim Bermingham
Millsap, TX
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2000 08:23:07 -0500
From: "Sweeney, David" <David@studentlife.tamu.edu>
Subject: Re: Sooky sooky la la. (Cat. 5) -> Cat. 6 (Deadly Serious)
Pat said:
>>>the point is that we'd prefer not to be classified as drunks simply
because we are home brewers. So I'm not "winging" - I am dealing with it by
publicly standing up for what I believe.<<<
I'm with Pat on this one. It's a slippery slope to approach brewing for
the wrong reasons. For me, drinking the beer I make is a secondary (and
pleasant) benefit to the process of making it. I co-advise the Texas A&M
brew club (TABC), which is made up primarily of graduate students (all over
21). I try to communicate my love of brewing so they will approach the hobby
with the *right* sense. Fortunately, they don't need a lot of
encouragement.
My department (Student Life) also contains an office for Alcohol and Drug
Education and Prevention (ADEP). We're in the process of setting up an
educational program to give presentations on the history of brewing to the
fraternities and sororities. Frats are one trouble spot for irresponsible
drinking. The thought is that we (TABC) can foster an appreciation for the
hobby of brewing rather than the hobby of drinking.
David Sweeney
Texas A&M University
david@studentlife.tamu.edu
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2000 10:09:42 -0400
From: "Czerpak, Pete" <Pete.Czerpak@siigroup.com>
Subject: part-time drunk reply
Gotta admit that I am a bit bummed by dave's comment to pats thoughts on
brewers and drunks. Pat is right in that most people take drunk to be a
derogatory term and certainly not a compliment. Personally I think that its
okay or not nearly as bad for a homebrewer to call himself a part-time drunk
(which is what the original poster may have heard his brother or whomever
say). Its a whole nother ball-game to be calling people part-time drunk and
homebrewer if its not you saying it about yourself. i assume since its his
brother he meant it in the nicest joking way and didn't mean to start a war
up.
I brew for the tasting experience. Gotta admit I do enjoy brewing tough
IPAs at 1.065 gravity and barley wines and imperial stouts and maybe even
belgian triples and scottish but I drink more for the flavor (as well as the
hops) than for the booze aspect. i also enjoy the aspect of knowing what it
takes to make water into beverage. designing beer is a darn fun thing and
when they come out just as desired or not quite, but maybe more perfect,
than its a job well done. plus seeing somebody taste homebrew for the first
time and say, "damn, thats good" is pretty neat too. the alcohol part is
just another piece in the puzzle in making a good malt beverage. the
correct amount really can make the recipe. obviously the range goes from
milds on up to the barley wines and the alcohol contribution to the
complexity are different.
Respect for brewers is good. Drunks probably do not deserve the same
however.
Pete czerpak
albany, NY
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2000 10:33:34 -0400
From: "Czerpak, Pete" <Pete.Czerpak@siigroup.com>
Subject: more no sparge and Gott info
Sean Dugre asks about on-line Gotts. I got mine from Homebrew Adventures
down in NC or SC for $62 plus shipping and this include cooler, fittings,
false bottom. They also have a sparge Gott for a little less. i think the
two can be had for maybe $110 but call or check their site
(1-888-785-7766). Not affiliated just a happy customer enjoying my Gott.
they sell the cooler separate from the mash or sparge equipment also.
Nate Lansing continues to ponders Steves and my commenst on haze and foam.
My mash contains about 5 gallons water and 15 lbs of grain or so. When I
drain first runnings this yields about 3-3.5 gallons of first runnings
showing about 1.5-2 gallons held up in the grains and the Gott. My batch
sparge of 2 gallons then yields about 5-5.5 gallons total. Sometimes I read
my mashout temperature but I don't think that I have recently since I've
gone from oven mashing to the Gott mash tun. temp of mash when I finish
drawing off first runnings is about 152-156F though. I don't really get any
decline over the 90 minute mash cycle.
Unfortunately, I do not measure pH. I do have a water analysis at home but
the quick and dirty is that Albany, NY water is pretty soft and not very
minerally. I do not alter my water in the mash or sparge but do add gypsum
in the boil for hopping effects for most of my hoppy ales that are not too
dark colored.
Continue to post your high hopping adventures. It was good to see Jeff
McNallys barley wine with the predicted and measured IBUs. get that 3 yr
old analysis run though. I brewed a barley wine in january which is predict
via Tinseth to be around 165 or so. Not too shabby but nothing like 424 or
Alan meekers brew. I will be pursuing this in the fall however once I drain
2 kegs of newly brewed and dry-hopped IPAs.
Pete czerpak
albany, ny
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2000 08:50:17 -0600
From: "G. M. Remec" <gremec@gsbpop.uchicago.edu>
Subject: British ale yeasts
Hello all,
I'm planning on brewing some British recipes: a Best Bitter, an IPA, and a
Northern Brown, and I'd like to use the same yeast for all three. Using
the same yeast is probably not optimal for these three different styles,
but I like to re-pitch. I've only used a couple of the British ale yeasts
available from Wyeast and White Labs, so I'm seeking recommendations.
The yeast marketing literature makes each strain sound great, so I'm hoping
to hear from those who have experience with these yeasts. Possibilities
from Wyeast include: 1028 London, 1098 British, 1099 Whitbread, 1187
Ringwood, 1275 Thames Valley, 1318 London III, 1335 British II, and 1968
ESB. White Labs offers: WLP002 English, WLP005 British, WLP007 Dry
British, WLP023 Burton, and WLP025 Southwold.
Which would you recommend?
Cheers!
Greg
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2000 07:57:39 -0700
From: "Michael J. Westcott" <mikew@sedona.net>
Subject: Phenols vs. esters in Weizen
I'd like to brew a Bavarian weizen which favors the
isoamylacetate esters (banana) in its flavor profile.
Based on a search of the HBD archives, it is the consensus
that lower pitching rates with higher fermentation temperatures
will favor the esters as opposed to higher pitching rates with
lower fermentation temperatures which will favor the formation
of 4-vinyl guaiacol and 4-vinyl phenol (clovelike) substances.
Seeming to contradict this consensus is Warner, who says on page
43 of "German Wheat Beer" that higher fermentation temperatures
as a rule produce more of the phenolic substances. He doesn't say
whether or not they also produce more of the esters. This would agree
with my experience over the course of brewing 6 batches of wheat beer
with fermentation temperatures at or above 68 F. I have used both Wyeast
3056 and 3068 and White Labs WLP300 and have produced fine beers, just
not with as much estery character in the flavor profile as I would like.
Any
comments as to yeast, fermentation temperatures or any other brewing
strategy to produce a taste which emphasizes the esters in a weizen would
be appreciated.
Thanks, Mike
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2000 11:24:57 -0400
From: "Spencer W. Thomas" <spencer@umich.edu>
Subject: HBD search on hiatus
Hi, all.
The HBD search link at hbd.org (the one on the "home page", not the
one on the "HTMLized" page) is hosted by yours truly. New digests are
added to the search list as a side-effect of me reading them.
So what's the point? The point is: I'll be on vacation for a couple
of weeks from July 26-Aug 8. During that time I won't be reading the
HBD. So don't expect recent issues of the HBD to be searchable until
some time after I get back.
I'll be thinking of you all while I'm sipping Alt in Duesseldorf and
Koelsch in Koeln. Really! :-)
=Spencer Thomas in Ann Arbor, MI (spencer@umich.edu)
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2000 11:26:39 -0400
From: "Paul Kensler" <paul.kensler@attglobal.net>
Subject: re: Gott coolers
Sean asks about Gott coolers...
Sean, I bought mine at a local sporting goods store... I've also seen them
irregularly at big hardware stores, Kmarts, Walmarts, etc. - I can't help
you as far as buying online goes.
But I do have a suggestion on how to replace the tap - its affordable, easy
and works great! First I removed the plastic spigot. Then I got one of
those minikeg bungs and shoved it into the hole from the inside - it fits
perfectly and although it wiggles a little bit it seals completely - even
while wiggling! The bulkhead is very thin where the spigot goes, so you
only need one bung. Next I shoved a 4" brass pipe nipple through the hole
in the bung. It's a pretty tight fit, so it doesn't leak at all. Finally,
I added a brass ball valve to the outside of the pipe nipple, and a hose
barb to the inside for attaching to my Phil's Phalse Bottom.
It doesn't leak, it won't pop off, it disassembles if you need it to, and
you have complete control over the flow rate. Much better than any other
methods I tried... (rubber stopper with tube, plastic bulkheads, etc.).
Also for what its worth, I drilled a couple more holes into the Gott and did
the same sort of modification - one of the holes (right above the ball
valve) is for a thermometer to screw into and the other (just below the lid)
is for attaching my sparge water hose so I can keep the lid shut during
sparging. If you drill through the main part of the body, use a 13/16" bit,
and you will need two minikeg bungs - one for the outside and one for the
inside, since the bulkhead is thicker.
Hope this helps!
Paul Kensler
Lansing, MI
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2000 12:02:59 -0400
From: "Czerpak, Pete" <Pete.Czerpak@siigroup.com>
Subject: Wyeast 1275 or 1318
Its time to be planning my August and September brewing. I am thinking of
trying Wyeast 1275 (thames valley) or 1318 (London 3) for the first time.
Planned brews are a rye ale and a pretty robust porter from the same yeast
with one pitched on the slurry of the other. reasonable sized starter for
the first batch is planned as well.
Traditionally I've been a 1028/1056 user for atleast 50% of my ales.
If I use 1275, I may used it for a fall scottish wee heavy as well.
Any comments on using 1318 or 1275 appreciated. There has been some
pooh-poohing of each in the past as well as some good compliments.
Thanks,
Pete czerpak
albany, ny
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2000 13:33:53 -0400
From: woodsj@us.ibm.com
Subject: Homebrew vs Coors Light
Don't know which category this fits but something happened Friday
July 21st that I must share with the collective. Every July there is an
all-star football game in Hershey, PA called the Big 33 Football Classic.
It matches the best 33 high school football players in Pennsylvania
against the same from Ohio. All of these kids are headed to big-time
college football (American football for the Aussies) programs in a few
weeks and the talent is impressive, but I digress. There is an annual
day long Big 33 Officials Clinic for officials/referees to prepare us for
the
upcoming season. The night before the clinic and game the officials
(I officiate both high school and college football, of which the only
downside is screaming coaches and it keeps me from brewing in the
fall) host a hospitaility suite, a drinking party in other words. This
year
I brought along a keg of ESB that went over fairly well. It seemed to be
more of a novelty for some. I usually bring along some brew for
after-game tailgating and many people look forward to working on the
field with me for the homebrew, I'm starting to think mostly for the
post-game liquid replenishment.
Anyway.....this year Jim Kelly (former Buffalo Bills QB) was the honorary
chairman. He was in the suite next door and we asked him to join the
party. He came in and immediately asked "Where's the beer ?" A guy
hands him a Coors Light and someone else hands him a glass of
homebrew and says try it. Jim trys it and says "Not bad", trys another
sip and says "Pretty good, but Coors pays me a lot of money to drink
their beer". We all got a big howl and he stayed for a while and partyed
with us. I was a proud brewer but got dissed by celebrity endorsements.
Any moral to the story ? Had to share this on the HBD !!
Jeff Woods
Camp Hill, PA
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2000 13:23:26 -0500
From: Matthew Arnold <revmra@iname.com>
Subject: Re: Sooky sooky la la (whatever that means)
On Tue, 25 Jul 2000 00:13:19 -0400, you wrote:
>Speak for youself Pat. Some of us couldn't give a rats arse what other
>people think of our drinking habits, we just brew. Yes, some of us do drink
>a lot, is there a problem with that? Yes, we brew beer for the flavours and
>aromas that we can create, but would you honestly brew beer with no alcohol
>in it.
If I could brew my beer with the same flavors but no alcohol I would do it in a
heartbeat. My job (Lutheran pastor, as some of you know) requires me to be on
call 24/7. I can't afford to be impaired at any time ("No, sorry, pastor can't
come to the hospital right now. He's not safe to drive over there"). I've
already had more than a few people make the "logical" assumption that
homebrewer = alcoholic, therefore pastor = alcoholic. I don't like having my
occupation, my church, or my Lord dragged through the mud just because someone
failed to take a logic course in college.
I never have understood (and I doubt I ever will understand) people whose goal
in life is to make it to Friday night so they can get drunk out of their minds.
Most of the people I know who subscribe to that theory can scarcely afford the
loss of brain cells. I'm not saying that this is _your_ modus operandi, Dave,
but, like Pat, I'm sick and tired of everyone assuming that it is mine.
Matt
P.S. On an actual brewing note: I just got 10# of sour cherries to add to my
plambic. I don't know if it will end up as utterly wonderful as Boon Mariage
Parfait Kriek, but I can dream, can't I?
- -----
Webmaster, Green Bay Rackers Homebrewers' Club
http://www.rackers.org info@rackers.org
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2000 15:04:59 -0500
From: Eddie Kent <ebk1@earthlink.net>
Subject: No such thing as too much hops....
The more the hops the longer my beer lasts since the miller/bud fans in
my neighborhood tell me my beer is too bitter (like omething is wrong
with it).
Also-Alemantoo@aol.com- PEOPLE WRITE IN PARAGRAPHS FOR A REASON
A hop head in Texas.....
- --
Eddie Kent
Houston, TX
Yes my son it is grain, in which any fool can eat.
But the Lord has a more divine use in mind.
Let us give thanks to the bounty and praise to the
beauty and learn about, Beer.
-- Friar Tuck --
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2000 16:07:48 -0500
From: hal <hwarrick@springnet1.com>
Subject: HOP Goddess ??
Did you say hop goddess ??
Prove it, I need pics. Show me photos.
Please excuse that burst of curiousity.
Hal
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2000 17:40:59 -0500
From: "Kevin Jones" <mrkjones@mindspring.com>
Subject: gott cooler mash tun
Sean,
The 5 gallon size are not hard to find....camping good store, Wall Mart etc.
I wanted the 10 gallon size and could only find them at a local lumber
store, about $45-50. As for the tap, if you are planning to use it for
mash/lauter tun just take the water tap out ( it just unscrews) and insert a
drilled stopper (sorry I don't know the size). Through the stopper insert
about 6 in. of copper tubing. One end will hook up to your wort runoff line,
the other to the false bottom. I use Phils 12" false bottom. One other tip
that Steve Scoville (Music City Brewers) came up with. Place a fine mesh
nylon bag over the false bottom to prevent stuck mashes (gain getting under
the bottom and plugging the pickup), helps filter small husk particles
during first running, etc. Works Great! Buy the bags at Home Depot
(building supply). The bags are for straining 5 gallon buckets of paint. I
just cut the elastic band off before using. Cost about a buck each and can
be reused many times.
Drink Better Beer,
Kevin Jones
Music City Brewers
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2000 17:48:52 -0500
From: "George Krafcisin" <gkrafcisin@mindspring.com>
Subject: ADVANCED TEXTS
Has anyone (besides Richard F. Sieben of Chicago, who kindly left a review
on the Amazon website) read either of the following pricy texts?
Malting and Brewing Science: Volume 1, Briggs, D.E.($120)
Malting and Brewing Science: Hopped Wort and Beer Volume 2, by Hough, J.S.,
Briggs, D.E., Stevens, R., and Young, T.W. ($130)
Handbook of Brewing, William A. Hardwick, PhD ($225)
Opinions? Should I buy if I want to know all the details, including the
difficult science? Or save my money and buy a grain mill?
George Krafcisin
Glencoe, Illinois (USA, not Scotland)
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2000 21:34:07 -0500
From: Marc Morency <marcmo.marcobrau.com@mail.marcobrau.com>
Subject: Dry-hopping a cause for infection?
I dry hop a lot of the pale ales I brew and I dry hop with pellets. I've
heard that dry-hopping with pellets prevents infection (compared to
using whole hops or plugs) because there is less surface area for
bacteria to attach themselves to and grow on. Is this true? I really
think add dry hops to the secondary is the best way to get hop flavor
and aroma in my beer, but if there's a better way that's proven, I'll
try it.
- --
Marc Morency - http://www.geocities.com/marcmo3/index.htm
Marcobrau Beer Pages - http://www.marcobrau.com
------------------------------
End of HOMEBREW Digest #3387, 07/26/00
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