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HOMEBREW Digest #2820
HOMEBREW Digest #2820 Wed 09 September 1998
FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
Digest Janitor: janitor@hbd.org
Many thanks to the Observer & Eccentric Newspapers of
Livonia, Michigan for sponsoring the Homebrew Digest.
URL: http://www.oeonline.com
Contents:
Green Hops ("J. Kish")
cleaning keg lines (K. Kutskill)
Dayton BPs (MicahM1269)
re: drying Hops (Pvrozanski)
favorite base malts II (Sharon/Dan Ritter)
when lager (kathy)
No Sparge 1st attempt (randy.pressley)
Reply to Thomas S Barnett (decoction mash) ("Chip Upsal")
New toys (Dave Hinrichs)
High Temp. Pump (cbs)
Re: Green hops (Sahti)
Green hops weight... (Some Guy)
Poly Clar ("Spies, James")
Dry green hops... (Some Guy)
Northern Wisconsin Report ("Jeffrey M. Kenton")
Hops Storage Tip #33 (EFOUCH)
Triple decoction / in-line thermometer / Thanks! (George_De_Piro)
New Liquid yeast packets (randy.pressley)
decoction mashing (Jeremy Price)
Pun of the Year (Steve Waite)
In defense of phenolic flavors/Ale+Lager US HIstory/AJ's zinc ("Steve Alexander")
19th Century beers ("Bryan L. Gros")
Storing grain (John Wilkinson)
Re: Carbonation with yeast (Matthew Arnold)
new email address (fridge)
Parti-Gyle and Batch Sparging (Dan Cole)
Rice Beer/Sake (Calgarey Penn)
re:green hops (Jon Macleod)
Let a good beer be the exclamation point at the end of your day as
every sentence deserves proper punctuation...
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----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 07 Sep 1998 22:02:05 -0700
From: "J. Kish" <jjkish@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Green Hops
To: Jack Schmidling
Are you telling us you never tried fresh, green hops
directly picked off the vine, and used in a batch of beer?
Don't wait another minute! Green hops seem to give enhanced
flavor to the beer, the heading is improved, too.
Once you try it, you'll wish you could use green hops all
year! Make lots of beer while the hops are green!
The weight of the hops is a lot heavier freshly picked, so
you will have to do some guess work to estimate how much to
use. In hot weather, hops start to dry out on-the-vine,
so that also needs to be taken in consideration.
Try it, you'll love it!
Joe Kish
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1998 07:21:49 -0400
From: kkutskill@net-ex.com (K. Kutskill)
Subject: cleaning keg lines
I seem to have a recurring problem. The beer in my kegs seem to pick up an
off flavor about 3-4 weeks after tapping, which I attribute to
dirty/contaminated keg lines (doesn't happen when I detach the the keg lines
after dispensing beer). I am currently using the plastic cobra taps, in a
converted chest freezer. What is the best way to clean and sanitize the
lines, so I don't have to keep on detaching the lines?
TIA,
Kevin Kutskill
kkutskill@net-ex.com
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1998 07:21:28 EDT
From: MicahM1269@aol.com
Subject: Dayton BPs
Does anyone know of some good drinking beer drinking establishments in the
Dayton, Ohio area? Any brew pubs?
private e-mail responses would be great.
TIA
micah millspaw - brewer at large
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1998 06:27:46 -0500
From: Pvrozanski@ra.rockwell.com
Subject: re: drying Hops
Paul VanSlyke wrote:
>Good morning,
>The last batch brewed, I used leaf hops (cascade) purchased in oxygen
barrier
>bags. Previously I have used either hops packaged as plugs or pellets. The
>leaf hops were very green in color. Hops that I have picked and dried have
>always "browned" to some degree.
>
>My question is: How do the commercial growers manage to dry their hops and
>maintain the fresh green appearance?
It depends on the method of drying.
If you dry in an oven you are relying on heat to remove the moisture from
the hops and in essence you are baking the hops.
I think the preferred method is to use a dehydrator. This method removes
the moisture by passing air over the hops. Of course the drier the air the
better. Most home dehydrators have a heating element in them to provide
warm air, which speeds up the drying.
By drying them in dehydrator you also maintain the hops color. The airflow
and gentle heat, usually around 115 degrees F., assure this.
If you do use an oven, cut the heat down and position a fan the air in the
oven so the air has a chance to move around.
The dehydrator I use is an American Harvest with 8 trays. I end up with 6-8
ounces of dried hops per 24 hour period.
Hope this helps,
Phil Rozanski
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 98 05:55:23 MST
From: Sharon/Dan Ritter <ritter@bitterroot.net>
Subject: favorite base malts II
A few weeeks ago I asked HBD readers to tell me their favorite ale and
lager base malts. A few responses trickled in but no clear consensus
emerged. In case you missed the post, I'd like to try it one more time.
Send me the malts you prefer and I'll post the final results.
Here's what I have so far:
Paul's Pale Ale malt (Hugh Baird also)
Canadian Malting Harrington
Gambrinus "ESB Malt
Maris Otter Pale Ale Malt. (Crisp Malting)
Hugh Baird (problems with recent bag however)
Durst lager
Weissheimer Pils
DeWolf Cosyns pilsner malt
Dan Ritter <ritter@bitterroot.net>
Ritter's MAMMOTH Brewery - Hamilton, Montana
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 07 Sep 1998 09:05:42 -0500
From: kathy <kbooth@scnc.waverly.k12.mi.us>
Subject: when lager
I am not an historian, but I've always associated the move to lager
beers with the industrial period. Workers in hot sweaty environments
wanted a cool, refreshing quench-your-thrist type of drink "Its Miller
Time" rather than a sip-thru-the-evening flavored ale/stout as you hang
with your buddies in the pub.
Also, the industrial period meant that mechanical refrigeration and
ice-making was possible and the Great Lakes ice that Made Milwaukee
famous as a producer of lager beer, could be had in St. Louis,
Louisville, Cincinatti, et al. Imagine in the 1870's trying to brew
lager beer in climates like Kansas City, Missouri or Alanta and having
to compete with ice loaded boxcars of beer from Milwaukee.
cheers, jim booth, lansing, mi
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1998 8:32:29 -0500
From: randy.pressley@SLKP.COM
Subject: No Sparge 1st attempt
I read an article recently in Brewing Techniques about conducting an all
grain
and omitting the sparge. I then searched the hbd archives and found
others who
have done the no sparge and everyone who does it seems pleased with the
results. Different folks use different techniques and I'm going to try
my own
technique this Friday if my yeast arrives thru the mail in time. I'm
going to
conduct a 15 gallon batch using two boilers. My plan is to make the mash
just
a little thin by using 1.5 quarts of water per pound of grain. I will
have 42
lbs of grain and 16 gallons of water in the mash tun. Assuming 1 gallon
of
grain absorption per 10 lbs of grain I should be able to get about 12
gallons
of first runnings. I'm hoping the gravity will be higher than my target
so I
can dilute with treated boiling water. Before I dilute I will stir the
first
runnings in boiler number one and transfer over a calculated amount into
boiler
number 2. The calculated amount is based upon the gravity and dilution
needed.
I will then figure out how much more wort I need for boiler number two and
add
that + an extra 20% to the mash tun and no sparge once again.
I guess this second boiler could be called a modified small beer since it
has
some of the good stuff or maybe it should be called a medium beer. I'm
looking
for any opinions or suggestions about my strategy. I'll post my results
when I
get to taste my first bottle which shouldn't be too long since this is
going to
be an English Brown Ale.
Cheers!
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1998 07:20:22 -0600
From: "Chip Upsal" <brewerchip@trail.com>
Subject: Reply to Thomas S Barnett (decoction mash)
I have used double decoctions for my Bock beers. I feel it does indeed make
for a better flavored -- richer/malter -- beer. (I won best of show with
this recipe in Memphis a couple of years back)
For me decoction mashing is the only way to do a multi-temp. mash; since i
have basically only an infusion mash system.
Yes it takes quite a bit more time, but i feel it is worth it for
traditional bocks and other lager beers.
Chip
______________________________________________
visit my site at:
http://www.computer-chip.com
chip@computer-chip.com
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1998 10:00:46 -0400
From: Dave Hinrichs <dhinrichs@quannon.com>
Subject: New toys
I just returned from a restaraunt supply house (more Stainless than a mad
scientist could use) and found the mother of all Igloo's. 11 gallon all
Stainless NSF. It's an AerVoid Thermal Container from Vacuum Can Co.,
Chicago, IL. The only problem is there is no bottom drain. Before I go
slicing and dicing this baby I want to ask the collective if anyone has one
of these and can give advice in regards to the drain.
Much appreciated.
***************************************************************
* Dave Hinrichs E-Mail: dhinrichs@quannon.com *
* Quannon CAD Systems, Inc. Voice: (612) 935-3367 *
* 6101 Baker Road, Suite 204 FAX: (612) 935-0409 *
* Minnetonka, MN 55345 BBS: (612) 935-8465 *
* http://www.quannon.com/ *
***************************************************************
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 08 Sep 1998 10:04:38 -0700
From: cbs@bellatlantic.net
Subject: High Temp. Pump
Collective:
I'm looking for a pump to circulate water at 200 dregees plus.
The pump should be able to push water throught 25 feet of 3/8" or 1/2"
copper tubing. Also this pump should able to lift 4 feet.
The cost I've been given is approx. $125.00.
Thanks for the Help.
B. Bennett
cbs@bellatlantic.net
Glassboro, N.J.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1998 10:12:04 EDT
From: Sahti@aol.com
Subject: Re: Green hops
In a message dated 98-09-08 04:08:01 EDT, you write:
<< > Is there any reason why hops must be dried before use?
>
> js
I believe hops are dried simply as a storage method. Similar to
making jerky or sun-dried tomatos. Remove the water and there's less
chance of molds and other contaminants getting hold.
SM >>
Another reason to dry hops is a beer recipe (using whole hops) assumes the
hops are dried. Non-dried fresh hops have a certain amount of moisture in
them, so you would not be able to assume 1 ounce of green hops (undried) would
have the same amount of alpha-acids or flavour compounds as 1 ounce of dried
hops. I do not know how much water is in green hops (comments anyone?).
Perhaps there is not enough to make a difference on small scale brewing.
Cheers!
Bill
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1998 10:39:41 -0400 (EDT)
From: Some Guy <pbabcock@oeonline.com>
Subject: Green hops weight...
Greetings, Beerlings! Take me to your lager...
Joe Kish intones: "The weight of the hops is a lot heavier freshly picked,
so you will have to do some guess work to estimate how much to use."
Should be a factor of around four.
See ya!
Pat Babcock in SE Michigan pbabcock@oeonline.com
Home Brew Digest Janitor janitor@hbd.org
HBD Web Site http://hbd.org
The Home Brew Page http://oeonline.com/~pbabcock/brew.html
"Just a cyber-shadow of his former brewing self..."
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1998 10:49:37 -0400
From: "Spies, James" <Spies@dhcd.state.md.us>
Subject: Poly Clar
All -
Due to the relatively low traffic on the HBD of late, I'll ask a
question that has been gnawing at me for awhile . . .
I would like to fine my beers with Poly Clar (have heard it's one of the
more effective fining agents), so I bought some, rehydrated about 1
tablespoon of it in boiled, cooled water, and dumped it into a finished
APA that I had sitting in a carboy in my 70 or so degree basement. I
swirled the carboy around once every few days to try to resuspend the
stuff, but the final bottled product was not that much different than my
un-fined beers. Scratching my befuddled head, I reasoned that I had
missed an essential step somewhere in the process. However, the
instructions on the Poly Clar container said only to "add to finished
beer" Gee, thanks for the scoop.
Anyone know what I did wrong? Should the beer be chilled to bring out
the chill haze before the Poly Clar is added? Should the Poly Clar be
added to an empty carboy and the finished beer racked onto it? Does
Poly Clar suck? Any ideas on how to use this or any other fining agent
would be welcomed and appreciated. BTW, the Poly Clar that I used was
white and had the consistency of confectioner's sugar (I've heard
there's 2 kinds of Poly Clar). I don't have any affiliation with the
stuff; just trying to glean a little info . . .
TIA,
Jay Spies
Wishful Thinking Basement Brewery
Baltimore, MD
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1998 10:46:41 -0400 (EDT)
From: Some Guy <pbabcock@oeonline.com>
Subject: Dry green hops...
Greetings, Beerlings! Take me to your lager...
Phil Rozanski opines: "It depends on the method of drying."
Actually, it seems to have more to do with the SPEED of drying. I dry on a
rack in the basement using ambent air currents. Hops are to 1/4 moisture
by weight within a few days, but brown considerably in the process. A
dehydrator would dry those same hops in much less time and would brown
much less. Same is true when "pressing" plant material for preservation:
the FASTER you remove the moisture, the less color change you experience
in the plant material. All else being equal, I don't think the oven
vs the dehydrator should make much difference - except the increased
airflow with the dehydrator. As has been said before, the key is airflow,
not temperature. (And, allied with the airflow, the ability of that air
to take up more moisture: humidity.)
See ya!
Pat Babcock in SE Michigan pbabcock@oeonline.com
Home Brew Digest Janitor janitor@hbd.org
HBD Web Site http://hbd.org
The Home Brew Page http://oeonline.com/~pbabcock/brew.html
"Just a cyber-shadow of his former brewing self..."
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1998 09:55:24 -0500
From: "Jeffrey M. Kenton" <jkenton@iastate.edu>
Subject: Northern Wisconsin Report
Howdy Gang. I just got back (last night) from a great time in the Door
County area of Wisconsin. My wife and I went 'up Nort' to help shingle our
family's summer cottage. Weather was great for that kind of work. Anyway to
the point: after shingling for most of the daylight hours, my parents
announced that they wanted to take us to a brewpub in Door County.
Always up for a new thing, I said "Let's go." When we got there, I noticed
a nice ten barrel system behind glass, spotless. My mouth began to water
when I saw that they had six styles, four of which were exciting to me.
However, the excitement that I felt when we took off for the brewpub was
instantly lost when I saw how they served their beers: in plastic cups like
at a keg party. I paid $3.00 a cup for beer while a younger lad, but that
$3.00 also afforded me all-I-care-to-drink amounts of beer (i.e. I could
refill it as often as I wanted).
Is this standard practice now (to serve pub-brewed beer in plastic cups)?
The other brewpubs I have been to served their beers in glass. The real
irony is that this brewpub sold glassware that had the pub's name on it. I
am currently drafting a letter to this establishment to express my opinion
about their presentation, as well as other facets of the service there.
In other notes, I had the six beer sampler, which came in two-ounce shot
glasses. Their fruit beers were boring (very faint fruit taste), and their
porter tasted like a fine dry stout. Two positive things to say: all beers
were crystal clear, and free of taste defects (to my in-training palate).
And as a final note, my wife (Jamie) expressed to me that she really liked
fruit beers, especially the ones that have fruit taste. (Thank you, God.
One more beer bullet.)
On the way home, Jamie even charted a course that would take us through New
Glarus, Wisconsin. New Glarus is a brewery that really takes its fruit beer
brewing seriously. You may remember they won the gold medal in the fruit
beer category for their Belgian Red (cherries, cherries, cherries). I
believe their raspberry beer also won high praise at GABF, but I may be
wrong. New Glarus Brewing Company also produces a fine line of more
standard fare: a pils, a light lager, etc.
Others may have said it first, but New Glarus may have a triple crown in
the fruit beer category at this year's GABF. Belgian Red, Raspberry and
Apple Ale. You can decide for yourself which takes first, second and third.
They are all excellent. Bring your checkbook when buying New Glarus' fruit
beers however. $5-6 for a 750ml bottle. Worth every penny.
Jeff
Jeffrey M. Kenton jkenton@iastate.edu
Ames, Iowa brewer@iastate.edu
------------------------------
Date: 8 Sep 1998 12:33:55 -0400
From: EFOUCH@steelcase.com
Subject: Hops Storage Tip #33
Marc said:
- --------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Sep 1998 10:38:58 -0400
From: Marc.Arseneau@fluordaniel.com
Subject: Homebrewing Tip #74
Step #1:
Light the Match
Step #2:
THEN turn the gas on.
DO NOT perform these simple steps in reverse order.
(the hair will grow back, right?)
Marc "Learning the hard way" Arseneau
- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Well, I've got my own tip to share regarding hops storage.
When using a CO2 fire extinguisher to purge wide mouthed one-gallon glass jars
for hops storage, it's best to do so BEFORE you put the hops in the jar.
I'm still picking hops out of my teeth and hair.
And Marc- in my experience, eyelashes and eyebrows grow back, but slowly.
Eric (Fire Marsall Bill) Fouch
Bent Dick YocotoBrewery
Kentwood MI
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1998 13:17:47 -0700
From: George_De_Piro@berlex.com
Subject: Triple decoction / in-line thermometer / Thanks!
Hi all,
Tom asks if a triple decoction is appropriate (and desirable) for
brewing at home.
First, a quick review of what decoction brewing does: it allows
sugars and amino acids to react to form melanoidins (which can give a
beer a deep, malty character). This does not happen to a significant
degree in an infusion mash because the temperature never gets hot
enough.
I decoction brew quite often, and gave up multiple decoctions about
1.5 years ago. Why?
I didn't think it was making enough of a flavor difference in the beer
to warrant the time, effort, and potentially damaging mash handling.
All that handling of the hot mash can put you at risk for hot-side
aeration and burning yourself. A single decoction seems to work
adequately.
Another tremendous factor in my decision to abandon multiple
decoctions was the damage done to both the body and head retention of
my beer because of the long protein rest(s) that are really hard to
avoid when doing a multiple decoction. As I've said (many times),
modern malts are quite well-modified and do not rigorous mashing like
the continental malts of yesteryear. Resting the main mash in the
proteoytic range for over 30 min. while decocting can harm your beer's
body and head. Ouch!
When doing a single decoction it is easy to get around the protein
rest: simply mash-in at saccharification, rest, pull the decoction
and boil, then return it to hit 165-168F (73.8-75.6C). At this
temperature alpha amylase will convert the starch that is liberated
during the decoction boil. This adds little time to the brew day,
too.
---------------------------------
Here is a neat trick that I have now used 3 times and therefore
declare a success: a simple in-line thermometer to measure the
temperature of wort as it exits my counterflow chiller.
I spent a while trying to find a thermometer with a stem that would
make a water-tight seal using a compression-T so that I could measure
wort temperature as it enters the fermenter. After a little
searching, I dropped the idea and simply cut a slit in a piece of
tubing. The slit is just big enough to allow the stem of my Taylor
pocket digital thermometer to fit in it.
I boil the tube, put it on the end of my chiller, poke the thermometer
through the hole and let the wort run. Voila! Amazingly, it doesn't
leak after three uses! Simple can be so good...
-------------------------
Thanks to everybody who responded about the light source for a
microscope. I tried to send replies back individually, but I may have
missed a couple.
Have fun!
George de Piro (Nyack, NY)
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1998 13:16:40 -0500
From: randy.pressley@SLKP.COM
Subject: New Liquid yeast packets
Has anyone tried the new liquid yeast packets. You're suppose to be able
to
pop it and 6 hours later it's ready. The package says there is no need
for a
starter. You can tell if you have the new kind because the cost is $6.
50
versus the usual $4.00. I bought a couple of packets but haven't had
the
chance to use them yet. I will probably use a starter anyway, however
since
more yeast makes you happy quicker beer.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1998 13:56:25 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jeremy Price <pricejy@email.uc.edu>
Subject: decoction mashing
Thomas S Barnett <barnets@mail.auburn.edu>
asked about Triple Decoction--Bock Beer
>From my experience, brewing a doppel bock beer using the traditional triple
decoction method is overkill. You will most likely get unaccetable levels
of HSA from transfering the mash so many times. I have brewed several
doppelbocks, and while the decocted ones taste a bit fuller and maltier,
the infusion bocks were very tasty. I would suggest a single decoction,
or alter your grist to achieve some extra maltiness. I have found that
Belgian D/C aromatic malt is a good start. Also don't forget to start with
a solid base of German or Belgian Munich malt. Both malts are high in
melanodins, the compounds which will ultimately produce thoes malty or
bready flavors. Some on the digest may blast me for it, but I don't believe
that domestic malts can give that nice maltiness to a traditional bock.
Jeremy Price
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1998 10:56:44 -0700 (PDT)
From: Steve Waite <swaite@sr.hp.com>
Subject: Pun of the Year
In HBD 2817, Mark Lubben writes:
"The recent starter discussion
had just caused me to contemplate using a stout cord and 2 liter plastic bottle
^^^^^
like a bolo in the back yard. The neighbors already know I'm crazy..."
Quite possibly the best beer related pun of the decade.
Steve
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1998 15:56:23 -0400
From: "Steve Alexander" <steve-alexander@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: In defense of phenolic flavors/Ale+Lager US HIstory/AJ's zinc
Paul Niebergall responds to George DePiro's comments about ancient beers as ...
>I have never
>experienced *phenolic, sour, etc.* flavors in any of my decocted brews.
George was referring to phenolic off flavors due to infection and dextrinous or
starchy worts due to lack of ability to measure and control temperature and not
due to the decoction process per se. A thermometer and the improved sanitation
and yeast handling practices have improved homebrew re these problems - however
infection and resulting off-flavors continues to loom large on the list of
threats to good homebrew - and commercial brewing as well.
As for the statement, ". I have never experienced *phenolic[...]* flavors in
any of my decocted brews". I think this needs to be reconsidered. If you
have no phenolic flavors you really don't have beer - it's more like a Zima
clone.
Phenolics get a 'bad wrap' in every venue on brewing, and certainly the bad
side of phenolic flavors can be very bad indeed. What the statement above (and
I'm not picking on Paul here) and other similar absolutist statements about
phenolics ignore is that normal levels of phenolic compounds are VERY IMPORTANT
to normal beer flavor profile. A beer stripped of phenolics will taste simple
and insipid. Unoxidized phenolic compounds also impart an important 'flavor'
of freshness and briskness to beer and other drinks (wine, tea). My recent
experience and experiments with sparge versus no-sparge and the use of malted
'feed' barley for brewing, and the dilution of the resulting beer has just
reinforced my conviction that all beer relies on balanced levels of phenolics
for many of the positive flavor elements - also that in excess the positive
contributions of these smaller and unoxidized phenolic compounds can quickly
become dominant and negative - much faster than say negative aspects of
excessive hops or melanoidins.
A while back I made a CAP using homemade malt from feed barley. As I reported
the beer had a decidedly off flavor component that might be called husk-like or
perhaps straw-like. This component faded fast on dilution 1:1 with another
more normal beer - making a rather acceptable drink. More recently I created a
no-sparge and a sparge-only (small) beers - same mash, same yeast, different
hopping - both are quite acceptable on their own . The obvious difference in
flavor is quite apparently due to the same component that appeared in the
feed-barley malt beer - namely added phenolic content.
It isn't really beer without background phenolics, tho' it certainly isn't good
beer with excess phenolics either.
==
Mort points out some great historical references and provides notes - but
mostly he makes me envy his libraries full collection of JIB. Mine stops
around vol 60 sometime in the 1950s. Great post again Mort. Jeff Renner,
resident renaissance man (brewer, baker, biologist, historian, and isn't there
a little Chem/ChemE in there too Jeff ?) also come through with some very
interesting insights into lager development/history.
Incidentally I also found some answers to the historical questions I recently
posed in a little gem of a book, "Beer: Tap into the Art and Science of
Brewing", by Charles Bamforth.1998 Plenum Press. The intended audience for the
book is, I believe, the non-brewing beer geek/science geek, and it's certainly
not a how-to book, but it contains many tidbits on the science and practice of
brewing that won't be lost on the HBD audience either. Fun to read and well
written, with some great insights on history as well as science (Answers the
burning question - why did the US Air Force fund the development of the metal
beer keg, and in Britain no less ?).
==
AJ posts on mineral levels in malt, esp zinc levels and the results surprise me
a bit - in that free zinc levels in malt are so high. He states ...
>It would be interesting to compare the free
>and total zinc (and copper) content of a finished beer with that of the
>malt it was brewed from and perhaps one day I'll get to do that. For
>now, suffice it to say that malt appears to have lots of copper,
>manganese and zinc and that at least trace levels of zinc make it
>through to the finished beer in free ion form.
I think it would be extremely interesting. I have read in several sources that
zinc and certain other metals Cu and Mn from memory) are so effectively removed
from wort, bound to the break material that wort can be deficient in these
critical yeast enzyme cofactors regardless of the apparent high levels in the
kettle. I know that adding 0.5ppm of zinc to my fermenter has a noticeable
positive effect on fermentation (and makes good use of the 'zinc as common cold
cure' scam tablets of a few years ago which still appear in the pharmacy
shelves).
- --
Apologies for all the bandwidth I've used recently, but I hope it's more
interesting than on-line freezer repair threads,
Steve Alexander
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 08 Sep 1998 13:36:33 -0700
From: "Bryan L. Gros" <gros@bigfoot.com>
Subject: 19th Century beers
I've found the discussions lately of 19th Century brewing in US
quite interesting.
I enjoyed the history section of the new style book Altbier,
which describes the "lager revolution" from an angle that was
new to me.
Basically, people (at least in Bavaria) had been trying to
"brew lagers" for hundreds of years. They realized that fermenting
and aging in cool caves made better beer than warm areas.
Brew laws like the purity law and a later law which prohibited
brewing in the summer, led to better beer. In the days before
yeast cultures, all these methods were leading people to making
lagers, primarily by selecting for cool fermenting yeasts.
Naturally people would perfer the cleaner tasting lagers to the
ales back then, which no doubt quickly went sour and were
flavored with all kinds of root and herbs.
Mid 19th century was, of course, when new yeast research
started to show brewers how to make lagers in other areas of
the world. Refridgeration quickly followed.
Jeff R wrote (re: Classic Am. Pilsner):
>If you haven't brewed this great style yet, do it this season. And
>consider entering it in competitions. We need to keep this in front of the
>non-HBD brewers! It was featured in Madison's Taste of the Midwest last
>month, where about a dozen commercial brewers brewed versions (some may
>have been ales).
Mine was very nice this summer. There is still plenty of predjudice
out there against non all-malt beers, even in (especially in?) long-time
homebrewers and craft brewers.
Didn't you post a recipe at one time for a "Classic Am Porter"?
Can you repost?
- Bryan
Bryan Gros gros@bigfoot.com
Oakland, CA
Visit the new Draught Board homebrew website:
http://www.valhallabrewing.com/~thor/dboard/index.htm
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 98 16:30:17 CDT
From: jwilkins@wss.dsccc.com (John Wilkinson)
Subject: Storing grain
There has been some discussion lately about how to store grain so I thought
I would contribute my method. It is similar to that offered by Gregg Howard
but instead of using icing buckets I use five gallon liquid malt extract
buckets retrieved from my local homebrew shop. They get malt extract in them
and empty them into large drums. They throw the buckets away and I picked
some up. I had to clean the buckets out but that was simple using hot water.
I have even used the extract recovered to make starters. I am cheap. The
buckets I got have a screw on cap on the lid which makes it easy to pour grain
out. I remove the lid to fill the buckets but just remove the screw on cap to
use the grain. I also use these buckets for sanitizer, collecting chilled
wort if not going directly to the fermenter, or anything else a bucket is good
for. I label the buckets containing grain with a strip of masking tape with
the grain description written on it. A 25 kilo bag of grain is about two
buckets and one batch of beer, or two and a partial bucket.
Another thing about these buckets is that the lid is hard to remove but I found
a plastic tool at Home Depot intended for removing paint bucket lids that
works well. If left out in the cold these tools will get brittle and break but
if warmed up before using are fine.
I don't know if these buckets are common elsewhere but anyone interested might
call their local homebrew shop, if there is one, and ask.
John Wilkinson - Grapevine, Texas - jwilkins@wss.dsccc.com
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 08 Sep 1998 21:41:04 GMT
From: marnold@ez-net.com (Matthew Arnold)
Subject: Re: Carbonation with yeast
Dave B. wrote:
>Try rousing (stir up the yeast or rack all of the beer - including
>the yeast) the beer about three days into the ferment and see if
>these conditions go away.
I'm guessing that this is the problem. After observing this yeast more closely
than I have in the past, I've noticed that the yeast (#1338, European Ale)
tends to flocc nicely and hard (i.e. it's not "fluffy" on the bottom of the
fermenter, it packs itself down hard). I'm guessing this would also explain why
others (and I) have noticed that #1338 tends to keep fermenting forever. Most
of the yeast floccs out and the rest keeps sloooowly chugging away.
This is one of the coolest things about homebrewing: getting to toy with
various yeasts and see how they react quite differently and give quite
different flavors/aromas.
Matt
- -----
Webmaster, Green Bay Rackers Homebrewers' Club
http://www.rackers.org info@rackers.org
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1998 19:09:20 -0400
From: fridge@kalamazoo.net
Subject: new email address
Greetings folks,
I have a new service provider and email address. I can now be
reached at fridge@kalamazoo.net.
Please bear with me as I get caught up with a lot of
correspondence.
Hope this helps!
- ----------------------------------------------
Forrest Duddles - FridgeGuy in Kalamazoo
fridge@kalamazoo.net
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 08 Sep 1998 19:19:02 -0400
From: Dan Cole <dcole@roanoke.infi.net>
Subject: Parti-Gyle and Batch Sparging
I am planning my first parti-gyle brewing experience this weekend and have
a few questions for those more experienced with this process than I (anyone
who has done this before). I am basically struggling to cross the
parti-gyle process with my batch sparge process.
Just as a little background, I am planning to brew the Big Brew '98
Barleywine recipe (from Rob Moline's/Jethro Gump's recipe) and wanted to
make a second small beer from the second runnings. I am planning to use the
article in the July/August issue of BrewingTechniques as a guide for the
recipe for the second small beer.
Since I batch sparge (add all the sparge water at once, rather than
trickling it over the length of the mash), my questions revolves around
when do you add your second batch of sparge water to the mash?
(1) Would you add the second batch of sparge water while your first brew is
boiling (and leave the mash to rest at approx 170F during that 60-90
minutes) or do you (2) shorten the time during which the mash "rests" with
the second sparge water (possibly waiting until the first beer is finished
boiling)?
Arguing both sides:
1) If I add the second batch of sparge water right after beginning the boil
on the first beer, I am concerned that the mash sitting in 170F water for
60-90 minutes will leech out tannins/other bad stuff from the malt.
2) If I wait until later in the process to add my second batch of sparge
water, I am concerned that the mash will begin to get lactic or otherwise
spoil while sitting (and cooling) after drawing off the first batch of
sparge water.
I understand that this is a strange combination of two processes (batch
sparging and parti-gyle brewing), but I really don't want to waste all them
good sugars left over from the barleywine.
Thanks in advance,
Dan Cole
Roanoke, VA
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 08 Sep 1998 19:04:57 -0500
From: cpenn@interaccess.com (Calgarey Penn)
Subject: Rice Beer/Sake
I have recently started experimenting with rice brews and would like to post
some ideas and results.
Brewing with rice is markedly different than brewing with other grains.
The biggest difference is that rice is not mashed to convert the starches to
sugars. Instead, the mold aspergillus oryzae is inoculated into a rice base
that is added to the rice to be brewed. This mold creates an enzyme that
converts the starches to sugar that is then fermented by the yeast. This
inoculated rice is called koji.
The process sounds difficult, but I have found it to be very easy in practice.
This whole process is also the process that is used in the brewing of sake.
Sake is often referred to as a rice wine, but since it is brewed from a
grain (rice), it is technically a beer.
I have not yet tried to brew sake, but I am sure it is in the near future.
Sake brewing follows the same basic process that I will outline, so it is
not at all difficult. Probably the biggest hurdle to overcome is finding a
source for the proper rice that is highly polished (50-60%). Most
commercially available rice in the United States is only polished to about 90%.
However, it is still possible to brew good homebrewed rice beer.
Koji is readily available from oriental grocery stores and not expensive.
Here is my basic rice beer procedure:
Ingredients:
4 lbs short grain white rice
20 oz koji
1 fresh lemon or lime
20 oz liquid beer yeast
Equipment: Rice/vegetable steamer
4-5 gallon plastic container (food grade)
Large stirring spoon
Large container for washing rice
Procedure:
Wash the 4 lbs of rice in cold water. Rinse repeatedly until
the water is clear.
Soak the rice in water for 12-18 hours. Store in the
refrigerator for this period of time.
After 12-18 hours, drain off the excess water. Steam the rice
for 1 to 1.5 hours.
After steaming is completed, place the hot rice in the
food-grade container. Add 3-4 gallons of cold water and mix
throughly. Add the 20 oz of koji and mix again.
Check the temperature of the mash. If below 90 degrees F.,
add the yeast and mix again.
Add the juice of the fresh lemon or lime.
Cover the container and keep at room temperature. Stir the
mash twice each day.
Once fermentation begins, much of the rice will appear to
float on the surface. This is normal. There will also be a
distinictive oder that is also normal.
In about 7-8 days, active fermentation will appear to have
ceased. Keep the container covered for an additional 24-36 hours.
Prepare a suitable number of bottles and caps. Rack the brew
to a bottling bucket and proceede with nomal bottling processes.
The beer is ready to drink at time of bottling. The brew may
have a distintive milky appearance, but this will settle out
within 24-48 hours, particularly with refrigeration.
Rice beer is typically a stillbrew, but it is possible to carbonate the brew
is desired. It is also possible to dramatically increase the alcohol content
from about 5 or 6% by volume to 18-21% by volume!
"Whatever you can do, or
dream you can, begin it.
Boldness has genius, power
and magic in it."
Goethe
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 08 Sep 1998 21:26:14 -0400
From: marli@bbs2.rmrc.net (Jon Macleod)
Subject: re:green hops
Yes, as the responsdent said, drying is to facilitate storage, however,
there is another point to consider. Dried hops, just like (other) dried
herbs have more flavor per weight (getting rid of that pesky water you
know). You'll want to up the amount you use, from what you would've
dried. How much? I don't know, but since you probably don't know the
acid levels that exactly, or a precise utilization, don't worry about it
too much...just some more. Relax and try it. Its always worked well
for me.
Mike
------------------------------
End of HOMEBREW Digest #2820, 09/09/98
*************************************
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