Copy Link
Add to Bookmark
Report
HOMEBREW Digest #2201
This file received at Hops.Stanford.EDU 1996/09/23 PDT
Homebrew Digest Tuesday, 24 September 1996 Number 2201
FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
Shawn Steele, Digest Janitor
Thanks to Rob Gardner for making the digest happen!
Contents:
BYE! & anyone want tons of e-mail? ((Shawn Steele))
Samual Adams Cream Stout ((Kevin O'Connor))
RIMS - heating (Steve Alexander)
definitive oktoberfestbier ((BAYEROSPACE))
Definitive Octoberfest (Clint Weathers)
Re: Scorching (Scott Murman)
Stainless Vs. Aluminum - Try this... (Brad Anesi)
Localized Heating / Enzyme Loss ("Sutton, Bob")
RIMS and Variable Speed Pumps ("Sutton, Bob")
Dwarf hops (Pierre Jelenc)
RE: the definitive Oktoberfest? ("Dave Eddington")
Biscuit Malt (Paul Brian)
Brewpubs near Burlington, VT (Mark Warrington)
Quality Judging a Longshot (Esbitter@aol.com)
octoberfest (Bill Watt)
microbrewery information (Vince Decker)
In Defense of Honeybees ((A. J. deLange))
"Beer" or "Malt Liquor"? (Tom Brouns & Anne Daugherty & Zoe Brouns)
The leaking cornie are no more! (Barrowman@aol.com)
RIMS: pump control (Marty Purselley)
RIMS Pumps (Mark Polnasek)
Re: RIMS: pump control ("Patrick Dominick")
Classic American Pilsner, pt. 1 (Jeff Renner)
Classic American Pilsner, pt.2 (Jeff Renner)
Andechs Kloster Braurei in Ontario Canada? ((Mike Spinelli))
For SUBMISSIONS to be published, send mail to:
homebrew@aob.org
For (UN)SUBSCRIBE requests, send mail to:
homebrew-digest-request@aob.org
and include ONLY subscribe or unsubscribe in the BODY of the message.
Please note that if subscribed via BEER-L, you must unsubscribe by sending
a one line e-mail to listserv@ua1vm.ua.edu that says: UNSUB BEER-L
If your address is changing, please unsubscribe from the old address and
then subscribe from the new address.
If your account is being deleted, please be courteous and unsubscribe first.
For technical problems send e-mail to the Digest Janitor, shawn@aob.org.
OTHER HOMEBREW INFORMATION
http://www.aob.org/aob - The AHA's web site.
http://alpha.rollanet.org - "The Brewery" and the Cat's Meow Archives.
info@aob.org - automated e-mail homebrewing information.
ARCHIVES:
At ftp.stanford.edu in /pub/clubs/homebrew/beer via anonymous ftp. Also
http://alpha.rollanet.org on the web and at majordomo@aob.org by e-mail.
COPYRIGHT:
As with all forums such as this one, copyrights are retained by the
original authors. In accordance with the wishes of the members of the
Homebrew Digest, posts to the HBD may NOT be sold or used as part of a
collection that is sold without the original authors' consent. Copies
may ONLY be made available at no charge and should include the current
posting and subscription addresses for the HBD.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: shawn@aob.org (Shawn Steele)
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 96 20:14:03 MDT
Subject: BYE! & anyone want tons of e-mail?
HBDers:
I am going to be leaving the Association of Brewers after 3 years to pursue
other opportunities. As such, there will be a new Digest Janitor after a
bit. The Digest is NOT moving, but it will need someone with reliable e-mail
access to process the oddball requests while the AOB looks for my replacement.
If you would like to volunteer during this month or so transition, please
send me a note. The does NOT require any computer hosting, but merely the
ability to process 30 or so bounced e-mail messages a day, doing the
unsubscribing and subscribing HBDers that can't quite figure out the process.
BTW, it's just send mail to homebrew-digest-request@aob.org and say:
unsubscribe
end
(Or subscribe if you want to join).
Thank you for participating in the HBD and allowing me to be your "Janitor".
- - shawn
------------------------------
From: koco@lsil.com (Kevin O'Connor)
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 1996 13:55:59 -0700
Subject: Samual Adams Cream Stout
Greetings gang,
I'm sure this has come up many times, but I haven't been part of
this list for very long so please bare with me.
I am looking for a Sam Adams Cream Stout extract recipe. I have
checked Cat's Meow and noticed a Watneys recipe which I may well use,
but I'd prefer to try the Sam Adams style first.
Can anyone help?
thanx,
Kevin
------------------------------
From: Steve Alexander <stevea@clv.mcd.mot.com>
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 1996 17:17:39 -0400
Subject: RIMS - heating
Dion Hollenbeck notes that he applies 1250 watts thru a 84.8 sq.inch
heating element surface in his RIMS. Ken Schwartz notes that this is
equivalent to a 10.5 inch diameter disk. Using such a large surface
area RIMS heating element at 1250 watts certainly answers my objection
about hot spots. Even tho the real heating area of a burner+sanke is
larger, the heat flux is not so evenly distributed (because stainless
is a mediocre conductor) so this large heating element may even be an
inprovement over burner heating.
I suspect that many RIMS are designed with much smaller heating
elements and at higher power.
Steve Alexander
------------------------------
From: M257876@sl1001.mdc.com (BAYEROSPACE)
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 1996 16:56 -0600
Subject: definitive oktoberfestbier
collective homebrew conscience:
tom lombardo asked:
> what commercial brew
>is to Oktoberfest what Guinness is to Stout?
in my opinion, it's probably spaten ur-marzen oktoberfest. this product is
quite widely available compared to some other fine bavarian beers.
particularly, i believe, this time of year.
>I think I read in the HBD that Munich malt is typically used in
>Oktoberfest, but the Sam's label doesn't mention it. It says crystal,
>caramel and harrington malts are used. (Harrington?)
harrington is a domestic 2 row pale malt. yes, traditionally, munich/vienna
malt is used for marzenbier.
>Opinions?
i think it's pretty hard to hit the malt
profile of a vienna/marzen without using the right type of malt.
brew hard,
mark bayer
------------------------------
From: Clint Weathers <clintw@echo.sound.net>
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 1996 17:20:15 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: Definitive Octoberfest
IMHO, its got to be Spaten's Octoberfest...
Merely the opinion of a really large white guy....
| Clint Weathers |
| Nano-brewer and Yeast Rancher |
| Kansas City, Missouri |
| Relax, Dont worry, Breed Yeast! |
------------------------------
From: Scott Murman <smurman@best.com>
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 1996 15:19:09 -0700
Subject: Re: Scorching
On Fri, 22 Mar 1996 17:16:46 -0600 "Dave Eddington" wrote:
> > Stainless steel is desirable from a non-reactive point of view, but its
> thermal >properties for cooking leave much to be desired. One of the
> reasons that heavy >gauge aluminum cookware is popular is that it will
> evenly distribute the heat through >the entire cooking pot, rather than
> letting it pass through easily and concentrate >above the heating element.
>
> Is this a commonly known fact? Is aluminum really that much better than
> S.S. for cookware? Why does every home (or commercial for that matter)
> brewery use S.S. for mash tuns, boilers and hot liquor tanks if it causes
> "hot spots"?
This is just a fact that I've observed, and is advertised as being
beneficial by Al cookware manufacturers, so don't go around quoting it
as gospel. I don't have a book handy for the thermal conductivity
properties of Al or Fe, so if any metallurgists are out there...
I would think SS is preferred because it is much more non-reactive,
meaning it can be cleaned easier.
> > Unfortunately, heavy gauge aluminum would be far too expensive for a 10
> or 15 >gallon pot.
>
> I gotta disagree. I visited my local restaurant supply house and saw (IMO)
> heavy gauge aluminum 40 qt. stockpots for about $70.
I know the aluminum pots are $70, but what I was referring to is the
Calphalon and similar products which are bonded or some such
manufacturing process, and which run about $70 dollars for a decent
sized stock pot. My local restaurant supply house has the $70 40
qt. pot, so I'll stop by and check it out this week.
As for Al causing Alzheimer's, the researchers were looking at
aluminum levels in drinking water. In this case it makes no
difference what you use to cook or store your food in. Where the
hysteria got started, I've no idea.
SM
------------------------------
From: Brad Anesi <BANESI@novell.com>
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 1996 17:00:40 -0600
Subject: Stainless Vs. Aluminum - Try this...
After considerable research and shopping, I have purchased what I think
is the ideal brew pot (for me, anyway).
I found a heavy duty 32 Qt SS pot w/ lid WITH a 5mm aluminum clad
bottom (for better heat distribution) for a net/net price of $138 (list $219).
The manufacturer is Dura-Ware, but some places also referred to it as
Excalibur. It is Korean-made, but it is definitely NOT typical department
store Korean quality - it is very heavy weight (12 lbs), and has
welded-on handles rather than rivets. Since the aluminum is
sandwiched between the SS, no aluminum is exposed at the surface, so
you need not be concerned about Alzheimers, etc, etc. The 8 gallon size
is perfect for my typical 6-gallon all-grain, full-boil batches brewed on my
kitchen stove - inaugural batch was successfully completed yesterday.
Here's where to get it: Empire Restaurant Supply (ask for Sheldon)
114 Bowery St
New York NY 10013-4791
(212) 226-4447 FAX: 226-4463 (preferred)
They begrudgingly do mail-order and accept plastic (Visa).
All disclaimers apply - this is the only time I've dealt with them - delivery
was 1 week.
Brad
------------------------------
From: "Sutton, Bob" <bob.sutton@fluordaniel.com>
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 1996 17:51:00 -0700
Subject: Localized Heating / Enzyme Loss
Ken Schwartz (KennyEddy@aol.com) stated
>>>The wort at the very bottom of
the kettle is bearing the brunt of
the heat transfer, just as the wort
next to the heating element is. To
me, this pretty much means that
*the wort can't tell the
difference*!!<<<
I think this sums up the situation
quite accurately! In fact, it is
highly likely that the heat
localization is far worse in the
kettle, than within the RIMS
heating chamber. Unless you have
vigorous agitation throughout your
heatup period, it's likely that you
will see carmelization in the
bottom of your kettle. Evidence of
localized overheating? Perhaps Dion
and others can address their
experiences with the electric
inline element.
On a related RIMS note...
Enzymes will not readily denature
from shear imposed by a centrifugal
pump. Excess thermal exposure is
the culprit. Whether you regulate
circulation flow using variable
speed or valve throttling, your
enzymes will survive. :)
UMMAGUMMA !
Bob
Fruit Fly Brewhaus
Yesterdays' Technology Today
------------------------------
From: "Sutton, Bob" <bob.sutton@fluordaniel.com>
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 1996 17:34:00 -0700
Subject: RIMS and Variable Speed Pumps
Several knowledgeable folks have
expressed the advantage of reduced shear
when using a variable speed controller
to regulate circulation flow, versus
throttling back on the pump outlet
valve. Let me caution that before anyone
just slaps a controller on their
existing pump, they should confirm that
the pump can operate continuously at
reduced speed. Most motors rely on self
induced fan cooling. When the rotational
speed id reduced, fan speed is reduced,
cooling is reduced, and at some point
the motor will overheat. Generally if
the motor HP rating is well above the
required load, a reduced fan speed will
still provide sufficient cooling. When
in doubt, check with the motor supplier.
Bob
Fruit Fly Brewhaus
Yesterdays' Technology Today
------------------------------
From: Pierre Jelenc <pcj1@columbia.edu>
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 96 19:26:48 EDT
Subject: Dwarf hops
Charles Capwell <chas@A119008.sat1.as.crl.com> wonders:
>
> I've been interested trying to grow my own hops, but unfortunately don't
> really have access to the height needed to grow regular hops. This
> article gave me hope though, stating that the optimum height for the
> dwarf hop varities is 8 ft.
You don't actually _need_ dwarf hops, though. Most cultivars will accomo-
date themselves with whatever is available, and if there is nothing to
climb on they will form a bush-like structure. The yield will not be as
good, but better something than nothing.
Pierre
------------------------------
From: "Dave Eddington" <homebrew@aristotle.net>
Date: Sat, 23 Mar 1996 18:18:39 -0600
Subject: RE: the definitive Oktoberfest?
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
- ------=_NextPart_000_01BB18E5.28F45820
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
In HBD 2200, Tom Lombardo <favt3tl@rvcux1.RVC.CC.IL.US> wrote:
>OK, I don't know much about the Oktoberfest style. I just picked up a six
>of Sam Adams Oktoberfest. I know Sam is usually an "Americanized"
>(watered down) version of most styles, so I'm asking, what commercial brew
>is to Oktoberfest what Guinness is to Stout?
I'm pretty sure that Paulaner is the Guiness of Oktoberfests. It is
considered the benchmark by which all others are judged. It's usually easy
to find in better bottle shops. I'm sure that some of you guys that are
lucky enough to have visited Munchen (Munich) can name some better, less
mass-produced O'fests, but for a readily-available, real German example of
the style, you can't beat Paulaner IMHO.
>I think I read in the HBD that Munich malt is typically used in
>Oktoberfest, but the Sam's label doesn't mention it. It says crystal,
>caramel and harrington malts are used. (Harrington?)
I agree that Munich malt is essential to the style, but it doesn't surprise
me that SA doesn't include it in the grain bill. This is a cost-cutting
measure, since it is easy to deceive virgin American pallates with only a
little crystal malt. This is consistant with most all of Sam's beers.
Pete's, too. Is SA trying to deceive us by putting crystal AND caramel
malt on the lable? Aren't they the same thing? BTW, Harrington is a
standard American 2-row pale malt variety, much like Klages. Nothing
exotic there, either.
*******************************
Dave Eddington
Little Rock, AR
Homebrew@aristotle.net
- ------=_NextPart_000_01BB18E5.28F45820
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
<html><head></head><BODY bgcolor=3D"#FFFFFF"><p><font size=3D2 =
color=3D"#000000" face=3D"Arial">In HBD 2200, Tom Lombardo =
<<font color=3D"#0000FF"><u>favt3tl@rvcux1.RVC.CC.IL.US</u><font =
color=3D"#000000">> wrote:<br><br>>OK, I don't know much about the =
Oktoberfest style. I just picked up a six <br>>of Sam Adams =
Oktoberfest. I know Sam is usually an "Americanized" =
<br>>(watered down) version of most styles, so I'm asking, what =
commercial brew <br>>is to Oktoberfest what Guinness is to =
Stout? <br><br>I'm pretty sure that Paulaner is the Guiness of =
Oktoberfests. It is considered the benchmark by which all others =
are judged. It's usually easy to find in better bottle shops. =
I'm sure that some of you guys that are lucky enough to have =
visited Munchen (Munich) can name some better, less mass-produced =
O'fests, but for a readily-available, real German example of the style, =
you can't beat Paulaner IMHO.<br><br>>I think I read in the HBD that =
Munich malt is typically used in <br>>Oktoberfest, but the Sam's =
label doesn't mention it. It says crystal, <br>>caramel and =
harrington malts are used. (Harrington?) <br><br>I agree that =
Munich malt is essential to the style, but it doesn't surprise me that =
SA doesn't include it in the grain bill. This is a cost-cutting =
measure, since it is easy to deceive virgin American pallates with only =
a little crystal malt. This is consistant with most all of Sam's =
beers. Pete's, too. Is SA trying to deceive us by putting =
crystal AND caramel malt on the lable? Aren't they the same thing? =
BTW, Harrington is a standard American 2-row pale malt variety, =
much like Klages. Nothing exotic there, =
either.<br>*******************************<br>Dave Eddington<br>Little =
Rock, AR<br><font color=3D"#0000FF"><u>Homebrew@aristotle.net</u><font =
color=3D"#000000"><br><br><br></p>
</font></font></font></font></font></body></html>
- ------=_NextPart_000_01BB18E5.28F45820--
------------------------------
From: Paul Brian <pbrian@Tudor.Com>
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 96 19:41:56 -0400
Subject: Biscuit Malt
Al K. commented on a recipe I submitted (I was asking for help on IBU
calculation) by saying:
>Well, first I'd like to note that the Belgian Biscuit malt has starch in
>it and neither the Biscuit nor the Crystal have any enzymes to convert it.
>The Biscuit is therefore adding very little other than a starch haze to
>your beer.
OK, this makes sense. So does this mean that Biscuit should be avoided unless
doing all-grain or partial mashes where you have pale malts to provide the
enzymes needed?
Which brings up my next question- For my next batch (a porter) I have a pound
of biscuit (too much?) already mixed and cracked with a half pound of black
patent. Since there are obviously no enzymes in the equation, should I get a
pound of pale malt and do a partial mash ala Papazian(113-122 degrees F for 30
min., 150 degrees F for 10 min., 158 degrees F for 10-15 min.) or just steep
what I have and get a hazy beer (I can think of worse problems)?
Thanks to all who responded to my origanal IBU question.
Cheers,
Paul Brian
------------------------------
From: Mark Warrington <76322.2102@CompuServe.COM>
Date: 23 Sep 96 19:58:35 EDT
Subject: Brewpubs near Burlington, VT
I am traveling to Burlington, VT this weekend. Anybody know of any brewpubs
near
Burlington, VT other than Vermont Pub and Brewery? I tried asking on
rec.crafts.brewing but only got two responses (thanks, Tracy). Tracy A. is
alive
and well!
Mark
Rockland, Delaware
------------------------------
From: Esbitter@aol.com
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 1996 20:22:22 -0400
Subject: Quality Judging a Longshot
The following is an excerpt of the letters I sent to Kate Begley, Co
Director of the Longshot Homebrew Competition of Boston Beer Company and
the Director of Sanctioned Competition Program of the American Hombrew
Association:
"My receipt of score sheets from the Boston Beer Company's World
Homebrew Competition was very disappointing. As one who has always been
counseled to include constructive criticism on score sheets, judge the
beer according to the style, and fully fill out the sheet, I was
saddened with the job the two "experienced" judges did on my Belgian
Pale Ale entry.
Other than their scores of 26 and 29, not much else agreed in their
assessment of my brew. Their Description Definitions (check off boxes on
the left of the sheet) never agreed, one judge did not sign his/her
name, saw fit to write only three full words on the sheet, and leave me
to guess what he/she was thinking. The other judge signed the sheet with
initials, wrote a few more words but offered no constructive criticism.
In reading their few comments, I have to wonder if these "experienced"
judges have ever tasted the style before.
Having organized one and now organizing another homebrew competition, I
know enough to pair seasoned judges with apprentice judges. It is not
fair to give a score that brands the beer "Exemplifies style
satisfactorily, but requires attention" and not give the brewer any
constructive feedback. I judged 21 beers in one day two weeks ago at
Topsfield Fair Homebrew Competition. Every score sheet I wrote included
positive feedback and advice when possible.
I can live with the score, but the quality of the score sheets was
unacceptable. Brewers enter competitions for FEEDBACK among other
things. I have to wonder if you approve of the way competition was run
in this case. Two other brewers wrote of extremely similar results from
the competition on the electronic forums Homebrew Digest and JudgeNet.
Why didn't Boston Beer Company pair veteran judges with non-certified
judges? Does the AHA review the score sheets completed after a
competition in order to audit quality or do you just take the sanction
fee and call it a day? Your literature states, "To maintain valid
standards of judging and achievable levels of excellence." When my club
needs to be sanctioned for this upcoming competition, we'll be sure to
call the BJCP instead."
[End of Letter's body]
I know this thread has been getting some attention lately. Both here
and in Judgenet. I wonder how many people got their beer judged by two
or more "judges" who were so lax as to neglect to use actual WORDS on
the sheet... I wish I could publish the actual score sheets for HBD readers.
It wouldn't take long to read them.
This isn't a matter of the subjective nature of judging. It is a matter
of following judging guidelines and protocol.
Finally, my question to the collective: If a competition breaks the
rules set down by the sanctioning organization, whether AHA or BJCP, is
anything ever done by the sanctioner to correct the situation? How are
repeat problems identified and avoided in the future? Is there any policing
of quality?
Any thoughts on this?
- -Randy Reed
=====================================================
Homebrewers are like dogs teaching each other how to
chase cars. - Ann Reed, Alewife
+-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-+
+ The Local Brewing Company +
+ Stoughton, MA +
+ ESBITTER@AOL.COM +
+ Randy Reed +
+ South Shore Brew Club +
+ (Boston, MA Area - South) +
+-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-+
------------------------------
From: Bill Watt <wattbrew@buffnet.net>
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 1996 19:57:17 -0700
Subject: octoberfest
Tom, you asked:
"OK, I don't know much about the Oktoberfest style. I just picked up a
six
of Sam Adams Oktoberfest. I know Sam is usually an "Americanized"
(watered down) version of most styles, so I'm asking, what commercial
brew
is to Oktoberfest what Guinness is to Stout?"
I recently picked up a 12 pack of Warsteiner Octoberfest at the local
TOPS on sale for 9.99. What a wonderful beer. I do not know if it
defines the style, but I recommend it highly.
------------------------------
From: Vince Decker <decker@ACAVAX.LYNCHBURG.EDU>
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 1996 20:31:42 EST
Subject: microbrewery information
As well as being a neophyte home brewer, I am a business consultant and
occasional entrepreneur. I am interested in finding some information on how to
open a small microbrewery/restaurant. If any of you out there have any general
information on how to do it, where to buy used commercial brewing equipment,
and any other bits of wisdom, I would appreciate it.
------------------------------
From: ajdel@interramp.com (A. J. deLange)
Date: Tue, 24 Sep 1996 00:43:01 -0500
Subject: In Defense of Honeybees
Mark Bayer posted a warning about bees. I was not present either at the
time of his observation nor at the unfortunate incident where an alergic
beer drinker smallowed a stinging insect (a friend of mine had the
misfortune to witness an identical mishap in Germany a few years back) but
I am guessing that it was not bees that were at fault but rather yellow
jackets. The reasons for this are that it is now the height of yellow
jacket season. Conversely, honeybees were just about wiped out in this
country last winter by a combination of cold weather and mites.
Yellowjackets are omnivorous and are attracted to most of the things humans
like to eat. Conversely bees are only attracted to certain sweet smells. I
have stood in an apiary drinking beer and never attracted a bee.
Bees are easily distinguised from yellow jackets by the fact that they are
fuzzy (the hairs collect pollen) and the rear legs are widened into
"baskets" to which they transfer pollen collected during visits to flowers.
Relative to yellow jackets they are "cute". Their colors are not so vivid
as yellow jackets on which the yellow is quite bright. Only Italian bees
are at all light in color. The more popular "breeds" are quite dark. As the
only bees you are likely to see these days are domestic ones, the chances
are that they will be quite dark in color. If you don't live within a
couple of miles of a beekeeper you aren't likely to see any at all.
All this does not mean that Mark's warning should be ignored. I ate a
yellow jacket in a chicken sandwich once and would not repeat that
experience willingly. The good news is that yellow jackets have less venom
and their delivery sytem is such that you get less of it (the honeybee
loses her stinger, venom sack and the muscles to keep pumping even after
she is gone; the yellow jacket stinger is smooth and is withdrawn when the
insect leaves the scene.
One interesting thing to note about beer and honeybees: iso-amyl acetate is
their alarm pheremone. If the breeze is just right you can smell it when
they sting. Don't wander into a bee yard with a freshly poured glass of
your best Weizen!
A.J. deLange Numquam in dubio, saepe in errore!
ajdel@interramp.com
------------------------------
From: Tom Brouns & Anne Daugherty & Zoe Brouns <atbrouns@midwest.net>
Date: Sat, 21 Sep 1996 11:14:03 +0000
Subject: "Beer" or "Malt Liquor"?
>Allen Underdown writes:
>> What is the major difference between beer and Malt Liquor? Is malt
>> liquor actually distilled? If so, why is it rated in percent and not
>> in proof (alcohol) and sold in the beer section?
Bryan Gros writes:
>Malt Liquor is just a legal term for high alcohol beer. I'm not sure if
>there is a consistent difinition of what "high" is. While it was originally
>used to separate stuff like Bud from stuff like Schlitz Malt Liquor, you
>might see it now on labels of imports which are "high alcohol".
Just to add a few thoughts to this thread, I spent most of my life in
Europe,
and when I returned to the States, I longed for the Grolsh and Pilsner
Urquell,
etc of my (relative) Youth. The "import" beer I found in the stores
tasted
different, and generally had a lower alcohol content.
The explanation I got was that the legal definition for "beer" in the US
specifies a maximum alcohol percentage, and that many European brews
are above that cap and therefore have to choose between calling their
brew a "malt liquor" or lowering the alc %. I think the cap is in the
high
3% or low 4% range.
Of course, the other explanation may be that foreigners are having US
companies brew their beer for them, or that the taste changes because of
shipping it to the US.
Enough rambling...does anyone know for sure?
(Oh, and Darrel--please read the header of the HBD)
------------------------------
From: Barrowman@aol.com
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 1996 20:46:15 -0400
Subject: The leaking cornie are no more!
With the help of many of you, I have solved the leaking keg problem. It seems
the new gaskets I used on the disconnects are too thin. They are black rubber
and are obviously not the ones to use. White or clear seems to be the
concensus. Until I can find better gaskets, I have solved the problem by
winding thin rubber bands around the disconnects to snug up the connection.
Thanks to everyone for the help,
Laura
------------------------------
From: Marty Purselley <brewer@flash.net>
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 1996 20:44:39 -0500
Subject: RIMS: pump control
I am in the process of setting up a crude RIMS system. Crude in that I
will not initially have the electric heater, instead relying on a
burner. My question relates to control of the flow from the pump. I've
seen several systems where a ball valve on the output is used to control
the flow from the pump. The pump never changes speed. This doesn't
sound too good. I've heard about some people using a dimmer switch to
control the pump. Has anyone done this? Do any modifications need to
be made to the dimmer switch in order for it to work? What wattage
switch is required? It seems that this would be more efficient than
controlling the output with a ball valve.
Marty
------------------------------
From: Mark Polnasek <dolt@mnsinc.com>
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 1996 22:13:46 -0400
Subject: RIMS Pumps
All the recent discussions about RIMS pumps and shearing got me
thinking. Our pump is a little bigger that we should have purchased. We
have to throttle it back with an output valve to prevent the screen from
collapsing. (Yes this happened. Crushed that sucker big time) Works OK I
guess, but some solid matter gets through the bottom screen and seems to
clog the valve which is about 90% closed. A quick twist of the valve frees
the stuck particles and off we go but this need constant attention.
Back to the thinking... How about one of those high quality power
tool speed controllers to slow down the motor?? That way I could open the
valve all the way, slow down the pump and prevent shearing and the particles
from clogging the mostly closed valve. Everything would be Wide Open!!
"Hey!! Great idea", he says. But. Are not most power tools brush riding
motors? Can I use this type of controller to slow down my common non brush
riding AC motor on the pump without damaging it.This pump will have to run
for HOURS on this speed controller. Am I worrying too much??
Mark P. and Ed B. (who is usually Pig Bitin' Mad when things don't
go right in the brewery. And that is my responsibility so HELP ME!!)
Just to fill you in. We use a 15 gallon system and heat the mash via
propane flame. No computers, just human attention and missed lunches. Lots
of attention is paid to the valve and the time and temperature. I would be
happy to automate but this looks expensive. Heating below the screen with
propane has not given us any problems with scorches. Of course we never
BLAST it. (Crushed the screen once from the giant pump) Never a bad beer
here at Pudlab Brew Co. Over 1,000 gallons since 1991.
------------------------------
From: "Patrick Dominick" <p-dominick@adfa.oz.au>
Date: Tue, 24 Sep 1996 12:26:04 +1000
Subject: Re: RIMS: pump control
Brewsters
All the discussion lately about RIMS systems reminds me of a
simple but elegant (IMO) design for a RIMS that was posted in
rec.crafts.brewing by a fellow Aussie back in June, but has never
been discussed in this forum (to my knowledge).
In order to add diversity to the debate (and because I am a RIMS
wannabe) I have included the original post here, and invite comment
on the design, pro and con.
Posted without permission of David Hill, hope he doesn't mind.
cheers,
Patrick Dominick
Original r.c.b. post follows:
Subject: RIMS pumps
From: davidh@melbpc.org.au (David Hill)
Date: 1996/06/13
Message-Id: <davidh.45.00A763BA@melbpc.org.au>
Distribution: world
Organization: Melbourne PC User Group, Australia
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.brewing
My brew partner and I have a very successful RIMS system powered by a
minuscule 6volt hobbyists' model motor.
Follows crude ASCII
| |M| |
| | | |
| : : |
|========|=|========|
| | | |
| | | |
|--------| |--------|
| #### |*| #### |
|____________________= drain tap
legend
| walls of tun
: perforation in vertical pipe for return flow
== liquor level
- -- false bottom
|M| motor inside 30mm vertical pipe
| | 30mm pipe mounted in centre of circular tun
## coiled 2000w element
|*| propeller connected by vertical shaft to motor
With this system we process 11 kg of grain. Liquor gently flows from
centre of tun up the vertical pipe and out over the top of the grain bed.
Motor is controlled by variable speed controller from the hobby shop.
Important to start motor very slow and then steadily build up speed
otherwise can compact the grain bed.
Element is controlled by an electronic thermostat with the sensor mounted
beneath the propeller and only 5mm from the element. We have never had
scorching problems & have no build up on the element.
As an extra safeguard against scorching, there is an electronic simmerstat
in series with the thermostat. The simmerstat is set to allow power to the
element on a 4sec on and 1 sec off cycle.
This tiny Archimedes pump runs continuously during the mash and the grain
bed is not touched after the initial doughing in.
The vertical pipe has several perforations and a sliding sleeve on the
outside. The sleeve is used to cover the perforations during dough-in
and to adjust the height of the liquor return point to just above the
liquor level.
With this system the pump needs to deliver a head of only 0.5cms in order
to successfully circulate the sweet wort.
For large rapid temperature changes the simmerstat can be set to continuously
on.
Credit for the original design belongs to Les Howard of South Oakleigh,
Melbourne Australia.
Best wishes &
and grand apologies for the mess I made with the first posting.
David Hill :-)>
Patrick Dominick, Senior Cataloguing Librarian
Australian Defence Force Academy, Canberra, ACT.
p-dominick@adfa.oz.au Fax: +61 6 2472324
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
"Eventually people realized that the Information Superhighway was
essentially CB radio, but with more typing."--Dave Barry.
------------------------------
From: Jeff Renner <nerenner@umich.edu>
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 96 22:35:06 -0400
Subject: Classic American Pilsner, pt. 1
After my post in HBD 2200, I have had several requests for my Classic
American Pilsner recipe, so below (next post, it bounced as too long) is
my original HBD post from about a 1-1/2 years ago, typos corrected (I
hope). I somewhat improved it in rewriting it for Brewing Techniques,
and the BT editors polished it further. It appeared in the Sept./Oct.,
1995 issue.
I have come to think that pre-prohibition CAP should be from 30-45 IBU
and post-prohibition should be at least 25 IBU, although it seems that
some beers did drop to 20 IBU post WWII. My personal favorite is OG
1.048 with ~22% flaked corn and 30+ IBU, and FG of about 1.014-16.
This
somewhat high FG results from a dextrinous wort from 30 minutes each at
122F, 140F and 158F, then mashout. It makes a great drinking beer.
Pete Garofalo made a great balanced pre-prohibition CAP at 1.060 OG, 45
IBU. Folks (men) 100 years ago seemed to drink this strong a beer
regularily, but then, they had only to walk a few blocks from the local
saloon to get home.
It seems at this point that only pre-prohibition will be recognized,
with 1.050-60 OG and 30-45 IBU, as I recall, with 20 - 25% corn, and
DMS
acceptable or even appropriate. Hop flavor and aroma should be
Continental or old American varieties, and NOT modern citrusy American
such as Cascade. First wort hopping works wonderfully well. American
six-row malt is the appropriate malt, both historically and, I feel,
for
flavor. The finalized new guidelines will be published in the Winter
Zymurgy.
Jeff Renner in Ann Arbor, Michigan c/o nerenner@umich.edu
------------------------------
From: Jeff Renner <nerenner@umich.edu>
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 96 22:36:30 -0400
Subject: Classic American Pilsner, pt.2
***Great Success in Recreating Classic American Pilsner, a Shamefully
Neglected Style!***
Now that I have your attention, I hope you'll read this long article.
I
think it will be worth it.
*Soapbox mounted*
Last fall I asked for help in recreating the taste of the beers I grew
up having tastes of in Cincinnati in the fifties. Part of the flavor I
remembered was certainly just the pungency of beer to a child's
sensitive palate. But part was certainly the greater hopping levels,
some DMS was expected, especially by mid-western palates, and just the
greater flavor profile produced by brewing without techniques designed
to reduce flavors (N2 wort scrubbing, neutral yeasts, minimal wort
caramelization, etc.).
Starting with the Brewing Techniques's article on Pre-prohibition
Lagers
by George Fix (May/June,'94) and the one on Bushwick Pilsners by Ben
Jankowski (Jan./Feb.'94), I formulated a 1.048 OG, 1.016 FG. 80%
six-row, 20% flaked maize, 25 IBU target beer fermented with New Ulm
yeast from Yeast Culture Kit Co. A good bit of the body/sweetness
profile was produced by the short, 15 minute rest at 60C with 45
minutes
at 70C, giving an apparent attenuation of 67%. If these times were
reversed, it would probably result in an apparent attenuation of close
to 80%, giving a drier, snappier, less satiating beer. This is not
what
I wanted.
Because I was mostly brewing for historical curiosity, I brewed only
five gallons. I now wish I'd brewed my usual 1/4 barrel, because it
succeeded beyond my wildest expectations! Not only did I brew a
successful historical reproduction, THIS IS A GREAT STYLE BY ABSOLUTE,
WORLD-CLASS STANDARDS. American mega-breweries have to answer not only
for the sin of what they are producing today, but for having killed off
a great beer style. Steam beer is not our only indigenous beer style,
only our best known.
This isn't a continental pilsner, but it yields nothing to that style
in
absolute terms. Fix and Jankowski were too stinting in their praise of
this style. I guess I thought of it as a pretty good job that American
brewers did making do with the materials available. It is far more.
This extinct beer is a WORLD CLASS STYLE. I'm not saying that my beer
is a world class beer, but it's pretty damn good. It has a beautiful,
full golden color with a long lasting, thick creamy head, full flavor
with modest maltiness bolstered by the subtle corny sweetness, balanced
by a clean hops bitterness and yeast character, with a long, clean
bitter finish.
We as homebrewers have helped revive other extinct styles (such as
porter), and I propose to this group that this should be next one.
This
isn't lawnmower beer. This is the beer that our grandfathers paid a
nickel for and got a free lunch with. This is the beer that German
immigrants created when they arrived in the US, and that swept out the
ales in the lager revolution by its demonstrably better quality. This
is the beer of American steelworkers and shipbuilders. This is the
beer
that built America! This is the bee.... Oops. Sorry. I got so
excited that I fell off my soapbox.
Now I know we are all fond of ales and despise American megaswill
lagers. We lament that ales were forced out of America by lagers. But
we are comparing today's commercial lagers with the ales we make or
microbrews. That switch would have been a tragedy, but a classic
American Pilsner is a different beer entirely, and ales of 150 years
ago
were probably pretty rough.
We've always heard that corn and rice are nothing more than malt
stretchers. American six-row barley malt is too high in protein to
make
stable beers, so corn was first used to dilute the protein. Cost
cutting was a bonus that got out of hand. But 20% corn is a delightful
flavor addition. Unfortunately, I know of no commercial examples that
still exist with that corn and malt expression, especially with decent
hopping levels.
The AHA guidelines are limiting on this. They allow a premium American
lager to have a maximum of 23 IBU, and say nothing about DMS - this
generally is considered a defect. (As a matter of fact, Fix relates
judges who liked his beer but found it "far out of category.") But this
flavor was expected, especially in mid-western beers. At the Ann Arbor
Brewers' Guild meeting last week, this beer got rave reviews from all,
including a number of highly ranked judges.
------------------------------
From: paa3983@dpsc.dla.mil (Mike Spinelli)
Date: Mon, 23 Sep 96 16:31:20 edt
Subject: Andechs Kloster Braurei in Ontario Canada?
HBDers,
Received some more info on the rumor that the great German Monastic Brewery
Andechs was coming to the US and opening up a Brewery.
Well I talked to a German employee at B. United International, the company that
imports alot of the four star beers from Germany like Scneider Weise and
Aventinus. I asked him if he was attempting to acquire the Andechs beers for
import. He said he tried, but the Kloster told him that they were working a
deal with a Canadian brewery (maybe Ontario?) to contract brew their beers
there.
That's the latest scoop. You Canadian HBers have any more info?
Mike in Cherry Hill NJ
------------------------------
End of Homebrew Digest #2201
****************************
