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HOMEBREW Digest #1876
This file received at Hops.Stanford.EDU 1995/11/06 PST
HOMEBREW Digest #1876 Mon 06 November 1995
FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
Rob Gardner, Digest Janitor
Contents:
Re: Wyeast 1056 problems (Bird)
Alcohol production (William H. Kitt, Jr.)
Regulators etc. (Al Stevens)
Propane Indoors (Frank J Dobner +1 +1 708 979 5124)
Boilers with electric heating elements (Chuck E. Mryglot)
Pumps and Hiding Yeast ("James Hojel")
15 gal. mash (barber eric stephen)
Oktoberfest via www (Jim Grady)
Franken-weizen (DHatlestad)
Corn Starch in beer recipe?? (O1_DSELDEN)
Responses to the styles thread (Ken Schroeder)
Mash/Lauter Tun and scorching (dhvanvalkenburg)
beer (Harlan Bauer)
WYEAST (Harlan Bauer)
Re: Phalse Bottom Open Area (hollen)
mason jars & preserving starter (Rolland Everitt)
Nat. Gas vs. Propane (Dr. David C. Harsh)
Last sputtering of the propane thread (Tim Fields)
RE starter wort and yeast cultures (Tim Fields)
RE slant media (Tim Fields)
RE bleaching mother nature (Tim Fields)
Kegging and Bottling (djfitzg)
Propane vs. Natural Gas (Mike White)
Summary of SABCO responses (DICKERSONP)
Gases and Slants (Gregory G. Graboski)
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----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 2 Nov 95 20:42:46 MST
From: roberts@Rt66.com (Bird)
Subject: Re: Wyeast 1056 problems
>>>>> "Robert" == Robert Marshall <robertjm@hooked.net> writes:
Robert> She said that they had had a probelm with another strain,
Robert> but had called all the dealers who had bought the infected
Robert> shipment.
Which one?
- --Doug
- --
"24 hours in a day...24 beers in a case...coincidence?"
Doug Roberts
roberts@rt66.com
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 2 Nov 1995 13:17:35 -0500 (EST)
From: wkitt@melpar.esys.com (William H. Kitt, Jr.)
Subject: Alcohol production
Questions about homebrew and alcohol content:
When I drink 3-4 commercial beers (usually Leinenkugel's Red or
Pete's Wicked Red, 12 oz.) I can feel the effect of the alcohol. I
have consumed the same quantity of my homebrew and have not felt a
similar effect. So, I'm questioning the alcohol content of my
homebrew. Based on S.G.s, it comes out to about 4% by volume. This
seems in-line with what commercial breweries attain in their beers.
But because of the dissimilar effects, I am left wondering what is the
difference between the beers with respect to alcohol content.
Are there other types of alcohol (than ethyl) produced in homebrews?
Are there substances other than ethyl alcohol produced during
fermentation that contribute to lowering the specific gravity, but
don't contribute to the alcohol content?
Tschao,
Bill
------------------------------
Date: 03 Nov 95 05:11:58 EST
From: Al Stevens <72704.743@compuserve.com>
Subject: Regulators etc.
In HB 1867 Brian asks about repairing regulators.
My experience has been that you don't want to do this yourself.
Look in the phone book for Fire Extinguiser service. These people are
qualified to repair and re-calibrate your regulator as well as presure
testing and refilling your CO2 tank.
The prices at places here seem reasonable to me, I suggest this route
mainly because I DO want to know if I am serving with 10 lb vs 20 lb.
Standard disclaimers, etc
Al Stevens
------------------------------
Date: 31 Oct 95 12:12:00 -0600
From: fjdobner@intgp1.att.com (Frank J Dobner +1 +1 708 979 5124)
Subject: Propane Indoors
Honestly, the subject of propane use indoors is one that I am glad
occurs many times per year on the HBD. Quite selfishly, it helps me to
remember to treat propane with a lot of respect. I also use propane
indoors and I think I do all the right things. If you get sick of this
propane posts, think of them as a "wake-up call."
Frank Dobner
Aurora, Illinois
"It takes a very careful brewer to be extremely dangerous."
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 07:51:33 -0500
From: cem@cadre.com (Chuck E. Mryglot)
Subject: Boilers with electric heating elements
There has been some chat about boilers with electric heating elements:
I converted an old scratched 7 gallon plastic primary bucket into a
boiler. I used 2 1kW heating elements from a scientific surplus company
@2.95 USD each, so this is definitely a cheap approach.
The elements are "1 kW, 115 VAC. Chrome plated copper heating element.
Features automatic shutoff when not immersed in water. Complete with mounting
nut and gaskets. Designed for through wall installation in a 1-9/16" dia.
hole (3/16" thick approx.). Electrical connection via recessed 3-wire socket;
supplied with mating 3-wire stub cord, 12" long; opposite end stripped. Size
4-3/4" long x 3-1/2" wide. New. Wt, 1 lb. Order No. TM89HVC5702...$2.95 US."
H & R Company, 18 Canal Street, P.O. Box 122, Bristol, PA 19007-0122.
Sales 1-800-848-8001 Fax 215-788-9577 Business Office 215-788-5583. (I have no
affiliation)
Things to keep in mind:
- You'll have to put your own plug on. The nice thing about the electrical
connector through thw bucket wall is that you just unplug the element when
you're manipulating the bucket, so there are no cords in your way.
- I have two heating units and this two cords. I plug each into a different
outlet.
- It takes the 2 elements to get a good boil going.
- No scorching so far.
- The elements get coated in hot break material that
needs to be cleaned off, but that's it. I use a brillo pad on each element
after every brewing session.
I have used this for over 50 brew sessions so far.
That's my 2 cents for today.
ChuckM
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 95 14:44:11 UT
From: "James Hojel" <JTroy@msn.com>
Subject: Pumps and Hiding Yeast
1) I recently had the pleasure of an in-depth conversation with a brewmaster
from Belgium. He has his masters in Electrical Engineering and is certified
by some fancy brewing association. Anyway, he had a very interesting opinion
on pumps and gravity fed systems. He communicated that using gravity is much
more gentle on wort/beer and will produce better tasting and more stable beer
(less damage on compounds, etc.??) than a centrifugal pump. I mentioned that
I use a pump for wort recirculation and to pump between kegs (Pico System).
He warned me against it; especially at the home-brew level. In fact, he told
me that they go to great lengths and expense to design breweries that use
gravity as much as possible, and when not possible, using special pumps (he
said a large part of his brewery budget was allocated for pumps that
minimized any damage and are very expensive). He mentioned what kind of
pumps he uses but it slipped my mind. I'm hoping someone out there will know
what kind of pumps he was talking about?? [He also emphasized great care
with the handling of grain (which most all homebrewers don't need to worry
about because of the small volumes we deal with).]
2) This same person also mentioned how some breweries go to great lengths to
"hide" their main yeast strain(s). He said some of the best microbiologist
have "tricks" to hide the yeast. My obvious thought is filtering. However,
to completely filter the yeast you would really rob the beer of most of its
taste compounds. How do you "hide" yeast?? Granted a bottling yeast would
do a partial job, but in theory, if the yeast is in the beer it should be
accessible; right??
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 12:28:59 -0500 (EST)
From: barber eric stephen <barber_e@hcgl1.eng.ohio-state.edu>
Subject: 15 gal. mash
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 13:54:13 -0500
From: Jim Grady <grady@hpangrx.an.hp.com>
Subject: Oktoberfest via www
If you haven't seen it already, there is a web page for Muenchen and the
Oktoberfest is prominently featured.
Granted, it's mostly a tease since you can't taste the beer (that'll be
the next www milestone) but check out http://www.bayern.de/Munich
Warning! This page can be expensive! Before you are done reading you'll
have called your travel agent and booked tickets for next year's O'fest!
- --
Jim Grady |"It's a good thing we don't get
grady@an.hp.com | all the government we pay for."
Hewlett-Packard Medical Products Group | Will Rogers
Andover, MA |
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 16:00:39 -0500
From: DHatlestad@aol.com
Subject: Franken-weizen
In my usual fasion, I brewed a weizen without ever having
tasted a German weizen or weisbier. The taste of it was so
surprising that I ran out and bought a bottle of Ayinger
Brau-weisse just to see if the taste was close. As it turns
out, my weizen was somewhat similar with some exceptions. Mine
is a little big, a lot more malty, a little under
carbonated (though not much), and a tiny bit sweeter. Mine was
similar in that it has just as much banana and clove aroma as
the Brau-weisse and I got the hops just right.
The primary fermentation of this beer was so vigorous that it
clogged the airlock and blew the lid off of my plastic-bucket
primary. I've never needed a blow-off tube for my plastic ferm
before.
I got such surprising results from this weizen that I thought I
would pass along the recipe.
Franken-weizen
For 5 gallons
OG 1.054
FG 1.014
6.5# Wheat malt
3# Vienna
2# 2-Row
1 oz Tettnanger, 4.4%AA, 45 min
1 oz Saaz (Domestic), 4.0%AA, 15 min
Wyeast 3068
My water is moderatly soft; added 2 teaspoons of gypsum to
the mash.
Mash schedule: 40 minutes at 50C; added an infusion to raise to
60C, rest for 15 minutes; added heat directly to raise to 70C,
rest for 60 minutes; raised temp to mash-out.
Primary ferment 7 days at 21-22C. Secondary ferment at 20C for
12 days. Force carbonated in the keg to 2.7 volumes of CO2.
Cheers,
Don
dhatlestad@aol.com
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 03 Nov 1995 17:14:10 -0500 (EST)
From: O1_DSELDEN@NELINET.ORG
Subject: Corn Starch in beer recipe??
I have a recipe - from Papazian's book that calls for a ton of corn starch,
12 -16 oz? Is this a typo or do I need to dump this liquid thickening
stuff in my allgrain batch. What is its effect on the brew? Should
I be using this pale ale recipe for my first allgrain batch?
Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
David Selden, Law Librarian
Orr & Reno P.A.
1 Eagle Square, P.O. Box 3550
Concord, NH 03302-3550
Tel 603-224-2381
Fax 603-224-9485
e-mail o1_dselden@nelinet.org (that's an oh one, not a zero)
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 95 16:35:18 PST
From: kens@lan.nsc.com (Ken Schroeder)
Subject: Responses to the styles thread
Hi all,
I responded earlier this week but used an old mail list so the posting
was sent to the wrong address (woopsy). Since then its been "get the code
working" week, so IL haven't had time to correct past sins. I appologize
if this post is a little out of date.
Charlie Scandrett continues the styles thread. Charlie claims to be
"outside" organized homebrewing. Charlie, you are more of an insider
than you realize. I must side with Charlie when he states he is trying
to make "positive and constuctive" statements. Reader beware that
what may sound like a flame war may very well have been taken the wrong
way. It is the nature of the this and most other forums like this to have
a "point - counter point" custom and should not be mistaken as flame wars.
Charlie, your points are valid and you raise good questions. Keep 'em
comming. On the other hand Russell calls judges old and smelly. Cute
Russell, but that is a bit harsh, don't ya think. I bet you beer is
old and smelly. (Joking folks!)
Charlie states in his last posting that the the microbrewing industry
"look to homebrewing as its roots". IMHO, this is not quite correct.
Many of the "brewers" look to homebrewing for their induvidual roots, but
brewing is an acient art/science. The roots of our brewing heritage are
found in the traditions of Germanic Europe, British Europe and not leaving
out Belgian and French traditions. This is why our styles are based along
these lines. Tradition is a hard thing to avoid. In fact with an art/science
that predates Acient Egypt, we should honor these traditions. But this does
not mean that we should be bound by tradition.
Charlie makes light that French wine makers are learning new thing from
Australian wine makers. I have a couple of points here. First, brewers
are closer to chefs than wine makers. Almost all brewers are willing to
share reciepes and techniques, which appears to not be the situation with
wine making. Charlie also jokes about "American craft brewers teaching
the Germans, Belgains or English new techniques!". I would find
it hard to be more inovative than some of European techniques. Try bringing
your wort to a boil by putting white hot rocks into it, then taking these
rocks, with carmelized wort on them, and tossing them into the fermentor to
add taste. That is really "out there", if you ask me. In this acient craft,
we learn from eachother and our traditions.
Charlie's main point is correct, no matter at what level, commercial
brewing success is measured by what is put in the bank, not what awards
adorn the office. Which bring me to the posting from Bill Knudson who
seems a little upset at the "big three bashing". I have some responses,
which are meant in fun though they are a bit "smart assed". (let's have some
fun here)
>"The big three still provide more beer to more people the "Craft brewers".
Bill, you call budswillooors beer? I preferr to refer to their commodity as
an "alcohol delivery system", American Malt Soda Pop if you will.
>So how can AoB ignore their niche? (refering the "the big Three")
AoB can't, they contribute more $$$$ than anybody else.
Bill tells the story of how Jim Kock and Sam Adams son medals art GABF. Good
story I might add. To me SA is a big brewer, maybe the biggest of the craft
brew companies. Siera Nevada is also big. Both these companies produce good
beer. So why can't budswilloors? Because they service the portion of the
market that is not as concerned with beer that tastes good.
Bill laments the merger mainia that is taking over the smaller breweries in
Gemany. I believe that the driving motive for this and the driving motive
for budswilloors is to make money, not brew beer. A while ago, someone
posted the facts of who brews what, where. I was amazed to see Millers brew
Budwieser in another country and everybody sell each other's products
all over the globe. (Can we have that posted again?)
> "Whatney's...It's plactic beer, nothing but chemicals, total rubbish!"
I've heard Whatney's referred to as "the worst beer in London" from
English people.
>What do you do when you're in BF Egypt and all they sell is that stuff?
>(referring to budswilloors)
I, for one, will support one of the "big two". I preferr Coke to Pepsi.
Honestly:
To Bill I say, the "big three" don't put the quality of their beer as top
priority, money is. This makes them an easy target. When Bud hires an
ad agency for Bud Lite, and tells that agency to drop Pete's Wicked as
a customer, that's chickhen s... In my opinion, it violates the brewing
brotherhood where brewers lend eachother a hand and trade ideas freely.
Though the big three do have good points, for the dollar tops all
transgression, it's open season on buswilloors!
Also:
It has been pointed out that I am appearing negative toward the AHA. I
do have some misgiving about that organization, but the AHA is really not
that bad. It is difficult to be in their position, with limited funds and
labor resources. the AHA has setup a reasonable styles guideline, though
we all (including the AHA) realize is due for an overhaul. Still the AHA
offers a national focal point and forum to advance homebrewing, not only in
the US but apparently is other countries as well. My critisim of the AHA is
based on the current state of the organization and the lack of a good
communication link with the average homebrewer. Without a good communication
link, the organization is at risk of looking autocratic and out of touch. The
current situation with the BJCP makes the situation look even worse. Pushing
the "relax, have a homebrew attitude", adds an appearance that the
organization does not care very much about the average homebrewer. With the
excellent web page the AHA has, why haven't they set up a bulleton board or
general communication link there? These rantings and ravings have not been
emailed to the AHA, and that is my fault, but this is an international forum
and an excellent place for the AHA to communicate with the average homebrewer.
How about it AHA? Many of is homebrewers would be more supportive of your
situation if you would communicate on a more personal basis that your web
page and magazine.(Now that is a direct challenge!)
Nothing personal....towards anybody.
Ken Schroeder
Sequoia Brewing (Where brewing is a serious effort filled with fun.)
ps The code I was working on works great! (After a few very long days)
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 03 Nov 95 16:50:41 PST
From: dhvanvalkenburg@CCGATE.HAC.COM
Subject: Mash/Lauter Tun and scorching
Hi All,
Regarding the current thread on scorching and Don Puts'
experience with a mash/lauter tun combination; here is
my experience:
I have not yet had misfortune scorching my mash or wort
and have used both a sort of false bottom (which I will
describe below) and a direct contact mash tun with
natural gas burner below. I will have to agree with
Kirk Fleming and Spencer Thomas; that with a sufficient
rate of wort being taken off the bottom and
recirculated, there is sufficient heat being drawn off
the bottom and thus no scorching.
homebrew@hpfcmgw.fc.hp.com
I have in the past used a combination mash/lauter tun
and boil pot all in one. What I had was essentially a
SS basket that was just slightly smaller than my boil
pot and fit down inside. This whole contraption sit
down inside the lower part of a cut out hot water
heater. The basket I made from a SS sieve I bought from
a restaurant supply store and had SS sheet metal spot
welded to the top of the sieve. At the top of the
basket I attached a cross bar made of oak. This cross
bar would never be under the mash or come in contact
with the wort. It was simply used as a handle and
something to attach a hook with a rope and pulley
assembly which I used to slowly pull the grain out of
the wort when I started sparging.
This system was a convenient transition from extract
into all grain and conserved space, but the problem and
the reason I do not use it any more is that I found that
I still needed a second pot for sparge water. With this
one pot system I was relying on the hot water heater for
my sparge water, which was totally inadequate, or I was
running between the kitchen and garage with pots of 170f
water. My efficiency was not to great either.
But on the good side, I made some great beer with it.
Also, with the burner below it gave me the opportunity
to experiment with different mash temperature schedules
-- with no scorching.
I hope this will give you the general idea:
|
|<-----rope/ pulley used to pull
| grain out of pot for boil
|
|
| ___ SS basket - mash/lauder tun
? /
||==============||
|| ||
|| ||
|| ||
|| ||<---- boil kettle
||~~~~~~~~~~~~~~||
|| grain ||
|| ||
|| ||
| \------------/ |___
\------------------|| <---spigot
sssssssss
Burner
Copper manifold (not shown)on the bottom of
kettle and attached to spigot filtered
whole hops used in boil. This also keeps
inside basket off the bottom.
Don VanValkenburg
dhvanvalkenburg@ccgate.hac.com
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 19:59:57 -0600
From: blacksab@siu.edu (Harlan Bauer)
Subject: beer
Algis Korzonas writes, American Lager is to beer what fluffy white bread is
to bread. Very true, and an observation which might give us hope. 10 years
ago salads were iceberg lettuce, coffee was folgers, and bread was wonder.
Today I can get a salad mix of 15 different lettuces, coffees from around
the world, and bread that rivals the french (well, maybe not as easily in
Carbondale as in Chicago, but it's improving). My point is that if the trend
in beer continues, the beer market will become more difused, beers coming
from many sources instead of one. 10 years ago, American beer WAS
budswilloors, now, even in Carbondale I can get fresh, microbrewed American
beer. As for restaurants, the selection is usually pretty dismal, but the
same is true for wine (white,pink,red). Solution? I won't usually go to a
place that has lousy beer; at least in the Chicagoland area, there's plenty
of restaurants of every stripe and color that have good to great beer, and
even more that will let you bring your own. I simply refuse to patronize any
place that has lousy beer or for that matter, liqur stores that do not take
care of their beer. The shift in salads and coffee in this country was
caused by consumer demand. We are part of that demand in beer.
As for the miller slight and lice-house crowd, I'm reminded of something
J.R. "Bob" Dobbs says, namely: You know how dumb the average American is?
Just remember that 50% is even dumber than that.
--Harlan
*****************************************************************************
* *
* Harlan Bauer ...malt does more than Milton can *
* <blacksab@siu.edu> To justify God's ways to man. *
* Carbondale, IL --A.E. Houseman *
* *
****************************************************************************
*
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 20:00:52 -0600
From: blacksab@siu.edu (Harlan Bauer)
Subject: WYEAST
There's been a bit of talk lately about Wyeast, and I suppose readers should
be reminded that Wyeast was caught selling Brettanomyces yeast (that's how
the package was labeled) when in fact the package contained mostly Ale
yeast. The homebrewer who pointed this out and posted on Lambic Digest was
threatened with law suit and forced to publically recant. Wyeast has since
changed the package, basically admitting that said homebrewer was correct.
So don't expect Wyeast to be forthcoming about any real or percieved
problems with their products. I'm not saying there ARE any problems with
1056, I'm simply suggesting that if there are any problems with it, you're
probably not going to hear about it from Wyeast.
--Harlan
*****************************************************************************
* *
* Harlan Bauer ...malt does more than Milton can *
* <blacksab@siu.edu> To justify God's ways to man. *
* Carbondale, IL --A.E. Houseman *
* *
****************************************************************************
*
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 07:13:06 -0800
From: hollen@vigra.com
Subject: Re: Phalse Bottom Open Area
>>>>> "Dan" == Dan Listermann, Cinci OH <72723.1707@compuserve.com> writes:
Dan> Dion Hollenbeck described his Phalse Bottom as having 7/64 holes
Dan> on staggered 11/32 centers. ( They were supposed to be 1/8 holes
Dan> on 3/8 staggered centers) I just wanted to note that we changed
Dan> the material for that product about three years ago to 3/32
Dan> dia. holes on 3/16 staggered centers. This gives an open area of
Dan> about 23%.
Thanks for the correction, Dan. I got my info early one morning by
measuring the hole diameter with drill bits until I got one that
exactly fit, and the spacing with a dial calipers. Sorry to any of
you out there I may have misled.
dion
- --
Dion Hollenbeck (619)597-7080x119 Email: hollen@vigra.com
Senior Software Engineer Vigra, Inc. San Diego, California
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 4 Nov 1995 07:59:49 -0500
From: af509@osfn.rhilinet.gov (Rolland Everitt)
Subject: mason jars & preserving starter
There has been some talk of late about mason jars and their
usefulness for bottling. There was also a question today from
someone who wants to preserve wort to make starters.
I don't think I would use mason jars for bottling beer, but
they are perfect for preserving wort and starting yeast. I make
a mini-batch of all-grain wort, and boil it (no hops). I fill
3 or 4 mason jars roughly 2/3 full (leave room for kraeusen)
with boiling hot wort (sterilize the jars and lids first),
cap them, let them cool, and put them in the back of my fridge.
When I buy yeast, I divide a smack pack between the jars, put
the caps on loosely (no airlock), and let them set in a dark
cupboard at room temp. I generally let the jars come to room
temp before pitching, and shake well to aerate before opening.
I usually have definite signs of fermentation in about a day.
I put these in the fridge (caps still loose). When I'm ready
to pitch, I just shake one up and pour it in the carboy
(after aerating the wort). I have been using Wyeast ale yeasts,
and pitching at about 66 F. I generally have high kraeusen
in my fermenter about 24 hours after pitching my starter. I
don't know how long they will last, but so far they are still
just fine after 5-6 weeks (ale yeast).
Rolland Everitt
af509@osfn.rhilinet.gov
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 4 Nov 1995 10:13:15 -0500
From: dharsh@alpha.che.uc.edu (Dr. David C. Harsh)
Subject: Nat. Gas vs. Propane
>I'm sorry, but I simply can't let a half-truth go unchallenged. Although it
>is true that Propane is heavier than air and therefore pools on the ground,
>so does Natural Gas. Both gasses are heavier than air, and both have the
>potential to pool.
>
>Could someone familiar with the relative molecular weights post the
>densities of air, propane, and natural gas. Is propane really that much
>heavier than natural gas?
Ok, here are molecular weights and densities (in lb/ft3 at 72=B0F and 1 atm)=
:
Molec Wt Density
Propane (CH3-CH2-CH3): 44 0.113
Air (79% Oxygen and 21% Nitrogen): 29 0.075
Natural Gas (CH4): 16 0.041
So, if the density of air is 1, propane is 1.5 and natural gas is 0.55.
Unless the air is stagnant, the pooling of leaked gas is not a problem, you
just end up with an explosive mixture everywhere. The compound that you
smell in natural gas (butyl mercaptan? not sure of this) is heavier than
air, but it just smells bad and is only in your gas feed at a few parts per
million.
Leaks aside, the reason that cajun cooker manufacturers don't want you to
use them inside is carbon monoxide produced. I've never seen any numbers,
but I think its safe to assume that a jet type burner is extremely
inefficient and produces lots of CO. Some propane burners *are* designed
for indoor use, but those are the minority.
I have ready many people here in the digest that use their cookers indoors
with no problems - I won't do it. It's not worth the risk. Yes, I brew
outside when its freezing cold. Beats dying.
I don't mean to lecture, but when someone kills themself doing this, some
hearse-chasing lawyer is going to claim that the warning wasn't in big
enough letters or some similar bullshit. Opinionated? Yes, guilty as
charged.
Dave
******************************************************************
* Dave Harsh *
* Newsletter Editor for the Bloatarian Brewing League *
* *
* Remember, 50% of all school children are below average. *
******************************************************************
------------------------------
Date: 04 Nov 95 10:24:37 EST
From: Tim Fields <74247.551@compuserve.com>
Subject: Last sputtering of the propane thread
As the indoor propane thread sputters to an end, I can't resist adding a
couple of comments:
Outdoor Propane cookers are designed for outdoor use and they CAN BE
extremely dangerous if used indoors. The gas furnaces that that one
poster refers to were all designed specifically for use where they were
installed and are coded/tested etc to be safe in those applications.
Outdoor Propane cookers are NOT designed or tested for such uses.
There are safer alternatives available. If you dont want to take even a
small chance of toasting your house and family, dont feel you need to.
For those using these burners indoors, I hope your homeowners insurance
agents don't read HBD ;-). Come to think of it, if your house DID go up,
I doubt insurance would cover it.
"Reeb!" Tim Fields ... Fairfax, VA
timf@relay.com (non-brewing time)
74247.551@compuserve.com (weekends)
------------------------------
Date: 04 Nov 95 10:24:40 EST
From: Tim Fields <74247.551@compuserve.com>
Subject: RE starter wort and yeast cultures
In #1875, "James Hojel" <JTroy@msn.com> writes:
>I have 2 short questions:
>1) I'm getting very tiered of paying a couple of bucks every time I want to
>make a yeast starter (DME). Question: can I collect some left-over runnings
>from my Mash and save it for later use? Maybe freezing it and boiling it
>when needed? How long will frozen Wort last; what affects does freezing Wort
>have on the quality (chemical structure etc.)? Basically, what is the most
>efficient and quality way of saving some Wort for later use?
I make up starter wort in volume and "can" it in mason jars using a
procedure from Dave Miller's book "Brewing the Worlds Great Beers".
Basically, you boil some DME, water, and hops; then "can it". I keep
this canned wort in a dark closet - no refrigeration. Always smell it
before using it, but it's been fine so far. IMHO this is a great system
- I always have starter wort available.
>
>2) Again, I'm also getting tiered of paying for yeast every time. What book
>is the best for learning yeast culturing and where is the cheapest place to
>get supplies (inoculation loop, etc.)?
RE supplies, there are probably several sources. I just ordered from The
Yeast Culure Kit Company (800) 742-2110, and their catalog appears to
have "it all" - from bunson burners to media. I ordered the beginners
kit, which seems to be a very good place for beginning yeast ranchers
like me to start. It has all the basic stuff and a good instruction
booklet. No affiliation, etc.
-Tim
------------------------------
Date: 04 Nov 95 10:24:19 EST
From: Tim Fields <74247.551@compuserve.com>
Subject: RE slant media
In #1875, Tom Williams (tjwillia@vm.occ.cc.mi.us) writes:
>Are there any available lab media formulas (i.e. specifically for
>propagating yeast) that I should avoid when making up slants? I have
>the opportunity to access a lab resource and personnel to assist my
>efforts at yeast farming, but they do not have specific info concerning
>brewers yeast strains.
Try contacting Dr.Dan McConnell of The Yeast Culture Kit Company at (800)
742-2110.
No affiliation, etc. Just a very new customer.
-Tim
------------------------------
Date: 04 Nov 95 10:24:32 EST
From: Tim Fields <74247.551@compuserve.com>
Subject: RE bleaching mother nature
In #1875, nparker@lockheed.on.ca (neal) writes, quoting Russell Mast:
>Russel Mast writes:
>>No, Greg, I like bleach okay, but I don't fault those who don't use it. It
>>also is supposedly very destructive to the environment. (That should make
>>it appeal that much more to certain people, of course...)
Neal responds:
>I've been using bleach for years now (with at least 3 rinses). One of the
>reasons I like it (besides the cost) is that it's a powerful sterilizer
>but it's still biodegradable (or so it says on the side of the Javex bottle).
>I think it breaks down to very innocuous compounds. If this isn't the case
>I'd like to know because an awful lot goes down the drain each time I
>brew.
>
>Any Chemical types with a proper explanation?
Russell: what's your source for the environmentally destructive comment?
I'm not a chemical type, but common sense tells me bleach is no
environmental problem if used correctly. People have been pouring it
into washing machines for years, and it goes right down the drain.
Perhaps large volumes of un-diluted bleach could, after time, bother
something - but I doubt many of us are using it full strength.
-Tim
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 4 Nov 95 10:59:36 EST
From: djfitzg@VNET.IBM.COM
Subject: Kegging and Bottling
I have a fairly basic question, but I'd appreciate anyone who has a tried
and true, experience similar to mine.
Some time ago I began kegging my 5 gallon batches of brew, and boy am I
happy. Now with the gift giving season approaching, I'd like to bottle
a few 20oz. gifts for relative's and friends. Does anyone have experience
with bottling a dozen or so bottles and kegging the rest. I would like
to know how you decide on the amout of sugar to prime with, per bottle
and also how do you assure you get the correct amout of disolved sugar
solution added to each bottle based on the amount of beer.
The beer styles will be pale ales, and also pilsner as the weather gets
colder.
Thanks for your help,
Dan Fitzgerald
djfitzg@vnet.ibm.com
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 4 Nov 1995 09:59:54 -0600
From: mike@datasync.com (Mike White)
Subject: Propane vs. Natural Gas
On Thu, 2 Nov 1995 Harlan Bauer said:
>I'm sorry, but I simply can't let a half-truth go unchallenged. Although it
>is true that Propane is heavier than air and therefore pools on the ground,
>so does Natural Gas. Both gasses are heavier than air, and both have the
>potential to pool.
>
>Could someone familiar with the relative molecular weights post the
>densities of air, propane, and natural gas. Is propane really that much
>heavier than natural gas?
To which I reply:
Harlan,
Here's that data you requested:
Density of air = 1.2 ounces per cubic foot
Density of propane = 2.0 ounces per cubic foot
Density of methane (natural gas) = 0.7 ounces per cubic foot
Of course these measurements will vary very slightly based on humidity, air
temperature, and air pressure. However (sorry to bust your bubble Harlan)
natural gas will always be lighter than air and propane will always be
heavier than air.
I often work along side an explosive investigator/instructor and he informs
me that one of the investigative steps used in determining whether propane
or natural blew apart a house is whether it blew apart from the
ceiling/attic area...which would indicate a natural gas leak, or whether it
blew apart from the basement/floor area which would indicate a propane leak.
Natural gas floats, propane sinks.
I have also seen people fill plastic trash bags with natural gas and float
them like helium balloons, and I have seen propane sprayed into a bucket
where it sat in the bottom as a mist without floating out.
But all of this is irrevelant...any leak in a house can cause an explosion.
The only difference is whether you want the roof to blow off first or the
bottoms of the walls to blow out first.
- ------------------------------------------------------------
Thought for the day:
Religions change, beer and wine remain.
- ------------------------------------------------------------
Mike White
mike@datasync.com
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 4 Nov 1995 11:09:30 -0500
From: DICKERSONP@aol.com
Subject: Summary of SABCO responses
Hello homebrewers! About two weeks ago, I posted to ask about SABCO kegs.
To quickly summarize, my questions were:
1) what is the difference between the $90 half keg and the $289 half keg with
false bottom and spigot?
2) did anyone have any experience with using either product?
I received a generous supply of responses to each question. They were as
follows:
1) The $90 product is only a boiling kettle and has no drain or false
bottom. The $289 product could be used to mash with direct heat (some said
direct heat was not so good because of scorching). Most said it would be
difficult to mash and boil in the $289 pot because you'd have to remove the
false bottom and the grain. If anyone cares, I plan to get the $90 pot and
mash in a Gott cooler.
2) Many responders actually used one or both products. Only one response
was negative -- the person said that the false bottom detached easily (poor
welds?). Most responses were complimentary of SABCO. One response
recommended a do-it-yourself job which might cost less.
Thanks to everyone who responded. By the way, I recently got a home page --
http://users.aol.com/dickersonp/phil.htm.
Check it out. Right now, I just have a few beer related links and my own
"beer review" page. Please, no flames on my reviews! I'm a rank amateur
presenting my personal views on some beers I've tried!! If I ever get the
SABCO kettle/Gott cooler/etc setup going, I'll put some info on the home
page.
Thanks again.
- ------------------------
Phillip Dickerson
Raleigh, NC
- ------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 04 Nov 1995 11:23 -0500 (EST)
From: gregory_g._graboski@Merck.Com (Gregory G. Graboski)
Subject: Gases and Slants
In HBD# 1875 Harlan Bauer writes that 'both natural and propane gases are
heavier than air......'
No flame intended but Tain't So McGee
Propane has a density of 1.8324 g/L at standard conditions (~RT)
Air has a density of 1.2929 g/L
Natural gas in the US is a mix of about 85% methane, 9% ethane, 3% propane
and 1% butane (remainder is nitrogen). Methane's density is 0.7167g/L and
ethane is 1.3567g/L. but the mix *is* less dense than air [athough some of
the components are heavier.] This data can be found in the CRC Handbook of
Chemistry & Physics (some o' us brewgeeks just love #s)
Nonetheless! your advice about using gas cookers indoors is still wise, even
if only considering the O2 consumption that takes place when using
100,000Btu burners. Not to even mention the SPU's needed for such an
undertaking.
Another subject,
Tom Williams asked about slant media....
I've used the following formula with good results:
agar 15 g/l
glucose 20g/l
yeast extract 10 g/l
malt extract 10 g/l
Hope this helps
Greg
graboski@merck.com
------------------------------
End of HOMEBREW Digest #1876, 11/06/95
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