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HOMEBREW Digest #1591
This file received at Sierra.Stanford.EDU 94/11/29 00:38:12
HOMEBREW Digest #1591 Tue 29 November 1994
FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
Rob Gardner, Digest Janitor
Contents:
Please help me find a Gott cooler ("Rick Gontarek, Ph.D.")
mashing advice (MicahM1269)
Aeration (Ed Hitchcock)
Foam City Canada revisited (Matt_K)
High Krausen (Hmbrewbob)
CP foaming (Btalk)
micro demo (RONALD DWELLE)
Coriander (Chris Lyons)
Malta starters (Pierre Jelenc)
Wanted: Used Corona Mill (Alexander R Mitchell)
Over-Aeration/62 F Lagering ("Paul Stokely")
Parallel propagation results ("Harralson, Kirk")
Re: Raspberry Ale and comments (Paul Baker) (Paul Baker)
see ya... (Frank Jones)
finding a cold place to lager (Chuck E. Mryglot)
Seperating the hot/cold break from your wort? (David Cutkosky)
NEW POLICY NOTE??????? (David Korb)
Re: Ideal blowoff experiment (Bill Szymczak)
Minimal blowoff ("Vandermey, John")
Re: Kegs to Bottles ("Alan L. Edwards")
Chalky buildup in brewpot (Daniel Cook)
Blow Off Beginners / Heat transfer. ("Palmer.John")
Use of Sparkolloids (TWideman)
Brew & Sweat 95 1.1 (Timothy Thomas)
Beer only foams once (MiniUniTnk)
New Store in So. Cal (Diane S. Put)
Allergy Challenge ("Rich Scotty")
Cloudy Bitter (Aidan "Krazy Krausen Kropping Kiwi" Heerdegen)
FOOP (Erik Speckman)
NDN: Homebrew Digest #1590 (November 28, 1994) (Gateway)
******************************************************************
* NEW POLICY NOTE: Due to the incredible volume of bouncing mail,
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----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Nov 1994 7:34:30 -0500 (EST)
From: "Rick Gontarek, Ph.D." <GONTAREK@FCRFV1.NCIFCRF.GOV>
Subject: Please help me find a Gott cooler
Greetings, Brewthren! Being that the holidays are upon us, I have asked
Santa Claus for a Gott cooler to use as a mash/lauter tun. I saw him after
the Macy's Thanksgiving Day Parade, and he told me that he's had some trouble
finding me a Gott cooler. He's tried places like Herman's, Sports Authority,
Wal-Mart, etc, with absolutely no luck finding a Gott. So I am asking
you kind folks to please help me tell Santa where to find a Gott cooler
in my area (Baltimore, MD). He would ask you himself, but he doesn't check
his email everyday because he's very busy this time of year. Anyway, I
would appreciate any information anyone has (even a phone number of Gott)
that could put Santa in touch with the present of my dreams.
TIA to everyone. BTW, Santa loves it when you leave him homebrews
to take back to the North Pole..."better then burnt cookies and room-
temperature milk" he says!
Rick Gontarek
Owner/Brewmaster of the Major Groove Picobrewery
Baltimore, MD
gontarek@fcrfv1.ncifcrf.gov
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Nov 1994 07:56:09 -0500
From: MicahM1269@aol.com
Subject: mashing advice
>Subject: Mashing Technique
>My questions are:
> 1) Should the mash have taken this long to convert to sugars using such
>a highly modified malt? Was expecting 45-60 mins.
In a likelihood conversion took place in the first 10 -15 min. IMHO iodine
starch
tests are very subjective and often just give the homebrew something else to
worry over.
> 2) Should I have mashed at the higher temperature, 156F, initially
>instead of lowering it to 150-152F?
Higher mash temps will yeild more unfermentables. Your targeted beer style
might require this.
>3) Would I have gained anything by doing a 2 step mash with a protein
>rest for this grain?
Yes, but the time to extract trade off should be considered.
> 4) Is Klage's malt an American 2-Row or British 2-row pale malt?
Klages is a North American grown 2 row barley it is however being phased out
in favour of Harrington. They are very similar. The reason for the change
is
agricultural.
>5) Using the picnic cooler method, would it be preferable to add boiling
>water to the cooler achieve mash-out or should I remove some of the sweet
>wort, bring it to a boil and return to the cooler to accomplish mash-out?
Using boiling water will ruin the picnic cooler ( warpage) Try using a
portion of your sparge water
for the mash out.
>For this first all-grain batch, it took me about 6 hours from start to
finish
>compared to the usual 4 hours for extract brewing. Despite the extra time
>involved, I found all-grain brewing quite fun and hope this brew will be
>rewarding when finally done.
All grain is fun and it will get faster and easier.
>TIA for any help in improving my technique for future all-grain batches.
micah millspaw - brewer at large
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Nov 1994 10:21:21 -0400 (AST)
From: Ed Hitchcock <ehitchcock@sparc.uccb.ns.ca>
Subject: Aeration
Bowe Wingerd relates a tale of over aeration and a seething
bubbling fermentation from Hades. He mentions Miller stating that the
wort cannot be overaerated during the first twelve hours after the yeast
is pitched. I don't have my copy of Miller handy but I don't think this
is what he said, at least he should know better. You can aerate the heck
out of it *before* adding the yeast, but once the yeast is pitched you want
to keep air out. Certainly once any signs of fermentation appear it is
time to cut out the aeration (dilemma: if you're bubbling the wort, how
can you tell if a kraesen is forming?). I have, on occasion, transferred
pitched wort between carboys before any signs of fermentation, but in
general I try to do all my aerating and trub removal before pitching the
yeast. Under good conditions (high pitching rate, good aeration) you can
get kraesen forming within a few hours, certainly far short of the twelve
hours mentioned above.
ed
----------------
Ed Hitchcock, now on the right side of the student/staff division
ehitchcock@sparc.uccb.ns.ca
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Nov 94 09:27:00 est
From: Matt_K@ceo.sts-systems.ca
Subject: Foam City Canada revisited
Message:
First of all I would like to thank everyone who replied to my post
last week re. the foaming problem I had. As it turns out, we solved
the mstery this weekend.
The hoses I was using were new. What we found was that the pin in
the liquid out quick disconnect, which pushes down on the poppet
valve, had been installed upside down. As soon as we installed it
correctly all was well.
Maybe this will help someone else at some point and thank's again for
all the help.
Matt (in Montreal)
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Nov 1994 09:37:37 -0500
From: Hmbrewbob@aol.com
Subject: High Krausen
Hi,
Earlier this month I inquired about about brewing Wit beer and recieved
alot of good info. I got the chance to brew it 2 w/e's ago and it went great.
But now I have another question. After 8 days in the fermenter at 66F I
still have an inch of krausen and pushing bubbles thru the air lock at a rate
of 1/10sec. No fowl smells, everything looks nomal. Is this just from the
high degree of protien in the wort? Any Wit brewers out there seen this
before? TIA
Bob DaBrewer
hmbrewbob.aol.com
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Nov 1994 09:49:46 -0500
From: Btalk@aol.com
Subject: CP foaming
Lee writes about excess foaming with his counterpressure bottler.
Lee, since you have everything cold already ( I work 35 F or colder), do you
pressurize the bottle before you begin to fill?
Also, take it slow particularly while the filler tube opening is submerged,
then you can speed up a little. All this assumes you have the 3 valve type
filler.
I often end up with foam filling the bottle neck, but vent it out and
actually fill the beer bottle completely. This compensates for what ever
foams out of the bottle once I yank out the filler and get the cap on.
Granted, this is hassle enough that I only do a few bottles at a time ( like
for contest entries), but it does work well.
Regards,
Bob Talkiewicz, Binghamton,NY <btalk@aol.com>
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Nov 94 09:49:18 EST
From: dweller@GVSU.EDU (RONALD DWELLE)
Subject: micro demo
I belong to a social club (with a bar) and have been asked (as a known
home-brewer) to help out at a "micro" beer night. The idea is to
introduce the large group of mega-swillers to some good beer. The bar
manager asked me to provide her with recommendations for four or five
micro beers to serve. (She does not want to do more than five.) I
would appreciate suggestions from HBDers--which four or five. Please
note that this is a licensed bar and the microbeers have to be bought
through the legal channels (distributors, etc.) Does anyone have
experience with mailorder from distant micros?
The manager also asked me consider doing a demo of beer making. I
thought maybe doing a full mash might be interesting.(The bar has a
big, full kitchen). Anyone done this? Tips?
TIA
Ron Dwelle (dweller@gvsu.edu)
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Nov 94 10:02:24 EST
From: Chris Lyons <Chris.Lyons@analog.com>
Subject: Coriander
Could some kind sole please educate me on the use of 'coriander'
as it pertains to brewing? I would especially appreciate information
on what it contributes to a beer and what quantities people add.
Regards,
Chris
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Nov 94 10:50:28 EST
From: Pierre Jelenc <pcj1@columbia.edu>
Subject: Malta starters
Last Friday, I decided to try the "Malta method" to make a starter. (For
the bodega-impaired, "Malta" is a Portorican soft drink that is basically
carbonated wort. (For the non-Americans, a "bodega" is an hispanic grocery
store in America, not a wine store.))
Anyway, I poured one bottle of Malta in a gallon bottle, and after
decarbonating and aerating thoroughly, I added a spatula-full of yeast
from a week-old plate (Stoudt's stout yeast, from a pure colony).
To my surprise, nothing happended until this morning, Monday. That is an
awfully long lag time for such a large inoculum, especially since that
yeast is quite sturdy, and grows on plates in 24 hours.
Has anyone had a similar experience? Is there perhaps a preservative or
inhibitor in the Malta (none is listed on the label)? There is no off
smell so far, and nothing that looks like bacterial scum.
Pierre
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Nov 94 11:11:28 EST
From: Alexander R Mitchell <ARMITC01@ULKYVM.LOUISVILLE.EDU>
Subject: Wanted: Used Corona Mill
Database/Analyst INF SYS
Phone: (502)852-5603
My Father-In-Law wants a corona grain mill for use on his farm and I thought
I'd check the HBD for a used one before he spends time at his local Flea
Market. Please Email me as this doesn't need to take up bandwidth.
armitc01@ulkyvm.louisville.edu "Mitchell" *** Fortes Fortuna Juvat ***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Nov 1994 12:07:25 EDT
From: "Paul Stokely" <PSTOKELY@ea.umd.edu>
Subject: Over-Aeration/62 F Lagering
The BOWEMEISTER described his experiences with an aquarium pump and 4
gallons of pitched wort in HBD 1590.
I have never aerated wort after pitching, so I can't speak directly
to what might be happening in your fermentor. But I can't see how it
is caused by over-aerated wort. In physical chemistry, you encounter
Raoult's Law, and a couple of other physical descriptions of gases
dissolved in liquids: at a given temperature, a liquid will only
dissolve a certain amount of a given gas. Introducing more gas after
the liquid is saturated will only cause the gas to bubble up and
escape out of solution. Aerating while fermenting is frowned upon in
brewing texts, although I don't know the physical reasons why.
Domenick?
I would advise any brewer who asked to aerate the wort before
pitching yeast. Of course no brewer has asked me....
**************
Remember the one-man thread from last August about high temperature
lagering in a basement?
I drank the amber lager which I fermented using Wyeast's
California Common Lager over the holidays. Recall: Vienna malt,
with 8 oz light crystal and 4 oz. chocolate, double decoction mash,
the average temperature of my basement was 62 degrees and the highest
temperature I recorded was 65 F.
My non-BJCP opinion of the beer: excellent!
There are some "off flavors" but none of them offensive. Actually it
reminds me of Anchor Steam, but not as strong. Well there you go. I
suppose the whole outcome was imminently predictable: lagering at @62
F produces a complex flavor, probably doesn't store well for long
periods, and is feasible for We Who Have No Spare Fridge. I am
storing a few bottles in my fridge to see how well it keeps and will
keep you happy readers informed.
Paul S. in College Park, Maryland "I dine on the flesh of the
living and I vote."
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Nov 94 12:25:14 EST
From: "Harralson, Kirk" <kwh@roadnet.ups.com>
Subject: Parallel propagation results
I have been using the parallel yeast propagation technique, as
described in the yeast faq, with mixed results over the past year or
so. I make about a gallon of 1.040 wort with hops and nutrients,
pitch a swollen Wyeast pack, let it go to completion, bottle in 12oz
beer bottles and store in the fridge until use. About a week before
brewing, I set a bottle out overnight to warm up gradually, make
another starter, decant about half the bottled volume, agitate the
rest and pitch when cooled and aerated. What I have found is: some
strains of yeast are better for this technique than others; and the
longer the yeast is stored, the longer the lag time in the starter. I
have had the best results with Wyeast 2565 Kolsch; the worst with 1056
American Ale. I know a lot of people work with 1056 with no problems,
but it did not work well for me. I think one of the problems is
taking the bottle out of the fridge and letting it warm up naturally
to room temperature. I think this is warming too quickly and shocking
the yeast. Is this valid? -- Is anyone using a better method with
this technique? Last week, I reluctantly bought a pack of Wyeast 1338
that, by the stamped date, was 5 months old. It was the only pack
they had, and it was refrigerated, and I really wanted to use this
yeast, so I took a chance... On the instructions, it said to add a
day of lag time to the starter for every month past the stamped date.
Sure enough, it started about 4.5 days after pitching in a starter.
Is this a good rule of thumb, or just a coincidence? Will I get
off-flavors from using yeast this old (besides the increased risk of
contamination)?
Someone posted a technique for storing wort in PET bottles for
subsequent use in starters. This appealed to me because the wort is
poured into the bottles and sealed hot (presumably right after
boiling) and then cooled in an ice bath. I saw this as a poor-boy's
pyrex. I experimented with a 2 liter soda bottle, and it deformed
when the hot liquid was poured in, but did not melt through. If
anything, the interior was heat sanitized. Is there any potential
problems with this? How quickly will they oxidize if stored in the
fridge? I even tried to find a stopper for these so I could use an
air lock, but it must be an irregular size -- my local supplier could
not help me -- any suggestions?
Kirk Harralson
Bel Air, Maryland
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Nov 94 10:50:00 PST
From: Paul Baker <bakerp@amhsgwy.jpl.nasa.gov>
Subject: Re: Raspberry Ale and comments (Paul Baker)
Eric Hale wrote of his Raspberry Ale blowing off some krauesen and
most of the raspberries:
> Do I have to trash this batch? Is it appropriate to throw in some
> campden (never used it before)? Is there anything else I can do to
> make this batch come out okay? Did I screw up? What when wrong?
> Help!
Your brew is probably fine. All the CO2 coming down the blow off tube
should have kept any beast from crawling up the other way. You lost a
lot of the raspberry flavor so the raspberry part of your ale may be
disappointing.
The campden will kill/inhibit the yeast. They need to finish their work
so do not use it.
If you have your heart set on making this batch with raspberries then try
adding a couple ounces of the natural fruit flavors that are available.
I have never used them, but good results have been reported. Adding
to the secondary seems to be the most common method.
Fruit beers and other high gravity beers will often blow off more wort
than is desirable. I always use a 6 1/2 gal carboy (with blow off) for
the primary with these brews.
Also, fruit beers will often come out over carbonated. It has been theorized
that the complex sugars in the fruit take longer to be eaten by the
yeast. This results in excess carbonation in bottles that age more than
a few weeks. (Anyone else notice this?) You may want to cut down on your
priming sugar a bit or figure out a way to keep your brew from aging that
long ;-).
Renato Bugge wrote of his all grain adventures with brewing in Norway:
That is a great story Renato. You are willing to go though much more
than most of us in the pursuit of this hobby. Thanks for posting.
Paul Baker
Telos Corp
bakerp@amhsgwy.jpl.nasa.gov
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Nov 1994 11:09:29 -0700
From: Frank Jones <frank@Solbourne.COM>
Subject: see ya...
Dear Friends, Net-Friends, select listserv-subscribers, et. al.
This is a blanket goodbye-for-now, as I am changing jobs at
the end of the month and losing my internet connection (only for the
short-term future, one hopes.)
Listserv owners, don't fret, I will send an appropriate signoff
to the listserv(s) on Wednesday.
Hope to be back on line soon. It's been fun, but it is time to
go on from here.
sla\n leat,
fj..
- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Franklin R. Jones
who once said,
(ok, more than once.)
"If we are not supposed to play with words...
then why do we have so many??
- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Nov 94 13:56:27 EST
From: cem@cadre.com (Chuck E. Mryglot)
Subject: finding a cold place to lager
Hi
in HBD 1587, GubGuy@aol.com writes:
> With lagering season now upon us (at least us without any extra
>refrigeration units), I have been thinking of several ways to go about this.
> I have a back bedroom, that if kept unheated reaches temps of ~50 deg in the
>coldest part of winter. That would seem to be OK for the primary (?, I
>re .............
If you have a basement in your house maybe you can do what I do. First, during
the cold weather months my basement is usually always around 55 degrees F. I
have a bulkhead (with a basement door) to exit the basement and stairs that
lead outside to ground level. At the bottom of the bulkhead (eg, outside the
basement door and inside the bulkhead door) it never gets below freezing. So,
in subfreezing weather in stays around 34 degrees or so... perfect for
lagering. This is my 20th century interpretation of monks lagering in the
Bavarian Alps ;-)
cheers,
ChuckM...
Framingham, MA
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Nov 1994 13:15:03 -0500
From: davidc@interaccess.com (David Cutkosky)
Subject: Seperating the hot/cold break from your wort?
What is the best way to remove the hot/cold break from one's wort? A brewing
buddy of mine and my self have two completely different brewing setups and
we are wondering about the effectiveness of our trub removal proceedures.
He has a stainless steel pot and does extract brews. After boiling he will
chill down with an immersion chiller and add the full pot, straining the
hops, to a glass carboy. He then sparges the hops with cool water, filling
the vessel. He uses only whole hops for his brewing. He will let this sit
for several hours to overnight allowing the break material to collect on the
bottom of this vessel. He will then siphon off the top of this into his
primary fermentor and pitch. His worry is that he is loosing a lot of the
heavier sugars in the break material he left behind. He has taken a specific
gravity of the wort at the bottom of this vessel and found it to be in the
1.080 area, on a wort of around 1.050. Is he losing a lot of fermentable
sugars in the trub he is leaving behind?
I'm an all grain brewer with converted keg and drain valve mounted on the
side of the keg at the bottom of the straight side of the keg. After boiling
I immediatly chill the wort to `80F and swirl. I let this sit 20 min. and
drain from the valve to my primary, leaving the trub behind in the keg. I
lose about 1-3 qts of liquid/break in the keg. I usually use hop pellets for
bittering and whole hops for flavor/aroma.
Does anyone see a problem with either of these methods? Are there
advantages/disadvantages to either of these? Private E-mail is fine but this
may be of general interest to the list. Would it be more advantageous for me
to move to a counter flow chiller if I am going to be using the keg setup?
- --
David, St. Charles, IL
(West of Chicago) Dammit Jim, I'm a homebrewer
davidc@interaccess.com not a doctor!
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Nov 1994 13:20:43 -0500
From: derk@psp.att.com (David Korb)
Subject: NEW POLICY NOTE???????
Anybody else see a problem here??? This is starting to get old.
>******************************************************************
>* NEW POLICY NOTE: Due to the incredible volume of bouncing mail,
>* I am going to have to start removing addresses from the list
>* that cause ongoing problems. In particular, if your mailbox
>* is full or your account over quota, and this results in bounced
>* mail, your address will be removed from the list after a few days.
>*
>* If you use a 'vacation' program, please be sure that it only
>* sends a automated reply to homebrew-request *once*. If I get
>* more than one, then I'll delete your address from the list.
>******************************************************************
>Date: 26 Nov 1994 01:23:12 -0000
>From: Gateway@foxmail.gfc.edu (Gateway)
>Subject: NDN: Homebrew Digest #1589 (November 26, 1994)
>
>Sorry. Your message could not be delivered to:
>
>ymoriya,George Fox College (The name was not found at the remote site. Check
>that the name has been entered correctly.)
- --
David
davidc@interaccess.com
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Nov 1994 14:48:53 -0500
From: Bill Szymczak <wszymcz%ulysses@relay.nswc.navy.mil>
Subject: Re: Ideal blowoff experiment
A few issues ago Al Korzonas commented on my experiment with blowoff use.
>I'm afraid that this was not an ideal experiment. You see, the two sub-batches
>have varying fermenter geometries -- the partially full carboy being similar
>to a short, squat fermetner. George Fix has reported that the effect of
>fermenter geometry can be a significant factor for some yeasts as has DeKlerck.
Yes, but it may not be a significant factor for all yeasts,
in particular, the yeast (WYEAST 1056) that I used for my test.
Of course my experiment didn't prove anything - it is simply a data point,
however, I believe it is valid since both beers were nearly identical.
If the batches came out differently, then the differences could be
explained by either the use of the blowoff, or the difference in fermenter
geometry, or the difference in fermentation time. Since the results
were the same, either none of these issues had an effect,
or some combination of the three cancelled eachother
out (which seems unlikely). By the way, both batches had very good
head retention.
Bill Szymczak wszymcz@relay.nswc.navy.mil
Gaithersburg, MD.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Nov 94 12:41:00 PST
From: "Vandermey, John" <JAVANDER@p06.dasd.honeywell.com>
Subject: Minimal blowoff
Jeff Renner wrote:
< I once had enough negative pressure in my
<fermenter (additional O2 absorbtion or cooling) to pull a little chlorine
<water into the beer. Believe me, once is enough! I fermented it out,
<but the chloro-phenolic flavor ruined the beer.
This is why I started using Vodka in my air-locks! It's been working real
well.
John
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Nov 94 11:51:09 PST
From: "Alan L. Edwards" <ale@cisco.com>
Subject: Re: Kegs to Bottles
In HBD #1586, dsetser@nttfsrv.gsfc.nasa.gov,
Dave Setser wrote:
| I've just purchased all the equipment necessary for kegging my homebrew,
| and love the convenience. The one problem that I've encountered is
| that of bringing samples to club meetings, friends, etc. Does anyone
| know of a method whereby I can condition my beer in the keg, and then
| use the keg to fill a limited number of bottles? Common sense tells
| me that if I just dispense to the bottle and cap it, I'll have problems.
| I'd appreciate any response - the more detailed, the better. Thanks
| in advance!
This was one of the problems that made me reluctant to switch to kegging.
The other one was cost. The mixed reviews and expense of counter-pressure
bottle fillers didn't help any either. But my dislike of bottling
eventually won out.
Now I keg all of my beers; and when I want to give some away, or take
some to a party, I fill plastic PETE bottles and recarbonate the beer on
the spot with a wonderful new thing called "The Carbonator". (I think
that's what it's called.) It's an attachment that screws onto any PETE
bottle--like the kind soda comes in--and has a ball-lock fitting for
your CO2 hose.
I have a pin-lock CO2 system, but bought an extra ball-lock connector
just for this purpose. I've got the kind of connectors that screw onto
a seperate barbed hose fitting (which stays clamped to the hose
permanently), making it VERY easy to switch between ball-lock and pin-lock.
There are several good points to this method. One is that you can get
PETE bottles in many different sizes from 16 oz to 2 liters. The 16 oz
size is especially useful for giving a "bottle" of beer to a friend. I
got a bunch of those by buying "Sam's Choice" soda at my local WalMart.
Another good point is that with practice, you can acheive the right
carbonation level on the spot, without regard to the carbonation level
that the beer was at when you started. Just fill the container (give
yourself plenty of headspace) and apply 25-35 pounds of CO2 (depending
on the temperature of the beer) and shake it vigorously. This over-
carbonates the beer slightly to make up for the fact that you will be
capping the beer at room pressure. Then wait for the foam to subside
and very slowly release the pressure. Put the plastic screw cap back
on the bottle and you're done.
Yet another GREAT point is that, if you are going to drink the beer
within a couple of weeks of bottling you don't have to worry about
sanitizing the bottles! Just make sure they are clean. (The beer will
keep even longer if it's refridgerated.)
I also use this method to taste unfinished beer by siphoning some off
into a small PETE bottle, chilling it and carbonating it. This gives me
a much better idea of how the beer is progressing than tasting it warm
and flat.
This is also a great way of turning KoolAid into soda pop (in 2 liter
bottles); or of turning any soda syrup that you may have inheirited with
your kegs into soda-pop.
This sort of ended up sounding like a commercial. I'm sorry. (I have
no affiliation with the makers of the gizmo in question.) While I'm
sounding like a commercial, I must warn everyone that you should NEVER
force carbonate anything in glass containers. Also, the makers of the
gizmo say that you shouldn't go over 40 pounds on PETE bottles.
Have fun,
-Alan
Alan L. Edwards ale@cisco.com | |
Systems Administrator Cisco Systems Inc ||| |||
Engineering Computer Services (ECS) 408-526-5283 ..|||||||..|||||||..
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Nov 94 14:49:48 TZ
From: Daniel Cook <dancook@microsoft.com>
Subject: Chalky buildup in brewpot
Greetings,
I have now made 4 all-grain batches in a brewpot
of enamel-on-steel. I am getting a buildup of white
on the bottom of the pot (inside). I suspect it is
a.) the pot is being oxidized somehow and the pot metal itself
is turning color
b.) The water in my home has some chemicals in it that are bonding
to the pot
c.) some residue from using my brewpot for mashing, sparging, boiling,
and cooling
I can wipe the spots with a damp cloth, which seems to clean the
pot, but after the water dries, the bottom of pot turns white again.
The white spots
are typically in the shape of my electric stove burners, so I can only
assume it has something to do with them.
By the way, I boil on an electric stove, and have to cover two burners
in order to get my wort boiling. Once I actually melted some of the enamel,
but I don't think this is related.
Any ideas on what this buildup is?
Dan Cook
dancook@microsoft.com
------------------------------
Date: 28 Nov 1994 16:02:40 U
From: "Palmer.John" <palmer@ssdgwy.mdc.com>
Subject: Blow Off Beginners / Heat transfer.
Hi Group,
Back from vacation, getting caught up.
Thomas asked about HSA and why I didnt mention blowoff tubes in my How To Brew
Your First Beer document. I think Phil Gravel answered the HSA question. To
repeat, the goal is to prevent off-flavors from oxidation by avoiding aeration
when the wort is Hot ie. reactive, above 80F.
I didnt mention the 1.25in blowoff hoses and the blowoff method because the
document is oriented to first time brewers using the big plastic buckets for
which this usually isnt a problem. Plus, I assume that further reading would
educate users to use those big tubes with carboys. That's why I didnt bother
mentioning it. I wanted to stick to the basics, despite my tendency to ramble
into details and tangents. I use the blowoff tubes myself, but in a 6.5 gal
carboy where blowoff is not a problem, but just in case...
**
Rich Larsen asked about heat transfer of type 403 stainless kegs (sic). Its
304, btw. Anyway, here are some numbers. IMO, I dont think an externally
mounted sensor would be effective (numbers aside) because of the known
differentials within the mash. If you had a constant stirring mechanism then
the wall temperature would better reflect the general internal temperature, but
I think you would still find that there would be a difference. Bummer, its a
nice idea.
Here are the numbers:
304 stainless steel 9.4 BTU/hr*ft*F (at 212F)
3003 aluminum alloy 90-104 BTU/hr*ft*F (at 75F)
C11000 copper (99.95%) 224 BTU/hr*ft*F (at 68F)
(Multiply by 1.73 to convert to W/m*K)
Note the order-of-magnitude difference. Pity I dont have a number for enameled
steel to round it out. Because 304 heat transfer # is so low, I would expect to
see (and in fact have felt) a large gradient from the lower wall near the
burner, to the upper wall near the handles.
Anyone watch Bill Nye the Science Guy? Good Program. :)
John J. Palmer - Metallurgist for MDA-SSD M&P
palmer@ssdgwy.mdc.com Huntington Beach, California
*Metallurgist's NECK to relieve Stress*
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Nov 1994 20:00:15 -0500
From: TWideman@aol.com
Subject: Use of Sparkolloids
A question for all:
In the past, at the recommendation of the owner of a homebrew shop I used to
frequent, I have used Sparkolloids in some of my brews for clarification. It
seems to reduce chill haze, at the possible cost of some head retention (I
base this on some brews without Sparkolloids). The recommended amount was
1/2 tsp in a 5 gal. batch, added 15 minutes before the end of the boil.
Getting further into this fine art, and while doing some reading, I realized
that none of the books I have (TNCJOHB/Papazian, Handbook/Miller, and Brewing
Science/Fix) mention Sparkolloids and its use. This leads me to wonder: WHAT
IS IT?
I would appreciate any information anyone may have about Sparkolloids -- what
it is, what it does, and any other useful tidbits.
TIA for your feedback.
Cheers,
Tom Wideman
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
/
| \ / / * * * * * * * * * * * |
\\\' , / // * Thomas A. Wideman *
| \\\//, _/ //, * American Eagle * |
\_-//' / //<, * *
| \ /// <//` * TWideman@aol.com * |
/ >> \\\`__/_ * * * * * * * * * * *
| /,)-^>> _\` \\\ |
(/ \\ //\\ "Aloft, we are
| // _//\\\\ not lost, but found." |
((` (( -- Ernest K. Gann
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
------------------------------
Date: 28 Nov 94 20:59:12 EST
From: Timothy Thomas <71674.3330@compuserve.com>
Subject: Brew & Sweat 95 1.1
O.K. Everyone get out your Franklin planners and mark off the weekend of Aug.
11-12th
for the 5th Annual Cincinnati Bloatarian Beer & Sweat ... The ONLY ALL KEG
A.H.A.sanctioned
contest .The last Brew & Sweat had 50 kegs entered in the the contest and lots
more kegs (and bottles) on ice for sampling by over 200 attendees. If you were
there last time, or know someone who was, you'll want to make plans to be at the
DrawBridge Estate in 95. The 95 Brew & Sweat is now in the planning stages, so
start working on your best keg rescipes, 1995 Brew & Sweat will be bigger then
ever.
The tenative schedule so far (it's still early; this is written in mud, and any
input is welcome):
FRIDAY NIGHT: DINNER AND BEER TASTING WITH (INSERT BIG NAME HERE)
We're still in the EARLY stages here ... any volunteers
out there..??
Charlie, Pete, Jim, ect. ... anyone want to be in town for the
weekend ??
Plus this will be your last chance to bribe the judges giving the
Sat.
beer judge test.
SAT. MORNING: BEER JUDGE TEST... we did this last time ..most people who took
the
beer judge test passed ; so start studying.
SAT. DAY : MICRO\BREWERY TOURS .... LUNCH WITH (INSERT BIG NAME)
KEGGING WORKSHOP ..... BEER SPONSOR TRADE SHOW....
SAT. P.M. : BREW & SWEAT ALL KEG CONTEST.... JUDGE POINTS AWARDED
TO ALL JUDGES .... BIG PRIZES... DOOR PRIZES TILL THE WEE
HOURS.... TONS OF FUN HAD BY ALL... LATE NITE YODELING
AT THE MOON POOLSIDE (Per Dan Listermann, please bring your
own Lederhosen) ..Plus NAME THAT YEAST floating in the Pool...
Yes there will be a tent (sponsor tent?) this year, in case it
rains again.
For more info, to be put on the mailing list, or to give some idea input call of
email:
Tim "TBird" Thomas
Event Coodinator (O.K. I was the first to raise my hand)
cis 71674,3330
(513) 221-3388 9-5 days
(606) 291-4843 6-9 nites
Kevin Bowler
Beer Judge Coodinator
(still need a few more judges to give the test and\or judge the contest)
(513) 522-8013 6-9 nites
Robert Pinkerton
Prize\Sponsor Coodinator
(We're still looking for more sponsors & prizes)
(513) 459-1046 9-5 days
The 5th Annual Cincinnati Bloatarian All Keg Brew & Sweat
Aug. 11-12 1995
Held at DrawBridge Estate, Ft. Wright, Ky
Right next door to Oldenberg Brewery, just 5 mins. from downtown
Cincinnati, just 5 mins. from airport, just off of I-75/71
For rooms call : (606) 341-2800
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Nov 1994 21:11:46 -0500
From: MiniUniTnk@aol.com
Subject: Beer only foams once
In the "blowoff" thread, I made a statement concerning re-use of head forming
proteins. There have been several requests offline for references, expansion,
and clarification.
The source of the statement: "Beer only foams once, whether in boilovers,
vigorous fermentation, rough treatment, or in the glass." was classes at the
Siebel Institute in Chicago.
WARNING - WARNING - NERD ALERT
-The proteins (polypeptides) that form the head (or any foam) are the largest
that
survive protein rests, hot break, cold break, filters, blowoffs, etc. and
remain in the
wort or beer.
-These molecules are chains that have both hydrophilic (water loving) and
hydrophobic
(water hating) ends. In solution, they have a certain initial configuration
(shape).
-When excited by change in pressure, boiling, agitation, bubbles are formed,
and the
molecules get exposed to the liquid/gas interface. The hydrophobic ends stick
their
heads into the gas bubble while the rest of the molecule remains in solution.
THIS CONDITION CHANGES THE SHAPE OF THE MOLECULE, i.e., de-natures it.
-The tail of the molecule in solution increases the viscosity of the
inter-bubble fluid,
impeding drainage and prolonging the life of the foam.
-When the foam collapses, and the molecule returns to solution, it has a
different
shape and no longer has the strongly hydrophobic and hydrophilic ends. It no
longer is
a driving factor in head formation and retention, therefore
-Any foam created anywhere other than the glass takes from the head and lace.
Disclaimer - it is not this simple! Other factors such as hop componants,
polysacharides, lipids, nucleation, etc., come into play..
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Nov 94 18:55:45 PST
From: diput@eis.calstate.edu (Diane S. Put)
Subject: New Store in So. Cal
(From "Don" Put)
Hello all:
Just a quick note to let those of you who live in Southern California
know that there's a new homebrew store in Long Beach. One of my brewing
associates has just opened:
Stein Fillers
4180 Viking Way
Long Beach, CA 90808
(310) 425-0588
There will be a grand opening party on Sunday, December 4th, from noon
until 6:00pm. Anyone in the area is welcomed and encouraged to attend.
I guarantee it will be worth your while.
Disclaimer: I have no interest in this store. The owner's are good guys
and I'd like to see them do well.
don
(diput@eis.calstate.edu)
- ----------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: 28 Nov 1994 20:54:52 U
From: "Rich Scotty" <rscotty@denitqm.ecte.uswc.uswest.com>
Subject: Allergy Challenge
Subject: Time: 8:48 PM
OFFICE MEMO Allergy Challenge Date: 11/28/94
A friend of mine has a grain allergy. She is allergic to wheat, barley and
rye but not allergic to rice or corn. She asked me if I could make a beer
for her using only corn and rice. I told her you _COULD_ (hell, Coors does
it...) but it wouldn't taste like beer. I also envision the stuck sparge
from hell.
The challenge is: Can the collective wisdom of the HBD come up with any
creative ideas to approximate beer without making her ill. I'm stumped as to
how to create a beer like taste with no malt.
I've heard that there are some South American grains that people with grain
allergies are supposed to be able to tolerate (quinola?) but have no specific
information in this area.
If we can come up with something, I'll try a 1 gallon pilot batch and let you
all know how it turns out.
TIA,
Rich Scotty
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 29 Nov 94 16:23:08 EDT
From: Aidan "Krazy Krausen Kropping Kiwi" Heerdegen <aidan@rschp2.anu.edu.au>
Subject: Cloudy Bitter
Full-Name: Aidan "Krazy Krausen Kropping Kiwi" Heerdegen
Hi y'all
I posted a few weeks back about a high FG on my Heavy Special
Bitter (my first all-grain). Well I won't go into the recipe
again, suffice to say that I think I mashed long enough to
convert the starches properly, but it is a damn cloudy brew.
After 2 weeks in the bottle it has not cleared appreciably. I
had a minor disaster with a leaky spigot, and consequently got
*alot* of aeration when transferring to another fermenter (which
cured the high FG problem nicely - insufficient aeration, a
problem which I didn't repeat with my Stout I made the other
week, did the old pour from bucket to bucket about 6 times
(thanks for the advice Ed!)). So .. the question is .. does
aeration during/after fermentation also cause haze? (as well as
problems of oxidation etc .. might havta drink this one quickly,
DAMN! hate that ... :) )
Cheers
Aidan
P.S. Oh yeah .. this is a hearty plug for all-grain brewing, it
is HEAPS of fun and I'd reccomend it to anyone, still trying to
get the brew time down to 4 hours, I'll get there!
P.P.S. Chris Pittock (another HBDer) and myself went to a fab
brew-pub and homebrew comp weekend before last, t'was alot of
fun, talked to some brewer "wise-heads" (including Andy Walsh
another HBDer). Chris even won the Stout category! I did hear
something controversial .. one of the guys had been to a
professional brewing course and they apparently said that the
maximum utilisation they expected from their hops was 40% ...
interesting huh! I know, I know .. can't directly relate
anything from commercial brewing to homebrewing, still .. food
for thought.
- --
e-mail: aidan@rschp2.anu.edu.au
Location: Canberra (the capital of Australia - no shit ..
a real trivial pursuit winner!)
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 28 Nov 1994 21:46:37 -0800
From: especkma@reed.edu (Erik Speckman)
Subject: FOOP
While discussing the relationship between krausen and head retention
Domenick Venezia mentioned a post I made a few months ago about possible
reasons for poor head retention with force carbonated beers, saying ,
>This is the first I've heard of FOOP (Foam Once Only Proteins). I'd like
>to hear more about this, a lot more. For instance, what is denaturing
>these proteins? What happens to them to prevent them from foaming again?
>What the source of this idea/data? Is this perhaps related to the idea
>that force carbonation reduces head formation and retention by the
>mechanical shearing of proteins as the bubbles form and break (see Erik
>Speckman in #1440)?
I don't rememeber the wording of my post but I wanted to clarify. I think
that most attempts at force carbonation are hurried . In the rush people
agitate the beer which creates a foam in the keg. The proteins in this
foam can be damaged by being stretched in the thin film of the bubble as
they grow. The damage is not limited to shearing of the protein chain, it
can also cause denaturation of the protein's folded structure. Either way,
the accumulation of damaged proteins could decrease the heading potential
of the beer.
As for blow-off and head retention, my unscientific hunch (I am not a
scientist anymore), is that while the foaming krausen damages heading
proteins,
not all the proteins in the blowoff are damaged beyond usefulness. I guess
you could test this hypothesis and testing its foaming potential.
The assay Domenick suggested sounds like a good start. I would suggest
that it could be improved and by ensuring the beer is gently allowed to go
flat before being transferred to the graduated cylinder.
__________________________________________________________________________
Erik A. Speckman Seattle, Washington Good Brain Doesn't Suck
especkma@reed.edu especkma@halcyon.com
Copyright, 1994 Erik Speckman. May be freely copied for non-commercial use
------------------------------
Date: 28 Nov 1994 21:38:04 -0000
From: Gateway@foxmail.gfc.edu (Gateway)
Subject: NDN: Homebrew Digest #1590 (November 28, 1994)
Sorry. Your message could not be delivered to:
ymoriya,George Fox College (The name was not found at the remote site. Check
that the name has been entered correctly.)
------------------------------
End of HOMEBREW Digest #1591, 11/29/94
*************************************
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