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HOMEBREW Digest #1463
This file received at Sierra.Stanford.EDU 94/06/30 00:44:52
HOMEBREW Digest #1463 Thu 30 June 1994
FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
Rob Gardner, Digest Janitor
Contents:
Wort Priming (DBLAKE1037)
beer king/ recipe request (Victor Franklin)
Brewpub at last! (Aidan "Krausen Kropping Kiwi" Heerdegen)
Dry-hopping (GONTAREK)
Bubbles and such (Ed Hitchcock)
Fusels, stuck fermentation (Art Tumolo)
When to add Isinglass (sp?). ("Steven E. Matkoski")
Non-beer ferment time (cate hesser)
Head space (Alan_Deaton_at_CTC)
Yeast Washing Information Request (Alexander R Mitchell)
Yet Another Newby Question (Douglas R. Jones)
Re: Lauter Tuns & big breweries (Jim Busch)
More on carbonation and head space (Renee Peloquin Mattie)
Date: 28 Jun 94 8:01:41 EST (M.Marshburn/D202)
Wheat extraction (Randall Bowen)
Re: St. Pat's 5 gallon kegs (Dion Hollenbeck)
2nd and 3rd batches, or look ma nomore bitterness! (Jeffrey S Walls)
Is there a digest similar to this one for wine? (J. Fingerle)
Re: Brewpubs in Houston? (R. Keith Frank)
Re: St. Patricks Kegs (David)" <mbarber@hsv23.pcmail.ingr.com>
questions from a newbie (ADNEYK)
Re: Sterile filtration & O2 ("Mark B. Alston")
Oxygen scavenging, permeation (Kelly Jones)
High temperature flexible hose (Mark Gryska)
microbrewery/brewpub merchandise & festival info (Kip Damrow)
Re: Colorado Brewer's Festival (Rick Myers)
Filters - Air/Beer (David Allison 225-5764)
Need source of used keys in SF bay area... (Michael Abbott 852-1959)
All-Grain Equipment questions (John Hippe)
Old style kegs, Beer through customs (Kelvin Kapteyn)
Cooling Carboys (John Hippe)
Silly Question (RONALD MOUCKA)
wort chiller advice (BToddL69)
Brewing methods ("Mark C. O'Connor")
Re: Harvesting Yeast Dregs (David Elm)
Wyeast "Steinbart" strain (via RadioMail) <jhorzepa@radiomail.net>
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----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 27 Jun 94 23:42:36 EDT
From: DBLAKE1037@aol.com
Subject: Wort Priming
When I brewed up my latest batch,I had the need to skim a little wort off of
the top to prevent overloading my measley 3 gal brew pot. I have saved the 3
cups of raw wort (sg=1.072) because I thought that it would be a good idea to
use it to prime when bottling time comes around. With that, I air the
following questions:
1) Do I have enough (volume-wise and sugar content-wise) to prime
adequately? (I am brewing a weizen).
2) I can assume that nuking the "starter" 'till it boils is a good idea to
kill any nasties. Am I correct?
3) Can someone furnish the formula to determine the approximate sugar
content of the "starter" so I (and others) may be able to find out how much
wort to use in the future? I figure that planning on making a little extra
wort at brew time might be a good idea.
I would appreciate any reply as, I'm sure, a few others on the HBD.
Thanks,
- --- Don ---
>DBLAKE1037@aol.com<
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 27 Jun 1994 21:42:03 -0700 (PDT)
From: Victor Franklin <biker@eskimo.com>
Subject: beer king/ recipe request
couple of quickie questions: where can i buy a beer king or similar type
small mini keg via mail order or in the seattle area?
also.... i have looked in the cats meow and didn't see any recipe's that
were Grants scottish ale and alaskan amber ale taste alikes. does anyone
have a recipe? they are great beers!
thanks.
Victor Franklin
biker@eskimo.com
** in search of a better beer **
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 94 17:46:31 EST
From: Aidan "Krausen Kropping Kiwi" Heerdegen <aidan@rschp2.anu.edu.au>
Subject: Brewpub at last!
Full-Name: Aidan "Krausen Kropping Kiwi" Heerdegen
This probably isn't strictly speaking the place to post this ..
but ... what the hell!
Canberra (ObAustralianFact: The Capital Of Australia) has at last
got a brew-pub .. the Wig And Pen. Not only that, they are
making English style beers, serving them at cellar (12 degC)
temps and they have English Beer Engines to dispense them! Happy
happy happy, joy joy joy! They claim they are the only brew-pub
in Aussie serving beer this way ... and it is 10 mins walk from
where I am sitting ... fantastic!
ObBrewingObservation: The English Bitter they make (which is the
only one I have tried so far) had a very nice hop (cascades)
aroma, they get this from just _ONE_ hop addition, 1 kg at the
start of their boil ... they have no late addition, hop back or
dry hopping. I expressed my surprise and they informed me that
it was due to the freshness of the hops. Thar ya go ... any
comment?
Some may remember that I am fermenting a sort of bastard ale /
lager thingy at the moment, well it hasn't cooled down as quickly
as I had hoped and has spent at least a day fermenting at about
17 degC Will this produce all sorts of horrible Esthers etc from
my WYeast American Ale yeast?
Thanks muchly for your perserverance
Aidan
P.S. How come the only feedback I have got from this forum was
when I made a small (and very understandable) mistake with my
mailer (left a header file on it) and got my butt flamed off
(thanks Ulick! :-) .. I was gonna flame back but your address
bounced ... go figure). When I ask straight questions I get no
feed-back.
- --
Aidan Heerdegen
e-mail: aidan@rschp2.anu.edu.au
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 1994 7:41:45 -0400 (EDT)
From: GONTAREK@FCRFV2.NCIFCRF.GOV
Subject: Dry-hopping
Hello all! I received several replies regarding how to dry-hop, and
I'd like to thank everyone. So, I brewed a honey lager abd I added
1 ounce of Williamette hop pellets to the secondary. It has been 11
days, and the hops are still floating on top! Someone said that
they will fall out and sink to the bottom. How long do I have to wait?
I know that I should probably relax, don't worry, have a homebrew, etc.,
but I wante to know how long it should take for the hops to settle out.
Yes, next time I'll use a hop bag...
Thanks to anyone who can answer my question. See Ya!!
Rick Gontarek
gontarek@ncifcrf.gov
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 1994 09:12:04 -0300
From: Ed Hitchcock <ECH@ac.dal.ca>
Subject: Bubbles and such
Erik Speckman writes:
>Let's just say the CO2 bubbles start out pure. That is, they have no O2 in
>them. In this case there is a concentration gradient between the wort and
>the bubble. O2 will diffuse out of the wort into the bubble until
>equilibrium is reached or until the bubble is released into the atmosphere.
>In time, I imagine that this could scrub alot of O2 frome the fermenting
>wort since CO2 is eveolved and O2 is prevented from rentering the wort by
>the CO2 blanket that forms..
Not to mention the fact that the partial pressure of a gas
dissolved in water is related to (usually directly, CO2 being the obvious
exception) the partial pressure of that gas at the surface. Thus, as the
O2 is purged from the headspace in the carboy, the O2 will diffuse out of
solution into the headspace, where it will be forced out through the
airlock. Yeast scavenging helps a lot too.
And speaking of headspace, Erik Speckman goes on to say:
>The volume of CO2 in the beer depends solely on pressure of CO2 in the
>bottle and temperature. All headspace does is allow the bottle to absorb a
>greater volume of CO2 for a given increase in pressure. This will mean
>that it takes *longer* to reach a given level of carbonation with a large
>headspace.
>
>I think reactant concentrations (%fermentable sugars) are at least as
>important as product concentrations (CO2 pressure) in determining the level
>of carbonation in the beer. Fermentable sugar concentrations will effect
>both the end point of ferementation and the rate of the fermentation.
>
>In this case, larger headspace may actually lead to a lower level of
>carbonation after reactant/product equalibrium is reached beacuse it
>absorbs a larger volume of the total CO2 produced.
Which sounds great, but doesn't explain the commonly observed
phenomenon of overfiled bottles being undercarbonated and underfilled
bottles being overcarbonated. That's the wonderful thing about science.
So much of it seems so bloody counterintuitive...
*--Ed Hitchcock---ech@ac.dal.ca----*
*--Anat.&Neurobio.---Dalhousie-U.--*
*--Halifax--NS--Can----------------*
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 94 07:53:36 EST
From: art@Chimay.digex.net (Art Tumolo)
Subject: Fusels, stuck fermentation
Ok, I admit it. I'm frustrated. Two of my last few batches have had problems
with fusel alcohols. They've both had fairly high OG. I believe I know what
happened to the first batch. It was a dubbel, and I used Chimay yeast which I
cultured from bottle dregs. The problems there were (probably) under
pitching and fermenting at 66 degrees. Now I know better. The second batch was
a weizen. It had an OG of 1062. I used Bretek cl-920 German Wheat yeast which I
grew up from a slant. The grain bill was 70% wheat, 2% Munich, balance pils.
I made a _huge_ starter, having learned from the problems with the dubbel.
Over the weekend I tapped the keg of weizen. The aroma was wonderful, until I
got a whiff of the fusels. The terminal gravity was 1018. I expected alcohol,
but not the hot alcohols I got. In every other way this is a very good brew.
I'm frustrated over the fusels, though. I just reread George Fix's article in
Zymurgy, but it didn't explain the problems I had with the weizen. Is there
possibly a problem with proteins form trub? It is frustrating to have a very
good brew spoiled by high fusel levels.
The other problem I'm having is a stuck fermentation. I have an IPA sitting in
secondary right now. I took the gravity when I racked to secondary (6 days),
and the gravity was 1020. Not bad, I thought (OG was 1056). I checked the
gravity again yesterday (now two weeks on), and the gravity was 1030. I should
also mention that I dry hopped in secondary with 2 oz. of Kent Goldings. The
dry hopping explains some of this, but in general, I'm puzzled. I used a
massive starter (half gallon slurry) of good yeast. This is an 8 gallon batch.
Any help would be appreciated. Private email welcome.
Frustrated in Falls Church, Virginia
Art Tumolo
art@chimay.digex.net
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 1994 08:45:07 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Steven E. Matkoski" <sematkos@syr.edu>
Subject: When to add Isinglass (sp?).
Hi, I started to brew a pilsener extract last night and when I opened the
top to the malt extract there was three packets. One being the dried
brewers yeast, the second being a brewers yeast nutrient, and the third
was a packet (25ml) of Isinglass (sp?). When should I add this stuff? I
was going to add it when I rack to the secondary, is this correct? I
added the yeast and nutrient last night around 7pm and by 7am I had a
very good fermentation going. Should I even add this?
-steve.
sematkos@mailbox.syr.edu
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 94 08:25:37 CDT
From: hessc@mayo.EDU (cate hesser)
Subject: Non-beer ferment time
Hi folks -
I am trying out a recipe gotten out of Cat's Meow II for something called Sima,
which is a "Finnish homebrew" based on sugar water and lemon peel & lemons
(OK, OK, I admit it - I thought maybe it was the basis for Zima! No flames,
please - I can't help it if I like it and it's not BEER!).
The recipe says to only allow it to ferment for 1 - 1 1/2 days before bottling.
My yeast has only barely SNEEZED after 2 days. I haven't bottled it yet - any
suggestions on length of time I should wait? I was wondering if the high acidic
content could be interfering with the yeast activity (it has finally started to
be more active now).
Suggestions please!
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 1994 08:23:24
From: Alan_Deaton_at_CTC@relay.aar.com
Subject: Head space
Text item: Untitled
I recently submitted a posting which stated
that the carbonation was a function of pressure
and that pressure is a function of headspace.
I was wrong. I would like to thank my more learned
homebrewing colleagues for their input in correcting
me without flaming my ass off.
Alan Deaton alan_deaton@relay.aar.com
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 94 09:32:19 EDT
From: Alexander R Mitchell <ARMITC01@ULKYVM.LOUISVILLE.EDU>
Subject: Yeast Washing Information Request
Database/Analyst INF SYS
Phone: (502)852-5603
The Yeast Faq discusses yeast washing and Charlie P. mentions yeast washing
with weak acids to kill off wild yeast and other beasties. Would someone
please send me information on yeast washing with weak acids covering PH levels
and how effective the process is at killing undesirable wild yeasts and
bacterial beasts.
Thanks in advance.
armitc01@ulkyvm.louisville.edu "Mitchell" *** Fortes Fortuna Juvat ***
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 1994 08:42:03 -0600
From: djones@iex.com (Douglas R. Jones)
Subject: Yet Another Newby Question
I was looking at my first batch last night (made with only extract, single
fermenter, S.G. 1.056 - F.G 1.014). My neighbor and I were trading ready
beer for almost ready beer! It has been in the bottles 8 days, and there is
still yeast in suspension. Is this normal? There is a sediment forming at
the bottom of the bottle. Anything to worry about? When can I drink the
stuff?
Thanks,
Doug
- -------------------------------------------------------------------
'I am a traveler of | Douglas R. Jones
both Time and Space' | IEX Corporation
Led Zeppelin | (214)301-1307
| djones@iex.com
- -------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 1994 10:02:30 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jim Busch <busch@daacdev1.stx.com>
Subject: Re: Lauter Tuns & big breweries
> Subject: Why use a Lauter Tun?
>
> Would anyone be able to offer some insight into why large(r) scale breweries
> use the seperate tuns? Do you know what the (grain/filter bed) system is for
> large scale lautering? False bottom, perhaps?
>
Part of the reason is that bigger brewers need more vessals. In many
traditional German small breweries the lauter tun also doubles as the
whirlpool. The bottom of the lauter tun is constructed with the
tangential wort inlet, for a whirlpool. Bigger breweries, like Old
Dominion need a completely seperate whirlpool. Even bigger breweries
like Sierra, have a dedicated mash tun, dedicated lauter tun and
dedicated kettle. This arrangement effectivly increases production
volume by one third, since the next mash can be doughed in while the
previous ones are marching through the other vessals.
Think about it another way, if a small brewery uses a combi mash/lauter
tun system, and the brewer is lautering, where does he put the sweet
wort? Its gotta go somewhere. The other issue is in larger breweries
one wants to do temperature controlled step mashing and this is more
difficult to do in a combi unit.
False bottoms come in two flavors, perforated sheet and V-wire. Perf
sheet is OK for small enough systems, and I am quite fond of the
performance I get out of mine. V-wire is something I really wanted
to add, but then I found out how expensive it is! V-wire is sheet
SS, fairly thick, with the V pointing down. THis helps in the flow
through characteristics of the lautering process. The 'V' runs along
in several inch long troughs, they do not transverse the entire
lenght of the sheet.
side view:
/\ /\ /\
/ \ / \ / \
top view:
------
---------
------------
---------------
------------------
---------------
------------
----------
--------
------
Good brewing,
Jim Busch
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 1994 10:35:36 -0400 (EDT)
From: Renee Peloquin Mattie <rmattie@ccantares.wcupa.edu>
Subject: More on carbonation and head space
Eric Speckman says:
> In this case, larger headspace may actually lead to a lower level of
> carbonation after reactant/product equalibrium is reached beacuse it
> absorbs a larger volume of the total CO2 produced.
He wasn't the only writer on the matter. But try the experiment yourself.
Next time you bottle, fill a third of your bottles to the 1/2" - 1"
recommended by Charlie P. Fill another third nearly to the top. Leave a
huge headspace in the final third. After conditioning, sample one of each
on several occasions.
I've never run such a carefully controlled experiment, but I have observed
that overfilled bottles tend to develop less carbonation than the 3/4"
fill which is most convenient with my filler (when I try for any more, I
wind up with an overflow). And the last, underfilled bottle of the batch
seems to develop a LOT of carbonation.
I've noticed a couple of postings which suggest that fill level shouldn't
make a difference. Obviously, there is something missing from the
discussion. What is it? Fellow chemists -- any ideas?
Renee Peloquin Mattie
rmattie@ccantares.wcupa.edu
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 1994 11:54:09 -0400
From: M.Marshburn/D202@cgsmtp.comdt.uscg.mil
Subject: Date: 28 Jun 94 8:01:41 EST
>I'm going to try a Dutch lager and since I can't do anything simply
>I want to take a whack at doing a mixed mash like the Big Boys do. The
>most specific reference that I have (Miller's Continental Pilsener) says
>to use "corn grits". Well, I can't figure out what he means. I can
>find "corn meal" and "hominy grits", hominy being (my wife says) corn
>that's been treated with acid or lye or something to partially break
>it down. Is this what I want?
Gary Rich
garyrich@qdeck.com
Not knowing where you live I don't know what brand names you have available.
In North Carolina and all the Southern states there are several brand names
of grits. Quaker (as in Quaker Oats) brand is fairly well distributed. They
make white grits, but if you can get them the yellow would most meet your
brewing needs. The white ones are corn that has been bleached. Living here
in Ill (no grits) and having grown up having grits, eggs and sausage for
breakfast I much prefer the yellow ones. You don't even want to come close
to hominy which is exactly what your wife said. You may ask your grocer if
they can get the Quaker brand yellow. If not I'll try the MOM and DAD
pipeline for you. Post or E-mail direct is fine.
M.Marshburn/D202@cgsmtp.comdt.uscg.mil
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 1994 09:30:48 -0700 (PDT)
From: rlbowen@wort.edaco.ingr.com (Randall Bowen)
Subject: Wheat extraction
Hello all,
I recently attempted my first weizen which was also my 6th all grain
batch. My first 5 were all infusion mashes using English pale malt and
with my system (picnic cooler with a Phil's Phalse Bottom(tm)) I was
obtaining extraction rates of 28 sg-pts/lb (measured after the boil).
The weizen was not only my first mash with ANY wheat malt as part of the
grist, much less the predominant part, is was also my first use of
Belgian pilsner malt. It was also my first step-infusion mash.
Anyway, I was able to hit the first temp with relative accuracy with
only a 2 degree overshoot and a mash PH of 5.6-5.8 (I can never read
those PH papers any better than that). This was the protein rest temp
(124F for 30 minutes, I wanted 122F for 30 min). When I added the
boiling water to reach my sacch. rest temp of 150F, I misread my
thermometer, thought I had undershot and kept adding more boiling water.
By the time I had realized my mistake I had a very thin mash with a
temperature of 154F.
I let that go for 1 hour and sparged. I ended up with a starting gravity
of 1.036 when I was targeting 1.053, which, by my usual calculations, put
me in the ballpark of 20 sg-pts/lb for an extraction rate.
I used 6 lbs of German wheat malt (malter unknown) and 3 lbs of Belgian
pilsner malt (DeWolf-Cosin I believe). 9 lbs of British pale in my
system would normally give me a SG of 1.050 using an infusion mash.
Anyway, I want to retry this and get it right. I am appealing to the
collective wisdom of the HBD as what the possible cause(s) of my
seemingly low extraction rate are/were. According to Miller's extraction
rate tables wheat malt is supposed to be higher by a few points than most
pale barley malts (at least with his system).
I can't help but think that the problem is systemic in nature but if I
have to just up the malt I'll do it. Is German wheat malt or wheat malt
in general usually have this dismal performance? Will a too thin mash
dilute the enzymes too much? Should I have just let the mash gone
longer, maybe another hour? Should I get some iodine and do the ole'
starch conversion test? All of the above? HELP!
TIA,
Randall
rlbowen@ingr.com
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 94 09:42:47 PDT
From: hollen@megatek.com (Dion Hollenbeck)
Subject: Re: St. Pat's 5 gallon kegs
>>>>> "Lehnherr" == Lehnherr, Pat J <11131lehnh@kcpbldg02.bv.com> writes:
Lehnherr> I have heard from a friend who called St. Patricks of Austin that the
Lehnherr> ball-lock kegs have gone up to 3 for $45.
That is still a very good price. Kegs in retail stores go for $25 for
one in horrid shape to $40 for ones in good shape, to $50 for one in
pristine shape. At the price of $15 each, snap up all you can while
they last. IMHO, St. Pats' was underpriced the last time they had a
load of kegs and they are now in the comparable price range to the
best prices ever around in the past. Still a good deal.
dion
Dion Hollenbeck (619)675-4000x2814 Email: hollen@megatek.com
Staff Software Engineer Megatek Corporation, San Diego, California
------------------------------
Date: 28 Jun 94 12:44:59 EDT
From: Jeffrey S Walls <71134.10@CompuServe.COM>
Subject: 2nd and 3rd batches, or look ma nomore bitterness!
Some of you may recall several weeks ago I posted about my first batch
being VERY bitter. Well, I drank it anyway. After getting used to it, I
could almost say I liked it. I made batch #2, a Petes Wicked Ale clone
(kind of) and after primary of 8 days, secondary of 10 days and 5 days in
the bottle, I just couldn't wait any longer. I put a couple in the fridge,
and popped em on Sunday. Hold the phone Martha, it was goodddddddddddd!!! A
taste of coffee, smooth, undercarbinated (Well.....impatience). I LOVE IT.
I also bottled my 3rd last night. It was the first recipe again but this
time, with 1/3 the hops. Tasted the (okay, drank) hydrometer sample. and
again good. Very light, it's for hot sweaty gulping beer days. just a touch
of bitter, and a nice after taste. Is it possible??? Have I brewed 2 good
beers in a row????? Am I batting .666?????? Tune in again in a few weeks,
Same Bat time Same Bat channel.............
Also, just a hint from a new guy. Don't try and bottle and watch a good
movie at the same time. I was watching the conclusion to Gettysburg and
kept over filling my bottles during Picketts Charge. Oh well, so little
time so much to do.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 94 12:58:46 EDT
From: fingerle@NADC.NADC.NAVY.MIL (J. Fingerle)
Subject: Is there a digest similar to this one for wine?
Hopefully, the subject says it all.
If you know of such a digest, please let me know.
Also, anyone familiar with the "List of Lists"
and know where I can ftp it from ?
Thanks in advance, private email, please.
Jimmy fingerle@NADC.NAVY.MIL
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 1994 14:19:53 -0400
From: keithfrank@dow.com (R. Keith Frank)
Subject: Re: Brewpubs in Houston?
>I will be in Houston, TX from July 1 through July 10, and was wondering
>if there are any brewpubs or other sites/beers in the area which are worth
>visiting/drinking. Thanx in advance for any info! (Send flames to /dev/null).
The only brewpub I know about so far in Houston is the Village Brewery in the
Rice Village area. It's OK, but nothing spectacular. They have five beers,
the best being their amber. I have been there twice, and both times the
service has been AWFUL. For my money (and time) I prefer the Ginger Man pub
just down the street (Morningside). They have 50 beers on tap.
Keith Frank
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 94 13:22:00 CDT
From: "Barber, Marshall (David)" <mbarber@hsv23.pcmail.ingr.com>
Subject: Re: St. Patricks Kegs
I am yet another very dissatisfied ex-customer of St. Patricks of Texas. I
ordered three of the ball-lock kegs for $33. This was the first time I had
ordered from St. Patricks, and will definitely be the last! After a three
or four week delay, I received three pin-lock kegs, and was charged the
higher price that those kegs went for. When I called to complain, Lynne
said she must have heard me say pin-lock when I ordered, and couldn't I use
the pin-locks anyway? (I later learned from discussion on rec.crafts.brewing
that others have been shipped pin-lock kegs instead of the ball-locks that
they had ordered). I then explained to her that I already have a setup
with hoses/connectors hooked to a 3-keg distribution manifold, and have no
use for pin-lock kegs. Lynne said she would send me replacements either
that day (4/25) or the next, and requested that I return the pin-locks ASAP
(Interestingly, I had to correct her when she said she would be sending me 3
pin-lock replacements). At this time Lynne also told me that she would
refund me the difference between the pin-lock and ball lock kegs, and
reimburse my expenses in shipping the kegs back to her. I shipped the
pin-lock kegs back on 4/27, and on 5/17 sent Lynne email asking where my
ball-lock replacements were. The kegs obviously had not been shipped to me
as promised. She finally replied on 5/23, saying: "I haven't received any
kegs from you and I ran out of kegs to send. I will send you 3 more kegs
today, but I need you to check with UPS to find out where your kegs are...".
I checked with UPS, who informed me that the kegs I had shipped had in fact
been signed for by an R. O'Connor at the St. Patricks address on 4/29! I
mailed Lynne a copy of the signed receipt ticket that I obtained from UPS.
It was at least a week into June when I finally received the three
ball-lock kegs, so for the second time the kegs were not shipped when
promised. I still have not been refunded the price difference or my
shipping expenses.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 1994 14:42:46 -0400 (EDT)
From: ADNEYK@delphi.com
Subject: questions from a newbie
Before I ask my questions, please don't consider me flame bait.
I am merely appealing to your collective expertise:
1. Although I've brewed app. 10 batches from extracts, I never see the
"hot break" of flocculating particles. Is it important? How long do
extracts REALLY need to be boiled?
2. It certainly is more convenient to brew a hop tea for an hour to add
the bittering hops than it is to boil the hops in the wort (less messy).
Any problems with doing so?
Ken Adney
Private mail to adneyk@delphi.com OK. Thanx everyone!
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 94 13:00:32 MDT
From: "Mark B. Alston" <c-amb@math.utah.edu>
Subject: Re: Sterile filtration & O2
> Secondly, I have never used the 5 micron unit but the .5 does not leave a
> totally clear beer so I can only assume that the 5 would be even less so.
I think something is amiss in technique if submicron filtration is not
resulting in a brilliant, clear product. The Filter stores 5 micron , high
efficiency product will result in a very clear beer when properly used.
Jim, you are forgetting that "microns are not microns." What some
stores sell as a .5 micron filter are much closer to 5-10 microns. My
.5 micron filter is nowhere close to a real .5 microns. Actually I am
quite happy with that fact. I don't want to filter my beer to .5
microns and my ".5 micron" filter gets my beer mostly clear but not
exactly sparkling (unless the beer is almost completely clear to start
with; which is not the case with my non-flocculating yeast). This was
discussed by George Fix in this group as well as at the convention.
So, all this arguing about what size filter one needs is nonsense
until we get some universal rating system.
In conclusion, everyone with .5 micron filters don't worry about this
nonsense about overfiltration. Filter your beer and decide by *taste*
and *look* if your beer is being over filtered. These blanket
statments about certain micron ratings being correct and others too
fine does not work out in the real world.
Mark Alston
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 94 13:38:52 -0600
From: Kelly Jones <k-jones@ee.utah.edu>
Subject: Oxygen scavenging, permeation
Jeff Guillet, talking about Oxygen scavenging caps, says:
>This kinda doesn't make sense to me. If you take a gas-permeable balloon
>and "inflate" it completely with liquid would you find air bubbles in
>it after a few months from air diffusing into the balloon?
Good question. Actually, as more and more air diffuses into the
ballon, the concentration of air in the water goes up. As the
concentration goes up, the rate of diffusion into the balloon falls
(diffusion rate is proportional to the concentration difference). The
concentration of air in the water will only approach its saturation
level, but go no higher. Bubbles won't form until the concentration
is at (or above) saturation, so bubbles shouldn't form in this case.
>Also, the caps don't work indefinitely. They first absorb the O2 in
>the headspace of the bottle. Are we to believe that still are able to
>absorb the "significant amount of O2" that diffuses into the bottle?
Another good question, which I don't have the answer to. Mark? Anyone?
Kelly
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 94 16:01:03 EDT
From: Mark Gryska <mark@vicorp.com>
Subject: High temperature flexible hose
Jim Merril writes:
> Does anyone have a source for a flexible, high temp (200+) food
> grade hose ?
The only thing that I am aware of that meets these specifications is
brewers or vintners hose which is some variety of chlorbutyl (sp?)
tubing. This stuff is very expensive, the best price I found was in
SLC Utah at a place called "House of Hose" where 100' can be had for
$11.00 per foot (1" diameter). You could use braided food grade PVC
but that is rated to about 185 F. Are there any other alternatives? I
was curious if polyurethane or Tygon tubing could be used in this
application, are there any polymer or materials scientists out there
who would care to comment? Does anyone have any idea what the water
hookup hoses for RV campers are made out of?
Mark Gryska
mark@vicorp.com
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 94 13:17:16 PDT
From: kdamrow@ariel.thomas.com (Kip Damrow)
Subject: microbrewery/brewpub merchandise & festival info
Hello HBers,
At the risk of being flamed beyond recognition, due to over
commercialism, I have waited to send this post until now
(this Friday, July 1, is my last day on the net). Relocation
to Appleton, WI.
If a anyone is interested in receiving the **very soon to be
released** microbrewery/brewpub catalog by "Micro Distributing
Enterprises", please call 1-800-942-9304 ext. 21358 (voice mail).
The catalog is at last being printed this week!!!
The catalog features glassware, steins, t-shirts, hats, etc, from
34 micro's as well as limited festival merchandise. New merchandise
is being added all the time.
MDE also prints glassware and t-shirts for breweries, festivals, and
homebrew clubs.
Also look for our booth at the "Lake Tahoe Microbrewery Tasting &
World Music Festival", July 23, at Harvey's Hotel/Casino.
60+ breweries will be serving!!! For info call 1-800-HARVEYS.
The usual disclamers do not apply... I am one of the partners.
Questions? feel free to send e-mail by Thursday.
Cheers,
Kip
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 94 14:26:17 MDT
From: Rick Myers <rcm@col.hp.com>
Subject: Re: Colorado Brewer's Festival
Full-Name: Rick Myers
> From: John Adams <j_adams@hpfcjca.sde.hp.com>
> Subject: Colorado Brewer's Festival
>
> The 5th Annual Colorado Brewer's Festival was held Saturday and Sunday in
> Fort Collins Colorado. 37 of Colorado's megas, micros, and brewpubs brought
> out their best for a day in the sun.
>
> Hubcap Brewery and Kitchen
> 143 E. Meadow Dr. Vail
> Boysenberry Honey Ale
> These guy's know how to make a very nice honey beer. One of my favorites
> from the 1993 GABF was their Killer Bee Honey Ale but Boysenberry Honey
> top's that one. A very well balanced fruit beer that not too sweet but
> perfect! This was a very close second to Phantom Canyon's for my best of
> show.
It's funny how people's tastes are different - I thought this stuff was
awful! WAAYYY too sweet! I could barely drink this stuff, and I love
a good mead. This was the only brew at the festival I had trouble finishing.
The honey was definitely not fermented out yet, I think it would be a great
beer if you let it sit for about 6 months...
- --
Rick Myers (rcm@col.hp.com)
Information Technology Specialist
Hewlett-Packard Test & Measurement Organization Information Technology
Colorado Springs, CO
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 1994 13:08:00 -0800 (PST)
From: David Allison 225-5764 <ALLISON.DAVID@A1GW.GENE.COM>
Subject: Filters - Air/Beer
On the subject of filters...
For those of you that have access to scientific "stuff" (ie. SP/Baxter
Catalog) there is an air filter for sterile air/gas filtration that is
excellent for in-line or sterile venting applications. It is pressure
rated to 75 psi (bidirectional) and removes 0.3 micron DOP particles at
99.97% efficiency. This is a Gelman product that cost $112 for 24 filters.
What good are these? Well...
1) Wort aeration. Instead of these other contraptions that I have seen to
sterilize air/O2 (ex. charcoal w/ cotton, peroxide in a flask), these vents
will do the trick and they attach right to the air line. BTW, there are
also gas dispersion units available that are disposible and reusable.
2) Venting Yeast Starter Flasks. When cooling down wort for the yeast
starter -- these vents can be attached so that the air that comes in when
the flask is cooling (prior to pitching) is sterile. I suppose that they
could also be used for the primary fermentors prior to yeast pitching.
3) CO2 gas lines -- enough said
To G. Fix, J. Busch, and others who filter there beers:
I am looking for a good way (cheap/fast) to filter beer between my
secondary (which is in a corny keg) and my conditioning keg (also corny).
The beer is carbonated in the secondary (spundig) and can either be room
temp. or refrigerated. Is there a 3 to 5 micron filter out there that is
reusable? Will it work with carbonated beer? I would like to get some type
of cartridge that I can use pressure from my CO2 tank to push the beer
through, then can be cleaned for reuse. Do they exist?
All the ones that I have seen are single use. If I am stuck with a single
use type -- which is better; a pleated filter, activated carbon, or a
string-wrapped type? I have seen a carbon type that would do the job, but
it gives no indication whether or not it can be cleaned out for future use.
TIA
- David
------------------------------
Date: 28 Jun 1994 14:39:29 -0800 (PST)
From: Michael Abbott 852-1959 <Mike.Abbott@syntex.com>
Subject: Need source of used keys in SF bay area...
Would appreciate any info on a source of *cheap* used keys in
the SF bay area.
-Mike-
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 1994 17:55:32 -0400 (EDT)
From: John Hippe <johnd@iglou.com>
Subject: All-Grain Equipment questions
I am currently planning my switch from extract to all-grain and have some
quesstions regarding equipment to purchase. I have read the all-grain
faq but still have some questions.
Mash/Lauter Tun: I am thinking of a round Gott type of cooler with
either a strainer/grain bag or manifold which will drain out the modified
spout. Are there definite advantages/disadvantages to either? What size
cooler should I get?
Cooker: I have seen the King Kooker for $50 with 170,000 btu but I am
concerned with the stability of the tripod. I found a Cache Cooker for
$70 rated at about 100,000 btu which looks more sturdy. What btu rating
should I look for? Does anyone have a distinct preference?
Brewing Outside: I live in an apartment and will have to brew outside on
the patio. If I use a screen to cover the grains and then the wort will
I be ok or is this a really lame idea?
Thanks.
John David Hippe
johnd@iglou.com
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 1994 18:04:26 -0400
From: Kelvin Kapteyn <kelvink@mtu.edu>
Subject: Old style kegs, Beer through customs
As a followup to Sean Rooney's question and Jeff Renner's nice answer to it,
I recently (1 1/2 months ago) saw the "old" style kegs with the wooden plugs
being used quite a bit in the UK for cask conditioned ales. Gives ya
something to think about, eh?
Specifically, I saw these kegs used at the Caledonia Brewery in Edinburgh.
I also have pictures of a cellar at a bar in Edinburgh where some of the
wooden bungs are visible on the kegs.
On a related note, while touring the Caley (the local lingo for the
Caledonia), I saw their old traditional wooden floor maltings. The
building was not used for malting anymore, but was only used for storage of
their malts. Well, Rich Fortnum (who was a rather good host, I might add,
Have you recovered from my visit yet, Rich? :*] ) tells me that last week
the whole building burned to the ground! Ouch! Did someone say "smoked
scotch ale"? (couldn't resist :-) ). It's a shame. It was really nice
to see that old building and think about the history of brewing in that area.
_________________
As to getting beer through customs, I brought 41 bottles through London
Gatwick, most of which were in my carry on so they would get gentle treatment.
The few I couldn't fit in the carry on went into one of the suitcases packed
in t-shirts, etc. along with 15 glasses. The only casualty was one of the
glasses. I planned to pay any duty, but never could find any place on the
forms to declare it, and nobody asked. It was *real* obvious that I had
a load of beer as I gingerly carried it through the airport. It generated
several nice conversations with other travelers. None of the customs guys
questioned it at all.
-Kelvin
Kelvin L. Kapteyn (kelvink@mtu.edu)
Ph.D Student specializing in Fiber Optic Strain Sensors (nearly finished!)
Mechanical Engineering - Engineering Mechanics Dept.
Michigan Technological University
Houghton, MI 49931
My opinions are my own. If something is incorrect, or if you disagree with
it, that's ok. Just point it out to me. That's half of the reason I post
things in the first place.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 1994 19:53:36 -0400 (EDT)
From: John Hippe <johnd@iglou.com>
Subject: Cooling Carboys
John Bloomberg asked about fermenting his beer at 70-75 degrees.
John, I have found that draping a wet towel around my carboy and running
a fan on it drops the temperature about 10 degrees. Thus when my
apartment is about 75, my beer is happy at 65.
John David Hippe
Internet: johnd@iglou.com
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 1994 15:07:28 GMT
From: rmoucka@OMN.COM (RONALD MOUCKA)
Subject: Silly Question
Brewers,
A silly one...Since I enjoy the gadget end of our hobby, I have made
myself a bleeder valve. I won't attempt any ascii graphics. It is
simply a gas disconnect, short hose, and a "t" with a gauge on one end
and a release valve on the other. Just like those that are commercially
available. So my question is, what do I do with this? I hook it up to
the gas side of my keg, and I get a reading on the gauge. So? Can it
be used for anything else? What do the readings mean? If the keg is
too full, I get liquid and foam backed up into it, but it seems to be
easily cleaned. Help me out. I've got a new toy, but don't know how to
play.
Told you it was silly.
rmoucka@omn.com
This message created on OMN BBS (303) 667-1149 data
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 94 23:03:31 EDT
From: BToddL69@aol.com
Subject: wort chiller advice
Homebrew@hpfcmi.fc.hp.com
First time poster, long time lurker here. I'll soon be attempting to create
my own immersion wort chiller and would like some helpful hints regarding
tube bending, necessary fittings, best length/type tubing, and other
pertinent info. I have a few designs in mind but just wanted some feedback so
as to get it right the first time. Any comments will be helpful, regardless
of simplicity. I prefer email (unless you think others might benefit) in
the spirit of saving space. TIA. Todd L.
btoddl69@aol.com
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 1994 21:18:45 -0700
From: "Mark C. O'Connor" <moc@well.sf.ca.us>
Subject: Brewing methods
My wife and I have made 57 five gallon batches since Jan of 88. One got
infected and got tossed. 2 were bad tasting, 1 virtually undrinkable. The
rest have ranged from so-so to sublime, mostly in the very good to excellent
IMHO (3 blue ribbons in 2 years at Siskiyou County Fair). Our goal is one
batch per month (we both like to drink a six-pack or so per week). I've done
ales and lagers, and extract, extract/mash combo, and all grain mash brews.
I'm sharing this mostly to find out if anyone else approaches things
similarly or if my methods raise eyebrows or perhaps solve a problem for a
novice.
Biggest improvements since I started?
- --purchase of a 9 1/2 gallon brewpot (Vollrath, William's Brewing, Box 2195,
San Leandro, CA, 94577, 800-759-6025). Boiling the whole wort is a must!
- --a big propane stove from Camp Chef with 100,000 BTU/hr and a smaller
30,000 BTU/hr burners (got it at my local gas company)
- --use of liquid yeast (Wyeast "punch n' grow" packets, available from lots
of places)
- --a refrigerator dedicated to beer
These set me back a few bucks but it was worth it. I'm just a schoolteacher
so its not impossible for the average Joes out there.
Extract:
Boil one hour with hops, my preference is with whole Cascades, usu. 3 oz. I
steep (pre-boil) adjuncts in a nylon straining bag. I don't have wort
chiller so I let the boil sit overnight (covered in a food grade plastic
bucket) and pitch the yeast the next a.m.
It ferments in my closet at a steady 65-70 deg. F for 10 days to two weeks,
sometimes I switch to a 2ndary but I'm into "easy." I don't usually dry hop
'cause its messy, tho' it can be a nice addition. I prime with 2/3 cup
table sugar boiled in 1 qt. water. The bottles go in the closet for 1 week,
then to the fridge. Two weeks at about 35 deg F and we drink. I've had 'em
4-5-6 months later and the "lagering" is excellent. Clean, clear, smooth,
yummy.
I use Wyeast "American Lager" in the cold months and either the "Bay Area
Lager" or "CA Ale" in summer. I've made traditional "ales" with lager yeast
with excellent results. Primarily I brew to my tastes and don't give much
of a hoot about "style", except for my annual St. Paddy's Day Stout (and
I've also used lager yeast here with, again, exc. results). I guess my
beers are "steams", hybrid ale/lagers.
Mash:
I only mash in the summer, when I'm off school and have time to play around.
Again, we are into steady production and an "easy routine." I get 2-3 gals
of tap water (we get good stuff around here) and heat to 180 deg F. It goes
in a Gott cooler with spigot with 10 lbs. of klages 2-row in a nylon
straining bag. Stir, wait one hour. Mash temp about 154-156 usually.
Sparge with sun-warmed 5 gals tap water into brewpot. I use a "solar
shower" hoisted up above the mash tun, it has a nice spray nozzle. All the
rest is the same.
This summer I plan to do a few wheat beers, wish me luck!
Mark C. O'Connor, Yreka, CA, USA
moc@well.com
.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 29 Jun 1994 07:58:39 -0400 (EDT)
From: David Elm <delm@hookup.net>
Subject: Re: Harvesting Yeast Dregs
In HOMEBREW Digest #1462 Bill King asked:
> Can anyone suggest a good Belgian Wheat beer with viable yeast, and any other
> ale yeasts for that matter ?
In Toronto, a popular choice is the Belgian strong ale 'La Chouffe'.
- --
David Elm delm@hookup.net (416)-293-1568
47 Chartland Blvd S, Scarborough, Ontario, Canada, M1S 2R5
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 29 Jun 1994 06:33:09 PDT
From: John Horzepa (via RadioMail) <jhorzepa@radiomail.net>
Subject: Wyeast "Steinbart" strain
I was at my local homebrew shop the other day, picking up the ingredients for a
new batch. The shop owner (whose advice I have found to be extremely good)
recommended I try a new Wyeast strain, Steinbart (I believe #1021). He said it
is another American ale strain, and that it is currently in only limited
distribution. Does anyone know anything about this strain? I decided to use
it, as I have never gotten bad advice from the store before, but I'm just
looking for any info on this strain that is out there.
john
------------------------------
End of HOMEBREW Digest #1463, 06/30/94
*************************************
-------
