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HOMEBREW Digest #1469
This file received at Sierra.Stanford.EDU 94/07/07 00:33:05
HOMEBREW Digest #1469 Thu 07 July 1994
FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
Rob Gardner, Digest Janitor
Contents:
'Brewing Techniques' (Simon W. Bedwell)
Brewing at work (David Allison 225-5764)
Hop Boil Durations (VABoyce1)
headspace/overcarbonation the pressure builds... (pittock)
RE: Q's: Bottling kegged beer. (Tel +44 784 443167)
Homebrew Digest #1465 (Ju (John Dodson)
Homebrew Digest #1465 (July 02, 1994) (the other white meat)
filtering (William Nichols)
Lagering in Cornelius Keg (RobertS735)
Brewpubs in Irvine Cal ("Lee A. Menegoni")
carbonation & headspace (Spencer.W.Thomas)
Burners (Derek Bowen)
GW Malts (Don Put)
Dr. Lewis/Pale vs. Dark Beer (Steve Robinson)
Carbonation vs. Headspace (JRT1)
Re: When repling (John Taylor)
St. Pats Kegs (Ken Schroeder)
Vanilla porter (Tad Deshler)
Warm weather brewing (U-E68882-John Bloomberg)
More answers please ("John Faulks, Martin Marietta, 8*255-3959")
Evaporation adjustments (Terri Terfinko)
Re: yeast culturing, recipes etc (Jeff Frane)
Cleaning stovetops (Conan-the-Librarian)
Rubber bottomed kegs (Kelly Jones)
stovetop cleaning (Btalk)
Forced kettle ventilation (Bob Jones)
Brewing Malt -vs- Dairy Malt (Lee Bertagnolli)
American Alt (Chuck Wettergreen)
Using freezer for fermentation (Lincoln Perry)
Replying to HBD (JEFF GUILLET)
Sludge in my wort (jmd)
HOPS-AAU measurement (Greg Fisk)
filters (Jack Schmidling)
newbie Questions (Ben Piela)
Non-alcholic malt beverage (jassmine s safier)
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----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: 05 Jul 1994 08:09:01 GMT
From: Simon_W._Bedwell@metro.mactel.org (Simon W. Bedwell)
Subject: 'Brewing Techniques'
I have a problem. I'd like to subscribe to 'Brewing Techniques' magazine, but
I've only got their toll-free 800 number. Why is that a problem you ask?
Well, I live in the UK and we can't call US 800 numbers from here. So...can
anyone email me an address or non-800 number for 'Brewing Techniques'? Also,
while I'm on the subject of being zymurgically challenged by living in the
UK, can anyone recommend US homebrew suppliers who are prepared to export to
the UK; I'm mostly interested in (small) equipment/accessories.
Thanks.
- --
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------------------------------
Date: Tue, 05 Jul 1994 18:04:00 -0800 (PST)
From: David Allison 225-5764 <ALLISON.DAVID@A1GW.GENE.COM>
Subject: Brewing at work
Brewing at work...
I work at a very progressive (re: fun) company which has weekly small
gatherings where beer (and softdrinks) are consumed. Unfortunately the
only beer that is served is the typical large commercial Budmilloors type
(IMO crap beer -- Sorry Dr. Lewis). These usually have small turnouts (gee
- I wonder why?) Every 4 to 6 weeks we have a large get together
(theme-type), sponsered by one of the Companys'Departments, where we get
microbrew (Yeah!!!) if the sponsoring Department wants a good turnout.
Once a year we have a company-wide Homebrew competition (_big_ turnout)
sponsored by our Fermentation Dept.(makes sense).
A few of us "fun" people have approached our Human Resource Dept. regarding
supplying the weekly gatherings with homebrew that is employee brewed. The
company would finance the ingredients and the equipment, and we would
supply the labor. They have been receptive to the idea.
This leads to many questions --
Initially, the beer would be brewed off-premise and brought to work by the
brewers. However, we were wondering what issues would have to be addressed
if we wanted to brew on-premise [Note: we are not concerned with liability
issues of drunk employees since they already supply beer at these
gatherings and the company supplies a taxi cab for employees who may imbibe
too much (very frowned upon -- most are mature enough not to get carried
away).
SINCE THIS IS A UNIQUE SITUATION, WE DECIDED TO ASK THE COLLECTIVE HBD
WISDOM ON THE ISSUES THAT WILL COME UP AND WHAT WE HAVEN'T THOUGHT OF.
For reference:
1) the company is in California
2) this beer is not sold -- only given away
3) in the future produce more than 200 gallons per year may be produced
here at work, but not by the brewing individuals in their households
4) what kind of licenses would be required for a company to produce beer to
be given away to their employees -- agencies to contact?
We are interested in comments on issues that we may not have foreseen, but
please do not guess at answers to these issues since it would only cloud
the situation (like the current thread on headspace carbonation)
If this were a business to sell beer to the public this would be clear cut,
but I have a feeling that lawmakers may not have thought of this type of
event occuring -- any help?
Private email OK
TIA
- David
(allison2@gene.com)
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 05 Jul 94 21:59:07 EDT
From: VABoyce1@aol.com
Subject: Hop Boil Durations
Hop Characteristics Imparted by Different Boil Durations.
60 min. +20-40 min. 10-15 min. up to 5 min Dry
Bitterness Primary Some Little Little Little
Flavor Some Primary Some Little Lots
Back Aroma Little Little Primary Some Lots
Front Aroma Little Little Some Primary Primary
Key:
Primary-The most significant contribution made by this duration.
Lots-This boil duration adds a significant amount of this
characteristic.
Some-A noticible, but relatively minor contribution by this boil
duration.
Little-Little or no contribution made by this boil duration.
This hop character boil duration chart is taken from the Rocky Mountain
Brews,
May/June From an artical by Keith Wanless.I found it to be very helpful,
as I like my beer rather hoppy in most cases. This is pretty basic and
probably
foolproof. You'll still need to figure out your HBU's and amount of hops
yourself to meet your style criteria, but if you know when and in what
amounts
that you need, or like to experience hop character in your beer, then try out
some different durations.
I'd also add though, that the amount of your boil has something
to do with the amount of your hop bittering character exctraction. Maybe
someone out there knows the amount of liquid needed to utilize all of the
oils in, say 1
oz. of XXAlpha hops?
HopHopHopHopHoppinggoodbrews
Todd Boyce
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 6 Jul 1994 18:49:11 +1000
From: pittock@rsbs8.anu.edu.au
Subject: headspace/overcarbonation the pressure builds...
In HBD #1468 Suurballe [suurb@farallon.com] wrote:
[snip!]
>One possibility is this: it has been posted here that at equilibrium there
>is more gas per unit volume in the beer than in the headspace. That makes my
>statement ,"After carbonation, the half-full bottle will have half its gas in
>the headspace and half in the beer" wrong, but it still doesn't explain
>overcarbonation. If ALL the carbonation in the half-full bottle were in the
>beer and NONE in the headspace, then the carbonation of the two bottles would
>be the same. There just isn't enough CO2 to overcarbonate, because there
>wasn't enough sugar to begin with. And the premise is ridiculous (no
>carbonation in the headspace) so this doesn't explain the overcarbonation.
Before trying to shed some light on the questions raised, there may be a
vital piece of the puzzle that's been missed by all (Gee how I love a
sweeping statement!).
The low-fill bottle may have the differing amounts of CO2 than the high (or
'normal') fill bottle - IT DEPENDS HOW YOU PRIME. Those who prime in
individual bottles & DON'T COMPENSATE FOR LOW-FILL, those who DO
COMPENSATE, & those who PRIME IN THEIR BOTTLING BUCKET. I present to you a
can of worms...
Is it possible that people who have different experiences with
under/over/normal carb., also have different priming styles?
Back to Suurballe's questions:
>I'm confused by this whole thing, so maybe you could answer two question's:
>1) How was the over-carbonation of a low-fill bottle perceived?
I can see that at a given headspace pressure there is more gas to escape
from a larger headspace, possibly giving the impression: "Gee, that's alot
of gas!". But I perceive over-carb. as excessive foaming in the bottle as
it's opened, & likewise when pouring.
>2) How can it be that there is more CO2 per unit volume in beer than in the
>headspace? How much more is there?
I really shouldn't attempt this one, given that I've previously displayed
my lack of a firm grip on pressure vs. amounts vs. solubility (Thanks
Cushing Hamlen for pointing that out!) But I will say this:
CO2 - very soluble?
|\___/\___ ___________
Chris Pittock 06)2495099 | o \ /No-one saw \
pittock@rsbs0.anu.edu.au | -------- /\ me do it../
PO Box 475 Canberra City | _________/ \_________/
ACT 2601 Australia. |/
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 6 Jul 1994 10:18:05 +0000
From: Brian Gowland <B.Gowland@rhbnc.ac.uk> (Tel +44 784 443167)
Subject: RE: Q's: Bottling kegged beer.
- -----Multi-Part-Message-Level-1-1-19019
In HBD 1468, Jack Skeels <0004310587@mcimail.com> writes:
>
> [Snip]
>
> 1) I have some beer left in a Sanke keg that I would like to bottle. It
> is at 10-12 PSI. How do I bottle this? Do I add a little priming sugar,
> or might I overcarbonate and then bottle?
I would say that there is a risk of exploding bottles if you prime. It
sounds like this is the end of a matured batch as you say you have some beer
"left in a keg" and so priming should be unneccessary anyway.
Brian
- -----Multi-Part-Message-Level-1-1-19019
|
|
| Brian Gowland Computer Centre
| Microcomputer Support Analyst Royal Holloway
| University of London
| B.Gowland@rhbnc.ac.uk Egham
| Tel: (0784) 443167 Surrey
| Fax: (0784) 434348 TW20 0EX
|
|
- -----Multi-Part-Message-Level-1-1-19019--
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 5 Jul 94 22:32:00 -0700
From: john.dodson@cantina.com (John Dodson)
Subject: Homebrew Digest #1465 (Ju
To Dan Hayes. This is the first time I've answered messages in the
digest... so hopefully this will make it (no big deal if it does not).
> 1. Is the 5 gallon cooler adequate, or do you outgrow it and wish you
> had bought the 10 gallon size?
I just started all-grain brewing with a Gott setup. I bought the 10
gal. so I would have no regrets. <g> Actually, I wanted the flexibility
to someday brew a 10 gallon batch... which I think is possible in a 10
gallon Gott. Gott also makes a 7 gallon. Buy either the 7 or the 10.
I paid $39 for the 10 gallon at Builders Square and will soon buy the 7
gallon for holding sparge water.
> 2. Is the cooler easy to retrofit with a spigot?
> 3. False bottom or Phalse bottom? I've even read that a folding
> steamer basket works well. What do you think?
Very easy for me (born lazy). I simply bought an EM (easymasher) from
Jack S., I removed (unscrewed) the Gott cooler spigot, I forced a 3.5
rubber stopper on the EM by removing the SS screen, pushing on the
stopper and then replacing the screen. To install, just stick the
stopper in from the inside. So.. for a little over $60 and about 5
minutes of work I feel I have a deluxe 'cooler' mash/lauter tun. I read
about this setup here in HBD. It works well and I am very pleased with
the results.
... john.dodson@cantina.com
___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.11
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 06 Jul 1994 06:08:53 -0400
From: the other white meat <falafel@titan.ucs.umass.edu>
Subject: Homebrew Digest #1465 (July 02, 1994)
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 06 Jul 1994 06:55:09
From: (William Nichols)
Subject: filtering
Hello all-
Without starting up a discussion that I'm sure most don't want to
see again, I know that there is a treatise in the archives but I
don't have access to them as I only have an e-mail acnt. Somebody
probably has this information locally, could you send it to me?
thanks in advance
Bill <bnichols@mlab.win.net>
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 06 Jul 94 09:25:03 EDT
From: RobertS735@aol.com
Subject: Lagering in Cornelius Keg
I need a little help in the procedure for doing a Lager- in a Cornelius Keg.
I am an experienced ale brewer using partial mashes- but as the summer
temperatures reach a point where my A/C will not keep me comfortably
in-range, my thoughts turn to a lager. I need an outline of the process for
doing a primary in the Stainless keg- as the glass carboy is too large for my
beer fridge.
Is this the process- and please offer corrections...
Prepare wort according to normal methods- begin primary ferment using lager
yeast in "normal, i.e., room temperatures- about 75 F, after a day or so-
transfer to fridge temps. after fermentation slows to a stop- lager for
several weeks more- then bottle/keg as normal- using residual yeast in
suspension- at room temps again for a week or two- then cool for drinking--
what did I miss? Questions? how to deal with blowoff if I use a Cornelius
keg? do I rack to secondary after the initial room temp starting period? or
what? how long will the fermentation take at fridge temps- call it 40
degrees?
what else?
thanks
Bob Stovall
RobertS735@aol.com
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 6 Jul 94 10:05:08 EDT
From: "Lee A. Menegoni" <lmenegoni@nectech.com>
Subject: Brewpubs in Irvine Cal
I will be on a business trip July 17 to 20th in Irvine Cal, I will be
staying near John Wayne airport. Could someone suggest some decent
brewpubs or restaurants in the Irvine area.
I will also be in the Palm SPrings area for a couple days and would
appreciate suggestions for that area too.
I don't have FTP access so I can't get at the FAQ's if this is indeed
covered there.
Lee Menegoni Lmenegoni@nectech.com
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 6 Jul 94 10:17:16 EDT
From: Spencer.W.Thomas@med.umich.edu
Subject: carbonation & headspace
I've been thinking about this issue. I agree that it seems unlikely
that a larger headspace actually causes higher carbonation levels.
But there must be something about it that causes the PERCEPTION of
higher carbonation. Here's a couple of possibilities:
1. Louder PFFFFFT when opening the bottle. With a larger headspace,
there's MORE gas under pressure, so more gas will escape in the
initial rush when you lift the cap. The gas that's in solution
comes out more slowly, and doesn't even start until the pressure is
relieved. With zero headspace, you'll get no pffft. With a big
headspace, you'll get a lot.
Anecdotal evidence: I opened a bottle of beer last night that was
filled essentially to the brim. Very small pfft. But when I
poured it, I got a huge head (it was a wheat beer). Interestingly,
I didn't get the "gushing" that I'd observed in bottles with a
lower fill. Which leads to:
2. Somehow, the gas rushing out in the initial PFFFFFFFFT from a large
headspace disturbs the beer so that more bubbles form in the
bottle, before you start pouring. In extreme cases, this can lead
to "gushing". In any case, as a head forms in the bottle, you get
the impression of a highly carbonated beer. When opening an almost
full bottle, this disturbance of the beer is minimized, and little
or no "gushing" occurs.
=Spencer in Ann Arbor, MI
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 6 Jul 1994 10:35:56 -0400
From: derek@bex.com (Derek Bowen)
Subject: Burners
Has anyone ever used a propane or natural gas BBQ as a cooker?
Is the heat capacity way too low/too high? I guess when doing it outside one
must be careful to be in the shade or risk facing skunky beer. I suspect the
breakdown of the hops in sunlight we be accelerated at the higher temperature.
Am I way out in left field on this one or what?
I can't believe that I am the only person to have ever asked this question?
I must agree that so many responses would be better made public for all to
learn from the wisdom of the HBD. Many questions posted are ones which I
have often asked myself but never posted. Public replies would be very welcome
in these circumstances.
TIA
Derek Bowen
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 6 Jul 1994 07:50:05 -0700
From: Don Put <dput@csulb.edu>
Subject: GW Malts
>From: Richard B. Webb <rbw1271@appenine.ca.boeing.com>
>Subject: This bud malt's for you
Richard writes:
<Some good info on GW malt snipped>
>If you have GW malt that is individulally bagged, then it has gone
>through another set of hands, as GW is not in the business of fooling
>around with bagged malt.
There is a GW malting facility in Los Angeles, actually it's in one of the
industrial suburbs (I think it may be Vernon), and they sell directly to
homebrewers every Wednesday. You have to place and order on Tuesday, and
the minimum order is 100lbs, then you pick it up on Wednesday in a
container supplied by you. Last time I checked, it was $0.23/lb. I
believe it's a two-row variety, but I'm not sure which one. Also, I'm not
sure if it's the same as they supply to Bud, or one of their other products.
I've never used it (I'm kinda stuck on the Belgian stuff myself), but I
know a lot of local homebrewers who do; they seem to like it just fine.
don
dput@csulb.edu
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 6 Jul 94 10:54:45 EDT
From: Steve Robinson <Steve.Robinson@analog.com>
Subject: Dr. Lewis/Pale vs. Dark Beer
Norm "npyle@hp7013.ecae.stortek.com" writes:
>Re: Dr. Lewis, Mark O'Conner writes:
>
>>1) He instructed us to first master the "pale beer" and use that as a base
>>to create higher gravity and darker colored brews with adjuncts. He
>
>This strikes me as absolutely backwards because flaws are oh-so-evident in
>paler beers. Why would a beginning brewer want to brew something that will
>probably be obviously flawed? I'd recommend something with some machismo, so
>even if it isn't good, you can woof about how it is only for real men, etc.
>etc. All seriousness aside, I'd recommend the opposite route than that of
>Dr. Lewis.
I believe flaws are the point here. If you can make good pale beer, you can
make good beer in any style. I think most beginners recognize that they are
beginners, and that some experience is necessary to perfect the technique. I
think we insult their intelligence when we recommend that they "brew a dark
beer because it will hide the mistakes." The same hurdle must be jumped when
switching to all-grain brewing. It takes a few batches to get it right, and
most of us recognize this and are willing to push through it. And most of the
recommendations I have heard for people starting to mash are along the lines of
"stick with a pale ale until you get it right, then branch out." Why do we give
one set of advice to more advanced brewers, but admonish beginners with "relax,
don't worry, you can't screw this up totally" homilies from the School of Sloppy
Beermaking?
Just my $0.02.
-Steve
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 6 Jul 94 8:10:39 PDT
From: JRT1%WPC%DCPP@bangate.pge.com
Subject: Carbonation vs. Headspace
In HBD #1468, Dave Suurballe writes:
> A low-fill makes more noise when you open it,
> because there is a lot more gas that has to
> escape. I think a natural reaction to the bigger
> hiss is to assume that this bottle is way gassier.
I agree with the premise, I normally leave about 2" of head space in my
bottles and now leave 1" or less. It APPEARS my beer is less carbonated
*when opening* because of the less amount of "hiss" given off...but the
actual carbonation seen/tasted appears to be the same.
I would also like to offer another explanation (*if* lower fills are more
carbonated), that is: the extra amount of oxygen available in the void is
used by the yeast to continue living a little longer, thus giving off a
little more carbon dioxide...makes sense to me.
Good luck...JRT@PGE.COM
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 6 Jul 94 09:15:47 -0600
From: taylor12@llnl.gov (John Taylor)
Subject: Re: When repling
>Date: Tue, 05 Jul 1994 10:04:50 -0400 (EDT)
>From: RAYMUN@delphi.com
>Subject: When repling ying , reply to HBD, not privately
>Hi all, I've been following the HBD for a while now and have noticed
>something that upsets me. I have noticed that when people ask
>questions about brewing or anything that relates to brewing in that
>matter "YOU" people reply to that message "PRIVATELY".
>PRIVATELY meaning you send the reply to the guy who asked the
>question! WHY NOT SEND THE ANSWER TO HBD!!!???? Other people might
>want to know the answer too, you know! Me being one of them.
<snip>
I would like to second RAYMUN@delphi.com comments about more answers to
questions being sent to the HBD. I too have looked for answers to questions
in back issues only to find the questions.
John Taylor
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 6 Jul 94 08:18:20 PDT
From: kens@lan.nsc.com (Ken Schroeder)
Subject: St. Pats Kegs
On the subject of St. Pats kegs. I purchased six of them. One does
not seal due to dents and folds in opening and is completely unuseable.
Another keg has a leaky "out" valve and it's thread arrangement does not
match any of the other kegs I have. The valve will have to be rebuilt before
the keg is useable. One of the kegs is so dented on the bottom it will be
a very hard keg to clean. Another keg's "rubber" bottom is comming off and
will have to be repaired before long. Out of six kegs, two are in reasonable
shape (after cleaning like all other kegs I have ever purchased). I will not
speak for others, but for me, it would have been cheaper to look for the
$25-$30 kegs I can find around here. I do not recommend St. Pats to anyone.
Ken Schroeder
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 6 Jul 1994 08:19:41 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tad Deshler <tdeshler@u.washington.edu>
Subject: Vanilla porter
> I am getting ready to brew a porter and I thought a might add some
> vanilla to it. I'll be using 2 can amber malt extract, some black patent
> malt and chocolate malt and cascade and tettnanger hops. (Incidentally,
> if the batch turns out well, I can post the actual recipe). My question
> is, has anybody successfully used vanilla extract in a beer like this?
> How much should I add?
>
> Also, I have burned my boiling kettle rather badly. Does anybody know a
> good cleaning method for a stainless steel kettle? I have been using a
> copper scouring pad, but the black stuff is not coming off.
>
> Thanks.
>
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 6 Jul 94 11:41:29 EDT
From: U-E68882-John Bloomberg <bloomberg_john@ae.ge.com>
Subject: Warm weather brewing
First of all I would like to thank everyone for the reponse
to my question on warm temperature brewing. Here is a summary
of the tips:
Keep the fermenter cool in a water bath (w/ or w/o ice) and
drape a towel around the carboy to take advantage of evaporative
cooling. (I'm embarrassed I didn't think of this.) Once you
get to your desired temperature it is very difficult to get that
much thermal mass to swing in temperature.
Use a yeast that performs well at the higher temps.
Brew something that is commonly made at a higher temp. and has
characteristics not easily overcome by a small ammount of the
potential off flavors at these temps.
Thanks lots.
John Bloomberg
bloomber@c0368.ae.ge.com
Mechanical Design Engineer
GE Aircraft Engines
(513) 552-5127
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 6 Jul 1994 11:47:24 -0400 (EDT)
From: "John Faulks, Martin Marietta, 8*255-3959" <FAULKS@bng.ge.com>
Subject: More answers please
I would like to amplify a note from yesterday re the number of private
email answers.
For example, there are a number of requests for good beer places in
this or that location. OK, so private email is good for saving
bandwidth, but I suggest that as a courtesy, the questioner should
post some highlight summary.
The same approach should be used when asking for help/fixes/cures.
Please post a summary of what worked for you. Some HBDers do it now
and I find those postings the most useful.
My 2 brews worth
John Faulks
faulks@bng.ge.com
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 6 Jul 94 12:01:38 EDT
From: terfintt@ttown.apci.com (Terri Terfinko)
Subject: Evaporation adjustments
When I brew a 5 gallon batch I try to start my boil with 6.5
gallons to allow for the evaporation during boil. When I calculate
recipes and extraction points for all grain batches, should I use
the 6.5 or 5 gallon number? I just brewed a pale ale with 9
pounds of grain and a SG of 1.050 After the boil, I had 5 gallons
of wort. I calculated my extraction points at either 50/9/5 =27
points or 50/9/6.5 = 36 points. Any advice on these calculations
would be appreciated.
Terry Terfinko - terfintt@ttown.apci.com
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 6 Jul 1994 09:08:18 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jeff Frane <gummitch@teleport.com>
Subject: Re: yeast culturing, recipes etc
Todd Taylor writes:
>
> I know this subject has gone around before here but I decided to try and
> culture my own yeast so I have some questions about it:
> 1. How is it done?
> 2. Can I buy a starter from my homebrew shop? or where do I get a starter?
> 3. How much do I use for fermenting?
> 4. Does the liquid yeast make the beer taste better?
>
> Sorry but when the subject came up before in the digest I was not
> interested enough to capture it all...............
>
Most, if not all, of your questions are (or should be) addressed in the
yeast FAQ. Question #1, in particular, requires a lot more space to
answer than is available here. Get the FAQ, read it, and then ask any
questions that remain.
==========================================================
Norm Pyle writes:
> Re: Dr. Lewis, Mark O'Conner writes:
>
> >1) He instructed us to first master the "pale beer" and use that as a base
> >to create higher gravity and darker colored brews with adjuncts. He
>
> This strikes me as absolutely backwards because flaws are oh-so-evident in
> paler beers. Why would a beginning brewer want to brew something that will
> probably be obviously flawed? I'd recommend something with some machismo, so
> even if it isn't good, you can woof about how it is only for real men, etc.
> etc. All seriousness aside, I'd recommend the opposite route than that of
> Dr. Lewis.
>
This is one of the rare instances in which I agree with Dr. Lewis, and
it has long been my own advice. I think it's much more useful to get a
grasp of the brewing process by making simple beers (pale malt and a tad
of caramel) than beers filled with lots of different malts, adjuncts,
whatever. It's (1) easier; (2) varying the recipe by changing the
caramel malt, or the base malt or the hops allows the brewer to see how
each of those variables works; (3) it is, as noted, more transparent,
thus allowing the brewer to see what's going on (including flaws); (4)
it serves as the base for all other beers.
Frankly, if you can't make a simple pale ale you don't understand the
process. Isn't it better to learn that process than to pretend you
understand it, while covering up your mistakes?
========================================================
Tom Lyons writes:
>
> I have been afforded the opportunity to receive a large amount of
> brown sugar, as in several hundred pounds, for free.
>
> Can anyone tell me if there is a reasonable use for massive
> quantities of brown sugar? What would be the outcome of using
> this product to constitute, say, 50% of the fermentables in
> a batch of beer? What styles of beer might benefit from a
> (smaller) dose of brown sugar in their recipe?
>
50% is way too much, but at levels around 10-20% in certain British
styles would be well worth exploring. Of course, the *kind* of brown
sugar is important, at least according to British texts. The critical
factors are the unfermentables, which can make or break the beer
depending on how tasty they are. One catch: the only way to tell is to
brew with the sugar.
-Jeff
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 6 Jul 1994 05:47:56 -0700
From: pascal@netcom.com (Conan-the-Librarian)
Subject: Cleaning stovetops
"Date: Tue, 05 Jul 94 13:13
From: KWH@roadnet.ups.com (KWH)
Subject: Stovetops, syrups
"Sometime during brewing last weekend, I scorched my stovetop beyond
recognition in the area between the two burners that my 33qt pot sets on.
I tried a few different cleaners on it - 409, softscrub, etc., but it
didn't budge. I looked through the index of old digests and got a few
suggestions, including using oven cleaner or baking soda. Does anybody
have any foolproof methods that could get me out of the dog house? "
Steel wool works great. Specifically, steel wool that is impregnated with
soap.
Naturally, one will worry about scratching the stove. Without seeing the
stove, I cannot comment, but, in general, stoves have what's referred to
as a "baked enamel" surface, which is resistent to very high temperatures,
and also resistant to scratching.
As with all things, there is a limit. 'Unbreakable toys are useful for
breaking other toys', and all that. Clearly the stuff can be scratched by
a determined party, with a hammer or a screwdriver.
However, the soap, along with some hot water, provides an excellent lubri-
-cant which facilitates abrasion, without erosion of the baked enamelling.
Don't forget the elbow grease. (-:
- -- richard
Law : The science of assigning responsibility.
Politics : The art of _distributing_ responsibility.
richard childers san francisco, california pascal@netcom.com
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 6 Jul 94 11:15:40 -0600
From: Kelly Jones <k-jones@ee.utah.edu>
Subject: Rubber bottomed kegs
In HBD 1468, John P. Curcio <jpc@philabs.Philips.COM> asks about
converting rubber-bottomed kegs to kettles. I have done this; believe
me it is no fun. The rubber is attached to the keg bottom with an
industrial strength glue that resisted my every attempt to pry it off.
In the end, I found the only thing that worked on the glue was intense
heat. Although its a bit environmentally unfriendly, the way to do it
is to take the keg out somewhere where no one is going to call the fire
department on you, and set the bottom of the keg on fire using a
torch, etc. Be sure the keg is vented so that pressure doesn't build
up, and keep some baking soda, water, or a fire extinguisher on hand
to control the fire. Before too long, the flaming rubber can be
gently pried off the keg bottom using a pole.
But you didn't hear this from me.
Kelly
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 06 Jul 94 13:36:15 EDT
From: Btalk@aol.com
Subject: stovetop cleaning
Kirk asks for advice...
If you have scorched boil over on your stove, try an abrasive cleanser. I've
used Comet. A couple sessions of soak and scrub usually does it.
If you have somehow managed to scorch the finish on your stove, the finish
must not have been that durable to begin with. You didn't paint the stove,
did you?
If it is a problem with the original stove finish, maybe you can get the
manufacturer to replace the stove top gratis.
Or get a replacement stove top from your local appliance parts place, unless
you are beginning to like the dog house. After a while its not so bad;)
Good luck,
Bob Talkiewicz<Btalk@aol.com>
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 06 Jul 1994 12:04:57 +0900
From: bjones@novax.llnl.gov (Bob Jones)
Subject: Forced kettle ventilation
Does anyone out there in HBD land use forced kettle ventilation? This would
be something like a fan and a vent hood to remove steam/vapor above the
kettle during the boil.
I am requesting this info for Micah, he has seen some interesting effects
when using forced ventilation, and is looking for other brewers to see if
they experience similar characteristics. I'll not let the cat out of the bag
just yet, and will let him publish his data at a later time.
Happy brewing through Hi-tech,
Bob Jones
bjones@novax.llnl.gov
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 6 Jul 1994 14:11:09 -0700 (CDT)
From: Lee Bertagnolli <bertagno@eagle.sangamon.edu>
Subject: Brewing Malt -vs- Dairy Malt
What is the difference between the malt extract powder we use in our hobby
and the "malt" powder that Dairy Queen and other ice cream novelty vendors
put into their "malts?"
****************************************************************************
* Lee Bertagnolli bertagno@sangamon.edu *
* Sangamon State University "Seville der dago, towsin bus essinarow." *
* Springfield, Illinois "Nojo, demmit trux, summit cowsin, summit dux!" *
****************************************************************************
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 6 Jul 94 07:31:00 -0600
From: chuck.wettergreen@aquila.com (Chuck Wettergreen)
Subject: American Alt
Recently my beer-distributor neighbor brought around a new beer for me
to taste: Schmaltz's Alt.
Schmaltz's Alt, "A dark German style ale", is brewed by August Schell
Brewing Company of New Ulm, MN. The bottle label is forest green and
tan/cream and says, " In 1993 a new style of Schell beer was born to
commemorate the loss of one of our founders." Centered on the label is
an old-time picture of an early (19th century) brewer sitting on a
wooden keg.
The beer is clear with a dark copper color. It has medium carbonation
and a very sweet malty aroma. There is no hop aroma. The head is brown
and does not last long. The initial flavor is sweet malt with little hop
flavor. The hop bitterness nicely balances the maltiness of the beer; I
would estimate that the beer is about 20 IBU's. There is a silght black
or chocolate malt bitterness at the finish. This is not a heavy beer in
spite of the strong sweet malty flavors. I'd guess that it started in
the 1.050 range.
I compared this beer to M. Jackson's alt descriptions in _Beer_Companion_
and found many similarities.
I do not think that the beer is selling very well, probably because
the schmatzy label makes people think that this is a novelty beer; it
isn't. My neighbor says that it retails in the $15/case range.
Cheers!
Chuck
My BBS' software refuses to recognize HBD so any questions MUST be
E-mailed.
* RM 1.3 00946 *
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 6 Jul 1994 13:50:47 PDT
From: Lincoln Perry <lperry@adoc.xerox.com>
Subject: Using freezer for fermentation
I've just gotten a chest freezer which I intend to use for
lagering and for maintaining finished kegs at dispensing
temperature. I'm using a Hunter Air-Stat controller which
maintains temperature by turning the power on and off.
I'd also like to use the freezer to regulate fermentation
at around 65 to 70 F. during the hot summer months (the
freezer is in the garage where it the air temperature can
easily get above 90).
My question is whether using the Air-Stat to maintain
temperatures near 70 will do any damage to the freezer,
since it will be operating so far from its design point.
For instance, will it cycle excessively.
I'd be interested in hearing from anyone with experience in
using a freezer in this way.
Thanks,
Link Perry
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 6 Jul 1994 17:10:00 GMT
From: jeff.guillet@lcabin.com (JEFF GUILLET)
Subject: Replying to HBD
RAYMUN@delphi.com said:
H>Hi all, I've been following the HBD for a while now and have noticed
H>
H>something that upsets me. I have noticed that when people ask
H>
H>questions about brewing or anything that relates to brewing in that
H>
H>matter "YOU" people reply to that message "PRIVATELY".
H>
H>PRIVATELY meaning you send the reply to the guy who asked the
H>
H>question! WHY NOT SEND THE ANSWER TO HBD!!!???? Other people might
H>
H>want to know the answer too, you know! Me being one of them.
I agree with Raymun but I can see a problem with this, too. When
someone posts a "Help! My fermentation's stuck!" question, the HBD
could quickly be loaded up with so many answers that other issues
would not be seen for days.
One solution is that if someone has an answer that they don't think
is worth posting to everyone, go and post it privately. Then when
the person who posted the question has an adequate number of supplies
they should summarize and post the answers to the HBD. This type of
editing should save space and give concise answers.
Another solution is to post a "yeah, me too" message to the person
who posted the original question and ask them to send you their
responses. This works for me, but it won't solve Raymun's threading
problem.
H>I have ALL 1460+ issues of HBD so i'm not missing a thing.
Except perhaps software that doesn't allow for single spacing.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Jeff Guillet - San Francisco, CA - <j.guillet@lcabin.com>
Official Beer Taster for the 1996 Olympic Games
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
-- SPEED 1.40 [NR]: Evaluation day 63...
------------------------------
Date: 6 Jul 94 20:56:00 GMT
From: jmd@mtunh.att.com
Subject: Sludge in my wort
OK so it's not sludge but it looks like it. Here's my problem:
After I'm done boiling my extract based wort for about an hour, I filter
the wort into the fermenter. Since I started using my new funnel with the
built in filter, it clogs 9 or 10 times per 5 gallon batch. The filter
is fairly small and the "clog" is a very fine impenetrable goop. I have
to stop pooring, rinse the filter and continue. Besides the annoyance
of this process I don't like chancing contamination so often.
Other information:
I use both bittering and hop pellots, the latter added in the
last 5 minutes of boil.
I cool the wort before filtering
I add grains(in bag) until just before the water boils
What is this stuff I'm filtering out and is it something I want to
keep or get rid of?
Do I need a no filter, a different filter, or a prefilter?
Any other clues or suggestions.
BTW, I loved the boil over submission. I'm thinking about hanging it
up in my kitchen so my wife can view my spills with the proper perspective!
Jeff Donnelly
jmd@mtunh.lincroftnj.ncr.com
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 6 Jul 1994 16:10:43 -0600 (MDT)
From: Greg Fisk <gregf@corona.med.utah.edu>
Subject: HOPS-AAU measurement
Help- I have lots of hops growing (8 varieties) but I have no idea how
bitter they are. I have access to standard lab equipment and chemicals.
If anyone has a
protocol to determine the AAUs for hops please either post it or send by
e-mail (gregf@corona.med.utah.edu)
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 6 Jul 94 22:12 CDT
From: arf@genesis.mcs.com (Jack Schmidling)
Subject: filters
>From: STROUD%GAIA@leia.polaroid.com
>So, Jack, it would appear that if you are filtering your beer
through a '0.5 micron' filter and getting a product that is not
totally clear and devoid of all yeast, then something is amiss,
either technique or filter size - most likely the filter size.
Not sure whether you are agreeing with me or taking a poke.
Clearly from everything I have written, including the cliche "all microns are
not equal", objective readers will conclude that it is the filter that is at
"fault". I put fault in quotes because even an expensive filter has an
efficiency spec and will leak a certain amount of over size stuff. Better
filters simply meet their specs more closely.
I really think we have beaten this one to death and don't seem to be making
much progress.
>From: Don Put <dput@csulb.edu>
> Besides, I have to beat js to the market with my motor/paddle assembly ;-)
Too late! Just sold the first MIXMASHER (tm). I liked it so well that I
bought the prototype.
Seriously, I used it again this morning and I got something else for that
museum,.. right next to the false bottom.... it's called a mixing spoon.
js
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 6 Jul 94 19:28:15 EDT
From: ben@fcmc.com (Ben Piela)
Subject: newbie Questions
Hello homebrew experts!
I have a couple of questions regarding my experiences with homebrewing.
I have just bottled my second batch, a summer type lighter colored ale,
dry hopped with Cascade hop pellets. I, being the beginner that I am, used
light malt extract (John Bull unhopped) in the cans, Cascade hop pellets,
Irish Moss, Munton Dry Ale Yeast, water, etc. I also bought one of those
5 gal glass carboys for use during secondary fermentation. Now comes
question number 1. The first time I brewed, I used hop plugs and put them
in the boil in hop bags. This time I just threw the pellets in and I got
a ton of sediment in my bucket when I went to rack it to the secondary. The
sediment seemed to be pure hop sludge!! I used the Irish Moss so that my
beer could be as clear as possible, but it seems like it was a waste of time
because of all the suspended hops in the mix. I then dryhopped my last
remaining ounce of hop pellets in the secondary and being the glutton for
punishment that I am, I again noticed a substantial amount of hop sediment
at bottling time. Should I have used the hop bags for the pellets also?
Second topic - my lame first batch. Actually it wasn't that lame in the
beginning. It was a darker beer and I primed it with the standard 3/4 cup
corn sugar. When it was two weeks in the bottle, I tried some and it was
ok. I thought that it was good for a first attempt and my friends that
homebrew agreed. Alas, as time went on, the beer became very carbonated.
Large soda-sized bubbles... it was horrible. I had about a six pack left
over when I started the boil for my second batch and I noticed that one had
exploded!!! I opened another bottle and I witnessed an extraordinary
geyser affect about 1 foot high out of the bottle! What happenend here?
What can I do to prevent this in the future?
Any and all replys will be greatly appreciated. I look forward to the days
of all grain brewing, but I feel I need to "master" the basic methods first.
Thanks much,
Ben Piela
ben@fcmc.com
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 6 Jul 1994 23:03:10 -0600 (MDT)
From: jassmine s safier <safier@unm.edu>
Subject: Non-alcholic malt beverage
I would like information on how to brew a non-alcoholic drink made in
Israel but not available in U.S. called "Nesher malt." It looks like a
dark beer, has a nice body, tastes slightly sweet, and is known as
"mother's beer" because it nourishes. They probably brew it to a certain
point and then stop the fermentation and pasteurize it, but I don't know
for sure.
Thanks for any help.
------------------------------
End of HOMEBREW Digest #1469, 07/07/94
*************************************
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