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HOMEBREW Digest #1173
This file received at Sierra.Stanford.EDU 93/07/02 08:34:25
HOMEBREW Digest #1173 Fri 02 July 1993
FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
Rob Gardner, Digest Coordinator
Contents:
Crushing wheat & Belgian Tripple (Todd Enders - WD0BCI)
Belgian Tripel Discussion and recipe (STROUD)
AB Beer Company (tm) (Russ Gelinas)
Re: AB buys SN (korz)
Electrim Bin (macdonald)
Lauter Tun Manifold (Don Doyle)
NJ Brewpub News (gcw)
re: High Gravity Brewing (Darryl Richman)
Re: Polypropylene (Jim Griggers)
Zymurgy Article Correction (Mark Garetz)
AUSTIN HOMEBREW NEWS (LLDSC)
Spigots, PU (Jack Schmidling)
Fruitiness (EBMiller)
Re: Japanese Beer Club ("Donald G. Scheidt")
re: Raw Wheat protein content (Darryl Richman)
food grade PP again (Ed Hitchcock)
"Belgian Ale" and Grand Cru ("Anderso_A")
maple in beer ("John Shane" )
Home brew mailing list ("Kogan, Michael D.")
Use of Erlenmeyer flasks in brewing (gmeier)
Maple Syrup (Anthony Rossini)
Re: Why so technical? (Timothy J. Dalton)
RE: AHA First Round at Kingston ("John R. Calen - Contacting Systems - E.F., N.Y")
Yeast culturing slants (/O=vmspfhou/S=dblewis/DD.SITE=JSCPROFS/)
Advertising on the HBD. (Jim McManus)
Hunter Airstat (Dan J Barnard)
Blueberries, sparge setups (Jeff Benjamin)
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----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 1993 14:20:15 -0500
From: Todd Enders - WD0BCI <enders@plains.NoDak.edu>
Subject: Crushing wheat & Belgian Tripple
Jim Busch writes:
>A question for wheat brewers: what kind of grain mill do you use, and how far
>(fine) do you grind the Wheat? I am beginning to wonder if my extract loss
>is due to not pulverising the wheat enough. Pound for pound I should be
>getting a much higher extract from Wheat, and I dont. An equivelent Pale Ale
>single infusion gives me at least 13P.
>
Well, as a point of reference, I made a Belgian White with a grain bill
as follows: 5# US 2-row, 2# Wheat malt, 1# Raw wheat. At the end of the boil
I had 5.5 gal @ 1.047 which is approx. 32.3 pts/lb/gal. I crush the wheat
rather more fine (+ 1/2 turn on the old Corona) than the barley. (no husk
to worry about with wheat) Lots of small bits and a good quantity of flour.
The flour pretty well seems to disappear during sacharification.
>Since my latest visit to Belgium last month, I am getting real anxious to brew
>an authentic Belgium Tripple. I though I would consult the HBD for any tips
>or opinions on the matter. My goal is a simple one, reproduce Bruges Tripple.
>I am aiming for 9-9.5% ABV, light pale color, warming alcohol presence but
>not overtly evident alcohol.
>
Unless you employ a yeast that produces sufficient esters and finishes
with enough maltiness, the task is not quite so simple. :-)
>So for say 10 gallons:
>Pils malt to result in an OG of ~18P (1.073/4)
>5-6 lbs glucose/sugar/candi mix (is this close?)
>~20-24 IBU Goldings/Saaz/hallertau/Perle/Liberty?
>Yeast???? LaChouffe, Westmalle, Duvel? Suggestions excluding Wyeast Belgium :-)
>A combination? I would assume a fresh bottling yeast is required.
>
I suspect the amount of sugar is too high by about a factor of 2. For
10 gal., about 2-2.5# of straight candi sugar (if it's light candi), or 50/50
sucrose and dark candi would be just about right.
Yeast is a tricky subject. One needs a yeast that can tolerate the
alcohol, but yet is not *too* attenuative. I've used Chimay yeast with some
success (although I still haven't concocted a dubbel or trippel that I'm
altogether happy with). The yeast was cultured dregs, not Wyeast Belgian
(which may or may not be Chimay). I've gone as far as 9% with it, without
having to employ fresh yeast at bottling (although your mileage may vary).
An acquantence once tried to culture from the dregs of Duval. I
strongly suspect one would have to plate it out, as the starter had a truly
*vile* odour about it. He *was* careful, BTW. However, in a matter of a
couple days the starter had a *strong* barnyard droppings odour. I've always
wanted to try Wyeast European (1338?), but will defer to anyone who has
employed it in a strong ale.
===============================================================================
Todd Enders - WD0BCI ARPA: enders@plains.nodak.edu
Computer Center UUCP: ...!uunet!plains!enders
Minot State University or: ...!hplabs!hp-lsd!plains!enders
Minot, ND 58701 Bitnet: enders@plains
===============================================================================
------------------------------
Date: 29 Jun 1993 15:33:01 -0500 (EST)
From: STROUD%GAIA@leia.polaroid.com
Subject: Belgian Tripel Discussion and recipe
Jim Busch asks about possible recipes for a tripel.
The Trappist abbey of Westmalle was the first to introduce the Dubbel and Tripel
style. Their Dubbel (1060 OG, 6.5% alc. by volume) is a dark, amber-brown color
with a rich maltiness and a hoppy dryness in the finish. A more impressive
beer, and one that they are better known for, however, is their stronger beer
called Westmalle Tripel. This is a very pale, strong (1080 OG, 8% alc.) ale,
obtaining its fermentables from pilsner malts and candy sugar. It is hopped
with English Fuggles, several German varieties, and Saaz. After several months
warm maturation (50deg F) in tanks, it is re-yeasted and bottle conditioned,
yielding a beer of great complexity.
Although Westmalle Tripel is the classic brew, other excellent varieties of
Tripel include the Trappist-brewed Koningshoeven, and the abbey varieties from
Leffe, Grimbergen, Isebart, and Bruges, among others. They all possess the
similar Tripel characteristics of a pale colored, high-gravity, complex Belgian
ale.
The exact recipes for the Trappist Tripels are generally a guarded secret.
There are those who think that small amounts of herbs and spices are added as a
flavor nuance. I know a person who thinks that camomile may be an ingredient,
while Jan Knoop, owner of La Vierge, a specialist beer bar in Maastricht,
Holland, suggested laurel leaves!
I had never seen a recipe for a tripel until a trip to Belgium & the Netherlands
several years ago. There I found several copies of The National Beer Journal,
a monthly newspaper published by the Nationaal Biermuseum 'De Boom' in Alkmaar,
Holland. In theback of one of them was an article (in Dutch) about yeast,
including a recipe for a Tripel.
The original recipe was in Dutch. Here is my translation:
***********
Tripel (2.6 gallon): Recipe by D. Walsh
35 oz munich malt
53 oz pilsner malt
1.2 oz amber malt
10.6 oz brown sugar
2.5 oz light candy sugar
1.4 oz hops (see varieties mentioned above)
0.11 oz coriander seed
0.07 oz dried orange peel
yeast
Procedure: Make a thick mash at 131 deg. F and hold for 45 minutes. Add
boiling water until the temperature is 145 deg. F and hold one hour. Raise the
temperature to 162 deg. F and wait another hour. Hold at 172 deg. F for 15
minutes. Sparge to collect 3.6 gallons of wort. Bring to a boil and add most
of the hops, boiling them for an hour. The sugar, coriander, orange peel and a
handful of the hops are boiled the last 5 minutes. Starting gravity is about
1080.
**********
Notes: I have made this beer a couple of times. It yields a beer of lovely
complexity. This recipe makes a beer that is borderline too dark for style and
I would simplify it by substituting all Pils malt for the darker grains. Also,
use corn or candy sugar for the brown sugar if you wish. The hopping rate seems
about right if you use low alpha noble hops like Saaz and EK Goldings. The
number of IBU's that Jim suggested is somewhat lower than in the above recipe.
Some experimentation here may be necessary for your own personal taste.
I think that the spicing is a necessary ingredient and adds interest to the
final product. Note that it is used only at the nuance level and in quantities
so small that you should use a gram scale for accurate measurement. Do NOT
overdo the spices if you use them, you only want a subtle touch.
As for the yeast, you are somewhat limited to what you have available. I agree
with Jim that Wyeast Belgian isn't appropriate (too banana-y). I have
experimented with Westmalle yeast cultured out of a bottle brought back from
Belgium, but it behaved as if it were a bottling yeast. Duvel is also reported
to be a bottling yeast. I think that La Chouffe would be a good yeast to try,
as might the Celis yeast if you can get your hands on some (they use it for
their Grand Cru). Has anybody given the Corsendonk Monk's Pale Ale yeast a
try?? The range of yeasts from the New Belgian Brewing Co. in Colorado might
also be of interest if you can get your hands on them.
So a 10 gallon batch might look something like:
22.5 lb Belgian pilsner malt
3.25 lb corn sugar
2.8 oz Saaz leaf hops (alpha ~ 3)
2.8 oz EK Goldings (alpha ~4.5)
12.5 grams coriander seed
8 grams dried orange peel
Assuming 30 pts/lb for the malt and 44 pts/lb for the sugar, you should get an
OG of ~1.080.
Good luck and let un know how it turns out.
Steve Stroud
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 1993 15:53:26 -0400 (EDT)
From: R_GELINAS@UNHH.UNH.EDU (Russ Gelinas)
Subject: AB Beer Company (tm)
>According to sources in both the brewing and financial worlds, A-B is
>seriously considering buying Jim Koch's Boston Beer Litigation Company.
And he's the kind of person who would sell. Worse things could happen.
As a side note (heh) for those of you in New England, in the June 23-July 6
edition of Face Magazine, a music-oriented newspaper published in Portland,
Maine, there was a full page ad by Anheiser-Busch about "quality", "natural
vs. artificial" ingredients, and "a major competitor ... willing ... to
slander the entire brewing industry...". Of course, nowhere in the ad
are the words malt, hops, yeast, water, grain, or anything else involved
in the actual *brewing* of beer ever mentioned. Just a FYI.
Russ Gelinas
Experimental Space Physics/Ocean Process Analysis Lab
University of New Hampshire, Durham
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 93 15:09 CDT
From: korz@iepubj.att.com
Subject: Re: AB buys SN
Chuck writes:
>Hey! It's rumor time.
>
>According to sources at the breweries, A-B did ask both Sierra Nevada
>and Anchor (and possibly others) what their selling price was, both
>declined.
>
>According to sources in both the brewing and financial worlds, A-B is
>seriously considering buying Jim Koch's Boston Beer Litigation Company.
Perhaps the brewmasters and food chemists at Anheuser-Busch have worked
so hard to remove all traces of beer flavor from their "beer" that they
have forgotten how to brew real beer. Actually, the fact that the
industrial megabrewers are taking notice of beer with flavor is a good
sign. All we have to do now is to encourage the good brewers to keep
giving A-B the finger.
Al.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 93 13:19:33 PDT
From: macdonald@a1vax.enet.dec.com
Subject: Electrim Bin
A few years back I bought an Electrim Bin in Canada. It's a heat resistant
plastic pail capable of holding about eight or nine U.S. Gallons, made in
the UK. It has a built in heating element, with a thermostatic contol
with a scale of 1 through 10 I think, with a mark for "boil". I have used
it with what I think of as "mixed success" in both mashing and in boiling
the wort. In both cases the source of the problem seems to stem
from the inability of the heating element to maintain a steady temp.
For example, in boiling the wort, it will shut down for a minute or two, the
wort will settle back, then it will start up, and the wort will froth and
bubble furiously etc etc.
Now, the advantage is that, with the portable Electrim Bin, in the warmer
weather I can do mashing and boiling out in my garage, away from the kitchen,
where I get complaints from other family members about the odors associated
with brewing. I love the odors; the rest of my family do not. They love the
final result, just don't like the odors associated with brewing, particularly
the hoppy stuff that goes with the boil.
The last brew I made with it was an extract "Canadian Ale" that had the
target OG, fermented out in primary and secondary as expected over about
12 days total at normal temps, but wound up with a strong off taste that
I can't identify in words, not bad enough to trash, but only good enough
for me to drink, and then goes best with some other strong taste, like
chile or a pizza with onions or some such.
Also, this batch is a suspect in the "headache" department, though I am still
tracking that down as a try a few more bottles.
I haven't kept accurate records, but my sense is that brews I have made with
the Electrim Bin have not been as good as stuff I have mashed and boiled
on the stove where I seem to be able to keep a steadier temp.
I'd be interested in hearing of other people's experiences with the Electrim
Bin.
I have just become a HBD reader in the last three months, so don't know if
this is a topic covered somewhere already in the conference. In any case,
your experiences would be helpful. I don't want to try using it again
if others have also had bad experiences with it especially in boiling the wort.
Regards,
Bruce MacDonald
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 93 13:23:45 PDT
From: Don_Doyle@Novell.COM (Don Doyle)
Subject: Lauter Tun Manifold
I have a question that I hope someone can answer. I am making a manifold for
my lauter tun with copper pipe in which I will make small cuts with a hacksaw.
The question I have is do I make the cuts face up or down or does it matter?
Also, what are the pro's and con's to a manifold type lauter tun.
Any info would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks,
Don Doyle
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 93 09:27 EDT
From: gcw@granjon.att.com
Subject: NJ Brewpub News
The bill (A-2354/S-614) to legalize brewpubs in the Peoples Republic of
New Jersey has passed the Senate (35-1) and will now go to Gov. Jim
(the tax man) Florio for final signature.
I do not know how the original bill was compromised to get through, but
there were rumors of very low volumns, no distribution outside brewpub and
a copy of the Pennsylvania law where a brewpub can only serve what they
make (ie no other beer, wine or hard booze). The public statement read
"The measure (A-2354/S-614) would create a restricted brewing license for
places where beer and ale may be produced and sold for consumption and
would dedicate the tax proceeds to the prevention of alcohol and drug abuse".
I believe the license fee will be $1000 and $500 more for every 1000 barrels
to a max of 3000 barrels. One person can only hold 2 licenses and the
resident municipality can bar brewpubs, but the brewpub can appeal to the
ABC (Alcohol Beverage Control) following a public hearing (ain't politics
fun!).
NJ figures it will raise $22,700 in annual fees based on the national
averages of 5 brewpubs producing 950 barrels each.
Three cheers for the sponsers of the bill - John H. Ewing (he also sponsered
the homebrew bill that passed last year and came down to NJ's first homebrew
contest and had a couple), Walter Kavanaugh and Jack Penn all republicians
from Somerset County.
Geoff Woods
gcw@granjon.att.com
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 93 14:09:33 PDT
From: Darryl Richman <darrylri@microsoft.com>
Subject: re: High Gravity Brewing
Jim Busch asks about experiences with high OG brews that are diluted in
the fermenter. This is what I do when I make Mild. I recently brewed
12 gallons of wort at about 1.068 gravity and then immediately boiled
and cooled an additional 13 gallons of water, to make a total of 25
gallons of Mild at an adjusted OG of 1.032. Caramelization is one
factor here, it allows more sweetness to be retained in the final beer
(and a higher final gravity -- mine finished at 1.011). Along with
caramelization comes increased melanoidin formation with the
concentration of reducing sugars and amino acids. This will tend to
emphasize the malt character in the beer. (Decoction mashing can have
an even bigger role here.)
As Papazian notes in one of his recent columns in Zymurgy, going
through the primary at a very high gravity can really enhance the
production of esters, leading to a more characterful beer even when
diluted in the secondary (or at packaging).
--Darryl Richman
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 30 Jun 1993 00:28:33 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jim Griggers <brew@devine.ColumbiaSC.NCR.COM>
Subject: Re: Polypropylene
In HBD1170, Al writes:
>I have yet to see anything that's been made of PP that is food grade,
>so I suspect that it is not food grade.
>Since we're on the subject of Polypropylene and food grade certification, if
>you buy yeast in plastic vials, check what kind of plastic it is. I've
>seen yeast sold in Polypropylene vials.
Al, Al, Al! Don't be so frightened of plastics. Plastics are our friends. :-)
Seriously, there is nothing that says that PP cannot be food grade. I am
holding in my hand right now a drinking cup (actually a beer glass from
a St. Pat's Day beer wagon) that is Polypropylene. It is made by Comet,
item PF14, from Chelmsford, MA.
I also don't think that PP yeast vials are going to poison a 5 gallon batch.
Even if the plastic had serious leaching problems (which I doubt), the dilution
after several starter solutions in which the yeast slurry is pitched, would
make the concentration extremely small.
>Jim Busch's post reminded me of one instance of food-grade PP -- those
>pleated PP filters. Are you sure the spun ones are PP also? In any
>event, I looked around a lot and called a lot and could not find a PP
>food-grade vial. Why not HDPE, you ask? Well, I wanted to autoclave
>it -- PP is autoclavable as is PC (Polycarbonate -- also not food-grade).
>Al.
So you bought a filter that was marked food-grade? Hmmmm. Mine from the
Filter Store Plus was not marked in any way other that their part number.
Maybe you bought from another source.
Anyway, polycarbonate, also known as Lexan (TM) can be food grade. Cuisinart
food processor bowls are made out of it. Also check out the Superior
Products Catalog. Many, many of their measuring cups, storage tubs, and
beer pitchers are made of polycarbonate. The good thing about polycarbonate
is that it is damn near impossible to break the stuff; it holds up much better
than acrylic, and survives industrial type dishwashing.
-jim griggers brew@devine.columbiasc.ncr.com
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 93 21:35:58 PDT
From: Mark Garetz <mgaretz@hoptech.com>
Subject: Zymurgy Article Correction
Keith A. MacNeal asked why my article on dry hopping the recent Zymurgy
stated that less hop aroma was extracted from pellets than whole hops. The
sentence that probably caused the confusion reads (on page 45): "You will
want to use whole hops as opposed to pellets, otherwise you'll still have
to let the beer sit with the hops for about two weeks..."
I guess there was a typesetting mistake. The sentence was actually two
sentences and should have read:
"You will want to use whole hops as opposed to pellets, otherwise you'll
have hop particles in your beer as you drink it. If you force carbonate the
beer, you'll still have to let the beer sit with the hops for about two
weeks to allow the hop oil to be extracted into the beer."
Of course I wrote this before I discovered that there actually were hop
bags that keep the pellet particles contained.
Also, later in the article I say, "Pellets give a better aroma yield because
the lupulin glands have been crushed, releasing the hop oil."
I'm going to write to Zymurgy and have them print a correction. BTW, they
don't believe in having their authors proof the galleys.
Mark from HopTech
------------------------------
Date: Tuesday, 29 June 93 18:42:13 CST
From: LLDSC@utxdp.dp.utexas.edu
Subject: AUSTIN HOMEBREW NEWS
Howdy,
News from Austin. Texas finally passed the brewpub legislation. All
Ann (big hair) Richards has to do is sign it and everything is set to
go. September 1 is the date. A couple of brewpubs are already under
construction here in town.
New beer: Celis Grand Cru. 7.5 % alcohol. They don't give any away
free on their tours though because of the TABC.
Keep on rockin in the free world
Scott Calonico
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 30 Jun 93 01:01 CDT
From: arf@genesis.mcs.com (Jack Schmidling)
Subject: Spigots, PU
>From: Bill Holman <jwh7k@uva.pcmail.virginia.edu>
>Subject: What valve/pipe fitting for SS keg?
> What type of ball valve/pipe fittings can be used for a drain on a SS
15.5 gallon keg? What kind of metal can be used? Iassume SS would be best,
but what about brass or copper?
I spent a lot of time thinking this one through both from the standpoint of
the ideal for my own brewery and for something for sale to others with
minimum tools or time.
The basic problem presented by everything available is that they are made
with tapered pipe threads. Kegs, kettles, etc. are not heavy enough to
provide reliable fittings to pipe threads so they must either be welded or a
compressing fitting must somehow be arranged.
If one has the tools, this can easily be done by rethreading the parts with
straight threads and the two pieces simply screwed together with the keg wall
in between and a leakproof and structurally sound fitting results.
As re-threading is difficult enough, I have chosen brass parts over SS but
either is appropriate. To further keep it simple, I use parts with 1/8" pipe
size because people are more likely to have a 3/8" drill bit in their tool
box than much larger ones.
My system consists of an aircock with a male thread that passes through the
kettle and a female connector screws on this from the inside. To this is
attached the removable copper tubing/ss screen via a compression fitting.
For detailed info, email for "easymasher".
>From: Jim Busch <busch@daacdev1.stx.com>
>Subject: High Gravity Brewing
>I realize one needs to take into account theadditional caramelization in the
kettle with the increased sugar content, but has anyone done much of this. I
am especially interested in the idea of brewing pale ales of OG 1.065-1.070
and adding water to result in a 1.055 in the fermenter.
As I now have a ten gallon keg and only a ten gallon fermenter, I brew and
ferment 8-9 gallons and top off the keg with boiled water at kegging time.
The end gravity is easy enough to predict and adjust for. I don't see any
reason to ferment the water and I need the head space in the fermenter.
I don't think this is quite the same as the infamous "beer concentrate" of
previous discussions but it is dangerously close. The key lies in what went
into the "concentrate" and if it is strictly Reinheightsgbot, when the water
is added seems incidental.
>From: korz@iepubj.att.com
>Subject: DMS and PU
>A few days ago, Jack wrote about his Pilsner Urquell clone that was
brewed as closely as possible to Darryl Richman's description of the
way Prazdroj Pilsenski (I think that's the spelling?) makes PU.
>Well, last night, I had a chance to try some of this beer. A good
attempt, I must say!.....
>The beer had been fermented and lagered at 40F for a while (I forgot
to ask how long).
Two weeks primary and two weeks secondary and about a week in the keg.
> Perhaps a longer lagering (and maybe if it was lagered at 32F as in
Pilsen) the DMS level would be a bit lower?
I suspect that time is more important then temp but have no way of checking
both. I did bottle a sixpack for tasting in about three months which is what
I recall PU does before shipping.
>From: Darryl Richman <darrylri@microsoft.com>
>Subject: re: Wort Chilling
>While it is true that the hot, bittered wort at PU is cooled slowly in
a coolship, which could engender a great deal of DMS production and
retention from latent S-Methyl Methionine (SMM), one must consider that
the preceding boil is exceptionally long and it is likely that most of
the SMM has already been converted to DMS and then evaporated off (see
Fix's "Principle of Brewing Science" for a lot more detail here).
For the record, I boiled this beer for 4 hours just as in your article. I
started with 16 gallons of wort and ended up with 7 gallons of beer.
> *Some* DMS flavor is, in fact, a defining character of lager beers, and
adds to the crisp flavor profile.
As a sequel to the story, we had lunch Sunday with the Parsons from the Malt
Shop at Edelweis where PU is on draft.
I bottled two bottles of my clone just before leaving and ordered 4 glasses
of PU and two empty glasses and did a real live comparison.
The color was identical. My beer was a bit harsher (for lack of a better
term) and the DMS became more obvious if a small amount was left to warm up
in the bottom of the Pilsner glass.
We all agreed that the PU was at least marginally better but that repeating
the experiment in three months would definately be informative.
js
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 93 12:50 EDT
From: EBMiller@DOCKMASTER.NCSC.MIL
Subject: Fruitiness
My partial mash brews are acceptable but lack the fruitiness of a
Limerick or Brooklen Brown ale. To date I have only used dry yeast
(Whitbread, Cooper's or Edme). Is the flavor I'm looking for yeast
related. Will Wyeast London give me what I'm looking for?
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 93 15:11:30 PDT
From: "Donald G. Scheidt" <dgs1300@aw101.iasl.ca.boeing.com>
Subject: Re: Japanese Beer Club
In HOMEBREW Digest #1164, Thu 17 June 1993, we see:
>From: u4imdmre@cpc41.cpc.usace.army.mil (Markham R. Elliott)
>Subject: Subscription Problems // Japanese Beer Club
>
>Japanese Pay $23,000 to Drink Beer at $78 a Pop
> .....
> Beer made in Japan tastes so dreadful that big-wigs eagerly pour into Tokyo's
>Club Knox, where they can sip beer shipped in from Britain, Switzerland and
>Belgium.
(Bear in mind, especially Markham, that I know this is a quoted article, so
I'm commenting on *it*. No flaming diatribe is intended. Thanks for the
excerpt, Mark.)
Beer made in Japan tastes "dreadful"? Funny, it tastes like competently-
made, lightly-hopped lager to me. There may be some quirky terminology, like
"draft" for unpasteurised beer in bottles, or "stout" for pale lager beer
with a bit more body than some, but hardly "dreadful", especially in com-
parison to some of the American industrial beerlike liquids. And then
there's Sapporo's "Black Beer", which is most definitely *not* dreadful.
Sounds like more brewing chauvinism at work here.
>Sure glad we don't have to pay prices like that.
Yeah, so am I. So are most Japanese, 'cause they don't always. I friend
brought back a bottle of Budvar/Budweiser, bought at a specialty drinks-
shop in Okinawa. He paid an obscenely high Y320 for it - an astonishing
$2.50 a bottle! Yow!
Seriously, the article was interesting, if for no other reason than to
display a bit of good old Western cultural bias ("Gol durn, them Japanese
sure pay high prices. How can they afford anything?"). The average
consumer in Japan deals with high enough prices for many things, but beer
is not usually that outrageous, and imports can be found, often in sur-
prisingly good condition and at not-exactly-astronomical prices. On the
other hand, a bunch of businessmen with a bit of extra money on their hands
seem to have found a novel - and fun! - way of getting rid of it, and at
least they're drinking some good beer - although I'm not sure about paying
$78 for a 'vintage' bottle of Gales Prize Old Ale! On the other hand, those
entry dues sure are high. Not surprising in a country where business
associations often blur the distinction between commercial and social
interests, and where memberships in such associations are often perceived
as being more valuable than gold.
ObHomeBrew: Because of the Japanese quirk of not letting one brew beer
unless one is going to make at least two million hectoliters, an
enterprising importer is selling homebrew equipment and kits, with
instructions to heavily dilute the malt extract, or to only use a small
amount, so it makes a legally "non-alcoholic" beer. Of course, anyone who
actually buys the kit receives subtle verbal advice to ignore the
instructions if a proper batch of homemade beer is desired ^_^.
- --
__ | | __
/\ \ | Don Scheidt | /\ \
/ \ \ | Boeing IASL, 777 Cab Development | / \ \
/ /\ \ \ | dgs1300@aw101.iasl.ca.boeing.com | / /\ \ \
/ / /\ \ \ | | / / /\ \ \
/ / /__\_\ \ | | / / /__\_\ \
/ / /________\ | | / / /________\
\/___________/ | | \/___________/
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 93 14:44:40 PDT
From: Darryl Richman <darrylri@microsoft.com>
Subject: re: Raw Wheat protein content
Al Korzonas asks about the correspondence between JX Guinard's quoting
of unmalted wheat protein at 1.8 to 2.1 % and the reality that all
wheat, malted or otherwise, has more than 10% protein. JX Guinard is
apparently quoting the amount of "amino nitrogen," which is often
interchanged with protein, and not the protein itself.
(In a very simple chemical assay, protein is made up of carbon, oxygen,
hydrogen, and nitrogen. It is the last item that distinguishes it from
a carbohydrate, so the nitrogen content of an (organic) substance is
taken as a figure of merit of its protein content.)
The ratio of nitrogen to protein mass is reckoned to be 6.25, so the
equivalent protein to 1.8-2.1% nitrogen is 11.25-13.75%.
--Darryl Richman
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 30 Jun 1993 06:56:03 -0300
From: Ed Hitchcock <ECH@ac.dal.ca>
Subject: food grade PP again
Since the last note I sent I've been seeing PP on the bottom of cottage
cheese containers, sour cream containers, and other household items. There
is food grade polypropelene.
____________
Ed Hitchcock/Dept of Anatomy & Neurobiology/Dalhousie University/Halifax NS
ech@ac.dal.ca +-------------------------------------------------------+
| I object to that comment! I know several pinheads |
| and they are fully functional members of society! |
+-------------------------------------------------------+
Eschew Labudmilloorsonhead
------------------------------
Date: 30 Jun 93 03:27:36 EST
From: "Anderso_A" <Anderso_A%55W3.CCBRIDGE.SEAE.mrouter@seaa.navsea.navy.mil>
Subject: "Belgian Ale" and Grand Cru
Message Creation Date was at 30-JUN-1993 08:02:00
Greetings,
I just finished reading Pierre Rajotte's <Belgian Ale>.
Great book, but it left me with some questions:
1. Where can I get "Candi" sugar in the US? Any mail
order places? If I can't get any candi, any suggestions
for suitable replacements? I suppose I could always plan a
field trip to Belgium to buy my own 50 lb bag ...
2. It seems like the yeast selection is of paramount
importance, yet the book just talks about using an
alcohol-tolerant strain. Aside from the Wyeast strain, what
recommendations does the net have for appropriate yeast
strains?
3. How do I introduce a second yeast? In his Grand Cru
recipe, Pierre states,"This recipe is great for two-yeast
fermentation. First fermentation takes place with a weak
attenuating yeast. In the secondary fermenter, add a second
wild type, or different higher attenuating yeast."
Aside from leaving my secondary fermentor outside in
the hopes of pLambic fermentation, what should I use for a
"wild type" yeast?
How does the second yeast accomplish its aeration
phase? Hasn't the first yeast already used up the avaiable
oxygen in the wort? Should I just pitch with a HUGE volume
of yeast and not worry about yeast propogation?
4. It appears that primary fermentation temperatures are
fairly high, while secondary fermentation takes place at
relatively low temperatures (for ales). Any comments from
people who've attempted these styles?
5. Finally, just how long will I be required to bottle
condition my attempt at a Grand Cru? With all the sugar, I
get the feeling it might take awhile to smooth out the
flavors.
TIA
Andy A
------------------------------
Date: 30 Jun 93 08:47:11 EST
From: "John Shane" <JSHANE@clover.uvm.edu>
Subject: maple in beer
Hi..
I tried to send this directly to the person who asked about maple in
beer, but got an undeliverable mail return, so I thought I'd send it
here:
I am a homebrewer and (note the state I live in) a maple syrup
producer. YES you can brew with maple syrup. A good ballpark
conversion is to remember that a gallon of syrup weighs 11 lbs with a
solids concentration of 66% (66.5% in Vermont, ...God we're
independent cusses) most of which is sugar of some sort, mostly
sucrose. Essentially, you can assume 66% sugar, all of which is
fermentable. Syrup gives an excellent flavor to all beers (in my
opinion), but some basic advice concerning syrup grades: Fancy (Grade
A Light Amber in all states but Vermont (did I mention that we do
thing our own way?) is VERY delicately flavored, and will be
overwhelmed in almost any beer; Grade A Medium Amber is darker and
less delicate, probably good in most lightish recipes; Grade A Dark
Amber is darker still, will leave a more perceptable flavor, Grade B
is even darker, good for beers with more robust formulations. As a
first try, you might want to consider brewing "Rocky Racoon" in "THE
BOOK", replacing the honey in the original recipe with an equivelent
(by sugar content, not syrup volume or weight) amount of medium or
dark amber syrup. Adjust further attempts to taste. NOTE: unless you
spend every waking hour during spring at blast-furnace temperatures
boiling sap (about 40 gals sap to 1 gal syrup) to get the liquid gold
yourself, this will wind up being a very expensive habit. Good Luck
(let me know what you think!).
John Shane (802) 656-2907
University of Vermont jshane@clover.uvm.edu
Forestry Department
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 93 18:02:00 EST
From: "Kogan, Michael D." <MDK1@NCH08A.EM.CDC.GOV>
Subject: Home brew mailing list
I'd be interested in joining the home brew mailing list.
Thank you, Michael Kogan
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 30 Jun 1993 09:29:25 -0600
From: gmeier@ncsa.uiuc.edu
Subject: Use of Erlenmeyer flasks in brewing
Mike Lemons wrote on the subject of using a 1 liter Erlenmeyer flask and a
solid # 9 stopper in yeast culturing:
>"I use 1/4 cup of dried malt extract. I fill the flask up with water to
>the 800 ml mark. (1000 ml tends to boil over.) I set it directly on my
>gas stove and turn the flame up pretty high. A long glass stirring rod
>would be useful for stirring, but I don't have one, so I use a plastic
>chopstick. I boil it for about ten minutes, put the solid stopper in it
>and set it in a sink full of cold water. (Isn't pyrex wonderful?)"
Pyrex (tm) is wonderful all right, but it is still possible to break it by
going from a flame to cold water too rapidly. I'd try to ease the
temperature transitions a bit, air cooling the flask for a few minutes
before moving it to not-too-cold water. What really concerns me is the
practice of stoppering the flask hot and putting it into cold water. If
the stopper fits tightly, that will create a partial vacuum in the flask,
and standard thickness Erlenmeyer flasks (or any other glassware that has a
flat bottom or flat sides) can't handle vacuum very well (you can get
thick-walled filter flasks that look like an Erlenmeyer and are made for
vacuum use, but they aren't meant to be heated, so that doesn't help).
Better to let clean (filtered?) air into the flask as it cools than to run
the risk of imploding a flask full of very hot solution. That WILL ruin
your whole day.
Happy brewing, Gary Meier
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 30 Jun 93 09:35:56 EDT
From: rossini@hsph.harvard.edu (Anthony Rossini)
Subject: Maple Syrup
>>>>> JORGENS_DAVID@Tandem.COM writes:
>> Has anyone tried using "real" maple syrup in any recipes?
>> Are the sugars fermentable? Does anyone have any recipes which
>> call for maple syrup? How much per five gallon batch should be
>> used?
I made a batch using grade B maple syrup (about the same price as malt at a
local coop food store), used about 3lbs, with 5.5lbs amber M&F malt syrup.
Used the generic 5 gallon beer recipe, except I messed up badly in hop
choice/usage, and it was overhopped. That problem has mellowed out, and it
now tastes like a mildly sweeter sierra nevada pale ale, or (pick your
favorite amber) hopped up with a nice maple after taste.
Some book (I think it was CJoHB) mentions not to use this much maple. Grade
B tastes similar to grade A (the standard stuff), but definitely doesn't
compare well in a side to side comparison (a bit more water and a tad less
sweet).
Don't overhop! hops + maple is an interesting combination, and probably
isn't for everyone (some friends like it, and others start making gagging
noises... typical.)
-tony
- --
Anthony Rossini - grad student/statistician/hacker
rossini@biostat.harvard.edu
Department of Biostatistics, Harvard School of Public Health
677 Huntington Ave, Boston MA 02115 617-432-1056
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 30 Jun 93 10:05:54 -0400
From: Timothy J. Dalton <dalton@mtl.mit.edu>
Subject: Re: Why so technical?
Edward Croft <CROFTE@delphi.com> wrote:
> Why so technical? I get HBD to get ideas on new brews, hear about taste tests,
> and get other peoples ideas on how to improve the process. What I have seen
> lately is more of a chemistry class on the properties of idophors(?) and
> chlorine.
Brewing is after all a science. It can be treated as an art, but
for the best results, you must understand that it is a science
and that things that you do at one step will have an impact on
another step.
I see a mix of levels here in the HBD. There's nothing wrong with
that. I prefer to see the technical side. Theres a plethora of
literature out there geared towards the general population
and not enough good technical info, unless you get into the
peer reviewed brewing journals.
> but don't you think it is getting a bit anal, when we start breaking
> down the composition of the chemicals so as to get the optimum cleaning for
> the least amount of chemical.
Not at all. These are important concerns if you scale up at all.
> I don't need to know how or why.
Fine. But some of us do. Skip the articles you're not interested in.
It works for me.
Tim
- ----
Timothy J. Dalton tjdalton@mit.edu
MIT, Dept. of Chemical Engineering, Materials Etching Technology Lab
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 30 Jun 93 09:41:38 EDT
From: "John R. Calen - Contacting Systems - E.F., N.Y" <calen@vnet.IBM.COM>
Subject: RE: AHA First Round at Kingston
Rick, ohhh yes!! The sheets of the non-advancers are out already. I got mine
back monday, and it's the end of the trail for those brews.
FWIW, I got the sheets back from the cider judging a week earlier, directly
from Boston in a plain envelope. The beer sheets came in the AHA oversized
envelope with a cover letter, a bronze certificate (guess I didn't do _too_
badly after all) and a survey questionnaire.
Come to think of it, the cider rated a silver certificate. Ciders must not
count.
Regards,
John R. Calen -- Hudson Valley HomeBrewers -- calen@vnet.IBM.COM
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 30 Jun 93 07:08 PDT
From: /O=vmspfhou/S=dblewis/DD.SITE=JSCPROFS/@NASAmail.nasa.gov
Subject: Yeast culturing slants
***************************** PROFS Note *****************************
From: DBLEWIS --VMSPFHOU Date and time 06/30/93 09:10:51
To: POSTMAN --NASAMAIL
FROM: Dennis B. Lewis <dblewis@jscprofs.nasa.gov>
SUBJECT: Yeast culturing slants
I've had a bit of trouble with my slants recently. The poured and cooled tubes
look great, but when I inoculate one, the solid wort begins to shrink and
pulls away from the sides of the tube. In one case, some yeast got down in the
bottom of the tube behind the wort plug and when I opened the cap to relieve
some of the pressure, the pressure crammed the wort slug into the neck of the
tube!
I don't have my notes, so I don't remember how much agar I put in the wort.
(15 gm in 0.5L sounds vaguely familiar.) Could my problem be too much agar?
Maybe I should fill my tubes more full so that there is a significant plug at
the bottom of the tube. The tubes were clean, but maybe I should give them an
acetone bath prior to filling and sterilizing to remove any trace of oils or
dust. I'm open to any and all suggestions.
Dennis B. Lewis * (713) 244-7809 * NASA/JSC/DH6 Payload Ops
Homebrew, The Final Frontier.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 30 Jun 93 11:13:02 EDT
From: Jim McManus <jjm@Think.COM>
Subject: Advertising on the HBD.
I have to agree with Martin A. Lodahl's message yesterday, but have to add
one thing. People shouldn't be advertising for profit and the shouldn't be
sending mail off bashing others to reduce profit. I kept quite during the
whole Sam Adams/Koch mail, but what it comes down to is, who cares how
people publicly advertise outside this list. It isn't effecting the way
I'm brewing.
*************************************************************************
Jim McManus
Special Systems Manager Thinking Machines Corp.
jjm@think.com 245 First St
617 234-2674 Cambridge, MA 02142
"A Rugger at heart, a beer drinker by dark"
*************************************************************************
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 30 Jun 93 08:13:37 PDT
From: djb@suned1.Nswses.Navy.Mil (Dan J Barnard)
Subject: Hunter Airstat
Somehow I lost the directions for using the Hunter Airstat. If anyone
could email them to me (weekly programming and how to program one
temperature and whatever else it says) I would greatly appreciate it.
djb@suned1.nswses.navy.mil
Thanks,
Dan
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 30 Jun 93 10:16:31 MDT
From: Jeff Benjamin <benji@hpfcbug.fc.hp.com>
Subject: Blueberries, sparge setups
Edward Croft <CROFTE@delphi.com> says:
> Allan Wright's Amber Wheat Beer fruit base in HB1166. I have been
> contemplating a fruit beer, and this may do the trick. But, Allan,
> blueberries in beer? Let me know how that turns out.
Why not blueberries? I made a blueberry brown ale last year that turned
out quite nicely. The berries gave the beer a subtle, wine-like
character that was very pleasant. The recipe was posted in HBD #926
(July 18 '92) if you're interested.
Jim Liddil <JLIDDIL@AZCC.Arizona.EDU> and "Mark S. Nelson"
<mnelson@eis.calstate.edu>, respectively, ask:
> I obtained a straight sided keg from the scrap metal yard this weekend.
> Now I want to turn it into a boiler/lauter tun. Has any one ever
> mounted an EasyMasher(TM) on a keg? What other manifold setups work
> well that can be easily removed?
> I'm a kit brewer second in the feild ready for the grain. Please give me
> your best advice, I really would like to know how to construct the best
> system.
There are a number of different lautering options: an easymasher, a
slotted copper pipe manifold, a false bottom, a separate double-bucket
Zapap-type as described in Papazian. The subject has been covered at
various times here, maybe it's time for a monthly FAQ?
Anyway, I favor the slotted pipe setup, since it's completely
removable, doesn't require you to drill a hole in your pot, and can be
disassembled for easy cleaning. I posted plans in HBD #1099 (Mar 17
'93). The description of the EasyMasher(tm) were originally posted by
Jack Schmidling in HBD #754 (Nov 4 '91), and there was a lot of
discussion and diagrams during March '93.
- --
Jeff Benjamin benji@hpfcla.fc.hp.com
Hewlett Packard Co. Fort Collins, Colorado
"Midnight shakes the memory as a madman shakes a dead geranium."
- T.S. Eliot
------------------------------
End of HOMEBREW Digest #1173, 07/02/93
*************************************
-------
