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HOMEBREW Digest #1093
This file received at Sierra.Stanford.EDU 93/03/09 00:27:32
HOMEBREW Digest #1093 Tue 09 March 1993
FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
Rob Gardner, Digest Coordinator
Contents:
RE: Boiling Water on Electric Burner (BELLAGIO_DAVID)
survey results (Rob Bradley)
demerara & turbinado (Rob Bradley)
Older, but not sweeter / Cloudy (Norm Pyle)
Carboy Cap vs BrewCap ("Joe Stone")
Re: Making a Corona malt ready (Roy Rudebusch)
Alan's RIMS Implementation, Part 1 (Rick Larson)
Alan's RIMS Implementation, Part 2 (Rick Larson)
RIMS Part 2 (Alan Gerhardt)
Thicker Beer Body (Dave Whitman)
Japanese hops (Lennart Sandberg)
Recurring infections (Steve Zabarnick)
Re: a carboy for under $15 (Timothy J. Dalton)
Last Call - Belgian Ale "Bitching" (Joe Rolfe)
some comments on sugar (Tony Babinec)
Clear beer... (mgerard)
Recurring infections (Steve Zabarnick)
Clear beer and women (Daniel Roman)
Marin, Bicycles, and the Marin Brewery (Richard Childers)
Infusion mash Stout (Ulick Stafford)
False Bottoms, Efficiency (Jack Schmidling)
Celis Beers (Michael Howe)
Nalgene bottles (colesa)
Wierd Science etc. (7226 Lacroix)
questions from a new snob :') (Frank Tutzauer)
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----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: 6 Mar 93 10:09:00 +1000
From: BELLAGIO_DAVID@Tandem.COM
Subject: RE: Boiling Water on Electric Burner
Joe Thomas wonders about boiling water on an electric stove. I have an
electric stove that I use for my brewing and have learned some lessons. The
first lesson is that if you are doing a full 5-6 gallon boil it takes a long
time to boil ( about 40 minutes ). The second lesson is that if you do a full
boil for an hour, your element will last about 3 batches before becoming
extremely warped ( thus decreasing contact surface and increasing boiling time
and heat directed elsewhere ). This warped element eventually leads to a
melted connector ( this actually happens after batch #7 since I was alternating
between both my big burners ). So, then I went to the appliance part store and
had to by a connector plug, two reflector shields, a regular large burner, and
an extra heavy duty canning burner. The canning burner cost $35.00 and I
highly recommend it! It has extra support and is raised higher than the stove
top. It also has a higher heat output. Now, I boil my wort and don't have to
worry about the heat and weight warping my burner. I would think a way to
decrease the boiling time would be to start boiling a gallon of water on both
burners, once they are close to boiling, put one in the other and refill the
empty one with a gallon and bring it to near boil. Keep doing this until you
have the desired amount in your big boiling kettle and it should all be near
boiling then. I have not done this since I am lazy. Have fun.
Super Dave
bellagio_david@tandem.com
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 6 Mar 93 18:54:19 -0500
From: bradley@adx.adelphi.edu (Rob Bradley)
Subject: survey results
I posted in 1089 about brown sugar. I asked HBD readers who had
experience using brown sugar to write with me. The results are
mixed but generally positive.
In HBD1090, Russ Gelinas said:
> Re. brown sugar: In my book, it's virtually *required* in an English
>style ale. Yes, I actually add brown sugar to all-grain batches, usually
>1 lb (10-15%). Purist, I'm not. Beer drinker, I am.
In HBD1091, Rick Zydenbos said:
>I'm an all-grain freak in search of a caramel taste in my ale.
>I've tried using brown sugar but with little or no success.
I had four people e-mail me about their experiences brewing with
modest amounts of brown sugar:
Respondent #1 brewed with:
2 packages Northwestern Gold Malt Extract
1/2 # 80 L crystal
2 c. North American dark brown sugar (about .8 #)
The result:
>...[it] was a big hit with my friends, and a number even remarked that it
>was quite similar to BA but with more carbonation and hop aroma. There was
>no 'cidery' flavor, but a nice caramel/molasses note in the beer which I
>thought was appropriate.
Respondent 2:
80% all-grain
20% US domestic brown sugar
The result:
>...Well the beer was well received by
>some and not liked by others. I now know the flavor and I personally
>don't like it. As said, others do. I can now taste it in some
>draught English bitters
_BEWARE_:
>.. When I brewed the 20%
>batch it smelled like H2S--sulfury rotten eggs during the ferment.
>It tasted fine, but the basement stunk during primary. This is the
>only time I've ever had sulfur smell in primary and it was the only
>time I used brown sugar, so the two might be related...
Respondent 3 says he took my recipe for
>.... Bass Ale from Cat's Meow and cranked it up.
10# 2-row Klages Malt
.5# Cara Pils Malt
.5# Crystal Malt, 90L
1# brown sugar, added to boil
The result:
>First Place in Classic Pale Ale category in an AHA competition
Respondent 4 brewed:
> ...a Bass-ale type beer, the recipe compiled from 3-4 others
>in the CM and elsewhere, and I did use 1 lb. brown sugar
The result:
> I think it tastes great.
Other notes:
Arf sez:
> you might consider just using molasses and leaving out the sugar.
I've experimented with molasses in the past. It never gave me the
caramel flavor I sought. Just a heavy molasses-ey flavor.
Donald O'Connor suggests Belgian Special B. I'm going to give that
a try. A good solution for the purists, too.
Cheers,
Rob (bradley@adx.adelphi.edu)
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 6 Mar 93 19:02:29 -0500
From: bradley@adx.adelphi.edu (Rob Bradley)
Subject: demerara & turbinado
"Turbinado" and "Demerara" are the "real" brown sugars. They are
both partially refined cane sugars. I've heard it said that they
are, respectively, the American and British names for the same thing.
However, turbinado is _very_ pale, lighter than a brown paper bag.
Demerara is about as dark as a brown beer bottle.
Demerara is readily available in the UK. Can UK readers confirm whether
turbinado is the same thing called "Trinidad" sugar by Dave Line?
As Jeff Frane said, turbinado is available in North America in health
food stores. When I lived in Toronto, I could buy demerara, imported
from the UK, in homebrew shops. My respondent #2 tells me it can be
bought from Great Fermentations in Santa Rosa, CA, but in the form of
sugar cubes!!!!!
North American supermarket brown sugars are refined cane sugar with
molasses added. (HBDers must be getting sick of hearing this: I said
it in HBD1089. Arf repeated it in 1090, as though it was news. In
1091 Jeff Frane said "Jack is right". Is it a fact yet?) Some
questions: since molasses is a by-product of the refining process,
what's the difference between a solution of turbinado and a solution
of refined white sugar with the appropriate amount of molasses?
Could a chemist tell the difference? Could a yeast cell? Are there
nasty trace chemicals in the supermarket brown sugar because of the
refining process? Did respondent #2's H2S smell arise because his
brown sugar was doctored with sulfurized molasses?
Cheers,
Rob (bradley@adx.adelphi.edu)
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 6 Mar 93 19:46:10 MST
From: pyle@intellistor.com (Norm Pyle)
Subject: Older, but not sweeter / Cloudy
I seem to have two problems with my homebrews, which I will discuss
separately.
The first problem I've had from my very first brews. It involves sweetness,
or a lack thereof. As my beers age, they seem to lose the sweetness they had
when they were younger. I'm comparing the flavor profile from a 1-month old
brew to a 3-month old brew (since bottling). This has happened with extract
brews, partial mashes, and all-grain'ers. I _really_ like my beers when they
are young, but as they age, I like them less and less. The hop bitterness
starts to overpower them, as the sweetness fades. Others have reported
hoppiness fading with time, but with this problem, it seems to gain
prominence. Anyway, I suspect the hop-fade reports really refer to aroma,
less so than bittering. So, this sounds like an infection problem, right?
Bacteria/wild yeasts eating up the "unfermentables", etc. etc. Well, none of
my brews have ever experienced gushing. The worst its ever gotten is some
bottles having more carbonation than others, which I attributed to poor
mixing of the priming sugar (this hasn't happened in quite a while). Of
late, I can't discern a difference in carbonation between the "young" beer
and the "old" beer. Of course, comparing a 3-month old beer to the memory of
a 1-month old beer is difficult at best. Help? Comments? I'll discuss my
sanitation procedures in another post if that seems to be the tack to take.
Second problem: my all-grain brews (3 to date) are, without exception,
cloudy. I do a simple single-stage infusion at 150-158F. I've used American
and British 2-row. I try to do a mash-out, but I know the temperature isn't
165F+ like it should be (I don't think mash-out would have anything to do
with this anyway). Do I need to a protein rest? At what temp? I mash in a
cooler, so upward infusion is doable, but I'd only like to do it if
necessary. BTW, the cloudiness doesn't make them any less tasty, but a
friend says he likes all-grain because he can get his beers much clearer than
with extracts (probably among other reasons as well). What gives? Thanks
for your (collective) advice. It will be appreciated.
Cheers,
Norm
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 6 Mar 93 20:59:11 PST
From: "Joe Stone" <JSTONE@SJEVM5.VNET.IBM.COM>
Subject: Carboy Cap vs BrewCap
As many of you probably recognized, I made a mistake in referring to my
0.5"-drill-bit-modified-hooked-racking-tube arrangement as an altered BrewCap.
It is simply an altered $1.50 Carboy Cap (which is actually better ... a
BrewCap runs $13.00)
js (a.k.a. Joe Stone)
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 7 Mar 93 15:33:00 -0500
From: roy.rudebusch@travel.com (Roy Rudebusch)
Subject: Re: Making a Corona malt ready
From: roy.rudebusch@travel.com
breiden@dsuvax.dsu.edu (Danny Breidenbach) writes:
OK -- I weighed the alternatives and my budget and got a Corona -- I
wanted a Maltmill -- but $50 more is $50 more. Maybe later ...
anyway -- now that I have this Corona -- now that I've assembled it --
I seem to remember hearing about various tweaks and modifications to
make it better for malt ---
Jack Scmidling:
JS:>Tighten both nuts that hold the thing together first. No matter
JS:>what anyone tells you, these must be tight. Then adjust the large
JS:>wingnut so that something the thickness of a dime will just barely
JS:>pass between the two plates. You must have a gauge on both sides at
JS:>the same time to do this.
Well said! But I would like to elaborate:
First, disassemble and wash with dishsoap.
Remove and do not replace the inner snap ring. The only purpose for this
ring was to prevent from losing the steel ball when it is disassembled!
To remove the snap ring just turn in the adjustment screw till the
ring is pushed out.
Remove the cotter key from the shaft and adjust the plate so it is more
perpendicular to the shaft. The mobile plate needs to run a parallel
course to the fixed plate. The hub may give some options for refitting.
Also the cotter key may need to be replaced.
File the end of shaft so it smooth and flat.
Crush on!
* OLX 2.2 * Corona Mill
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 7 Mar 93 23:09:12 -0600
From: hpfcla.fc.hp.com!melkor!rick (Rick Larson)
Subject: Alan's RIMS Implementation, Part 1
Here is part 1 of some text I received from Alan Gerhardt about his
RIMS implementation.
- ---------Alan's-Text----------
Hi Rick,
I built my mash tun by getting a 15.5 gal keg, using a metal cutting
blade in a circular saw to cut the top off at the top seam where the
handle ring is welded on. As it turns out, the groove at that weld
tends to guide the blade, so it is easy to get a straight cut. Be sure
and use safety glasses, however, because sparks and metal bits will
be flying. Make sure you follow all the normal safety tips for working
with kegs as well.
I then drilled a drain hole in the bottom, and used a brass "cooler
drain" fitting. The fitting has a nut and a gasket, which gives a
good seal, and is threaded on the inside as well. I then attached
the required pipe/fittings to connect the drain to my RIMS unit.
=======
=======flange
=| |=gasket
----------| |------------keg bottom
=======
======= nut
|| ||
| |
| |other fittings to suit
I used a water heater jacket as insulation by cutting it in approx
thirds, and wrapping three layers around the keg and securing it
with duct tape.
For a false bottom, used a piece of 3/8" copper tubing formed in a
circle to fit the bottom of the keg, and soldered a straight piece
as an extra support across the center. Picture an international
"NO xxx" symbol and thats what it looks like.
A piece of stainless screen rests on top. I also soldered a 1/2" copper
coupling to one side of the inside of the copper ring into which I
stick a vertical piece of copper tube as a vent stack which sticks
above the grain bed. This limits the compaction of the grain bed by
the suction from the RIMS pump. If you're not using a RIMS, then you
don't need the vent stack, and you have a conventional mash/lauter tun.
My plumbing is set up as follows:
|--------|
| v | | v=vent pipe
| v | | g=grain
|gvgggggg| | s=screen
|gvgggggg| |
|svssssss| | ______________
---------- --| |
|__________| RIMS |
| |______________|
x
drain
w/valve
On the next installment, I will describe the contruction of my
RIMS unit, which is patterned after the original Rodney Morris unit.
Cheers,
Alan
- --
Rick Larson rick@adc.com, melkor!rick@cs.umn.edu
ADC Telecommunications, Inc. ...!uunet!melkor!rick
Minneapolis, MN 55435 (612) 936-8288
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 7 Mar 93 23:11:08 -0600
From: hpfcla.fc.hp.com!melkor!rick (Rick Larson)
Subject: Alan's RIMS Implementation, Part 2
Below is the remaining text I received from Alan.
- --------
Date: Thu, 23 Jan 92 14:57:32 -0600
From: agerhardt@ttsi.lonestar.org (Alan Gerhardt)
Subject: RIMS Part 2
As promised, here's a description of my RIMS unit. I started with the
R. Morris basic design and adapted it as needed.
I think Rodney deserves a lot of credit for coming up a practical
homebrewer's implementation of this idea. His methods sure gave me
a headstart.
I wanted the unit to be able to do at least a 10 gal batch size, which
for me usually equates to 16-20 lbs of grain, so I chose a 5KW heating
element from WW Grainger. It is a very low heat density element which
is advertised to be able to even run dry. It is a very long element,
which has in a "U" shape, and folded over to be about 19" long. It
cost about $20, but has turned out to be a very good investment, in
that I have seen no evidence of excessive heating (which would kill
the enzymes) or scorching. With this element, I get about 1.75-2
degrees/min temperature boost with 18 lbs of grain and about 7-8 gal
of water.
I used a length of 1.5" (about 21") copper pipe as an element housing,
with a cap for each end, and assorted fittings to connect things up.
I used a length of 1.5" (about 21") copper pipe as an element housing,
with a cap for each end, and assorted fittings to connect things up.
outlet------------------------------------------------- .5" copper pipe
----------------------------------------------- |
| |
---- | | ----__
| ------------------------------------- --- | |-_
| |==========================================| | |-
| |==========================================| | _|-
| ---- ------------------------------------- |__|- ^
---- | | ---- ^ |
| --- __ | element
| |||||__ stopper with | head
| --- thermistor
| |
| |
------ copper nut
| |--------------
| | |
inlet------------| | |
------------| | pump |
| | |
| |--------------
------
The inlet and outlet pipes are .5" copper. I drilled holes in the 1.5"
tube for the inlet and outlets ( a tight fit is better ), and soldered
them in.
The trickiest part was the mounting of the heating element. Rodney used
a 1" threaded pipe to copper pipe adaptor. Since the adaptor narrows
down too much to allow the element I chose to fit through, I cut off
the threaded portion, in effect making a copper nut. I soldered the nut
outside of the cap ( with hole drilled in it ), and the element just
screws into the end of the pipe. The supplied gasket makes a water
tight seal. The element is easily removed for inspection/cleaning,
although cleaning is seldom required if a clean water rinse and
recirculation is performed after use.
I put the thermistor inside of a .125" copper tube, and sealed it in
epoxy, being careful not to short it out. The tube is inserted through
the stopper so that it sticks into the fluid flow.
The Radio Shack thermometer Rodney used is no longer available, so I
didn't put that through the stopper too. I use an external digital
thermometer instead.
I put the whole thing into a wood case, with the inlet and outlet tubes
sticking out through drilled holes. I connect to the unit using plastic
tubing and band clamps.
I built a pump speed control per Rodney's design and it works fine.
I have not been able to get his temperature controller to work yet, and
am currently using a toggle switch instead.
As he recommended, I used a GFI outlet inside my box, from which I get
all power. That is in my opinion, a very wise investment.
I set the whole system up on two Workmates, one for the RIMS unit, and
the other for the mash tun. The whole thing disassembles and stores so
I have my garage back when done.
Observations:
(1) At full flow, the outlet stream will sometimes generate a
LOT of foam in the mash tun if not properly directed.
(2) Sparging is a snap now. I just add as much water as my mash tun
will hold, raise to 165-170 degrees, and recirculate for about
30 minutes. My efficiency is typically 30-31/lb/gal, for 6 row
malt ( Stew's Brew malt ), just short of Miller's numbers. For
larger quantities of malt ( not as much room for more water ),
I plan to drain/replace the sparge water as required.
(3) A proper grain grind is just as important as always.
(4) The wort runs incredibly clear by the time you are sparging, and
no husks or other particles make it into the boiling kettle.
(5) If you are contemplating building a RIMS, don't scrimp on the
pump or the heating element.
(6) You have to be crazy or an obsessive tinkerer to go to this
much trouble.
I hope this helps somebody !
Cheers,
Alan
- --
Rick Larson rick@adc.com, melkor!rick@cs.umn.edu
ADC Telecommunications, Inc. ...!uunet!melkor!rick
Minneapolis, MN 55435 (612) 936-8288
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 Mar 93 07:49:20 EST
From: Dave Whitman <rsndww@rohmhaas.com>
Subject: Thicker Beer Body
To homebrew@hpfcmi.fc.hp.co
X-Mailer: LeeMail 1.2.4
In HBD #1092, Steve Slade asks:
>How do I make a beer that is, for
>lack of a better term, thick? The best beers I have tasted have all seemed
>like they have more body, or greater viscosity, than the ones I brew using
>a partial mash. I don't want to brew a sweet beer, so useing less
>attenuative yeast is out. Do dextrins add body without a sweet taste? I've
>tried using 1/4 cup flaked barley in a 5 gallon batch without much luck. Is
>carapils or one of the Belgian malts a better choice?
I'm using 0.5 lb maltodextrin powder in my latest batch in an attempt to
improve body. I added it in the hopes of improving body without increasing
color, but I tasted the powder prior to addition, and it had very little taste.
As such, you might give it a try to increase body w/o sweetness.
I'm also interested in cara-pils malt. Could someone post a nano-tutorial on
its use? From reading, I thought I could treat cara-pils as a very low color
replacement for crystal malt, just steep it in my brew water while heating to a
boil, then filter off before adding my extract. However, the guy at my local
brew store told me that it needs to be mashed to allow conversion. I don't
want to let enzymes chew the nice dextrins down too much, since the whole point
is to get some viscosity. What's the story?
Dave Whitman
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 Mar 1993 13:59:34 +0100
From: lennart@mistral.btj.se (Lennart Sandberg)
Subject: Japanese hops
I found while shopping a package of seeds and it said japanese hops,
Humulus Scandens ( H. japonicus ). The package says it's a fast growing
creeper, few flowers. It was a serie of seeds called Grandmothers flowers
and this plant was to remind of the time when it was law to grow hops for
beermaking. I presumed its either a mutant or a japanese relative.
Teenage mutant ninja hops ?? ;-)
Because it wont flower very much I doubt it has any use in beermaking,
anybody with more info?
Of course I had to buy it.
/lennart
lennart@mistral.btj.se or lennart%mistral.btj.se@mail.swip.net depending
on mailhost.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 Mar 93 8:49:01 EST
From: Steve Zabarnick <steve@snake.appl.wpafb.af.mil>
Subject: Recurring infections
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 Mar 93 09:45:34 -0500
From: Timothy J. Dalton <dalton@mtl.mit.edu>
Subject: Re: a carboy for under $15
sagard@digi.lonestar.org (Steve Agard) writes :
> 1. Work a deal with a local homebrew shop on a used
> 5 gal carboy. there's an excellent shop in the area.
Beer and Wine Hobby up here in Woburn MA sells used
7 gallon glass carboys for $14.95
I bought one. Didn't look very used. Works great and
the price was right.
I think these ones are pickup only, no mail order.
Tim
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 Mar 93 10:00:10 EST
From: Joe Rolfe <jdr@wang.com>
Subject: Last Call - Belgian Ale "Bitching"
hi all,
last call for those of you who have questions/problems or comments on
Pierre Rajotte's Belgian Ale book. I will take these questions/complaints
to Pierre this Saturday whilst visiting and return the comments to
you. all comments welcome, if you wish reponse in private - indicate so
in your email. this way you can "holler" as loud as you like without
public interruption...... Last call!......email to jdr@wang.com
thanx in advance!...
- --
joe rolfe
jdr@wang.com
508-967-5760
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 Mar 93 9:42:14 CST
From: tony@spss.com (Tony Babinec)
Subject: some comments on sugar
HBD is in one of its cyclical sugar threads. Here are a few
thoughts on sugars.
Sugars such as American cane sugar (American table sugar) are
highly refined sugars that, from the standpoint of brewing and your
yeast, are fully fermentable. Molasses is a thick syrup produced
when sugar is refined. American light brown sugar and dark brown
sugar are highly refined sugar with some of the molasses added back
in. From this, it does not follow that you cannot or should not
use them in your brewing. As I understand it, brown sugar has some
unfermentables that will impart flavor to the finished beer.
Demerara sugar is a light-colored, partially refined sugar. Did
you know that there is a Demerara River in Guyana? This must have
been (still is?) a sugar-producing area. Turbinado sugar is a
less-refined, darker, sticky sugar. You might be able to find
these in health food stores.
"Sugar in the Raw" is a light amber fine-crystal sugar available in
commercial supermarkets (in the Chicago area, anyway) in 2-pound
boxes. "Raw Hawaiian Sugar" is an amberish rock-candy sugar
available in 2-pound bags.
If you cannot find demerara or turbinado sugar, permit me to
suggest that in recipes calling for demerara sugar, use Sugar in
the Raw or Raw Hawaiian Sugar if you can find them, or use light
brown sugar, and that in recipes calling for turbinado sugar use
dark brown sugar.
Molasses is available in at least two forms -- as mild molasses or
as a stronger blackstrap molasses. I've avoided the blackstrap
molasses but have used mild molasses in a few recipes. I didn't
have a good idea how much to add, but I started with small
additions on the order of 1/4 - 1/2 cup, as I didn't want the
flavor to dominate.
Finally, Rajotte's "Belgian Ales" suggests that Belgian brewers use
sugar for coloring. The grain bills of Rajotte's homebrew recipes
typically feature only small amounts of crystal malt or highly
roasted malts, if any. Instead, he suggests that for pale beers
use pilsner malt and refined sugar (or consider a light honey such
as clover honey or alfalfa honey), and for color use small amounts
of crystal malt or brown malt and use darker candi sugar. I think
it's a great suggestion, though I don't know how to calculate the
color contribution of darker sugars to the finished beer!
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 Mar 93 11:54:23 EST
From: <mgerard@engin.umich.edu>
Subject: Clear beer...
There is a recipe in Cat's Meow called "Sima" that calls for
brown sugar and priming sugar bittered with lemons. It sounds
like this new "Zima" is priming sugar with lemons (or something
similar).
Here's my recipe for dull clear beer:
5 gallons water
1 lb rice
1 lb corn sugar
4 lbs priming sugar
1 oz cheap hops
Boil hops alone for 1 hour (there's nothing to be added to the
water/wort)
Add priming sugar
Ferment
Result: A clear beer with no body (what a great
marketing strategy)!
Mike
Ann Arbor, MI
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 Mar 93 12:01:44 -0500
From: steve@snake.appl.wpafb.af.mil (Steve Zabarnick)
Subject: Recurring infections
I started homebrewing two months ago and have had two out of
three batches go sour. The first batch was the only not to
bad. For all batches I used a plastic bucket primary and a
glass carboy secondary. I sanitized all surfaces with bleach
solution for each batch (I was especially careful for the last
batch). I preboiled all the water for the last two batches.
The first batch used dry yeast, the last two used liquid.
Any ideas on what I am doing wrong? I'm getting very
frustrated! Should I throw out my plastic primary and get
another glass carboy?
All advice is appreciated.
Steve
Steve Zabarnick
steve@snake.appl.wpafb.af.mil OR
zabarnic@udavxb.oca.udayton.edu
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 Mar 93 12:13:07 EST
From: roman@tix.timeplex.com (Daniel Roman)
Subject: Clear beer and women
Ming-chung Lin writes:
> Daniel Roman,,,,,You don't think that clear beer appeals
> to "women's taste", do you???? I was a little insulted
> to be put into a category of people who like that kind of
> thing. Perhaps you (and Miller) should find someother
> words to use for people who like clear beer. Women I know
> who drink beer (most of us brew our own) prefer strong ales
> and stouts.
>
> Lisa St. Hilaire <MARS@SUVM.ACS.SYR.EDU>
Whoa! I was just listing Miller's et al marketing reasons for creating
"clear beer". Did it sound to you like I agreed with them? Perhaps I
was negligent in not stating that my source for the info was the Daily
News and that these are not the opinions of the author etc. etc. etc.
but I did not expect to get jumped on for that. Just thought I'd
"CLEAR" :-) that up before any more FemiNazis attack me.
My wife's favorite style of homebrew is my Oatmeal Stout, and though she
does not take an active part in the brewing process (though I've tried
to get her involved), she is more than happy to consume a wide variety
of the homebrew, especially the dark stuff.
BTW Lisa, I take it you are using someone else's account?
_________
Dan Roman GEnie: D.ROMAN1 Internet: roman@tix.timeplex.com //
American Homebrewers Association member Only AMIGA! \X/
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 Mar 93 09:33:33 -0800
From: pascal@netcom.com (Richard Childers)
Subject: Marin, Bicycles, and the Marin Brewery
"Date: Thu, 4 Mar 93 22:23:57 -0800
From: pascal@netcom.com (Richard Childers)
Subject: bikePUBcrawl
"Despite suggestions to the contrary, I have decided to go ahead and carry
out this bicycle-based pub crawl, as scheduled, this Sunday, 07 March 1993."
For those interested, the day was great, and so was the ride. A bit of fog
while crossing the Golden Gate, but this also was an indicator of the wind's
minimal presence. Across in Marin, the fog evaporated and was not seen until
we crossed the Bay via ferry that evening.
The route is pretty straightforward ... down to Sausalito, along the bike
path, under 101, across Blithedale in Mill Valley, right at the school, then
along Lomita to 101, right, onto the bike path paralleling 101, over the hill
and down into Corte Madera. Cross at the light, onto Madera, which becomes
Tamal Vista. Go to the end, turn right, cross the freeway at the pedestrian
bridge, then continue along, parallel to 101, back onto the bike path, along
101, down the off ramp, bearing right with the road, into the parking complex
of the Larkspur Golden Gate ferry landing.
It all sounds very complex but the secret is that everyone uses this path all
of the time and it is well established, as well as quite intuitive. In every
case but one - at the school, where the right turn is unobtrusive - choices
were either obvious, IE, straight ahead, or intuitive, IE, in order to cross
the freeway I needed to zig-zag a bit but the goal was obvious.
We checked the schedule, then crossed the pedestrian bridge to the shopping
complex Marin Brewery was within. We sat outside, on the patio, at a small
table. ( There were only three of us - both, friends, neither HBD readers but
both interested in brewing. ) The beer was good, but it was not noteworthy ...
although my tiredness may have had something to do with this perception. The
food, also, was good but not noteworthy, and the fish & chips, a touch oily.
However, the clam chowder was excellent, and next time I'll have a bowl of
that and skip the fish & chips. Their hamburgers may be much better, I'll
have to see another time.
Afterwards, we returned to the ferry building and boarded ... returning, we
put two bikes in my truck and drove up to meet the third person, at the Toro-
-nado ... thence, homeward.
Overall, one of the best benefits of this ride is seeing just how easy it is
to cover 20-plus miles in under two hours. ( We did it in 2:08 and loafed a
_lot_. ) Another thirty minutes of riding and I could have been up in San
Rafael, picking up brewing supplies at Great Fermentations ... and, of course,
there are many other nice rides in Marin, as well as some nice picnic spots
we passed en route. Although the brewery was not as rewarding as I thought it
should be, the ride amply compensated for this lack ... and I _will_ return to
the brewery again.
One problem is the meeting place - where we met was not immediately obvious,
although it _is_ the southmost end of the _bridge_, and it _is_ on the west
side, and it _is_ the beginning of the bike path, as clearly denoted by the
very large sign at the beginning of the crossing, which directs bike riders
to go down the ramp and under the bridge, to the other side ... I hope this
did not cause anyone any inconvenience.
- -- richard
"It is obligatory, within the limits of capability, to commend the
good and forbid evil." _Kitab_Adab_al-Muridin_, by Suhrawardi
richard childers pascal@netcom.com
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 Mar 93 12:39:30 EST
From: Ulick Stafford <ulick@bernini.helios.nd.edu>
Subject: Infusion mash Stout
I intend to make a stout using a single infusion mash with the major
component of the grain bill being a British Pale Ale malt. But
I want to know if I should worry about the fact that my roast and
flaked barley have not been exposed to a prtotein rest - usually
I make stout using lager malt with a prtoein rest, quite successfully.
Is the likely problem a stuck sparge or simply poor conversion of
the adjuncts?
__________________________________________________________________________
'Heineken!?! ... F#$% that s@&* ... | Ulick Stafford, Dept of Chem. Eng.
Pabst Blue Ribbon!' | Notre Dame IN 46556
| ulick@bach.helios.nd.edu
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 Mar 93 11:50 CST
From: arf@genesis.mcs.com (Jack Schmidling)
Subject: False Bottoms, Efficiency
From: "Joe Stone" <JSTONE@SJEVM5.VNET.IBM.COM>
>In my haste, I immediately applied heat to the mash with a 35K BTU cooker.
The Vollrath pot has a SS tooled screen in the bottom. Upon applying heat,
the temperature of the water/grain-dust solution below the screen increases
rapidly. By the time I could thoroughly stir the mash, the temperature was
at 190oF. Oops!
Welcome to the ranks of us drones who have blindly built the "standard"
version of the scaled down commercial mash tun only to find it poorly suited
for home brewing. The following is the relevant section from my soon to be
published article on Kettle Mashing.....
..............
The key to the system is the screening device and the spigot for the kettle.
The first one I made was to be used in conjunction with an overlaying false
bottom. The false bottom was a stainless steel plate the size of the kettle
bottom with a zillion holes laboriously punched into it. It created no end
of problems on the very first batch. Mash got under it and scorching was
just about impossible to control. So in disgust, I pulled it out, continued
the mash and assumed a disaster was at hand.
Much to my incredulous delight, when I opened the spigot, the wort ran clear
after less than a cup of turbid runoff. I have since made about 50 batches
using only the screen device and get very consistent and respectable extract
yields.
..............
If anyone would like a copy of the entire article, drop me mail.
>From: Lee Menegoni <necis!lmenegon@transfer.stratus.com>
>Subject: Sparge efficency
>What am I doing wrong that prevents me from getting to the next level of all
grain snobbery the thirtysomething level of extraction all grain snob??
Probably just telling the truth and not fudging the numers :)
We have been through this a zillion times and my opinion is that
instrumentation error and measurement technique can easily account for +/- 5
points of uncertainty. 28 is well within the range of nominal. On my last
batch I got 33 and the only thing I changed from the previous batch (30) was
the malt.
The most important thing is that, once you are in the ballpark, with what is
expected, you should worry less about what others get and more about
establishing a meaningful measurement technique that will give you consistant
and meaningful results. If you change a process or ingredient, you want to
know that any change in yield results from that and not from sloppy
measuring.
It is perfectly legitimate for example, to include the liquid in the trub you
throw out in your volume determination but you must keep this in mind when
you compare results with others and you must do it all the time. The same
applies to reading the hydrometer. If you fudge to the top of the meniscus
or the bottom, you must do it consistantly and keep in mind that it has about
a 4 point effect on the bottom line when comparing with others.
js
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 Mar 1993 09:48:15 -0700
From: Michael Howe <howe@gwl.com>
Subject: Celis Beers
Hello all,
All this talk of the various Celis beers arriving in cities around the
nation has gotten me excited. My brother sent me an article from the Austin
daily newspaper about Celis a while back. The article stated that Celis
was going to be introduced in a number of test markets around the nation.
COLORADO was one of the lucky states.
I live and work in the Denver,CO area (Englewood to be specific) and have
yet to see Celis anywhere here (believe me, I've looked). Has anyone in this
area seen Celis at any of their local liquor stores? If so, could you please
show me to the promised land :-). Any help would be greatly appreciated. I
am getting tired of trying to EXPLAIN Celis White to people. I'd rather just
give them a bottle of it...
Reply via e-mail if you prefer.
Michael Howe e-mail : howe@gwl.com
Software Engineer II
The Great West Life Assurance Co.
Englewood, CO
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 Mar 1993 11:02:34 -0700
From: colesa@spot.Colorado.EDU
Subject: Nalgene bottles
Nalgene makes 20 litre (about 7 gallons) PLASTIC bottles that have the
following features:
1) Large mouth
2) Screw top cap
3) Large handles to carry it
4) Best of all, a spigot about 3/4 inch above the bottom of the bottle
The biggest problem would obviously be sanitation, but these
bottles are designed for laboratories, and the large mouth would make
cleaning easier than a narrow mouthed carboy. Punch a hole in the cap for
the fermentation lock, and I think it would make one hell of a closed
fermenter. They cost about $23.
Anyone use these before, and if so, how did it work?
Adam Coles *
Senior, Bioengineering * Sure I'll wear a three piece suit...
College of Engineering * As long as it's jeans, t-shirt,
CU Boulder * and a leather jacket!
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 Mar 93 11:12:57 MST
From: stevel@chs.com (7226 Lacroix)
Subject: Wierd Science etc.
Ya know, one reason I like the HBD is all the home science info I pick
up. The Hot Water heater element trick is sooooo cool (really!) and I like the
responsible nature of the poster....but hey, we're adults (well most of the
time) and if you whoever said Home Brewing wasn't risky business!!!
On another note, during my travels in Mexico, I learned that at least
one culture on the continent has a name for USAers and Canadians that relates
to the land mass....most Mexicans call USAers North Americans...
I throughly enjoyed the humorous posting about the Clear Beer
Catagories....sorta reminds me of of Old Frothingslosh...point of order...
Coors tested a product named "Zima" last summer. If Miller is using "Zima"
as a product name, all of you weaselly lawyer-types might want to take time
out from you "Boston"tm adventures to get on this fat cow. Oooooooh doesn't it
make your nipples hard to think of yourself in the middle of a spat between
these two well funded cowboys????
Well, back to work...and keep those fun science projects coming!!!!!
Steve Lacroix
Primitive Brewing (and wierd science student extraordinaire)
------------------------------
Date: 08 Mar 1993 14:05:42 -0500 (EST)
From: Frank Tutzauer <COMFRANK@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu>
Subject: questions from a new snob :')
Well, I finally did it. Yesterday I brewed my very first all-grain batch.
Back in December I asked for some tips and got them, so a very belated thanks
to Jay Hersh and Tim Norris (lauter tun designs), Rob Thomas (strike heat/mash
temp formula), Jeff Benjamin and Spencer Thomas (general all-round advice),
and Jack (quick delivery of a MALTMILL--for the record, mine had no debris and
only a very light coating of oil which I took care of with a toothbrush and
some really crummy roasted barley I had laying around).
Some observations and questions:
First, things went pretty well. Temperature control in my picnic cooler was
harder than I expected and sparging was easier than I expected. I got about
28 points a pound. The runoff cleared *very* quickly, like within a quart or
two. (I suspect Jack's mill is the reason why.) And about this business of
the iodine showing conversion at the top of the cooler but not with the wort
from the spigot: I didn't experience this phenomenon. At the beginning of
the mash, both top and bottom turned black; at the end of the mash, neither
did. So, who knows....
In terms of time, I would say that I only spent about 2 hours longer than my
extract batches, and much of that was due to fumbling on my part since I don't
have my technique down yet. Naturally, it took me longer to crush the malt
than the pound or so of specialty grains I was used to using, but the sparge
took place while the rest of the runoff was heating up on the stove, so that
didn't really add much extra time (I've been doing full-volume boils). As far
as I could see, only the hour or so mash represented any significant time over
and above an extract batch.
Now the questions. First, in yesterday's digest, Joe Stone asks how long the
sparge should take. I've got the same question. Miller, people in my club,
and lots of other folks talk about the sparge slowing to a trickle. Mine
didn't. It did slow a little, but never to a trickle. If I'd've wanted to, I
could have run it out like gangbusters. Again, my guess is that Jack's mill
is why, and for me the length of the sparge seems to be strictly under my
control. So, how long should I make it? The most convenient is to finish the
sparge right as the wort on the stove is coming to a boil. Is this
reasonable? Is longer better (more sugars?), or is shorter better (fewer
tannins?)?
Second, what's the deal on acidifying the mash? Miller says to get the pH to
5.0 to 5.5. I checked right after doughing in, and it was like maybe 6.3. I
thought to myself, "Man, this is my first all-grain batch. I've got a lot
more important stuff to worry about than acidifying the mash." Also, I
remembered Miller saying something about not fighting the "natural
inclinations of the malt." So I remembered not to worry, decided to let the
malt naturally inclinate, and opened the day's first homebrew. What should I
do in the future?
Finally, should I acidify the sparge water? Charlie P.'s silent on the
matter, Miller says to acidify to a pH of 5.7, and Noonan spouts of a
typically let's-make-it-harder-than-it-needs-to-be Noonanism, something like
acidify if the pH rises .7 during sparge but never more than .2 unless the
azimuth of the moon corresponds to the declination of blah, blah, blah....
What should I do and how important is it?
Thanks a bunch, folks,
- --frank
------------------------------
End of HOMEBREW Digest #1093, 03/09/93
*************************************
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