Copy Link
Add to Bookmark
Report
HOMEBREW Digest #0738
This file received at Mthvax.CS.Miami.EDU 91/10/04 12:15:03
HOMEBREW Digest #738 Fri 04 October 1991
FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
Rob Gardner, Digest Coordinator
Contents:
Liverwort (RCARLSON)
siphon tube end caps (dave ballard)
bottle caps from hell (dave ballard)
Odd Cola... (Greg Roody - dtn 237-7122 03-Oct-1991 0927)
re: Geary's (Tim Ness)
GMcD,Geary (Russ Gelinas)
Re: A call for recipes (Chris Shenton)
re: Express bottle washing (Darryl Richman)
Munich Beer Recipe (Brian Bliss)
re: request for homebrew mailings (Darryl Richman)
Re: Homebrew Digest #737 (October 03, 1991) (A.D. Williams)
weizen experiment results (Marty Albini)
Hop ecstasy. ("DRCV06::GRAHAM")
Re: Express bottle washing (Greg Wageman)
MISC (Jack Schmidling)
High Fermentation Temps (Steve Carter)
Samuel Adams' Boston Ale (Brian Smithey)
cleaning blow-off tube (Bryan Gros)
Send submissions to homebrew@hpfcmi.fc.hp.com
Send requests to homebrew-request@hpfcmi.fc.hp.com
[Please do not send me requests for back issues!]
Archives are available from netlib@mthvax.cs.miami.edu
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 3 Oct 91 01:27 PDT
From: RCARLSON@MAX.U.WASHINGTON.EDU
Subject: Liverwort
Last week I brewed a scotch ale. At the end of the sparge I had collected
9 gallons at SG = 1.050. Although I've used the same boiler for five years
(a keg with water heater element welded inside), on this day the wort smoked
and burned as it boiled. When my 1.5 hour boil (burn) was over, I opened the
tap to drain the wort. Nothing came out. Looking inside, I saw a slab of
liver clinging to the side of the boiler. Using my spoon, I found another
clogging my tap, and many small specimens as well.
Summing up the courage to actually touch this strange and repulsive
substance, I found it to be like a wet newspaper, and found it to separate
into sheets. Naturally my first reaction was that the brewing Gods had sent
down some gremlins to throw the liver of some errant homebrewer (who wouldn't
heed their warnings) into my boil. Or perhaps an issue of Zymurgy.
But having kept a close watch over my boiler that day, I can't help but
wonder if there is a scientific basis for this wierdness. Perhaps excess
flour from the first runnings of the sparge which I did NOT recycle
combined with the high gravity of the wort to make "wort dumplings"
I would like to hear from anyone who has had this experience or has any
theories about what caused it. It gives me the willies. I would consider
there to be safety in numbers, but if I stand alone, I may just heed the
warnings of the brewing gods and hang up my apron.
MORE TECHNICAL INFO: At the end of the boil the SG was only 1.060. The
heating element had a thick black crust on it.
Ron Carlson
------------------------------
Date: 3 Oct 1991 7:38 EDT
From: dab@pyuxe.cc.bellcore.com (dave ballard)
Subject: siphon tube end caps
Hey now- You know those little red thangs that fit on the end of the sihon
tubes? Does anyone know if they come in different sizes? When I racked
to my bottling bucket last night, there was total yeast carnage at the
bottom of my carboy resulting in more sludge than most superfund sites.
I ended up sacrificing about a quarter-inch of brew to avoid sucking up
the nasties. A longer end cap would have been helpful as I could have jammed
it into the trub as normal without having the opening submerged in slime.
later
dab
=======================================================================
Dave Ballard
dab@pyuxe.cc.bellcore.com
------------------------------
Date: 3 Oct 1991 8:25 EDT
From: dab@pyuxe.cc.bellcore.com (dave ballard)
Subject: bottle caps from hell
Hey now- I had a pretty bad cap experience last night and thought I'd
give a word of warning. The caps were over-runs, blue with "Clearly
Canadian" printed on them. When I boiled them for sanitation, the rubber
lining came off of every single one. At this point I had my beer/sugar
in the bottling bucket ready to go, so I was a little peeved. I decided
to try again- this time just bringing the water to a boil, turing the heat
off, and dumping the caps in. Within like 3 minutes half the caps
were peeling. I ended up having to drive to a friend's house to get more.
I plan on doing a little minor bitching to the place where I bought them,
but in the meantime I figured I'd spread the word to avoid these Canadian
caps from hell....
later
-dab
=======================================================================
Dave Ballard
dab@pyuxe.cc.bellcore.com
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 3 Oct 91 06:32:22 PDT
From: Greg Roody - dtn 237-7122 03-Oct-1991 0927 <roody@necsc.enet.dec.com>
Subject: Odd Cola...
Somebody wrote in yesterday about a spruce cola sold in Canada and that
made me remember "INCA COLA" which is very popular in Peru and other South
American countries. It tastes exactly like Bazooka Bubble gum, only you
don't get a comic with it. It's incredibly sweet and sicklingly gummy.
They must use xanthum (sp?) gum.
But the beer down there was very good.............
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 3 Oct 91 13:28 GMT
From: Tim Ness <0003073267@mcimail.com>
Subject: re: Geary's
In HBD #737 there is this comment:
>IN HBD #736 Jeff Frane asks about Geary's Ale.
>Brewed and bottled in Portland, ME. It is by far the best beer I've ever had
>from a microbrewery. Of course I haven't had nearly the range of opportunities
>that you on the west coast have. I can however recommend staying away from
>Wild Goose (from one of the Carolinas I believe).
It is interesting that you mention both Geary's and Wild Goose. The man
responsible for the recipe development of both brews is Alan Pugsley. Alan
is now Brewmaster at the Wild Goose Brewery in Cambridge Md. I believe both
breweries have similar equipment and brewing styles also via Alan's
participation in the setting up of the breweries.
It has been awhile since I have had a fresh Geary's ( I do remember enjoying
it however), but I see (taste) no reason why Wild Goose should be recommended
to stay away from. I bought a case fresh from Cambridge last weekend and still
find it to be one of the most refreshing Microbrewed beers on the East Coast.
It has a very HOPPY character but I doubt that should be enough for the bad
review. Was the sample you tried bought out of Mid Atlantic region ? Maybe it
was just an older bottle. Fresh is the only way to enjoy a brew, that's why
we homebrew anyway......Tim Ness
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 3 Oct 1991 9:55:16 -0400 (EDT)
From: R_GELINAS@UNHH.UNH.EDU (Russ Gelinas)
Subject: GMcD,Geary
Thanks, Dan K., for letting me know I'm not out of line in thinking that
Gritty McDuff's brew is lousy. Like you, neither my wife nor I could even
finish the pale ale (and we'll drink just about anything). I think Mr.
Davies would be much happier down the street at $3 Deweys.
Geary's Ale, though, is very good. Not as good as Sierra Nevada, but
better than most micro-beer I've tasted.
In my mailbox at work today: a bottle of Liefman's Kriek, direct from
Belgium! Yeehah!
Russ Gelinas
OPAL/ESP
UNH
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 3 Oct 91 10:16:49 EDT
From: Chris Shenton <chris@asylum.gsfc.nasa.gov>
Subject: Re: A call for recipes
On Wed, 02 Oct 91 08:39:16 -0700, night@mapme7.map.tek.com said:
Mark> I have noticed that most recipes posted are ones that the homebrewers
Mark> have yet to try... This disturbs me.
Like brewing a pig-in-a-poke...
Mark> Would every homebrewer who has brewed at least 10 batches post the recipe
Mark> of their ONE, and only one, FAVORITE batch?
Perhaps with the favorite-batch recipes people could say *why* this was a
good beer and compare it to commercial examples. Also, how they might tweak
it next time and what taste they were targetting -- if any. That way the
folks in HBD-land would know more closely what taste they were going to
get.
Perhaps you could collect and re-post? Or maybe archive them?
And are you interested in extract or all-grain recipes, or both?
Bis spaeter!
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 3 Oct 91 08:54:48 -0700
From: darryl@ism.isc.com (Darryl Richman)
Subject: re: Express bottle washing
Nuking bottles *may* be a good idea. But nuking dry bottles is not, as this
will burn out your magnetron bulb. If you want to sanitize with the uwave,
add an ounce or two of water and then boil the water for several minutes to
sanitize by steam heat. Unfortunately, this eliminates the advantage you
mentioned of not warming the bottles. I've done this a few times in
anticipation of bottling a few from the keg.
--Darryl Richman
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 3 Oct 91 11:07:14 CDT
From: bliss@csrd.uiuc.edu (Brian Bliss)
Subject: Munich Beer Recipe
on Barvarian Weizen:
Is the Wyeast a Weisse or a Weizen yeast? (I don't have a package
around to check) If it is a Weisse yeast, then the beer should be
quite sour, and I wouldln't be surprised with an weird smelling
fermentation.
I have never heard of adding amylaze to already fermenting
beer. A friend of mine mentioned it last night, and I
thought that one would add it during the mash. How well
does it work? (If this Batch has SG < 1, then pretty
well) but does anyone else have any practical expreience
adding it in the secondary?
- --------------------------
Recipes - heres my best so far:
Munich Beer:
10 lbs pale alt Malt
5 lbs munich malt
.5 lb dextrin malt
1.5 lb amber crystal malt
1 0z gypsum
.333 oz burton H2O salts
5.5 g hallertauer 90 min
1.5 oz cascade 60 min
.25 oz cascade 30 min
.25 cascade 15 min
wyeast munich beer yeast
the sparge stuck, so i got out a big strainer and sparged
individual 1 lb strainerfulls of grain. I let the stuff
settle, and it cleared up. After the boil, I had
3 gal 1.077 S.G. wort. fermented 2 months @ 40F, added
polyclar, racked and dryhopped with 1/4 oz hallertau
pellets two days later, moved to room temp a week later,
let sit for a week, and bottled. Finished the
last bottle the other night.
You should get twice as much with a good sparge.
The wort really needed to to be dry hopped longer -
the pellets never really completely dissolved,
and kind of filtered themselves out in the siphon.
Serve very cold or very warm.
bb
P.S. I had tried to post this recipe about a week
ago, at 2:20 in the morning. apparrently it got
to rob just as the digests were being packaged
for morning delivery, because it never would
up in the next day's (or the next day's) digest,
but the mail I sent 10 minutes earlier did.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 3 Oct 91 09:20:40 -0700
From: darryl@ism.isc.com (Darryl Richman)
Subject: re: request for homebrew mailings
mlh@cygnus.ta52.lanl.gov (Michael L. Hall) writes:
> I would like to get my name on ANY homebrew related
> mailing lists or digests. I am a homebrewer and the
> editor of our local homebrew club's newsletter.
I'm the (retiring) editor of "The Brews & News", the newsletter of the
Maltose Falcons Home Brewing Society (in LA). We run a newsletter
exchange program: you send us yours and we'll send you ours. Mail
a copy of yours to The Maltose Falcons, 22836 Ventura Blvd. #2,
Woodland Hills, CA 91364 and include a note about exchanging newsletters.
We exchange with about 50 clubs.
There are a surprising number of newsletter editors on this digest.
John Polstra of the Brews Brothers (Seattle), Doug Henderson of the
Oregon Brew Crew (Portland), Russ Wigglesworth of the San Andreas Malts
(San Francisco), I think that Russ Pencin of the Worts of Wisdom (San Jose),
Martin Lodahl of the Gold Country Brewers (Sacramento), Dr. John Lenz of
the IBUs (Ithaca, NY), and... and... well there must some more.
Also, there's a very active homebrew forum on CompuServe, sponsored
by the AHA. Costs a bunch to get on and read it, but there's a very
large and diverse population and a lot of interesting discussion. (How
come nobody has mentioned Anchor's spruce beer here?)
I believe that there are discussion groups on Prodigy and Genie, too,
but I haven't been on Prodigy in over 2 years, and I've never been on
Genie.
--Darryl Richman
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 3 Oct 91 12:32:40 -0400
From: adw3345@ultb.isc.rit.edu (A.D. Williams)
Subject: Re: Homebrew Digest #737 (October 03, 1991)
Well, last night I opened my first bottle of my first batch of homebrew.
The beer had a good head and a nice smell, and was definately alcoholic.
However, it had a very strong hops taste and was watery. Also, it was
dark and cloudy rather than pale yellow.
I used the standard malt-extract single stage fermentation method, which
I found to be the simplest to start with.
How can I improve this batch? Should I let it age further, or was there
something seriously wrong with the way I prepared it? Reading this
mailing list, I think it was said that a watery taste is a result of
using too much (corn) sugar. Is this true?
Thanks for any help, and I enjoy reading this mail group. Y'all are just
so wonderful :-).
Derrick
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 3 Oct 91 10:13:17 PDT
From: Marty Albini <martya@sdd.hp.com>
Subject: weizen experiment results
A while back, I began the search for the elusive
"wheat beer" character after brewing a batch that didn't have
much. I decided to isolate variables, and turn the knobs all
the way up on the ones under scrutiny. I brewed two batches: a
"doppelweizen," 1.090 OG of 100% wheat, very little hops, a
pure culture of S. delbruckii (the bavarian weizen yeast) from
MeV; then a barleywine (1.090 OG, same hops) which I poured
onto the yeast cake in the secondary left over from the first
batch.
The results were interesting, if not really
drinkable. Both finished at around 1.030, indicating that S.
delbruckii is not a very attenuative yeast, and proceeded at a
leisurely pace, starting slowly and behaving itself well (no
blown-out stoppers or foam gysers). Both beers were cloyingly
sweet. My guess is that another yeast tossed in after S.
delbruckii conks out would get these batches down around 1.010
or lower, and I understand this is the practice in Bavaria.
Why not mix the yeasts at pitching time? S.
delbruckii, I fear, would start so slowly and compete so
poorly that an agressive ale yeast would "eat its lunch," so
to speak. I have sworn off the Wyeast mixed-species wheat beer
yeast for that reason, as I noticed that very effect when I
used it. I've also had excellent wheat beers made with it, so
I suspect that the semi-random whims of Father Bacchus and
temperature have a lot to do with it.
BTW, since MeV is out of business, and Wyeast wants
$15 for a bag of S. delbruckii, I may have the only culture of
this yeast in SoCal. If anybody wants some, come see me soon!
The all-wheat beer had the clove aroma and complex,
fruity character I was looking for. It was quite pronounced,
in fact, but not unpleasently so. The flavor was just sort of
unbalanced, missing something that my untrained tongue can't
identify. It also had a soapy aftertaste that I noticed with
a couple of other 100% wheat batches I'd tasted, so I think
we can safely chalk this up to the malt alone.
The barleywine had the same complex flavors the
doppelweizen had, but much more subdued. I wouldn't think
"wheat beer" if someone handed me a glass without telling me
what it was; I'd think "wow, you fermented this much to warm
and the yeast must have up and died on you halfway thru."
There was such a rich mixture of strong flavors, it's hard to
distinguish them, but you wouldn't mistake it for the
doppelweizen. No soapy aftertaste, for one thing.
So it's not the yeast alone. It's not the grain alone.
In fact, it's not the grain and the yeast together either; I
think the flavor isn't complete without some barley malt. I
guess when I get that figured out I'll start fooling with hops
too, but I'm content to get the sweet stuff right for the
moment.
That yeast cake is now fermenting its third batch
(thanks for the tip, Fr. Barleywine!) with a 2:1 mix of wheat
and barley malts. When it finishes up, I'm going to pitch some
Whitbread and let it eat (after the obligatory tasting and
gravity measuring). I'll probably mix my two experiments and
do the same, for a kickass wheat beer for the winter.
Which will probably be spent somewhere else. As of
10/15/91, I will no longer be employed by HP, and won't have
access to this fine publication. So if anybody out there wants
to get ahold of me electronically, beter do it soon! It's been
fun, I've learned a lot, met some interesting people. Hope to
see many of you again.
- --
________________________________________________Marty Albini___________
"To enjoy the flavor of life, take big bites. Moderation is for monks."
phone : (619) 592-4177
UUCP : {hplabs|nosc|hpfcla|ucsd}!hp-sdd!martya
Internet : martya@sdd.hp.com
US mail : Hewlett-Packard Co., 16399 W. Bernardo Drive, San Diego CA 92127-1899 USA
------------------------------
Date: 3 Oct 91 14:32:00 EDT
From: "DRCV06::GRAHAM" <graham%drcv06.decnet@drcvax.af.mil>
Subject: Hop ecstasy.
A few digests ago a poster observed that he got an extra kick from
homebrews, even if they weren't especially high in alcohol. This is easily
explained. Nearly every herbal medicine book will tell you that hops are
classed as hypnotics. The lupulins are a great barbituate.
fHomebrew relaxes you as much because of the hops as for the ethanol. If
you want to prove this, make some tea from a few hop pellets, plugs or
dried cones. Sweeten it a bit and drink up. You'll probably be asleep in
a little while.
Hops have been used as a soporific for thousands of years. They work even
better if mixed with catnip, valarian and scullcap.
Hoppy Oktoberfest,
Dan
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 3 Oct 91 11:44:23 PDT
From: greg@cemax.com (Greg Wageman)
Subject: Re: Express bottle washing
Jim Buchman writes:
>Is there any reason that microwaving the bottles for a couple minutes at
>high power wouldn't do the trick equally well? This would fry the little
>nasty contaminants directly and not unduly heat the glass ( I would
>imagine). It would be faster than heating /cooling in the dishwasher
>or oven, and you wouldn't have to worry about annealing the glass.
It's my understanding that microwave energy requires moisture to generate
heat (those bi-polar water molecules oscillating in the field, you know).
Dry, clean bottles wouldn't have any reason to heat up; the question
still remains, would it disrupt the microbes? I don't know.
The reason some of us use the dishwasher is that it does the double duty
of washing *and* sanitizing in one step. What I do is rinse the bottles
thoroughly with hot water immediately after pouring the beer. This removes
the yeast cake and prepares the bottle for storage. I then put the rinsed
bottles back into the (originally empty) case.
When a batch is ready for bottling, I first clean the dishwasher. If
yours has a screen for catching large food particles (some do; some
grind it up), this must be cleaned first, otherwise you'll be bathing
your bottles in the remains of last week's dinner. I usually run the
thing through one wash cycle, empty, with a couple of tablespoons
chlorine bleach, then allow it to rinse itself. Then I fill it with
two cases of bottles, bottom rack first, overflow to the top rack.
Repeat the above cycle: 1 wash with bleach, one rinse, this time with a
hot dry cycle. (Now admittedly this may be overkill, but the one thing
I *hate* is to have a batch ruined by an infection. It helps me not to
worry.)
I find that if I start this before I begin the rest of the preparations
for bottling (sanitizing another carboy for racking, boiling caps,
etc.), the bottles have dried and cooled to the point where I can use
them straight out of the dishwasher when I'm ready.
-Greg
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 2 Oct 91 23:51 CDT
From: arf@ddsw1.mcs.com (Jack Schmidling)
Subject: MISC
To: Homebrew Digest
Fm: Jack Schmidling
From: afd@hera.cc.bellcore.com (adietz)
Subject: Re: NITROSAMINES (Jack Schmidling)
>Dammit Jack - I'm an engineer, not a medical doctor!
>What are the physiological effects of nitrosamines and why
should I be concerned about this?
They turn engineers into feedstock for funeral directors. They are
carcinogenic.
.........
From: Jeff Frane <70670.2067@compuserve.com>
>To Jack Schmidling: That's Briess, with two "ss".
Thanks you. The bags at Baderbrau said "Chilton" on them and spelling isn't
obvious over the phone.
> Has your "limited research" gotten any farther than the notes I passed
along from Great Western Malting?
My apology for not crediting you as a source. Other than that, the "research
is limited to what was detailed in the article. The insight in crystal malt
came from Noonan as mentioned in another article.
I have also been told that Great Western sells malt made by other sources and
would appreciate any info you have on them to the contrary.
>Before anyone goes reeling off to drink Coors (eeagh!) do remember that GW
switched to an indirect process a number of years ago. They supply pale malt
(primarily Klages) to virtually all the west coast breweries, both mega- and
micro-. I *know* they use an indirect process because I've toured their
Vancouver plant at least four times, and have a friend who works there.
The local brewshop seems to carry only Briess.
From: Jeff Frane <70670.2067@compuserve.com>
Subject: Comments in General
>On the subject of oxidation and momilies, etc....
>Has Jack Schmidling never tasted oxydized beer?
ARF says:
As I have never tasted anyone else's hombrew and have been using the roundly
condemned procedure all my brewing life, a no answer would prove my case
wouldn't it?
Well, to be totally objective, I suspect that "off" taste that an occasional
batch aquires, just might be what y'all are talking about. The problem was
particularly persistant when I was kegging beer. (5 gal of beer in a 7.5 gal
keg) It is entirely possible that all my beer was potentially bad but I
drank it faster than it could oxidize. The "off" taste I have in mind took a
month or more to develop.
>If that's the case, I would be happy to let him join us in judging homebrew
at the Oregon State Fair next May; I'm sure we'll find him some good--well,
bad--examples.
I suspect this would be of help to all home brewers. As with pictures, a
taste is worth a thousand words. However, even that is misleading. I will
give you an example:
The guy who criticized my billowing foam guaranteed that it will taste
"cidery" because of oxidation. Never having tasted beer that tasted like
apple cider, I brought him a bottle of my "off flavor" beer to see if that is
what he meant by cider.
His comment: "nothing wrong with this beer, could use a little more hops
though".
I have posted another article ("Plastic") on the beer actually made in the
video.
...............
You can all ignore the article on "Plastic". Bad science. The last bottle
was as yucky as the glass ones.
jack
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 3 Oct 91 13:02:09 -0700
From: scarter@qualcomm.com (Steve Carter)
Subject: High Fermentation Temps
I've been battling the San Diego summer heat for my last two batches, and
realized that I don't fully understand the enemy...
I understandthat high temperatures during primary fermentation causes
overactive yeasties and off flavors, but how about in the secondary, when
most of the fermentation is complete? How about during aging in the
bottles or keg?
On a similar note, how does changing the temperature affect the beer at
these different stages. I've heard the conventional wisdom about not
taking bottles out of the fridge, warming them, then returning them to the
fridge, but is this really a problem? Such antics may become necessary for
me soon when I buy a fridge for brewing: if I'm in the middle of lagering,
and want to start another batch, I'll need to warm the fridge to 65 degrees
for my primary for a few days. Will my lager be angry? What will happen
if I'm keeping my finished, drinkable kegs in the fridge and bounce their
temp up and down a few times? On the other hand, maybe I should just relax
and wait for the winter ;-).
Steve Carter
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 3 Oct 91 16:10:27 PDT
From: smithey@esosun.css.gov (Brian Smithey)
Subject: Samuel Adams' Boston Ale
On a trip to Boston a couple of years ago I had some Sam Adam's Boston
Ale on tap at a restaurant. At the time I was told that it wasn't bottled,
only available in kegs; I even seem to recall that it was brewed in
Boston, not in PA, but I could be wrong about that. Anyway, I saw an
"article"/ad the other day in "All About Beer" that had a photo of
bottled SA Ale. Has anybody seen SA Ale in bottles, particularly out
on the West coast? Does anybody know of plans to start shipping this
stuff around the country?
Thanks,
Brian
- --
Brian Smithey
smithey@esosun.css.gov - uunet!seismo!esosun!smithey
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 3 Oct 91 16:19:41 PDT
From: bgros@sensitivity.berkeley.edu (Bryan Gros)
Subject: cleaning blow-off tube
i finally filled my carboy up to 5gal or more last time, and sure
enough, lots of brown foamy stuff was pushed through the tube and
into my mason jar of water. in fact, too much stuff, so i had to clean
the wall and floor the first night...mason jars aren't big enough!
the question is, now my blow off tube is coated with hard brown stuff
on the inside. how do i get this out? or do i need to clean it?
In all three batches so far, i have not removed the blow off tube to
put an air lock on the carboy; i simply leave the tube on in a jar
of sanitized water. seems like the same thing as an airlock to me.
but the foam had a week to dry in the tube. surely you people that
blow off krausen don't buy a new tube every time??
- Bryan
bgros@sensitivity.berkeley.edu
p.s. so are there no homebrew clubs in the east bay? or in SF?
------------------------------
End of HOMEBREW Digest #738, 10/04/91
*************************************
-------
