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Lambic Digest #0815
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Date: Thu, 14 Mar 1996 00:30:07 -0700
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Subject: Lambic Digest #815 (March 14, 1996)
Lambic Digest #815 Thu 14 March 1996
Forum on Lambic Beers (and other Belgian beer styles)
Mike Sharp, Digest Coordinator
Contents:
Orval, comments on microbiology of (Todd Gierman)
Server Problems? (TAyres)
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Date: Wed, 13 Mar 1996 10:26:28 -0500
From: tmgierma at acpub.duke.edu (Todd Gierman)
Subject: Orval, comments on microbiology of
Paul Edwards supplies some great technical information on Orval. Thank
goodness for people who get out and travel. I'll take a moment to add a
couple of comments.
>c) The yeast stains are kept in the laboratory:
> 1 yeast strain is used in the main fermentation process
> 5 strains are used for secondary fermentaion; the strain
> used in the main process is also used for additional
> fermentation in the bottle
My culturing endeavors support this information. I have recovered in
addition to a S. cerevisiae yeast 2-6 strains of Brettanomyces. I say 2-6
because I recovered 6 morphological variants (colony morphology). However,
in liquid medium I can only distinguish clearly 2 morphologies and
flocculation profiles. Flocculation type 1 is very powdery, but settles
readily. Flocculation type 2 forms large clumps and seems to have greater
ability to form a pellicle. None of the strains could assimilate galactose
in my hands indicating that none are Br. lambicus. All seemed to have
assimiliation profiles of Br. bruxellensis. Anyway, this all fits with the
information.
>fermetation and bottle conditioning takes place at 15 deg C; primary
>fermetation is 1 week, followed by secondary fermenatation they call
>lagering for 3 weeks,
Now we understand Jackson's confusion about the use of "5 lager strains"
for bottling.
It seems that the mystery of Orval has been nearly unraveled in the Lambic
Digest over the course of a year and a half. One question still remains:
what prompted them to use a Brettanomyces secondary in the first place?
It's interesting to note that DeDolle has an Orval knockoff, which I have
never had, and that they also use Br. lambicus in their high gravity
products like Stille Nacht, Bos Kuen and Oerbier (and a lacto bug). I'd
like to know the overall rationale for using Brett in these beers. Sure it
gives them interesting flavor and helps make them great, but it can also
backfire by causing off flavors (a significant portion of Orval on U.S.
shelves).
Todd
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Date: Wed, 13 Mar 1996 15:33:02 -0500
From: TAyres at aol.com
Subject: Server Problems?
Hi, Folks--
Sorry to post this message here, but I was dropped from the Lambic Digest
list due to AOL problems about two weeks ago after many months of happy
reading. Several attempts to resubscribe have proved unsuccessful -- I have
received neither Digests nor any auto-response to my subscription requests.
Is the list closed now? Can I get back on? I really miss receiving it, so
I hope this post resolves the problem. Apologies to Mr. Mast -- Brews tells
me these kinds of posts get you a little tweaked.
Lambic-less in Vermont,
Tom Ayres
TAyres at aol.com
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End of Lambic Digest
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