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Date: Fri, 16 Feb 1996 00:30:07 -0700
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Subject: Lambic Digest #790 (February 16, 1996)
Lambic Digest #790 Fri 16 February 1996
Forum on Lambic Beers (and other Belgian beer styles)
Mike Sharp, Digest Coordinator
Contents:
RE: Lambic Digest #783 (February 08, 1996) ("Manning Martin MP")
fecal thoughts (Todd Gierman)
Belgian Beer Tour
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Date: 12 Feb 1996 12:34:47 U
From: "Manning Martin MP" <manning_martin_mp at mcst.ae.ge.com>
Subject: RE: Lambic Digest #783 (February 08, 1996)
CR Saikley (how's your head?) wrote:
>Based on this admittedly somewhat anecdotal evidence, I propose that
>a vital element in the making of a Flanders Red/Brown is simply time.
I can add another piece of anecdotal evidence to support this assertion. A
member of our club, Ray Spangler, shared a sour brown beer with me several
years ago. It was very sour indeed, and so off in lactic/acetic balance that
it tasted very much like vinegar. He gave me a bottle, which I graciously
accepted, but had no intention of drinking. It wound up in the back of my
beer cooler, and sat at 48 degrees F for over a year. When I was cleaning
the cooler out, I found the beer and opened it, mostly "in the interest of
science." It was so good I stopped what I was doing, sat down to enjoy the
rest of the bottle, and called Ray immediately to express my astonishment.
(As an aside, Ray was "out there" doing this kind of thing long before most
of us, taking best of show at the '87 AHA Natonal with a Belgian Ale, a
Saison I think.)
MPM
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 15 Feb 1996 13:38:06 -0500 (EST)
From: Todd Gierman <tmgierma at acpub.duke.edu>
Subject: fecal thoughts
Dave Sapsis' adroit comments prodded me enough to share this thought:
Let's try to lose the enteric/fecal thing as a descriptor of aroma and
flavor. First of all, it's really disgusting. Just try to persuade
anybody that such characteristics are desirable in any type of food
or beverage item. Second, I think that it is misleading because it seems
to suggest that this characteristic is a direct result of a primary
fermentation involving enteric bacteria. There is really no direct
evidence to back this up, only inference. You can certainly get these
aromas coming from the secondary/tertiary stage of fermentation even when
no enterics are involved. My wife who complains quite loudly from an
adjacent room whenever a bottle from a certain batch is poured can attest
to that ("God, what smells!?"). Do barrels of 1-2 month old fermenting
lambic emit such noxious odors? I don't recall this being in anyones
description - usually people express their surprise at how mellow it is.
I know that the Leuvan theses have emphasized the role of enterobacteriae
in the fermentation of lambic, but I suspect that it may be neither
universal nor critical. I have received samples from young Boon and have
been unable to culture out enterics, nor do the samples smell
particularly enteric. I think that Brettanomyces is largely responsible
for the characteristics that we perceive in lambics (except for lactic
souring). Of course, the lactic bugs may also contribute characteristics
as may some other types of yeast. However, I think that that
"vegetal/enteric/fecal" thing is Brett secondary/tertiary fermentation.
I think that enterics tend to produce a really disgusting cheese-like
odor in wort that is distinctly different from what we are talking about
here.
Todd
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 15 Feb 96 16:01:48 EST
From: "Houseman, David L TR" <DLH1 at trpo3.Tr.Unisys.com>
Subject: Belgian Beer Tour
Date: Thu, 15 Feb 96 16:14:00 EST
Message-ID: <3123A18B at trpo1.tr.unisys.com>
Encoding: 31 TEXT
X-Mailer: Microsoft Mail V3.0
I was given a notice of a beer tour of Belgium for this September by an
acquaintance (no connection to this other than to provide the favor of
letting homebrewers in the states know about this). Some specifics in case
anyone wants to contact the conductor about this tour:
* Discover More Than 400 Beers
* Dates: Sept 14-21, 1996
* Hops festival in Popperingen, hops capital of the world (only once every 3
years)
* Beer museums in Bruges and Brussels
* Breweries in Esen, Bruges, Brussels, Chimay, Oval, Hoegaaren and more;
meet the experts
* Lots of beer-tasting opportunities
* Great Gastronomical meals
* Shopping for beer, lace and chocolate!
* Minimum of 30 participants; max 50
* Price about $1000, depending on number of participants
* Price includes local transportation, lodging, all visits, all meals
* Registration deadline is March 15, 1996
* Participants responsible for providing transportation to Brussels
Send inquires and information to register to:
H. Delori FAX 32 2 728 0484
EMAIL delorih at everpo1.be.unisys.com
Again, no connection other than a potential participant.
------------------------------
End of Lambic Digest
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