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From: lambic-request at lance.colostate.edu (subscription requests only - do not post here)
To: lambic at lance.colostate.edu
Subject: Lambic Digest #556 (March 12, 1995)
Date: Sun, 12 Mar 1995 00:30:27 -0700
Lambic Digest #556 Sun 12 March 1995
Forum on Lambic Beers (and other Belgian beer styles)
Mike Sharp, Digest Coordinator
Contents:
RE: Rajotte's AHA/AOB style book / yeast source (uswlsrap)
Re: Belgian Ale Recipes ("Andrew R. Ruggles")
Oregon Fruit Products (Michael Sharp)
Re: Rajotte's Belgian "book" (Jeff Frane)
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----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 10 Mar 1995 10:50:52 EST
From: uswlsrap at ibmmail.com
Subject: RE: Rajotte's AHA/AOB style book / yeast source
David Moos asks about recipes in the BELGIAN ALE book.
Beware the typos!! There are several. Most or all should be obvious.
Just ask yourself if it makes sense when you read it and do the right thing.
I don't typically use recipes from books, but will use them as very rough
guides to tell myself whether I'm on track with one I formulate. That having
been said, I've "used" the saison, wit, and oud bruin ones with some success.
Yeast?? Use one appropriate for the style, whether you culture it yourself
from a commercial brew or buy a Yeast Lab, Wyeast, et cetera.
ON THE TOPIC OF YEASTS AND OTHER FUNNY BUGS: Brian Nummer has a catalogue
out (sorry don't have it with me to give you address/phone/email) with some
interesting looking stuff. (almost standard disclaimer--no financial interest,
and also not (yet) a satisfied customer because I haven't ordered yet)
Most are reasonably priced, with a few as high as ten bucks (which may also be
reasonable for what you get) I'm sure someone out there can provide the
communications details so you can request a catalogue.
Now go have a beer,
Bob Paolino / Disoriented in Badgerspace / uswlsrap at ibmmail.com
- ------------THIS SPACE UNDERGOING RENOVATION-------------------
(I was getting tired of the Crash Test Dummies quote)
- ---------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 10 Mar 95 11:36:46 -0500
From: "Andrew R. Ruggles" <rugg0002 at gold.tc.umn.edu>
Subject: Re: Belgian Ale Recipes
David Moos writes if reference ot Rajotte's book:
> 1) Most or all of his recipes call for Pale Malt.Can or should Belgian
> Pilsner Malt be used?
Any good malt can be used. Quality and freshness seem to be the factors.
> 2) Has anyone tried his recipes and if so what are your likes and dislikes?
I'd be surprised if anybody on the LD made one verbatem. In general, it's a good
jumping off point. Everybody's results will differ, and thus corrections will
be made accordingly.
> 3) What yeasts should be used for the recipes?
I once did a search on past LD's (about 300 or so) for the word "critter." I
remember coming up with something like 57 different occurances. Fascinating. The
yeast in a Belgian Ale is a passionate soul. Stay away from those wallflower
types. I personnally do not like the Wyeast 1214. Not because it is a
wallflower, but because I don't like its attitude - very aggressive, but hard to
put in balance. I don't get that fine Brie character - more of a food and fuel
quickstop kind of character. I gave up on commercial Belgian yeast a few years
ago (though the selection has improved dramatically since then), so I would buy
a few commercial Belgian Ale products, dump the dregs on a starter, see if it
comes up, and then taste it to see if I liked it. Somewhat empiracal, but what
the hell, it seemed to work. Which ones have viable "critters"? Ah, the search
goes on....
Cheers,
Andrew
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 10 Mar 1995 10:25:14 -0800
From: Michael Sharp <msharp at Synopsys.COM>
Subject: Oregon Fruit Products
Hi,
(I'm sure this has appeared before, but here it is again.)
No, I haven't tried this stuff, but I plan to.
I just received an information packet from Oregon Fruit Products.
They provide "aseptic puree" of a number of different kinds of fruit.
This is substantially cheaper than buying frozen fruit retail
PROVIDED you are willing to buy 42lbs. (from what I've seen for
prices in the local market)
Oregon Fruit Products
150 Patterson St. NW
PO Box 5283
Salem, OR 97304-0283
(503)581-5211
Bryan Brown and Sara Barlew appear to handle sales (?)
Price/lb
for 42lb case
Oregon Strawberry $0.75
Red Raspberry $1.40
Blueberry $0.65
Marion Blackberry $0.75
Oregon Boysenberry $1.15
Bing Cherry (Dark Sweet)$0.65
Purple Plums $0.45
Apple $0.40
Red Tart Cherry $0.45
Peach $0.40
Black Raspberry $1.80
info from the sales literature:
"Aseptic is sterile. Product is microbiologically sterile. Laboratory
testing done on all production."
"Aseptic may be shipped dry. Save frozen transportation costs by shipping
dry. substantial savings shipping overseas."
"Flash cooked & immediately cooled. Color and flavor is maintained by short
heating time and immediate cooling before packaging."
"Aseptic contains no preservatives."
[hmm, fruit wines anyone?]
Std disclaimer: I'm not a farmer, I don't own an orchard or a field of
fruit. I also have no interest in this company nor do I play a lawyer/doctor
on TV who would have such an interest.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 10 Mar 1995 13:24:54 -0800 (PST)
From: Jeff Frane <gummitch at teleport.com>
Subject: Re: Rajotte's Belgian "book"
David Moos writes:
>
> I have just read Pierre Rajotte's book on Belgian Ales and I have a couple of
> questions.
>
> 1) Most or all of his recipes call for Pale Malt.Can or should Belgian
> Pilsner Malt be used?
>
> 2) Has anyone tried his recipes and if so what are your likes and dislikes?
>
> 3) What yeasts should be used for the recipes?
>
You will undoubtedly get quite a response to this -- Rajotte's book is
something of a sore point among homebrewers who've had a little more
exposure to Belgian beers and brewing procedures. You should take it
with a grain of salt.
In limited defense of Rajotte, I would say that his book was published
(as I recall, anyway) just before Belgian malts became widely available
here in the U.S. There is a lot of useful information about them,
consequently, that doesn't appear there (see George Fix's article in the
premiere issue of Brewing Techniques). You should definitely use
Belgian pilsner malt if it's available to you.
You should pretty much ignore most (all?) of what Rajotte writes about
sugar -- if you can even sort it out.
You should definitely ignore what he says about fermentation
temperatures--keep the temps down!
For recipes, see Phil Seitz's article in the latest Zymurgy (caveat:
ignore my hopping rates, and pull them down by 1/3).
Good yeasts are definitely available. Do NOT use Wyeast's 1214 Belgian
ale yeast unless you are simian; my personal favorite is Wyeast's 3944.
LaChouffe is also commercially available, along with several other
strains. These are good, aromatic, alcohol-tolerant yeasts.
As I recall, Rajotte doesn't mention the use of flaked maize, but it is
in some favor in Belgium.
Others will no doubt have more (and better) to add.
- --Jeff Frane
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End of Lambic Digest
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