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From: lambic-request at lance.colostate.edu (subscription requests only - do not post here)
To: lambic at lance.colostate.edu
Subject: Lambic Digest #490 (November 22, 1994)
Date: Tue, 22 Nov 1994 00:30:20 -0700
Lambic Digest #490 Tue 22 November 1994
Forum on Lambic Beers (and other Belgian beer styles)
Mike Sharp, Digest Coordinator
Contents:
Re: A Ghost in the Machine (Spencer.W.Thomas)
Correction on E-150 (Jim Busch)
Eric Toft's recipe guidelines (Jim Busch)
Scoresheets ahoy ("Phillip R. Seitz")
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----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 21 Nov 94 12:58:26 EST
From: Spencer.W.Thomas at med.umich.edu
Subject: Re: A Ghost in the Machine
I think this has been said before, but I'll say it again: Phillippe
Perpete, in his presentation at the SoB, explicitly said that Brett
went into Orval at bottling, along with a S.c. I don't think he's got
any reason to lie to us.
On the subject of "how many yeasts?" Eric Toft said that in the
brewery he worked at, they used 8 yeasts to make 14 beers (including
Verboten Vrucht (sp?), the "secret" of which he did NOT share with us.)
=Spencer in Ann Arbor, MI
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 21 Nov 1994 14:47:11 -0500 (EST)
From: Jim Busch <busch at daacdev1.stx.com>
Subject: Correction on E-150
Good to know you SoBers (doesnt that sound great!) are paying attention.
Ive already received a note reminding me that E150 and wort similar sugar
are distinct entities. E-150 being the coloring agent. What is known as
"wort similar sugar" contains:
35% glucose
32% maltose
12% maltotriose
21% dextrines
Now if someone has the specs handy on actual wort breakdown , it
might be interesting to see how close this is.
Jim Busch
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 21 Nov 1994 17:00:56 -0500 (EST)
From: Jim Busch <busch at daacdev1.stx.com>
Subject: Eric Toft's recipe guidelines
AS promised, I brought Eric's notes with me. Here are some rough
guidelines to be followed in recipe formulation:
BTW: here is the commonly available forms of E-150:
26-27 EBC
34-36 EBC (Most common)
40-41 EBC
Pils:
up to 30% corn or rice, rice better for taste (dryer)
remainder malt (2 or 6 row). Usually not more than 20% of total grist from
6 row (used to compensate for lack of husk in adjunct). Remainder Pils malt.
If >20% adjuncts be careful of sluggish fermentation due to amino acid
deficiency.
EX: 25% Rice
60% Pils
15% malt from 6 row winter barley
OR
20% Corn
80% Pils
Other:
for an all malt beer to export to Germany, 100% Pils, hell and maybe
some vienna malt.
up to 10% caramel malts (I would assume the lightest like caraPils-JB)
wheat starch possible in mash for heavier beers and the addition of
sugar in the kettle is also an option.
EX: 100% Vienna employing a double decoction mash to enhance character.
or
80% hell malt
10% caramel malt
10% wheat starch
some kettle sugar is also an option
********************** end Pils ******************
********************** British Beers ************
Pale Ale:
up to 25% corn (usually in none or 15-25%)
50-75% pale ale malt
0-15% Pils malt
0-10% darker caramel malt
6 row malt possible in adjunct beers
EX: 15% corn
80% pale ale malt
5% caramel malt
or
20% corn
60% pale ale
20% pils malt
Scotch Ale:
up to 15% corn
up to 10% caramel
up to 2.5% roasted barley
up to 85% hell or vienna malt
wheat starch possible
up to 25% sugar usually in wort similar composition
EX:
90% Vienna
2.5% roasted barley
7.5% wheat starch
20% of total extract as wort similar sugar in kettle
OR
90% vienna (I see a pattern here-JB)
10% dark caramel
15% sucrose
Stout:
up to 2.5% roasted barley
up to 8% chocolate (that would be a chocolaty stout!-JB)
up to 95% vienna or pale malt (again a trend-JB)
lactose in kettle if desired for a milk stout
********************** end British Beers ************************
********************** Belgian Ales ****************************
Belgian Ales (11-13.5 Plato):
up to 15% corn
up to 80% pils or vienna malt
fraction of 6 row occaisonal
up to 10% aromatic or brumalt
EX: 15% corn
75% vienna
10% pils
or
15% corn
75% pils
10% aromatic
or
90% vienna
10% aromatic
Trappists, Abdij, Strong Ales:
up to 15% corn but rare
pils or hell malt, usually pils
caramel malts or chocolate possible
sugar: no more than 20% of total extract. Added near the end of boil with enough
time to allow for thorough mixing. Crystalline or liquid possible: dextrose,
sucrose, invert, normal and dark candij, A wort similar sugar must be used when
sugar is greater than 20% of total extract to avoid the crabtree effect.
In many strong dark beers (Excluding British beers) color comes to a great extent
from caramelized sugar (E-150) or from dark candij (== caramelized candij). These
beers often dont have a true dark malt character (notable exception is Westmalle
Dubbel). In other dark beers and even in light colored beers, E150 is used as
a color correction since malts can vary considerably in color. Caramel, chocolate
and aromatic vary even greater. Actual color may vary by +/- 10 EBC.
EX:
15% corn
85% pils
or
100% Pils with 20% of total extract from dextrose in kettle
or
60% hell malt
35% pils malt
5% caramel malt
20% of total extract from dark candi in kettle
or
95% pils
5% caramel
5% total extract as invert sugar
Brown beers:
up to 15% corn
up to 15% caramel or aromatic malt
up to 85% pils or hell malt
color only through dark candij also possible (in this case use 100% pils)
White Beers:
up to 40% raw wheat
rest pils or hell, 6 row possible
oats possible
Lambic:
up to 40% raw wheat
rest pils or hell
************************* end Belgian ales*****************
Ill wrap this up with a humorous tidbit that Eric told us during his
talk. Apparently the brewer at Westmalle dumps the entire kettle break
(hot and cold trub) directly into his fermenter. Seems he doesnt want
to waste anything! Tell this to the next brewer scientist who says
"this is the only *proper* way to make a beer".
Jim Busch
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 21 Nov 94 22:28:44 -0400
From: "Phillip R. Seitz" <p00644 at psilink.com>
Subject: Scoresheets ahoy
This is just a note to say that I'll be mailing the judging sheets for
the Spirit of Belgium competition tomorrow morning, Tuesday Nov. 23.
I'll also be sending in the competition report within a week, so all
our hard-working judges and stewards can get credit for their work.
Thanks once again to all for a job well done!
------------------------------
End of Lambic Digest
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