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Lambic Digest #0395
From postmaster at longs.lance.colostate.edu Wed Jul 13 03:32:24 1994
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Subject: Lambic Digest #395 (July 13, 1994)
Date: Wed, 13 Jul 1994 00:30:10 -0600
Lambic Digest #395 Wed 13 July 1994
Forum on Lambic Beers (and other Belgian beer styles)
Mike Sharp, Digest Coordinator
Contents:
Lotsa stuff ("Phillip Seitz")
sour mash / oul brun-red (Aaron Birenboim)
plambic & oak ("Norman Dickenson")
Goudenband ("Anton Verhulst")
Sorry, Little More Data (Martin Lodahl)
Oxygen and pLambic (Ed Hitchcock)
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Date: Tue, 12 Jul 94 09:16:27 -0400
From: "Phillip Seitz" <p00644 at psilink.com>
Subject: Lotsa stuff
Brian Moore asks:
>Also, does anyone out there have a good recipe for Liefman's Goudenband?
I think this is the challenge of the year, just as everybody was trying
to brew white beers last year. Your guess is as good as mine (at least
until we see how the BURP Guys' batches turn out).
Jay Hersh asked where to buy lactobacillus:
Here at BURP labs we have a split batch fermenting. In one carboy is
the Head Start Oud Bruin culture (which is supposed to contain lots of
nice bugs) and on the other is the Liefman's culture (which doesn't)
along with a L. delbruckii strain (this last also from Head Start).
The L. delbruckii was very interesting to start up. I made up 2 ozs of
MRS broth (also available from HS) and innoculated it with the culture.
The whole thing went into a beer bottle with a stopper on it, which I
put into our oven. With the pilot light on the oven is usually 100F.
About five days later when I pulled the bottle out it had a wonderfully
clean, sour smell.
So far I haven't heard how the split batch is doing, but if anything
obviously works or doesn't work I'll let everyone know.
Martin Wilde says:
>While I was at Lindemanns, I found out that Hansens obtains there wort
>(inoculated) from Lindemanns. Amazing the difference between one
>blender and another. Maybe Lindemanns could learn from Hansens...
I'm delighted more people are getting turned on to Hansens. However,
they ALSO get wort from the Girardin brewery in St. Ulricks Kapelle,
and as far as I'm concerned Girardin also makes some of the very best
gueuze products. Fortunately these products are relatively easy to
find in Belgium, so check 'em out! (When Jim Busch and I were at
Drinks Wets last year all the Girardin products were available in polypins!)
Phil
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 12 Jul 1994 07:02:04 -0700
From: mole at netcom.com (Aaron Birenboim)
Subject: sour mash / oul brun-red
on sour mashes: I had several of doug's lambics at the conference.
the one which tool second was, indeed, excellent. others were definitely
sour mashes. Martin seems to be right. luck plays a big role.
On goudenband (a flanders brown/red)... Brian nummer sells a
flanders brown culture, and an L. Delbreuckii. I mention this even
though I am not yet a happy customer. We have bounced e-mail a few times,
but have yet to get an order together. Would anybody be offended If I
asked brian to post a VOICE TELEPHONE NUMBER??? I know he's not getting
rich doing this. I think that a short conversation could get my order
togeather. (He MAY also have Brett... i dunno.)
aaron
------------------------------
Date: 12 Jul 1994 08:29:51 U
From: "Norman Dickenson" <norman.dickenson at Sonoma.EDU>
Subject: plambic & oak
Subject: Time:8:13 AM
OFFICE MEMO plambic & oak Date:7/12/94
I did a plambic about eight months ago for which the primary fermentation
was in glass, and then I racked to a new amerikan oak
cask for a one month secondary fermentation. Pedio and Brett were
added at beginning of secondary. The beer was then racked to stainless
to await the butterfly. As might be expected, it absolutely reeked of
oak and tasted like a tree. I figured that I could use it to blend into
something else down the road. Well, suprise...suprise!! Seven months
later I tasted it and found an absolutely bright, light, very sour, mildly
horsey and drinkable plambic. While the oak aroma is still fairly noticible,
the oakiness in the flavor has all but disappeared. This experience is
counter
to the prevailing wisdom of avoiding amerikan oak casks. I will, of course,
continue to age my plambic and will probably ultimately use it for both
a gueuze and a kriek. " Next time" I expect I will alter some procedures
to be more in step with prevailing thoughts on production methods.
-norman-
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 12 Jul 94 13:42:39 -0400
From: "Anton Verhulst" <verhulst at zk3.dec.com>
Subject: Goudenband
Brian Moore asks:
>Also, does anyone out there have a good recipe for Liefman's Goudenband?
>I've heard the grain bill contains only pale and crystal malts. What about
>hops and yeast? Is it possible to get that much complexity in a homebrew?
I used a pale malt plus a little chocolate and black patent (3 oz each
in a 10 gallon batch). The yeast was cultured from a bottle of Liefmans.
The brew came out way too phenolic. Before pitching, I plated out the
bottle dregs and found nothing unusual (no bacteria). In case Liefmans
pitches serveral different strains, I made a starter by selecting a random
group of 12 or so colonies from the plate. Can any one explain the high
(much higher that Goudenband) phenol levels? The beer is drinkable - barely.
- --Tony Verhulst
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 12 Jul 1994 10:56:26 -0700 (PDT)
From: malodah at pbgueuze.scrm2700.PacBell.COM (Martin Lodahl)
Subject: Sorry, Little More Data
In Lambic Digest #394 John DeCarlo wanted more:
> Martin writes:
> >And just another data point: the best faux-lambic I've tasted to date
> >was a Kriek fermented entirely in glass, single-stage. I'd been
> >thinking the same thing as Scott has, until I tasted that one.
> >Wood was involved, however, in the form of French oak shavings.
>
> Tell us more. Was it a full carboy, or was there plenty of headspace?
> How was the oak used?
Unfortunately, we only had time for a two-minute exchange in a crowded
hall, standing next to Glenn Tinseth's table at an event in the '93
AHA Conference. I don't know how full the carboy was, but he was so
casual about it that I assumed that there was nothing unusual there.
The chips were just boiled and tossed in. He (I can't recall his name,
for the life of me) was a microbiologist, and felt the "secret" was
in the critters, which were a mixture of bottle cultures and ASBC
cultures. Sorry, that's all he told me ...
- Martin
= Martin Lodahl Systems Analyst, Capacity Planning, Pacific*Bell =
= malodah at pacbell.com Sacramento, CA USA 916.972.4821 =
= If it's good for ancient Druids runnin' nekkid through the wuids, =
= Drinkin' strange fermented fluids, it's good enough for me! (Unk.) =
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 12 Jul 1994 15:18:37 -0300
From: Ed Hitchcock <ECH at ac.dal.ca>
Subject: Oxygen and pLambic
There has been some discussion lately about oxygen transfer through the
fermenter when making pLambics. Has anyone used a glass carboy with a wad of
cotton stuffed in the neck rather than an airlock? Seems to me this might
be a suitable compromise. It would allow slow gas exchange of the headspace
while keeping those pesky fruitflies at bay. I'll give it a try if no one
else has.
*-Ed Hitchcock---ech at ac.dal.ca---* Mares drink Grolsch and does drink
*-Anat.&Neurobio.---Dalhousie-U.-* Koelsch and little lambs drink Lambic.
*-Halifax--NS--Can---------------* Ed'll drink Lambic too, wouldn't you?
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End of Lambic Digest
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