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Lambic Digest #0396
From postmaster at longs.lance.colostate.edu Thu Jul 14 03:21:33 1994
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To: lambic at longs.lance.colostate.edu
Subject: Lambic Digest #396 (July 14, 1994)
Date: Thu, 14 Jul 1994 00:30:10 -0600
Lambic Digest #396 Thu 14 July 1994
Forum on Lambic Beers (and other Belgian beer styles)
Mike Sharp, Digest Coordinator
Contents:
Flanders Beers (Gary Rich)
Sour Mash/Capping ("RKESSLER")
Lindemans vs. Handsens (Algis R Korzonas +1 708 979 8583)
LUrk-o-leap (Marc Hugentobler)
Goudenband Yeast ("Moore, Brian")
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Date: Wed, 13 Jul 94 07:25:18 PDT
From: Gary Rich <garyrich at qdeck.com>
Subject: Flanders Beers
Phil Seitz <p00644 at psilink.com> says about Oud Bruins:
>I think this is the challenge of the year, just as everybody was trying
>to brew white beers last year. Your guess is as good as mine (at least
>until we see how the BURP Guys' batches turn out).
I'm on it! On the cutting edge with BURP Labs! I've got my third serious
attempt in secondary now. The first one I foolishly followed Rajotte's recipe
from the Belgian Ale book. The second try used pils/aromatic/caramuinich and
fermented with Affligem yeast, Rochefort yeast and acidified with lactic acid.
Decent beer, but I miscalculated something and the OG came out at 1.080 (a wee
bit high :-/.
Third batch I think is getting pretty dialed in. for 10 gallons I used 3 lb.
D-C aromatic malt, 1 lb Cara-munich, a handful of Special-B, 1 lb of oat flour
sifted over the mash water (this really does work well) and enough pils to get
a gravity of 1.055. This grain bill seems to give me very much the malty
qualities that Goudenband has. I don't know if the oat flour really
contributes much of anything, but it's fun so what the heck.
This batch is fermented with the Brian Nummer/Aeonbrau/Headstart mixed
Flanders that Phil and Aaron were mentioning. This stuff sure ain't no
Chico yeast! The primary was powerfully funky and the secondaries are going
in a decidedly Rodenbachian direction. Sour complex and potently peculiar.
I like it! this beer may come out "austere" enough to scare the heck out of
the local cadre of BJCP judges. I can't wait.
Since I have a son named Alexander, I can't resist doing a cherry beer with 5
gallons of this. Does anyone have any good idea about how long to wait
before adding the cherries? The 1 year normal for lambics seems too long, but
just adding them when I racked to secondary seemed too short a time. when do
Liefmans/Rodenbach add them? FWIW, all I have access to are local (non-sour)
bing cherries, but I think this beer will be sour enough to stand up to them.
Also, Brian Nummer is still (to the best of my knowledge) out of the country
gathering new yeasts (yay!). The person handling his mail while he is gone
is, to be charitable, easily confused. Brian was kind enough to send me this
culture just before he left the country. I've tried sending the invoice and
$$ to Aeonbrau twice now and it keeps getting sent back because they think
it's a new order (despite the note that says "Hey! I have the yeast, keep the
check") and are not filling any in his absence. I would suggest waiting until
he gets back. I think he is on this mailing list, so maybe we can get him to
post an "I'm home" message when he gets in.
Gary Rich
garyrich at qdeck.com
PS: Aaron mentioned that he thought Brian had a brett culture. I have the
catalog. He lists three or four brett strains with a promise of more to come.
Glad to see someone other than us and Frank Boon has realized that there is
more than one brett strain in the world.
-Gary R.-
------------------------------
Date: 13 Jul 1994 10:04:10 EST
From: "RKESSLER" <RKESSLER at HR.HOUSE.GOV>
Subject: Sour Mash/Capping
I have noticed a lot of discussion lately of sour mashing with
particular regard to Papazzian's method. I am intending to make
a sour mash blackberry wheat next week (kind of a quickie
Berliner Weiss), but all this discussion of the pitfalls of
Papazzian Mash have made me a bit timid. When I started my
plambic --long before I ever knew of this forum-- I followed,
somewhat, the Pappazian method. I got no off tastes from this.
Actually, I didn't get much of anything. No real sourness
occurred until after I added my cultures and, later, dregs from
Boon and Cantillon bottles.
So, my question now is this: If I want to do a sour mash,
instead of using crystal malt to infect the wort, could I instead
infect it with some of my p-lambic and perhaps some dregs? I'm
only looking for a 24-30 hour souring period, i.e., just a bit of
twang.
Also, I was wondering if anyone out there has capped their
bottles of lambic rather than used corks. While, corks are
certainly more authentic and charming, are they really necessary?
As usual, I would appreciate any thoughts on these matters.
Yours truly,
The Amateur
aka Rick Kessler (rkessler at hr.house.gov)
------------------------------
Date: 13 Jul 94 16:22:00 GMT
From: korz at iepubj.att.com (Algis R Korzonas +1 708 979 8583)
Subject: Lindemans vs. Handsens
Martin writes:
>While I was at Lindemanns, I found out that Hansens obtains there wort
>(inoculated) from Lindemanns. Amazing the difference between one
>blender and another. Maybe Lindemanns could learn from Hansens...
A week or so before Homebrew U III in Seattle, CBS member Randy Mosher,
who was going there to do a talk, asked me if I have any questions for
Dr. Roger Mussche, who is supposed to be the world's foremost authority
on Brett. I said, well, my most pressing question is: "Do we homebrewers
have any hope of making a beer that is in the same league with true
lambiks?" Randy reported back a sort of backwards answer from Dr. Mussche.
Dr. Mussche said that the orchards that used to fill the Zenne valley
have all since been cut down. It was these orchards that provided the
microbiota that drifted into the coolships in the attics of the lambik
breweries. He said that most of the microbiota that now ferments the
lambiks is from the casks.
Note that:
1. this would explain why Lindemans tastes different from Handsens (different
casks),
2. implies that if we could buy a retired old stave from a true lambik
cask and have a cooper insert it into a new cask, we could eventually
have a fully impregnated cask, and
3. there's hope for us yet (as proven by Jim's success).
Al.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 13 Jul 1994 10:57 -0600 (MDT)
From: Marc Hugentobler <MARHUG at TELECOM.USU.EDU>
Subject: LUrk-o-leap
hola,
Well the supreme lurker is about to take the leap. This weekend I will brew
my first plambic. I have surveyed the sources I can find and feel after
reading this fine digest that I am ready to take the plunge.
My main problem is getting enough bugs to fill the bill. Here in the dry
depths of the utah desert there is nary a supplier around.
I would greatly appreciate it if someone might send me infor on procuring and
raisin' all those great critters. Like, is a starter necessary for brett. and
pedio ? If so how much? Or do I just Pitch the packet? If a starter is needed
what kind? THe faq mentions beer w/ tomato juice is this all?
I apologize mor my ignorance, hopefully nobody will be offended. I need the
advice real bad.
Thanks
Marc
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 13 Jul 94 13:53:00 PDT
From: "Moore, Brian" <Moorebw at hvsmtp1.mdc.com>
Subject: Goudenband Yeast
Hello,
I'd like to thank everyone for their input on my request for a Goudenband
recipe. There didn't seem to be any clear consensus but I guess that is to
be expected. I would like to pose another question on yeast.
I was looking thru a pre-earthquake catalog from Brewer's Resource in
California. One of their yeasts sounds like a good candidate. It is listed
as CL-32 'Belgian Ale #2'. They describe it as a 'Flanders style yeast.
Makes a terrific strong brown and a good base brew for fruit flavored
beers.' Has anyone ever used this yeast or know anything about it's
characteristics?
TIA,
Brian Moore
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End of Lambic Digest
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