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Lambic Digest #0405
From postmaster at longs.lance.colostate.edu Mon Jul 25 03:28:16 1994
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Subject: Lambic Digest #405 (July 25, 1994)
Date: Mon, 25 Jul 1994 00:30:09 -0600
Lambic Digest #405 Mon 25 July 1994
Forum on Lambic Beers (and other Belgian beer styles)
Mike Sharp, Digest Coordinator
Contents:
Those Belgian yeasts... (Jeff Frane)
Undeliverable Mail (Computing Resources)
Old #3 (Todd Gierman)
Book Review/Recipe (Teddy Winstead)
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Date: Sat, 23 Jul 1994 18:08:16 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jeff Frane <gummitch at teleport.com>
Subject: Those Belgian yeasts...
As a point of reference:
On 6-17, I brewed something in pursuit of an Orvalish ale, bitter,
hoppy, and ... well, Orvalish. You know, fruity, odd contributions from
yeast. On returning from vacation, I got to sample the beer, bottled
about two weeks previously, although our housesitter (in spite of what I
thought were *very* clear instructions) had polished off AN ENTIRE
F***IN CASE!!!!!!! It is very good, thank you. <mild applause> I'm
not entirely sure whether I've come near Orvalish, but to me the
interesting thing is how non-Belgian it is, given that the yeast strain,
La Chouffe, has a reputation among the cognescenti as being quite
distinctive.
The truth is, the beer is not unlike a very characterful, bitter pale
ale. Fruity (plus vanilla, some diacetyl, no banana), BITTER, nicely
hoppy but with all those other fermentation characteristics --- but not
very weird, either. It gives one pause ... or paws.
In his Beer Companion, Jackson makes a reference to the fact that the
Duvel (is this right) strain was isolated from some bottle-conditioned
McEwan's ale. Hardly what you'd think of as "Belgian".
My experience over the last year or so has been that certain Belgian/?
yeast strains *IN CONJUNCTION WITH* certain ingredients achieve an
effect that the yeast/ingredient alone cannot. And that the grist has
an amazing effect on the contribution of the yeast (ie the Wyeast 3944
strain which makes a strong ale considerably different from the witbier
is makes).
At any rate, for the interested:
Domestic 2-row 7#
D-C Aromatic 1#
D-C CaraVienne .5#
Candi sugar 1#
grains mashed in at 130F for 30 min. raised to 150F for approx 1 hour
(water hardened)
Hops:
Eroica 1.5 oz after 15 min
BC Golding .5 oz after 45 min
E Kent Golding 1 oz after 90 min (end-boil)
E Kent Golding 1.5 oz dry-hop for 2 weeks
Irish Moss
Fermentation at 65F
OG 1058
FG 1008
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 24 Jul 1994 02:23:48 -0600
From: Computing Resources <Computing_Resources at mactel.uthscsa.edu>
Subject: Undeliverable Mail
Unknown Microsoft mail form. Approximate representation follows.
Message: Lambic Digest #404 (July 23, 1994)
Sent: Sat, Jul 23, 1994 2:16 AM
To: sohaskey
On Server: Barbour Lab
Date: Sun, Jul 24, 1994 2:23 AM
Reason: Could not be delivered because the destination Microsoft Mail server
could not be found.
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 24 Jul 1994 10:47:53 -0500
From: tmgierma at acpub.duke.edu (Todd Gierman)
Subject: Old #3
A number of people have been making reference to the L. delbrueckii culture
sold by Head Start. Indeed, Phil Seitz writes in Lambic Digest #403:
>We at BURP Labs made a split batch attempt at an oud bruin, with one
>side getting the Liefmans culture and the HS lacto. debruckii and the
>other getting the Flanders brown culture. First off it appears that
>our recipe will need some work, as the color is light and the body too
>thin. The lactobacillus so far hasn't done much, though whether that's
>due to the bugs or mishandling on our part is impossible to say.
I am quite familiar with the limited history of this culture and would like
to make a few comments about it and its dissemination. You see, it is
known to a number of us as L. delbrueckii #3. Now, that isn't any kind of
taxnomic designation; that's just a code to distinguish it from a number of
other L. delbrueckii cultures that were being looked at. Uh, let me back
up.
I am acquainted with a very generous fellow who is a homebrewer and
internet surfer, among other things (we'll call him Mr. Mud ;-), lest he be
besieged by those seeking favors). During the course of numerous
exchanges, Mr. Mud and I realized the usefulness of a good, reliable
souring bug. Mr. Mud had some connections and thought that he could get
some typed cultures for us to try out with the idea that promising cultures
would then find their way to adventuresome homebrewers.
We were concerned mainly about shipping and revivability of the culture and
the ability of the culture to grow in readily available media (wort). Mr.
Mud grew his cultures up in an enriched laboratory medium, inoculated agar
stabs and sent them to me. I, in turn, attempted to revive and grow the
cultures in various media. The first 2-3 attempts met with abject failure.
Mr. Mud and I pulled our hair out for several months over the fact that we
could not produce a "user friendly" culture. Finally, Mr. Mud obtained
several more L. delbrueckii cultures and sent them as before. By this
time, I had become convinced that any culture that would not grow in wort
was useless to most homebrewers. I received L. delbrueckii cultures #1,
#2, and #3 and introduced them into _unhopped_ wort.
Pleased by the proficiency with which #3 grew, I sent the three cultures on
to a talented brewer/culturer for further trials. Again #3 showed promise
(I believe that this culture was used with some "tricks" to produce an
award winning flanders-type ale). At some point, Mr. Mud, generous soul
that he is, passed on this culture to Brian Nummer, who, I think, was in
transition between Aeonbrau and Head Start at that time.
So...what are the tricks involved with using this bug? Well, trick number
one seems to be that you have to grow it in unhopped wort, as it grows
poorly in hopped wort. I believe that the flanders ale that was so well
received was made by blending an unhopped lacto #3 ferment with the main
ferment once both were complete. This bug sits in my freezer and I have
not had a chance to use it. However, I am a proponent of a pure-culture
sour mash for this bug. Let's face it, there are two things going against
a mid-60s primary or secondary ferment: 1) L. delbrueckii #3 doesn't like
hops and 2) although this culture will grow fine at room temp (72F),
delbrueckiis are generally somewhat thermophilic and, so, probably do
better up around 100-110F. The nice thing about them is that they do not
produce CO2, so if they make it to the bottle - no big deal.
For souring in the primary and/or bottle, I think that L. brevis is the
culture that people want. Generally, L. brevis will perform at
fermentation temps. and tolerates hops just fine. The main drawback is
that L. brevis will produce CO2 from glucose (this may or may not be a
problem). I don't know of any L. brevis cultures that are available.
The bottom line is: caveat emptor - you may end up doing the R&D yourself.
Todd
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 24 Jul 1994 14:49:51 -0500 (CDT)
From: winstead%brauerei at cs.tulane.edu (Teddy Winstead)
Subject: Book Review/Recipe
Well, I've been meaning to post a review of this book for some time,
so here goes --
The book is titled _Gueuze,_Faro_et_Kriek_, and it's written by
Raymond Buren. I had originally intended to translate sections from
the original French into English, and post them here for everyone's
betterment, but unfortunately there's not too much stuff in there
that's useful for Lambic production. The book is mostly comprised of
humorous anectdotes, cartoons, and history of Lambic production and
consumption. There's a good deal of information on Lambic breweries
in Belgium, but unfortunately Buren doesn't review their products
critically. The cartoons are pretty amusing -- my favorite is one of
a wild yeast (Brett. Brux.) drinking a beer and pissing. This is a
good book, and is worth reading if you want to improve your French.
It's availible, as I said earlier from Librairie Francaise in New York
City (800) 255-3741. No affiliation, etc. The book is about $20.
For travelers, there is a comprehensive list of Lambic makers and
information about their products. There are also some recipes, and
I'm taking the liberty of posting a couple -- here's one, more to
come....
Crepes Bernadette
For 16 crepes
2 whole eggs
1/2 liter of gueuze (about 2 cups)
4 Tablespoons sugar
1 Tablespoon vegtable oil
1/2 kilo of whole wheat flour (about 1 lb)
Mix all ingredients well, let sit for a few hours, then cook in a
no-stick pan.
- --
Nathaniel Scott "Teddy" Winstead |
winstead at cs.tulane.edu (Preferred) |
winstead%brauerei.uucp at cs.tulane.edu |
Fanatical Homebrewer & CS Undergrad/Grad |
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End of Lambic Digest
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