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Lambic Digest #0339
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Subject: Lambic Digest #339 (May 10, 1994)
Date: Tue, 10 May 1994 00:30:08 -0600
Lambic Digest #339 Tue 10 May 1994
Forum on Lambic Beers (and other Belgian beer styles)
Mike Sharp, Digest Coordinator
Contents:
barrels, 60 gal french oak, (Michael Sharp)
bottling day (Michael Sharp)
t-shirts -- blatant commercialism (kind of) (Michael Sharp)
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Date: Mon, 9 May 94 09:23:00 PDT
From: msharp at Synopsys.COM (Michael Sharp)
Subject: barrels, 60 gal french oak,
As usual I've bunched a few replies into this message.
"DEV::FVH" <FVH%DEV.decnet at mdcgwy.mdc.com> writes:
> Subject: Newly acquired barrel and other ?s
>
> My SO and I went to Temecula, Ca a couple of weekend ago. Touring the
> winerys led us to a newly acquired establishment called Temecula Crest.
> They were selling their old(from previous owner) wine barrels(55gal) for $30.
I have long been tempted by similar prices on used wine barrels.
I've always resisted because you can't move a 55gal barrel.
You can't lift it to rack into bottles, etc. unless you have a
pallete (sp?) jack. Storage space is also a problem...
> Anyway, I am soaking it and am tossing around ideas and would like to
> bounce some off the collective. Mr Winstead has already rebounded some
> of these. I do not wish to make a 55 gal batch. At least not at first.
> I would be willing to go 15 gal for a trial. Can I store this in the
> cask with bung in place without worrying about the cask leaking? Will
> the humidity inside the barrel be enough to keep a decent seal on the
> parts that are not under the beer line?
I can't address how much the barrel will dry out with only 15 gallons in it.
I can tell you that in my _opinion_ you shouldn't make a batch size less
than 2/3rds the barrel volume. Think about how 15 gallons will look in a
55gallon barrel -- You'll hardly make a dent in the total capacity and there
will be a _LOT_ of beer in contact with the air.
[2/3rds isn't a magic number. I know that I've had batches of plambic
drop to ~2/3rds the volume of my barrel -- due to not topping up -- and
still behave reasonably w.r.t. fermentation, infection, etc]
> Also, since space is at a premium in Southern Cal, I plan to store this
> outdoors. Perhaps make a make-shift table to help shade the barrel from
> direct sun. Temps fluctuate from somewhere in the 40s(winter) to the
> 90s(summer) where I am. I'm fairly close to the beach. Will this cause
> a problem?
90s? hmmm. I dunno about temperatures that high. How are you going to
keep the cask dry (when it does rain)?
> Since I like to use fruit and whatever is available at a reasonable price,
> I was wondering if using plums for a lambic is acceptable.
Its your beer... I've never used plums in a lambic & haven't a clue as
to what to expect.
You've got ~1 year (maybe more) to figure out where the fruit is coming
from. You don't add fruit until the beer has aged for a while (~1 yr).
> Can tasting a lambic in various stages cause health problems?
I can only say that I'm still healthy. I do have this wierd nervous
twitch & occasionally howl at the moon, but... 8-)
> For those cask users(or non-cask users),
> do you use the hydrometer to check when the lambic is ready for bottling or
> is it just whenever you're ready after a sufficient amount of time?
After a year plus of being exposed to superattenuative yeast (Brettanomyces)
and bacteria you're not going to have to worry about _anything_ left to
ferment.
FWIW, I just bottled my last batch (started a little over a year ago while
I was still in Portland) and its FG was 1.006 I checked just for kicks.
> I was planning on doing the primary with a belgian yeast(1214) in plastic
> fermentors(about 1 week), then rack to the barrel and pitch some Brett and
> Pedio. One opinion tells me to pitch everything at once. Any other opinions?
Before continuing in this process figure out what a 'turbid mash' is.
This technique creates a highly dextrinous wort that gives the pedio &
brett something to chew on during their long stay in your beer.
[yeah, I've been lax in posting info about the process. I'll try to
rectify that soon].
Other random musings:
I sure hope you're not getting in over your head. As I said above, I've
always been tempted by cheap used wine barrels, but to be honest 55 gallons
of beer takes a while to make. Thats three runs even in my equipment.
Also, have you given thought to bottling? We're talking ~580 12oz bottles
here.
Now here is an interesting thought that I hope folks read...
What happens if you buy a used wine barrel that was cut in half and then
you seal plexiglass to the cut end with a little silicone sealer (food
grade please)? This sounds like a way to get the neutral barrel character
_and_ a more reasonable batch size. This idea just came to me, so
I may be full of sh*t and realize it later.
> Any ideas what might be in the wood already?
Given what you're doing, nothing you need to worry about.
(though you will extract some of the wine flavors from the wood in the
first batch or two)
==========================
bickham at msc.cornell.edu writes:
> I recently ran across an interesting catalog from a store that claims
> to cater to the Amish community in Western Ohio. Here is a summary of
> some brewing-related items, including their barrel prices:
> ....
> Barrels and Kegs
> - made of white oak, 6 hoops per barrel with 8 for the larger ones
Lots of folks have been posting info on where to get American oak
barrels lately. If you're _really_ serious about getting a barrel
you _DO_NOT_ want American oak. I took that route initially and
I'm just now (5? years later) getting my cask to the point where it
doesn't produce tree-beer. Maybe somebody has a new way of cleaning
these things & reducing the tanin levels in a new American oak barrel,
but the methods I've tried (long soaks, soda ash soaks, etc.) have been
unable to yield anything even remotely neutral. Only brewing a lot of
beer has been able to remove the tannins.
-- Mike
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 9 May 94 09:41:58 PDT
From: msharp at Synopsys.COM (Michael Sharp)
Subject: bottling day
Hi,
Since you managed to miss all the fun in my kitchen Saturday I feel
compelled to tell you about it (in hopes of getting a little sympathy).
[everywhere 'I' appears you should probably read 'Sheri and I' since
this wasn't a solo effort by any means]
Saturday was the day to bottle my latest framboise. (The previous
Saturday and Sunday I spent obtaining & cleaning bottles)
The end results are:
(67) 330ml punted splits with corks and cages
(because I'm anal even about presentation)
(19) 750ml punted bottles with corks and cages
(ditto)
(66) 12oz long necks which hopefully won't explode
(because I ran out of splits & corks)
I can just hear those questions...
No, I can't buy splits and corks out here. I emptied these bottles
myself (and with help from the tasting at the Portland AHA conf). They're
from the likes of Boon, Cantillon, and Liefmans.
Yes, its a bitch corking those splits. Upon first inspection they all
appeared to take the same size cork. Well, thats not the case and some
where _much_ easier to cork than others.
Before bottling I racked off the raspberries (which had settled & left
me with a very clear beer) added a little sugar for priming, and pitched
a new yeast for bottling (it wound up being McEwans ale yeast because thats
what I had grown up).
Oh, and after all of this fun I bottled 3 gallons of a Flanders Brown attempt
that I made with a culture from Felix Oud Bruin.
I started all of this fun at about 6:00AM and finished about 5:00PM...
Hopefully I'll be able to deal with doing this once a year.
--Mike
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 9 May 94 14:50:09 PDT
From: msharp at Synopsys.COM (Michael Sharp)
Subject: t-shirts -- blatant commercialism (kind of)
Hi,
[I was really tempted to title this "Jesus is coming, he wants you to apply
for a GREEN CARD so you can MAKE MONEY FAST", but it was too long and perhaps
too much of an inside joke.]
A few weeks back I was talked into making one last run of the
bio-hazard/lambic brewer t-shirts (bright orange t-shirt with bio-hazard
logo and "Caution: Lambic Brewer" on back, Cantillon logo on left breast)
I'd now like to sell the extras from this run. They're $11.50 each
including shipping in the U.S.A. and are available in L,XL,XXXL
(sorry, no XXL). Orders to: Sheri Almeda, 3415 Turner Ct, Fremont, CA
94536. Complaints about commercialism to the benevolent lambic-request
dictator (me) at lambic-request at longs.lance.colostate.edu 8-)
When they're gone (there aren't many) we're not going to make more.
This isn't a serious commercial enterprise, just an amusing t-shirt & a way
to burn two afternoons of free time (when I should be brewing).
--Mike
p.s. these have gone through the _same_ dryer as my laundry and I have
personally touched each one (we made them by hand). That should make
them worth something. 8-)
p.p.s. for an extra charge I'll personally pre-wear your t-shirt to
instill the proper brewing 'karma' in it. 8-)
p.p.p.s Oh, and if anyone out there needs a green card... 8-)
and now back to your regularly scheduled Lambic Digest.
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End of Lambic Digest
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