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Mead Lovers Digest #1037
From: mead-request@talisman.com
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Subject: Mead Lover's Digest #1037, 21 August 2003
Mead Lover's Digest #1037 21 August 2003
Forum for Discussion of Mead Making and Consuming
Dick Dunn, Digest Janitor
Contents:
Re: a meading I will go #1036, 16 August 2003 ("Ira Edwards")
Re: Wyeast Sweet ("Matt Maples")
Maple syrup ("Joseph Toubes")
Thor's Mead-lackluster ("Merlin")
Mead Lovers Digest: Oxygenation Systems ("James Davis")
Starter gravity ("Dan McFeeley")
Dirty sugar in response to Jeff Renner ("Olluyn Jo")
Fermentation stopped -- now what? ("Olluyn Jo")
Re: Agave fermentation ("Kevin Morgan")
First Mead OOPSIE? (cxc16)
NOTE: Digest appears when there is enough material to send one.
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----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re: a meading I will go #1036, 16 August 2003
From: "Ira Edwards" <ira_j_e@hotmail.com>
Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2003 01:31:23 +0000
Jim,
A lot of us beer brewers have had big problems with Agave nectar, even to
the point that some nationwide online and LHBS outlets will not even carry
the stuff anymore. the problem has stemeed from the fact that many
manufacturers use artificial flavorings and corn syrup to thin out any
actuall agave nectar in the product. Of the five different products I tried
a few years ago (I forgot the brands, but you can research discussions on
the HomeBrewDigest at HBD.org) and all of them ended up having reservatives
in them that prevented active fermentation.
Unless you are getting the nectar straight from the farms in mexico that
make tequila, you may have these problems. I have visited a few tequila
producers and the agave nectar that I tried was quite tin and tasted nothing
like the stuff I bought. the nectar you can buy must either be sweetened or
highly condensed.
these are only my own experiences, but I know that you can find a lot of
stuff at HBD.org
- -Ira
Anchorage, Alaska
- -----------------------------
Subject: A Meading I will go
From: "Jim Barnhart" <jimmydo2@earthlink.net>
Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2003 13:27:49 -0700
Greetings all:
I just found a local supplier for Agave, Raw Honey, and Prickly
Pears.... I am in Mead Heaven.
I have a currently have two batches going, that were started on
08/05/03.
I started a Plum batch with 10 pounds of Honey and 6 pounds of agave
Nectar, OG 1.120 (White labs wine and mead yeast with a 1 pint starter)
and a 100% agave batch using 24 lbs of Blue Agave Nectar OG 1.100. with
White labs Champagne Yeast in a 1 pint starter.
The Plum Took off and is fermenting well, but the blue agave is doing
almost nothing, I think I have seen about 5 burbles of the airlock
Before I start another Batch with Agave, I was wondering if anyone might
have any suggestions of what might have gone wrong with the Agave, or
how I might be able to Kick it
Jim Barnhart
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Wyeast Sweet
From: "Matt Maples" <Matt_Maples@liquidsolutions.biz>
Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2003 19:51:20 -0700
>Those with lower initial gravity (1.09ish) tended to have a lower final
gravity. I suspect
>that the yeast is just reaching its alcohol tolerance. Your agitation
No it is not alcohol tolerance I test for and expect a drop out at higher
alcohol levels. I think it has more to do with its high flocculation
tendencies and temperature fluctuations. Even though I do my best to keep
the temp stable, if you do not heat your house at night you are going to get
temp swings no matter what. Some yeast handle this better than other and I
think the Sweet mead is not one of them.
I also think that it has to do with whether you sulfite, I believe (though
I could be wrong) that the sweet mead yeast is not very sulfite tolerant and
which can cause long start times and poor performance.
If you have had better success with it great, more power to you. I have used
it and got a wide range of results so I have moved on to other yeasts that
have performed with better consistence for . Heck I have had better success
with 1056 American when I wanted to go for a lower alcohol sweet mead than I
did with the Wyeast Sweet. Don't get me wrong Wyeast makes great product and
I use it all the time (Chablis yeast for one, 1056, Dry Mead and others).
Just because they slapped the word "Mead" on it does not mean it will fit
the way you make mead or the environment you ferment under. I would rather
change to a yeast that will perform under my fermentation conditions rather
than go to lengths to change my fermentation conditions.
Matt Maples
Liquid Solutions
12162 SW Scholls Ferry Rd
Tigard, OR 97223
503-524-9722
866-286-9722
503-579-6493 (fax)
www.liquidsolutions.biz
Over 450 beers and 25 meads online, shipping available.
May mead regain its place as the beverage of gods and kings.
------------------------------
Subject: Maple syrup
From: "Joseph Toubes" <toubes1@mchsi.com>
Date: Sat, 16 Aug 2003 15:09:04 -0500
I went to Sam's Club and purchased my maple. They had this sign that read
"REAL MAPLE" right next to the corn syrup types, but I was careful. The
maple mead did well, but I think when I added some additional at the very
end before bottling was my downfall - too sweet. But it does have
potential over time.
Sincerely,
Joseph A. Toubes
Des Moines, Iowa <http://home.mchsi.com/~toubes1/> Weather
------------------------------
Subject: Thor's Mead-lackluster
From: "Merlin" <Merlin@Honalee.com>
Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2003 08:11:28 -0400
About 3 months ago I whipped up a batch of Dave Polaschek's- Thor's Mead
(ginger) 3 months later it is more like water than meade like and
uninteresting. What can I do to save it?
Merlin - meaditation for the soul
------------------------------
Subject: Mead Lovers Digest: Oxygenation Systems
From: "James Davis" <jjdavis@pgtc.com>
Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2003 10:04:59 -0500
Hello Everyone:
I have been following the digest for a while now and am finally getting
underway with my first batch of mead. I have made wine for quite some
time but now on to the good stuff. I have a question regarding oxygen
in the must during the first stage of fermentation. A lot of the
recipies I have come across for mead suggest sloshing or stirring the
must to oxygenate it for the aerobic stage of fermentation. I found a
handy looking little gizmo on morebeer.com called an oxygenation system.
It is an oxygen tank attached to a line with a .5 micron stone used to
inject oxygen into the must. I know from reading that oxygen is
essential in the first stage of fermentation and will help produce a
stronger yeast colony when the levels of oxygen in the must are right.
Is this item really useful? Has anyone out there used this or a similar
device? Thanks for your help! James Davis
------------------------------
Subject: Starter gravity
From: "Dan McFeeley" <mcfeeley@keynet.net>
Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2003 01:30:24 -0500
Hello all --
In the last MLD Dick Dunn recommended low gravities for
starters, about 1040 - 1050, citing _The Compleat Meadmaker_,
Ken Schramm, p. 62. Fred Johnson recently put out a post on
the Homebrewers Digest (HBD) that seems relevant to the
discussion. The table at the bottom of the post is of particular
interest. I contacted Fred and he gave me permission to crosspost
to MLD.
A quick background note -- Fred is referring to the Crabtree effect,
a much discussed thread on HBD. It's important to keep in mind
that biomass *does* increase during anaerobic fermentation, and
that yeasts generally don't enter respiration unless forced to do
so, even under the conditions Fred lists. Oxygen is important
to yeasts during fermentation, which is shown in the tables cited
by Fred. Check the archives at hbd.org for more information
on the Crabtree effect.
Another item of interest to MLD readers -- Dr. Clayton Cone is
on HBD again for another period of question and answers to
HBD subscribers. Check recent digests at hbd.org for some
very stimulating discussion on yeast microbiology as it relates
to fermentation.
<><><><><><><><><><>
<><><><><><><><>
Dan McFeeley
Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2003 10:15:10 -0400
Subject: Aerobic yeast propagation
There have been a few posts recently regarding the question of whether
stirring a yeast starter will improve yield. I doubt that simply stirring
the culture will have a significant effect on the number of yeast cells
you will produce, keeping all other variables the same. What one
wishes to do is to keep the yeast metabolizing the sugar into biomass
and CO2 rather than alcohol and CO2. To achieve this, one must
maintain LOW sugar concentrations in the medium and provide
oxygen. This will allow the yeast to respire rather than ferment. If
the glucose concentration in the medium rises above 0.4%
(approximately), the yeast will ferment the sugar, no matter
how much oxygen and stirring you provide. See my post to
the HBD from a few years back below.
In regard to the following post, the YeastLink web site is long gone.
Fred L Johnson
Apex, North Carolina, USA
- - --
>I have been interested in establishing an aerobic yeast propagation system
>for my starters. Such a system putatively has the advantage of producing
>large amounts of yeast in minimal volumes in minimal time. Below is an
>excerpt from the YeastLink website in which the method and commercial
>equipment for this process is described.
> Glucose levels in a all-malt wort are in the approximate range of 1% -
> 1.5 %. Brewer's yeast has a metabolic effect where the yeast will respond
> to glucose levels above 0.4% with or without the presence of oxygen by
> metabolizing the sugar through fermentation rather than respiration.
> If the yeast propagation is aerated and the culture is fed incrementally
> with sterile wort at a rate that the yeast metabolizes the glucose to keep
> the level of this sugar in the propagation below 0.4%, the yeast will stay
> in a respiratory or growth state. A similar process is utilized in the
> production of baker's yeast although molasses is utilized instead of
> brewer's wort. Under these circumstances, far more energy is available
> to the yeast cell than under fermentative conditions and far more yeast is
> produced while less alcohol is produced. The yeast produced from this
> method are in highest growth phase(log phase) and can be pitched at a
> dilution rate of 1:100 or higher. The volume of the propagation medium
> is 1% or less of the batch total.
Oops. I forgot to include in my last post the following table showing the
benefits on yeast production of aeration versus aeration plus continuous
infusion of wort into the culture to maintain low glucose concentrations.
YIELDS OF YEAST AND ETHANOL Mass (kg)
Medium Conditions Yeast Ethanol
Wort Unaerated 2.7 17.5
Wort Aerated 8.6 10.5
Wort Aerated-Incremental Feed 23 0.7
Molasses Aerated-Incremental Feed 50 0
*from Malting and Brewing Science
Fred L Johnson
Apex, North Carolina
USA
------------------------------
Subject: Dirty sugar in response to Jeff Renner
From: "Olluyn Jo" <Jo.Olluyn@cronos.be>
Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2003 09:08:14 +0200
As far as I know, sugar refinery is the ore-mining of the food industry.
I have no documentation at hand but seem to recall from my university
days that what I currently believe about the refinery process is not far
from the truth. I'll see if I can come up with some more direct
indication of what I mean, though. If you consult you ostheopathist or
"alternative" medicine man, he will pretty much corroborate. Doesn't
mean a thing, I know.
Let's not forget it's a refinery process. I mostly picture oil rigs when
I think of refinery, and if memory serves me correctly, suger refinery
is of a similar viciousness.
With "dirty" sugar I mean that it is certainly NOT 100% pure. It
contains traces (and often more than that) of all the intermediary
soluents and bleaches. It is not natural for a product to be this white
(apart from snow that is). If you take into acoount the enormous amounts
of sugar consumed in western society these days, this amounts to quite a
lot of traces altogether. I always use unrefined sugar or syrups (rice
syrup is relatively cheap and gives decidedly different taste).
Greetz
Jo
------------------------------
Subject: Fermentation stopped -- now what?
From: "Olluyn Jo" <Jo.Olluyn@cronos.be>
Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2003 09:11:37 +0200
I think my first batch of mead has stopped fermenting. It took about a
week and half for primary fermentation (quite vigorous and lively).
After about a half inch of sediment had settled at the bottom I racked
it into a clean Damme Jeanne where it very gently continued for another
week. Now it seems to have stopped. I have read a lot about fermentation
starting again if you just wait a bit. Is it worthwile or do I bottle it
now?
It still seems a bit murky, a bit like looking at a really cold glass of
dark white wine. Translucent but still opaque. How does it clear up.
Greetz
Jo
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Agave fermentation
From: "Kevin Morgan" <kevin.morgan2@verizon.net>
Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2003 21:15:27 -0400
Jim Barnhart" <jimmydo2@earthlink.net>
Said on
Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2003 13:27:49 -0700
>Greetings all:
SNIP
>and a 100% agave batch using 24 lbs of Blue Agave Nectar OG 1.100. with
>White labs Champagne Yeast in a 1 pint starter.
>The Plum Took off and is fermenting well, but the blue agave is doing
>almost nothing, I think I have seen about 5 burbles of the airlock
>Before I start another Batch with Agave, I was wondering if anyone might
>have any suggestions of what might have gone wrong with the Agave, or
>how I might be able to Kick it
Jim, I tried a similar Blue Agave batch with the same problem, then I tried
pitching more yeast and re-aerating. In fact I tried this with 3 different
yeasts, all to no avail. Finally I tried diluting the batch (originally 5 gal,
diluted to 6 gal) new OG 1.072 and it took off like a rocket.
Kevin, brewing and meading in south jersey
------------------------------
Subject: First Mead OOPSIE?
From: cxc16 <cxc16@uark.edu>
Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 23:11:15 -0500
I have just recently started my first mead and it's going great except for one
thing, a few days after it was started I found that I had mis-read the
instructions for the Irish moss (1tsp/gallon instead of 1tsp/5 gallons) and
used about 5 times more than was needed and now it smells kinda funny I'm not
very experienced so this is the best description I can give you.
So 1. is my mead in danger
2. if so can it be saved
3. is the smell maybe caused by something else
4. or am I just going to have a really clear mead?
Any help is more that appreciated
thanx
Caleb
------------------------------
End of Mead Lover's Digest #1037
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