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Mead Lovers Digest #0977
From: mead-request@talisman.com
Errors-To: mead-errors@talisman.com
Reply-To: mead@talisman.com
To: mead-list@talisman.com
Subject: Mead Lover's Digest #977, 13 December 2002
Mead Lover's Digest #977 13 December 2002
Forum for Discussion of Mead Making and Consuming
Dick Dunn, Digest Janitor
Contents:
Cranberry Mead ("Brian Morgan")
camden (darrell.leavitt@plattsburgh.edu)
is this correct????? ("John Stilwell")
Wine Conditioner ("Berggren, Stefan")
Re: Honey and Yeast and other assorted bugs (Joe Kaufman)
Doug - RE: Stefan ... arrest (Tommy_Thompson@aismail.wustl.edu)
cherry mead (PHREDLESS@aol.com)
Corks for Bottling Mead ("Maurice St. aude")
Re: Mead Lover's Digest #976, 10 December 2002 (NetLinked@aol.com)
Re: Mead Lover's Digest #976, 10 December 2002 (JayAnkeney@aol.com)
Re: I need a specific type of yeast... ("Geoffrey T. Falk")
Re: Mead Lover's Digest #976, 10 December 2002 (Eric Drake)
Montrachet yeast, boiling honey ("phil")
NOTE: Digest appears when there is enough material to send one.
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----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Cranberry Mead
From: "Brian Morgan" <brian-morgan@cinci.rr.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 06:02:30 -0500
Arthur Torrey asked about a Cranberry Mead - I have been making a
Cranberry Mead for a couple of years now - seems pretty popular with friends
and family.
I use the Barkshack Ginger Mead recipe that's floating around (I got it
from Charlie Papazian's book). I leave out the ginger, and put in 1.5
pounds cranberries that have been frozen, thawed, then cut up some in a food
processor. I leave the cranberries in until I rack the first time (specific
gravity is close to 1.000). I let it finish dry - use Champagne yeast. It
probably gets racked 2-3 times more - allowing it to clear.
Then I usually keg it - and artificially carbonate it. But you can
bottle it with some priming sugar. When done, it's almost like a dry, pink
champagne. It's great over the holidays, but it's a great summer drink as
well.
Brian
Cincinnati, OH
------------------------------
Subject: camden
From: darrell.leavitt@plattsburgh.edu
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 06:52:55 -0500
I need some advice regarding camden tablets and wine. In an effort to
avoid sulfites, I heated 5 gal Merlot grape juice to 170F , left it there
for 25 minutes, then chilled and pitched some re-hydtated Lavlin (sp?)
yeast. After 2 1/2 months I siphoned into secondary, and it tasted very
good. But, I do not want to use camden at the end before bottling.
Can I prevent the possibility of over carbonation, and bottle bombs? The
gravity going into secondary was 0.99
...Darrell
------------------------------
Subject: is this correct?????
From: "John Stilwell" <cybershot@pdq.net>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 07:39:16 -0600
>Subject: Stefan ... arrest
>From: DOUG BAILEY <BAILEY.O@xtra.co.nz>
>Date: Sun, 08 Dec 2002 12:08:04 +1300
>
>..... I rack onto about 1 tsp sodium & potassium metabisulfite / gallon
and >refrigerate the mead.
Is this correct, In the short time (2 1/2 months) I've been making mead
I use Sodium Metabisulfite as a sanitizer for my equipment, maybe im
learning something new.
Gryphon
------------------------------
Subject: Wine Conditioner
From: "Berggren, Stefan" <stefan_berggren@trekbike.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 08:42:53 -0600
At the risk of upsetting purists, has anyone ever used
wine conditioner to sweeten meads and inhibit renewed
fermentation prior to bottling?
Cheers,
Stefan
There is more to life than increasing its speed." --Gandhi
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Honey and Yeast and other assorted bugs
From: Joe Kaufman <sutekh137@yahoo.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 07:28:13 -0800 (PST)
Hey all,
Just wanted to throw in my two-cents on the whole heat/pasteurize/boil
debate...
I used to boil. Everything. Then I stopped because I was too lazy
and it took too long (and experiencing boil-over, even once, is
enough to make one think twice about boiling again).
So then I heated (pasteurized) my must. Still took a long time to heat
and a long time to cool down. My laziness won out again, and I stopped
doing that too.
Now I only pasteurize something if I think it is of questionable
sterility, like fruit taken from off the ground. I never heat the
honey, and don't bother heating any apple juice or other items
used as "filler" (a lot of times the "filler" ingredients are
store-bought items that are already of good sterile character).
I always use water out of the tap, and have never had trouble
at three different locations in two states.
I have now made 8 batches of mead with no heat, and every one is fine.
I am not a fanatic about sanitation, but the bleach (and consequent
rinsing) is used liberally. I generally primary in a plastic bucket
and then rack into glass. I rarely rack to a tertiary, so some of the
meads have sat on secondary lees for 4-6 months. It's all good.
I can't say my non-heated meads are any better than previous batches,
but they sure are easier. And easier means more meads made. That is
the point, at least for me.
The way I see it, as long as you have a vigorous yeast starter to get
the party started, no other beasties can get in the way. By the time
they might even think about making a move, my meads are up to 12%
alcohol, and nothing stands a chance except for the yeast. Essentially,
the must goes from too sugary to too alcoholy so fast that I don't
worry about baddie invasions. Yeast starter is CRUCIAL.
Anyway, that's the word from a guy who has turned off the stove burner
and will probably leave it off from here on out... Do whatever you feel
most comfortable with!
Thanks,
Joe Kaufman
------------------------------
Subject: Doug - RE: Stefan ... arrest
From: Tommy_Thompson@aismail.wustl.edu
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 09:48:20 -0600
Hi Doug,
>>I now almost exclusively stop my meads. If I start at about 1.102, I
>>stop them around 1.005-8. This gives a nicely balanced sweetness and a
>>better taste then fermenting to dryness and resweetening, I think.
I agree with you that the flavor of mead with residual sugar being better
that when it is resweetened. I have had good luck with K1V-1116. It
always seems to stop at 1.004 - 8 for me.
>>I don't have the facilities to sterile filter to get rid of any yeast,
>>so when I am ready to stop the fermentation I rack onto about 1 tsp
>>sodium & potassium metabisulfite / gallon and refrigerate the mead.
>>
>>Fairly soon after (within two days) the mead begins to clear, descending
>>in a layer of about 1 inch/ day. After about 10 days I rack of the lees
>>onto about 3/4 tsp PMS/gallon and refrigerate for another week.
I am a little uneasy with your technique though. You add a lot of
sulfite. I'm not sure what the laws are like in NZ, but here in the US a
commercial winery can't add more than 200 PPM of free SO2 to wine. That
is approximately 1 tsp per gallon. Most home wine/mead makers are even
more reserved. If I read your post correctly, you add 1 3/4 tsp of
sulfite per gallon.
With deepest affection and all due respect I say aaack!!!!!!
I dislike the flavor and aroma of high levels of sulfite. Now except for
a few sulfite-sensitive people, it will be perfectly safe to drink. It is
just, well, aaack!!!!!!
Tommy
Who having let the airlock dry out is now serving a "sherry style" mead to
all his friends.
------------------------------
Subject: cherry mead
From: PHREDLESS@aol.com
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 11:04:02 EST
Howdy to all makers of cherry mead. This past year a beer making friend and
I made a batch of cherry mead. We decided to go whole hog, and used 20
pounds of cherries plus 20 pounds of honey per 5 gallons. The honey was
"mountain wildflower" from the Auburn, CA area and the cherries were picked
by us, after the orchard opened for us who don't care that the fruit is too
ripe to ship. All I have to say is, "DAMN, that's good stuff."
Interestingly, like with so many fine wines, which include leaves and stems
in the crush, we left the little bits of bark, branch and stem that were
attached to the cherries. Definately boosts the tannins. I'd recommend
that, if you decide to replicate, because it would be too cloying without it.
Unfortunately, this lovely 100+ year old orchard, of a red Italian variety,
got plowed under for houses a few months back. I mourn its loss
Doug Thomas
------------------------------
Subject: Corks for Bottling Mead
From: "Maurice St. aude" <bludrgn@sympatico.ca>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 13:58:13 -0500
Hello all:
With the state of the natural cork market and the resent lawsuits
launched against certain aglo manufacturers I come to a confusing spot. It
is bottling time again and I find that I must purchase new bottle closures
and am not really looking forward to the choice ahead of me. First the
natural corks in my neck of the woods aren't fit to seal a bottle of
fermented Kool Aid. They are brittle have large voids in the sides and seem
prone to splitting in half on removal. My next choice Aglos are cheaper and
more uniform in shape and size without large voids or crack don't need
soaking and for the most part can be laid down right away. However according
to "experts" they have a tendency of leaving an "Aglo" flavour (slight
glueyness) and detract from the flavour of the beverage inside. Altec seemed
like the next choice, however after the recent Australian study pointing out
that Altec corks were highly prone to corking bottles and the lawsuits in
the states I'm afraid that choice is out too. Next comes the synthetic corks
the corqs, these seem to be the closures of the future however they are
unproven over the long haul and some people say they leave a plasticy
flavour in the bottles they are used to close.
So what choice do I make? Do I stick to natural cork with a failure rate
of aprrox. 5% per batch, or do I take my chances with one of the modern
corks or cork alternatives? Any help or thought on this matter would be
appreciated.
Thanks
Maurice
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Mead Lover's Digest #976, 10 December 2002
From: NetLinked@aol.com
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 15:57:38 EST
Greetings to all:
This is my first reply to the group. I have been researcher
on the Internet the History of Mead, Making Mead.
I have purchased from the brewing supply houses
The various books (all 10 years old or older) on Making Mead.
I still need to buy all the equipment to start. But one question
I have of many..but I will start with this one.
How do you keep the Alcohol volume to 9%, I see all the time
references to make it to 12 to 13 %. But have never seen a Mead
to make at 9%. I know us first timers are hard to have to deal
with.. But as one of the guys on here said, we are the future
mead makers.
One more.. has anyone seen a book on the subject that has
been published int he last few years, If not make this would
be a good project for MLD to do.. a real do it yourself guy
with photos of all the steps and equipment to the end result.
thanks again for any help and replys
bob
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Mead Lover's Digest #976, 10 December 2002
From: JayAnkeney@aol.com
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 16:35:36 EST
In a message dated 12/9/02 11:59:00 PM, mead-request@talisman.com writes:
<< I have just had a look at the Beer Judge Certification Program
(bjcp.org) where they have tons of info on beer tasting. But I could not
find much about mead tasting anywhere on the web or in mead books >>
I'd like to contribute to Mathieu in Ann Arbor's quest for info on judging
meads. As a BJCP judge myself, and recipient of my share of ribbons for both
meads and homebrews, I'll forgive his slight of beer as a "base drink". But
if he really wants to learn about judging meads, the best way would be to
participate in a local homebrew competition at which meads are judged. The
best way to start is to volunteer as a steward which allows you to sit in on
the judges' deliberations. Overhearing some BJCP judges analyze the meads
that are entered can be a graduate level education on the vagries of various
mead flavor profiles. He might also gain an appreciation of the glories of
competition homebrew if he keeps an open mind. Info about local homebrew (and
mead) competitions can be found at the Assoc. of Brewers web site:
http://www.beertown.org.
Jay Ankeney
President
The Strand Brewers
Jayankeney@AOL.com
------------------------------
Subject: Re: I need a specific type of yeast...
From: "Geoffrey T. Falk" <gtf@cirp.org>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 18:36:13 -0700 (MST)
Eric,
Try Lalvin D47. It has a high alcohol tolerance, does not produce
off-flavours (in my experience), and enhances esters and fruitiness.
Great for a melomel or cyser. Let us know how your next batch turns
out.
Geoffrey
In MLD 975, Eric wrote
> I'm been making mead for about 2 years now and I
> finally kind of know what I want to accomplish. You
> know? I've failed a couple of times and come close
> enough to have a good idea. Here's the deal, I want
> to find a yeast to use that will result in high enough
> alcohol content so I can age it for a long, long time.
> I like to cellar stuff. But I tried champagne yeast
> and the result may be able to fuel funny cars. And
> it's got too much of the breadiness that you can get
> from the champagne yeasts. So what are some
> recommendations? I generally make melomels. Any and
> all info appreciated.
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Mead Lover's Digest #976, 10 December 2002
From: Eric Drake <drake.49@osu.edu>
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 12:24:11 -0500
At 12:57 AM 12/10/2002 -0700, you wrote:
>Debate!
Wine making started around 6000 BC in Caucasia and
Mesopotamia: http://www.history-of-wine.com
By 380 AD wine was being produced in the Loire River region (origin of
Sauvignon Blanc): http://www.abigslice.com/sauvignonblancmain.html
My question that I have been trying to find an answer to on the net and
failing miserably is how long after wine production began, or even wine
production in a particular area was the product known for the variety of
grape from which it was made? When did people stop calling it wine, and
start calling it Sauvignon Blanc or Chardonnay etc.? I think this
distinction was caused by the globalization of the market. I make an
apple pie mead and call it "Apple Pie". People ask me not about my "apple
pie", but instead ask about my "mead".
Personally, I think that while the market is so young we should be suer to
keep the word "mead" in the title of our drinks. That way the commonality
between our orange blossoms and our buckwheats are established. If my
friend who loves my "buckwheat" was offered an "orange blossom", she might
refuse, but if my friend who likes my "buckwheat mead" is offered an
"orange blossom mead", she is more likely to relate the enjoyment of my
mead to this new unknown type and accept. To recite some of the Buzz from
the Chicago meadfest, "A rising tide raises all ships."
Long live the mead revolution!
Eric
------------------------------
Subject: Montrachet yeast, boiling honey
From: "phil" <pcwojdak@earthlink.net>
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 17:35:46 -0800
Hi all,
I'm gratified that my posting has sparked so much lively and divergent
feedback. I did not even ask about montrachet yeast and an interesting
conversation has begun. It seems that people who like it do so because
it is dependable, and others don't like the flavor profile. I'm
wondering if the people who don't like the flavor profile are talking
about meads that have aged sufficiently--if the people who like this
yeast expect mead to take a year and people who don't like it expect
their meads to develop faster.
I mentioned a Listerine quality as if it were an established
characteristic of montrachet yeast. This is based on my having read
several comments in various sources using that term. They also say that
this quality comes from phenols that will age out after a year. How do
these observations jive with the experiences of you montrachet fans and
critics?
People with experience and opinions with montrachet yeast-lets further
the depth of this discussion.
Someone posted in MLD-976 his thoughts about creating varietal meads.
It seems to me that deepening the conversation about the subtleties of
montrachet yeast's effects on the flavor profiles of mead is moving our
art of mead making in that direction.
My question about heating honey has also started a lively conversation
which I hope will continue and deepen. So far, the only first hand
experiences posted seem to show that boiling or sulfating may be
unnecessary. Dan wrote, "Meads I've made
Without using heat have lasted quite well, over two years now and
No sign of deterioration." Dan mentions a study done in the 1950's in
which meads made with no heat were tested and found to remained
microbiologically stable.
I think the most provocative post was Alson's which stated. "I've got
1.5G batches of Sanddunehoney mead fermenting right now: one is boiled
(15min); one is not boiled. Tasted them last night. Preferred the not
boiled Mead, seemed to have a little more complexity. But it was also
Drier than the boiled mead, so I won't be able to really judge
Until both are finished fermenting to dryness."
In the other camp, I hear lots of sound seeming reasoning why heating
and sulphiting are good ideas. This camp's view seems to be, "Why take
the risk."
However, no experiences of meads failing without these precautions have
been posted. Thus, the risk may be only theoretical, having no value
but to make the mead maker feel safer.
However, it may well be that any benefits from not boiling are also only
theoretical. In wine making the less processing, the more varietal
character e. g. pinot nuir. Is this true for mead though? The results
from Alson's experiment are not in yet. Alson also mentioned that two
commercial mead makers boil their musts not because of fears of flora
and fauna, but because it makes better mead. Ken said he switched from
boiling to sulphating and has noticed no differences in aromatics.
Theories aside, Is there such thing as mead gone bad for lack of
heating? Can other people share any experience with specific
differences between the flavors in heated verses unheated meads?
Let's talk more,
Phil
------------------------------
End of Mead Lover's Digest #977
*******************************
