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Mead Lovers Digest #0955
From: mead-request@talisman.com
Errors-To: mead-errors@talisman.com
Reply-To: mead@talisman.com
To: mead-list@talisman.com
Subject: Mead Lover's Digest #955, 16 September 2002
Mead Lover's Digest #955 16 September 2002
Forum for Discussion of Mead Making and Consuming
Dick Dunn, Digest Janitor
Contents:
Re: Distillation (Adam Funk)
Re: Mead Lover's Digest #954, 14 September 2002 (JayAnkeney@aol.com)
Bourbon Barrels ("Matt Maples")
RE: Honey famine? ("Houseman, David L")
Sour mead and clarity (Eric)
Looking for Recipes... ("Briggs WebDesign")
Re: Honey famine? / Supply and demand ("Kenneth R. Irwin")
Re: Honey famine? / Supply and demand (Mike Faul)
Re: Honey famine? / Supply and demand (Mike Faul)
Honey prices (Christopher Coonce-Ewing)
("stuart smith")
Small fermenters (LJ Vitt)
Aging Mead in Oak Barrels ("Stevenson, Randall")
Plastic Jars for Initial Fermentations. ("Stevenson, Randall")
NOTE: Digest appears when there is enough material to send one.
Send ONLY articles for the digest to mead@talisman.com.
Use mead-request@talisman.com for [un]subscribe/admin requests.
Digest archives and FAQ are available at www.talisman.com/mead. There is
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----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re: Distillation
From: Adam Funk <adam.funk@blueyonder.co.uk>
Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 18:30:59 +0100
> Subject: Re: Distillation
> From: "Robert Goulding" <sanctuary@rushmore.com>
> Date: Sat, 7 Sep 2002 21:20:37 -0600
>
> There is virtually no way for a homebrewer to get a license for
> distillation from the ATF. They say so right on their website.
Is anyone lobbying for this to be changed? It's no-one's business what
people produce for personal consumption and some home-fermenting
organizations ought to demand the right to distill too.
- -- Adam
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Mead Lover's Digest #954, 14 September 2002
From: JayAnkeney@aol.com
Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 14:39:32 EDT
In a message dated 9/14/02 10:20:35 AM, mead-request@talisman.com writes:
<< Subject: Honey Supplies
From: Nathan Kanous <nlkanous@pharmacy.wisc.edu>
Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2002 13:47:31 -0500
For what it's worth, my father-in-law is buried in honey this year. >>
Hey Nathan. Would your father like to sell some of that honey? I'm pretty
sure our local homebrew club, The Strand Brewers, would be interested in a
group buy.
Also I note you said you were intersted in filling a 55 gallon barrel with
mead. Hope you like the results. That's one heck of a lot of a single style
of mead to consume. Then again, I've always wanted to mass produce mead ice
cream.
Jay Ankeney
The Strand Brewers
------------------------------
Subject: Bourbon Barrels
From: "Matt Maples" <Matt_lists@hotmail.com>
Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 12:13:09 -0700
> Good Afternoon,
> I have an opportunity that is somehow begging me to seize. I know someone
> who has two full-size oak barrels from a very nice boutique bourbon
Out here in Portland we have two or three breweries that use them for
beer aging from time to time. It seems to me you are going to have to
make a big effort to come up with a mead that will not be totally
overpowered by the bourbon flavor. The Bourbon Porters, Stouts and Bocks
I have tried seemed to be over the top on the bourbon flavor. Don't get
me wrong I liked them but I think it would have been better if they had
less bourbon flavor. With mead being significantly less assertive flavor
wise (compared to these big porters and stouts) I would think you
might end up with something that tastes more like sweet bourbon than
bourbon flavored mead.
If it were me I would use a good honey that has tons of flavor that
would complement and stand up to the bourbon. My first choice would be
an avocado honey or maybe a meadow foam. I would make two batches, one
in the barrel and one just in glass. That way when the barrel one is
finished I would have another batch to blend with it if the bourbon is
too strong.
It sounds like a lot of fun and I definitely think you ought to at least
try it once. The idea is not without precedence, Lurgashall meadery from
England did one aged in rum barrels that I hear good things about.
Hope this helped.
Anyway I could talk you out of a bottle when it is done :-)
Matt Maples
Liquid Solutions
12162 SW Scholls Ferry Rd
Tigard, OR 97223
503-524-9722
www.liquidsolutions.ws (web site)
http://list.liquidsolutions.ws/scripts/lyris.pl (mailing list)
------------------------------
Subject: RE: Honey famine?
From: "Houseman, David L" <David.Houseman@unisys.com>
Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 15:51:17 -0400
Mike says the price of his honey has gone up from $.89/lb to $1.20/lb and
that this is "Purely because of Chinese hoeny being dumped on the market."
This doesn't make sense. If a commodity were being dumped on the market
this brings down the prices, not causes them to rise. The price rise must
be due to some other factor or I slept through Economics 101.
Dave
------------------------------
Subject: Sour mead and clarity
From: Eric <edahlber@rochester.rr.com>
Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 19:57:47 -0400
Hello - I have 2 topics I'd like your feedback on.
The first is has anyone done an intentionally soured mead - if so, how?
Sour wort/must? Lambic mix from wyeast or others? Lactic acid? I
recently moved a cherry/weisse/lambic mixture next to a barkshack ginger
and the rusty wheels in my head got to turning. I enjoy lambic krieks
immensely and also enjoy fruit meads why not try a soured cherry or
raspberry mead? I'm thinking along the lines of primary with wyeast
sweet mead and then racking to secondary over fruit and adding the
lambic cultures. I did a quick search of the archives and found a
posting by Matt Maples from 2000 saying he was experimenting with
different yeast and might try a Guzee (Gueze?) mead. Matt are you still
out there and did you try it? Is there a beverage like this already or a
category for competition?
The second is on clarity, (which may be a dead horse) I have done 7
different batches of mead. Frequently I will split batches of a sweet
mead and add different thing to the secondary and get odd results with
clarity. My latest was split into the following
2.5 gallons of Rosehip and Hibiscus mead (added tea from 18 teabags
steeped in 5 cups water) and
2.5 gallons vanilla mead (1 bean and 2 ounces extract)
The rosehip mead is so clear it is scary and it happened within a week
of racking. The vanilla looks like it did when I racked cloudy cloudy
cloudy) In fact nearly all of my yellowish meads are cloudy (the
exception being a hazelnut mead) and the 2 red meads cleared up quickly
and easily. What's likely to be happening here?
I've enjoyed reading this digest for the past several months, and hope
to hear your opinions on these topics.
Thanks,
Eric in Rochester, NY
------------------------------
Subject: Looking for Recipes...
From: "Briggs WebDesign" <bwd@coxinet.net>
Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 21:40:49 -0500
Good day all! I'm currently looking for recipes that involve pre-1600 CE
ingredients that tastes good. I've searched the web, but there seems to be
little that anyone has made that quite fits the bill. Does anyone have any
personal data on making period meads? I am looking at Nordic/Scandinavian
receipes if possible, if not, then any period European.
Thanks In Advance,
Hos
BTW, the first batch is merrily fermenting away in the secondary :) and
still tastes good, so there may be hope for this novice mead maker!
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Honey famine? / Supply and demand
From: "Kenneth R. Irwin" <kirwin@wittenberg.edu>
Date: Sun, 15 Sep 2002 12:40:58 -0400
On Wed, 11 Sep 2002, MeadMax <carraig@earthlink.net> wrote:
>The prices have gone from, remember this is bulk, $0.89 per/lb to almost
>$1.20 per/lb.
>Purely because of Chinese hoeny being dumped on the market.
>Mike
I'm confused about this assertion -- if foreign honey is being dumped on
the market, this should cause prices to *drop*, not increase. If there's
more supply, prices usually go down. (This is why steel manufacturer in the
US are so upset about the "dumping" foreign steel in the US -- they have a
harder time selling their steel at a profit.)
Is there something different about the Chinese honey situation that causes
prices to react differently?
What I *would* have expected to see is that the foreign honey would help
alleviate the price spikes that one might see because of the mite
infestations (though I don't know how widespread those are -- here in the
Midwest, many honey producers are having very low yields, and consequently
some of our prices are going up.)
Ken,
who hopes to one day have the facilities for dealing with 4000 lbs of honey
too...
Ken Irwin kirwin@wittenberg.edu
Reference/Electronic Resources Librarian (937) 327-7594
Thomas Library, Wittenberg University
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Honey famine? / Supply and demand
From: Mike Faul <carraig@earthlink.net>
Date: Sun, 15 Sep 2002 11:00:23 -0700
Kenneth R. Irwin wrote:
>> Mike
>
> I'm confused about this assertion -- if foreign honey is being dumped on
> the market, this should cause prices to *drop*, not increase. If there's
> more supply, prices usually go down. (This is why steel manufacturer in
> the US are so upset about the "dumping" foreign steel in the US -- they
> have a harder time selling their steel at a profit.)
>
> Is there something different about the Chinese honey situation that
> causes prices to react differently?
>
> What I *would* have expected to see is that the foreign honey would help
> alleviate the price spikes that one might see because of the mite
> infestations (though I don't know how widespread those are -- here in
> the Midwest, many honey producers are having very low yields, and
> consequently some of our prices are going up.)
Okay it is not dumping from this year that is causing the price
increases but dumping in previous years that caused the prices to drop
artificially. Now that the 'dumping' has been stopped the prices are
starting to come up and stabalize.
The following chart shows the amounts of honey that were imported into
the US for the past years.
http://www.nhb.org/intl/4Country/img001.gif
> Ken,
> who hopes to one day have the facilities for dealing with 4000 lbs of
> honey too...
hahha yeah I never thought I'd be dealing with that much myself. I just
had another 1800 lbs 'dropped' off yesterday.
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Honey famine? / Supply and demand
From: Mike Faul <carraig@earthlink.net>
Date: Sun, 15 Sep 2002 11:06:18 -0700
In case anyone is interested you can read the report from the USDA here
at this URL http://www.ams.usda.gov/fv/mncs/honey.pdf
Specifically see the bottom of the document for the report.
Mike
------------------------------
Subject: Honey prices
From: Christopher Coonce-Ewing <chris@coonce-ewing.com>
Date: Sun, 15 Sep 2002 19:19:10 -0500
In Connecticut, I've found the price to be $100.00 for a 60lb container
and even when told that price I was told that honey prices are on the
rise.
------------------------------
Subject:
From: "stuart smith" <stuartsmith@froggy.com.au>
Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 10:29:47 +1000
Oh woe is we.
Australia being I the grip of an extended drought at the moment has had
to start importing honey. (Might be contributing to why your prices have
gone up although I know it's not just us with production issues) So
honey prices are on the increase here too. Capilano Honey who are I
believe Australia's largest honey producer have had to import honey from
Argentina for the first time ever.
Apparently Australia usually exports around 15,000 metric tons each year
to the USA, Western Europe, South East Asia and Middle East. Not this
year.
Here's hoping for a better growing season next year.
Stuart
Melbourne Australia.
------------------------------
Subject: Small fermenters
From: LJ Vitt <lvitt4@yahoo.com>
Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 07:43:31 -0700 (PDT)
Jodie Davis asked in MLD#954 about what to ferment one gallon batches
other than glass jugs.
Some people do primary fermentations for beers in stainless kettles
with the lid on and no airlock. You may want to look at that option.
You should be able to find a size that is reasonable (8 quart?)
The great thing about 1 gal glass jugs is they are easy to get and
find stoppers and airlocks to fit them.
The only meads I made in 1 gallon quanities were part of a 5 gal batch
that got split up into different fruits after primary fermentation.
=====
Leo Vitt
Rochester MN
------------------------------
Subject: Aging Mead in Oak Barrels
From: "Stevenson, Randall" <rstevenson@ldi.state.la.us>
Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 09:56:52 -0500
Nathan asked about aging mead in oak barrels.
It has been a while -- and a few bottles of mead -- since I experienced
this, so I may misremember part of it. A homebrewer friend of mine did
something along the lines of what Nathan mentioned. Instead of mead, he
distilled the mead to make a honey brandy and aged it in an oak barrel.
The result was actually quite delicious. He used a smaller barrel which
increased the surface area per gallon and I thought the oak taste would
have been better if it were not so strong, so the 55 gallon barrel would
probably be perfect. The mixture of oak and honey flavors was
complementary. I think he also aged a batch of mead in an old bourbon
barrel. As I recall the taste of the bourbon from the barrel was
absorbed by the mead. That was a really interesting mead (tasty, but
not something I would want to quaff all night -- but I am not a bourbon
fan ... well, Bourbon Street is fun, but bourbon spirits and I divorced
20-something years ago after a fraternity party in college and have
never reconciled).
Brandy and whiskey does not run the risk of nasties that you may face
with straight mead. The biggest danger I see is the risk of
contamination of a large batch of mead. I would hate to hear that had
happened.
Wassail!
Randall Stevenson
------------------------------
Subject: Plastic Jars for Initial Fermentations.
From: "Stevenson, Randall" <rstevenson@ldi.state.la.us>
Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 10:02:56 -0500
Jodie mentioned using plastic for the initial fermentation. I've used
one gallon milk jugs with some success. I've also used some large
mouthed soft drink (3 liter) bottles. The airlock fit perfectly on
either. The only problem I ran into with the plastic was that some
flavors can pass through plastic to the mead. In other words, don't put
your plastic jugs next to a bag of onions unless you want your mead to
have an onion odor and slight taste. (Duh-huh ... said slapping my
forehead!)
Wassail!
Randall Stevenson
------------------------------
End of Mead Lover's Digest #955
*******************************
