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Mead Lovers Digest #0898
From: mead-request@talisman.com
Errors-To: mead-errors@talisman.com
Reply-To: mead@talisman.com
To: mead-list@talisman.com
Subject: Mead Lover's Digest #898, 23 January 2002
Mead Lover's Digest #898 23 January 2002
Forum for Discussion of Mead Making and Consuming
Dick Dunn, Digest Janitor
Contents:
artesian well water question ("Stephen J. Van der Hoven")
Re: Bottle Carbonation & Corn Sugar (JazzboBob@aol.com)
Drinking Vessels (Christopher C Carpenter)
Wheres the honey?! ("Azslande")
Autolysis, Oxidation, and Disappointment (Clogar)
Re: Mead Lover's Digest #897, 19 January 2002 (Gardengate32@aol.com)
Yeast in Oz (Tony Bilbrough)
RE: Mead Lover's Digest #897, 19 January 2002 (Shane Hultquist)
Acid level of meads/blackberry mead (Russ_Hobaugh@erm.com)
Mountain Guava Melomel (Don Conley)
keg Mead (Tony Bilbrough)
Re: Mead labeling (Bob and Winnie)
NOTE: Digest appears when there is enough material to send one.
Send ONLY articles for the digest to mead@talisman.com.
Use mead-request@talisman.com for [un]subscribe/admin requests.
Digest archives and FAQ are available at www.talisman.com/mead. There is
a searchable MLD archive at hubris.engin.umich.edu/Beer/Threads/Mead
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: artesian well water question
From: "Stephen J. Van der Hoven" <sjvande2@ilstu.edu>
Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2002 13:29:39 -0800
Jim Book asks about the minerals that are precipitating from boiled
artesian well water. I'm not sure what the thin black whisps are, but the
white sediment is most likely calcium carbonate. Calcium carbonate is a
mineral that has retrograde solubility. That means that as temperature
increases, it is less soluble in water. For most minerals, the opposite is
true, they become more soluble as temperature increases. Your artesian
well water is probably saturated with respect to calcium carbonate and when
you heat it up, you get mineral precipitates. I would just decant the
water off the precipitate and use it.
This artesian well water is probably as hard as your well water. Lots of
calcium is usually a sign of hard water. If you're worried about dissolved
iron, let the water stand for a few days stirring occasionally or bubbling
some air through it. The added oxygen will cause the iron to
precipitate. Unless you think your well water tastes bad, I wouldn't worry
about using it. I think there is an urban myth attached to "artesian"
water that it is somehow better than other water. In many situations,
artesian water can have much higher total dissolved solids (usually
equating to increased hardness) than water from shallow wells.
Steve
_____________________________
Stephen J. Van der Hoven
Assistant Professor
Department of Geography-Geology
Illinois State University
Campus Box 4400
Normal, IL 67190-4400
Phone: 309/438-3493
Fax: 309/438-5310
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Bottle Carbonation & Corn Sugar
From: JazzboBob@aol.com
Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2002 15:38:16 EST
Mead is brewed from honey and water. The addition of fruit and spices can
make many variations if desired. I think the use of dextrose/corn sugar is
fine for the purposes of priming. For practical purposes, the addition of
1/2 or 3/4 a cup of priming sugar in 5 gallons of mead will be so minor a
proportion of the ingredients as to be flavor neutral. Only a complete
purist and contest rule nitpicker should criticize the use of sugar priming
in a mead.
Priming in bulk with sugar is easy and consistent. Some people still like
the traditional addition of a spoonful of sugar in each bottle to avoid the
extra transfer and racking on bottling day. Beer and mead only needs to be
raised around 3 specific gravity points to induce enough refermentation in a
sealed bottle for carbonation to form. This is why premature bottling is so
dangerous. Also, cold beer and mead in the winter will have more CO2 in
solution from a recently completed fermentation compared to an old batch
that's been maturing a long time. It can be necessary to add fresh yeast at
bottling time assure the viability of a second fermentation in a batch that
has aged a long time before bottling and is free of sediment.
Another thing to keep in mind if priming with honey VS sugar is the
difference in volume because of the liquid. One cup of honey is
approximately equal to 3/4 cup of dextrose. But even this may vary with the
moisture content of the honey. Also, priming with honey might introduce
other fermentation issues too especially if it isn't boiled and evenly
dissolved into the mead. Further, the yeast will probably be quicker to
ferment the dextrose since they don't require dissolved oxygen to develop
nutritional equivalents in a finished mead to ferment the primer.
While I don't recall seeing sugar listed as an ingredient in historic mead
recipes, there are many old beers made with the use of sugar adjuncts. All
the old recipes I've read seem to simply bottle the mead and wait for it to
mature without the mention of priming so they were either still meads or
naturally carbonated from fermentation of residual sweetness. Bottles were in
short supply in the old days and most beverages would have been served from
wooden kegs that couldn't hold anywhere near the high volume of carbonation
as a bottle. I think that sparkling clear Champagne-like mead is a modern
style adaptation.
Modern British Real Ale producers prime with sugar. The traditional German
Krausening practice is to prime with a bit of fermenting beer. I wonder when
the practice of priming beer with sugar (and adopted by homebrewers for mead
too) developed and guess that it is a relatively recent practice. I believe
that it was the legendary Dom Perignon that discovered and devised the
practice of priming Champagne to produce a consistant sparkle.
Also, Budweiser uses rice as a brewing adjunct and not corn sugar. I feel
that rice lends a crisper cleaner fermented taste compared to sugar.
Japanese beers also are brewed with rice. I would only characterize the
flavor description of Budweiser as thin and watery compared to an all malt
beer or a stronger beer style. It's a classic example of a modern American
Lager and is brewed with great consistency and adherence to quality control
and freshness. Bud is a pretty consistent product for such a mass market and
they earn my respect as great technicians. While I don't personally drink Bud
or other American light beers because I don't enjoy this beer style, I
recognize these giant commercial brewers for their financial business
strength and driving sales and distribution systems they have developed.
Bob Grossman
<< < I use corn sugar on my beers, is it acceptable to use corn sugar on the
mean, or is honey, even processed clover honey, a better bet?
<<<Any honey is better, this is the point of mead. Corn sugar has no
appreciable character or taste, and is added only to raise the alcohol
content. Corn sugar is usually from genetically altered corn, and is closer
to being a chemical than natural product. (On this list I would guess that
a majority of meadmakers value of its historical/religious significance as
well as its aesthetic and alcoholic values. The older the recipe the better,
and sugar just does not enter the picture as an ingredient in any of the
recipes I have seen.) True, traditional mead is honey, water and yeast,
just like true beer is malt, hops, yeast and water. The unmistakable taste
of Budweiser (thin and watery) is due to its use of cheaper corn sugar
rather than true malt.
------------------------------
Subject: Drinking Vessels
From: Christopher C Carpenter <chris.carpenter@ndsu.nodak.edu>
Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2002 17:05:09 -0600
- --On Saturday, January 19, 2002 10:35 AM -0700 mead-request@talisman.com
wrote:
> I realize that in years past, there have been any number of containers
> used to drink mead. Are there any specific mead drinking vessels today
> recognized as "mead glassware" or "mead drinking vessels"?
As a longtime SCA person, One of my pet peeves is the idea that if it is
not documented it did not exist. I am a musician and you would not BELIEVE
the arguements I have had on this topic. Common sense says that if mead
was the common drink of the masses, they probably did not have "Special"
drinking vessels for it, they used whatever was at hand, and if you want a
special glass, find one that fits your fancy that was used during the
period, and whether you can prove it was used or not, I can assure you it
was. It is YOU who makes the vessel special, not a peice of paper that
says someone else knows more than you do.
Chris Carpenter
------------------------------
Subject: Wheres the honey?!
From: "Azslande" <azslande@azslande.com>
Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2002 20:50:17 -0500
Hi i have a question, I live in south-central Pennsylvania, and there
seem to be NO places around here that sell Mead, except for the local
state shop, they sell something called Irish Mead. Do you know of any
places i can order Mead online? Or perhaps some stores in South-Central
PA (Around Harrisburg). Thanks.
Bright Blessings!
"Judge ye not by faith, and judge ye not by color, for underneath our
skin, we are all like one another."
Azslande - You're local friendly Witch!
------------------------------
Subject: Autolysis, Oxidation, and Disappointment
From: Clogar <clogar@concentric.net>
Date: Sun, 20 Jan 2002 08:00:17 -0500
Yesterday, I completed bottling two pyments (one semi-sweet and one
sweet; both using pinot noir juice) that I started roughly one year
prior. About 4 months ago (the last racking before transfering to the
bottling bucket), they tasted pretty good - a little strong, but nothing
additional aging wouldn't cure. When tasted yesterday, they both had a
disappointing off taste that I couldn't identify. I figure it is either
oxidation (something I thought was prevented by keeping the airlocks
full and using sulfites) or autolysis (which is possible since the
second racking was about a month late due to a family crisis; still,
I barely tasted the off flavor at that time), though I'll be happy
to listen to the suggestions of others if they have any idea as to
what caused it - this is not something I want to happen to a big
batch again.
My question is, how can I safely create "samples" of autolysis- and
oxidation-damaged mead so I know what it tastes like? I know some
people talk about "almond" flavor, but that really doesn't help
me. What I need to do is actually kill some tastebuds on some bad
mead so I know what the flavors are. Any little "tricks" to create
some "bad" samples that won't cost me too much precious honey?
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Mead Lover's Digest #897, 19 January 2002
From: Gardengate32@aol.com
Date: Sun, 20 Jan 2002 09:21:39 EST
In a message dated 1/19/2002 1:14:41 PM Eastern Standard Time,
mead-request@talisman.com writes:
> Subject: artesian well water
> From: Book2928@aol.com
> Date: Sat, 12 Jan 2002 10:21:40 EST
>
>
> hello all,
> i've been reading the archives for the last week or so. very
> impressed!! i have read in one of them about using artesian well water. i
> have such a well close by, so i thought i would try it. i got a large
> stainless steel pot and boiled three gallons of water. i noticed thin black
>
> whisps in the water as it got hot. i strained these out. there seemed to be
> a
> small amount of a film as the water heated. after a ten minute boil, i let
> the water sit. when i looked in at it, there was about 1/8" of white
> sediment
> on the bottom. is this calcium?? if not, then what? should i not use this
> water, or could i just rack it off the sediment. also, i have well water
> which is very hard. i have heard that this is ok, but there is a lot of
> iron
> in it. what about it. i have been using bottled water for the first four
> batches. is there any problem with this? thank you so much to all who have
> been a part of this group. i have learned so much from you all. thanks
> again, jim book
>
>
hey, jim. what you saw were precipitates of mineral and organic matter. if
you have been drinking the water, and have not had any reactions to it, it is
probably fine. of course, it's always a good idea to test water, any water.
inexpensive test strips are available at most hardware stores, or you can
have a treatment professional check it out. the solid precipitates were
likely calcium and magnesium, for the most part. the black or grayish black
wispies indicate the presence of organic matter or a small amount of sulfer
bacteria. this is from decomposing organic matter which has fallen into
wells, usually. at higher concentrations there will be a rotten egg smell
and a very objectional taste, then you have to chlorine shock the well.
there will be minerals and bacteria to some degree in any water, i wouldn't
sweat it too much. b
------------------------------
Subject: Yeast in Oz
From: Tony Bilbrough <tony@bilbrough.org>
Date: Mon, 21 Jan 2002 21:27:42 +1000
G'day All,
Thank you for the Mead Lovers Digest. It's a great read.
Well, now its seems ok to admit to being a Lurker. So I was.
* till now -
Just a couple of things, here.
I was wondering if any of your readers are in Brisbane, Queensland, Oz.
My nearest beer brewing shop is in Annerley, and the bloke in there
reckons that any of his yeast's will be all right for Mead - but I've
heard lawyers say similar, and have come away disappointed!
*anyway
I bought D 47 and All Purpose
I also got 20k of un processed honey from a bloke down past Currumbin,
delivered to my door, for $50.
I've collected most of the gear your readers have talked of over the
last few months, and am now ready to 'do it' - whenever.
- - whenever The Mead Queen has a spare morning [She has 'done it'- once
already, you know].
*now
Does anyone have a favourite recipe, one that is reasonably fool proof,
for a novice, in a beer and wine drinking environment?
*and
apart from the Yeast info and Recipe, I was wondering if there were any
other Lurkers ready to stagger out of the scrub, who wanted to watch the
first phase of Making a 25 l batch of Mead, being done at my place.
We will worry about this racking stuff when we get there.
Anyway, it looks like we have to wait a few months for that.
cheers all
- --
..........Tony Bilbrough
I find myself looking thru a veil
...........seeing a halo of gold
and I am lost for words
------------------------------
Subject: RE: Mead Lover's Digest #897, 19 January 2002
From: Shane Hultquist <Shane.Hultquist@pwgsc.gc.ca>
Date: Mon, 21 Jan 2002 08:21:54 -0500
mead drinking vessels ("Lindi Edens")
Tamarindo Mead (leavitdg@plattsburgh.edu)
finings ("Mark Tumarkin")
artesian well water (Book2928@aol.com)
Subject: Bottle Carbonation ("Mitch Rice")
Drinking Vessels ("Matt_lists")
Mead, Meade, and ATF ("Matt_lists")
Response to "Jadwiga by Matt" ("Julia Herz")
Subject: Bunratty, again ("Meade" is NOT mead) (Adam Funk)
Orange-Cinnamon Mead Advice ("Jeff Woods")
A Very Pleasant Smell (Rod Heil)
RE: Dry, sparkling meads in Cincinnati... ("Brian Morgan")
Subject: mead drinking vessels
From: "Lindi Edens" <lindiedens@hotmail.com>
Date: Sat, 12 Jan 2002 01:05:43 -0600
"Subject: Mead Drinking Vessels
From: "Joseph Dillon" <dawnshala@msn.com>
Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2002 07:18:45 -0500
I realize that in years past, there have been any number of containers used
to drink mead. Are there any specific mead drinking vessels today
recognized
as "mead glassware" or "mead drinking vessels"?"
>Yes, although they are not modern, and that may be what you are asking.
>Although I drink my mead in a pewter mug, many meaderies and renaissance
>stores sell a "mead glass". It's an interesting looking thing. It's
shaped
>like a cone, and you have to put it in a holder to set it down. The idea
>behind it, is that if you can't sit your glass down, nobody can slip any
>poison into it and kill you. Offhand, I know that Pirtle's Winery in
>Weston, MO sells them, but others do as well.
Traditionally, drinking horns are used to consume mead. That is probably
where the design of the glass you mention comes from.
I know that when we do a Norse ritual, we always use a drinking horn. I
guess back then they used the horn of the Aurochs, but now we just use a cow
horn (more accessible).
There are horn dealers online, or you can make your own. Do a search on the
web for "Drinking horn". You will find many places.
Wassail!
Vidar
------------------------------
Subject: Acid level of meads/blackberry mead
From: Russ_Hobaugh@erm.com
Date: Mon, 21 Jan 2002 08:21:53 -0500
I recently bought a wine acid test kit to get more precise in
my approach to mead. It is pretty simple to use, but gives
no acid levels regarding mead. The kit has instructions
for white, red, and fruit wines. I would assume a melomel
would count as a fruit wine. Would a regular mead equate
to a white wine? Anybody use these, or just dump acid
blend into the mead like I usually do?
On a totally unrelated note, I recently started a batch of
blackberry mead:
7 lbs frozen blackberries
8 lbs of clover honey
Lalvin D-47 yeast
I was planning on adding a 3lb can of blackberry purree
after the secondary. This is my first mead with D-47--I
have always used champagne yeast. Will this be to much
sugar for the D-47 to ferment? I am looking for a slightly
sweet finish somewhere around 1.015 or so. I could
always through in another yeast if it got stuck, but I am
looking for a strong blackberry flavor, and a slightly
sweet finish(SWMBO detests dry wines).
Russ Hobaugh
Goob' Dog Brewery
Birdsboro PA
------------------------------
Subject: Mountain Guava Melomel
From: Don Conley <dconley1@san.rr.com>
Date: Mon, 21 Jan 2002 12:37:55 -0800
I've created my new years mead. On Jan 1, I pitched the yeast to create my
Mountain Guava Melomel.
This batch consists of:
5 gallons Palomar Mountain Artesian well water (Drawn from a well near the
top of Palomar Mountain in California, not the store bottled stuff)
15 pounds clover honey
8 pounds Guavas
Juice of one lemon
1 tsp yeast nutrient
1 tsp yeast energizer
1 tbsp Irish Moss
The night before:
The Guava was quartered and frozen, any questionable bad
spots were removed.
I pasteurized the honey and water and skimmed off the foam at the top. I
then added the energizer and nutrient, lemon juice and guava to kill off any
bacteria as well. When the pasteurization was done for the mostpart, I took
out the guava and put it into my primary fermentor (packaged in a nylon mesh
sack) and added the Irish moss to the must.
I added the must to my primary fermenter (a 6 gallon bucket) and topped it
off with the remaining water. I then sealed the lid, attached an airlock and
let it cool over night.
Jan 1:
To make it a true New Years mead, I pitched the yeast right at 12am.
After about 48 hours the fermentation took off like wild fire. Since this is
my first time using fruits in my mead, instead of juices I wasn't quite sure
what to expect with this batch. The lid of the bucket was swollen and it
look as though it was about to explode and I had overflow coming through the
airlock. I placed the bucket into a large pan to catch any drip off and
placed a small bowl on top of the airlock to prevent any from spraying out...
On Jan 3rd, I came home from work to find the lid blown off, and the bowl
that was on top was thrown across the kitchen. I closed the lid as soon as I
saw that, I'm unsure how long it had been open as no one was home but the
cats to witness it. I then got out my roll of duct tape and tried using that
to close the lid tight so that it wouldn't blow again. That lasted all of
about 8 hours. I was woken up by an extremely loud pop and rushed to the
kitchen to see that it had blown the lid again and this time spewed must
through the tape and onto the wall and counter top.
At this time, I removed the airlock, and stuffed my racking tube into the
stopper and put the other end into a jar of water. I thought that the
pressure was caused by the airlock not being able to release enough pressure
fast enough. However, the next day I found it not to be caused by the
airlock as I got up and found the lid was blown again.
What I discovered is that the bag of guava was floating around at the top of
the bucket. I didn't think to weight it down so that it stayed at the
bottom. I had to quickly find a way to keep it away from the top and not
plug up the airlock. Short of dumping out the batch and risking farther
contamination, I sterilized a plastic chop stick and was able to put it down
the hole in the lid of the bucket, push the fruit down and to the side and
hold it in place with the stopper. I kept the tubing and the jar, as I still
had a lot of overflow from the krausen (sp?) forming at the top and pushing
out of the bucket.
Now, 21 days later, the fermentation is going very strong with a very
audible bubbling coming through my overflow tube into the water. It appears
to not be slowing down. I've got a wonderful aroma of Guava through out the
kitchen now and all messes have been cleaned and future messes stopped. If
it tastes anything like it's smelling at the moment when it's done, then I'll
have achieved sauces.
I've learned a couple things from this batch already:
1. If using fruit, be sure to weight down the bad to keep it from stopping
the escape of pressure and causing a huge mess!
2. I need a larger bucket. I wasn't taking the volume of the fruit into
consideration and added my normal amount of water. All in all I've lost
between 1/2 and 1 gallon of must to the overflow container. This should
still keep it at about a 5 gallon batch.
3. Duct tape can't even stop the pressure created by the little yeasts! I
have to wonder what kind of PSI was in that bucket to blow the lid in such a
manner. That lid isn't easy for me to remove.
Don Conley
------------------------------
Subject: keg Mead
From: Tony Bilbrough <tony@bilbrough.org>
Date: Tue, 22 Jan 2002 11:08:55 +1000
G'day Brian,
and Mead Lovers Digest
I am not sure of your protocols vis a vis writing to your contributors
directly, so please forgive me if I have done bad, ok?
I am about to 'do' my first mead, and have been carefully following Mead
Lovers digest for a while.
You mentioned kegging. I have a couple of spare 20 l stainless steel
ones. [I now use 50 l ones for my beer]. so am hoping these will be ok.
Or do I have to get oak ones? The latter are rather exy here in Oz.
Can you tell me the sequence of doing a sparkling, and pass on any
tricks?
thanks Mate
- --
..........Tony Bilbrough
I find myself looking thru a veil
...........seeing a halo of gold
and I am lost for words
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Mead labeling
From: Bob and Winnie <natvwine@cut.net>
Date: Tue, 22 Jan 2002 17:43:38 -0700
My winery has a COLA (certificate of label approval) from the atf for
"Mead" and we sell it out of our tasting room.
As mentioned below the label must list a class type but elsewhere in the
regs it allows that this type listing is not necessary in certain cases;
if the wine is a Cabernet or Pinot Noir or a Mead then that name alone
will suffice for the class designation.
These classes in turn are defined in a strict manner by the atf
presumably so that someone like Bunratty can't pass off a fake product.
The atf has decided that mead is only to contain honey, water, yeast and
(optional) hops, as well as any of the standard adjuncts approved by the
regs. This is why Bunratty cannot use the word "Mead".
We also make several Methyglyns, etc. using flowers, fruits and spices
and these by definition (atf) cannot be meads and so in these cases we
must use a term like "Wild Rosehip Honey Wine" with a type listing that
says "contains wild rosehip wine and honey wine". Both of these wines by
the way require the filing and approval of a formula by the atf!
Although I myself have grumbled mightily about the regs and rules, in
the atf's defense I must say that they have an imposibly complex task
and are under pressure from many sides of the political and economic
spectrum.
Bob Sorenson, Native Wines
> Dick is right on both counts. ATF is sticklers about labels and the only
> way things will change is if we get off our collective butts.
>
> Now I have looked at the ATF Beverage manual concerning labeling and
> type classification and it says that you MUST include a type and under
> the heading of "wine from other agricultural products" (chapter 5
> http://www.atf.treas.gov/pub/alctob_pub/bevalmanual/chapter5.pdf )
> it states that wine made from honey must be labeled mead OR honey wine.
> The key word there is OR. I don't know if this has changed recently but
> I have heard that some three years ago a meadery up here tried to use
> the term MEAD and it was rejected. So either meaderies haven't tried to
> submit a label with just "mead" on it recently or ATF isn't following
> there own guidelines.
>
> Anyone know of a mead out there that is labeled just "Mead" without the
> term honey wine on the label??? Of the one I have seen all of them
> include the term honey wine (by choice or force I don't know).
>
> As for the whole Bunratty Meade, labeling law states that "A name that
> describes the age, origin, identity or other characteristics of the wine
> is prohibited UNLESS the name , whether standing alone or in combination
> with other printed or graphic material:
> Accurately describes the wine
>
------------------------------
End of Mead Lover's Digest #898
*******************************
