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Cider Digest #1750
Subject: Cider Digest #1750, 7 December 2012
From: cider-request@talisman.com
Cider Digest #1750 7 December 2012
Cider and Perry Discussion Forum
Contents:
Re: Harrison, VA Crab, Wickson (Ben Watson)
Cider book, 3rd edition (Ben Watson)
Re: Sharp, sweet, bitter? (Claude Jolicoeur)
Small cider startup, and Cidercon rooms. (Jim Lord)
Sharp, sweet, bitter? (Andrew Lea)
Re: Sharp Apple (Charles McGonegal)
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Subject: Re: Harrison, VA Crab, Wickson
From: Ben Watson <BWatson@chelseagreen.com>
Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2012 08:27:48 -0500
Richard Reeves wrote:
Does anyone have experience with the American cider varieties
Harrison, Virginia Crab and Wickson Crab, vis-a-vis where they lie on the
bitter/sweet/sharp scale?
Richard ? I haven't taken readings on Brix or pH/titratable acidity
on single-variety juices for any of these apples (as a non-commercial
cider maker, I tend to measure by tasting rather than measuring). But I
have experience tasting both the sweet and fermented juice of all these
apples. And all, in my opinion, are superior cider fruits.
Harrison and Virginia Crab are both high in sugar and both yield a
dark-colored almost viscous, syrupy juice. Both ferment to make a very
good varietal hard cider. The darker color of Harrison is retained in the
finished cider; to my taste, Harrison makes a more complex and interesting
single-variety cider than Golden Russet. As far as I know no one is producing
a commercial single-variety Harrison cider, although a few producers are
using it in their blend. Many trees planted in recent years are just now
coming into production.
Virginia (or Hewes) Crab can also make a very good single-variety cider. The
fresh juice resembles Harrison, very dark and thick, rich and sugary. The
fermented cider I've had is much lighter in color than Harrison. When
young, the VA Crab I had (made by Chuck Shelton at Albemarle Ciderworks)
had a pronounced "strawberry"-like aroma and berries in the palate as
well. A quality that some people find interesting, others peculiar. But
I just opened my last bottle (aged 2 years) at Thanksgiving this year,
and was very impressed with how the cider had aged. There was a much more
subtle berry-ness and the cider was really excellent.
Wickson is one of the most useful American cider apples, in my opinion,
because it is so high in both sugar and acidity. In the Northeast, anyway,
the acidity predominates, so to my taste the resulting varietal cider is
a bit too acidic and unbalanced all by itself. However, Wandering Aengus
has made a varietal Wickson in the past.
I'd be tempted to blend Wickson and one or both of the other apples, but
VA Crab is early (Sept), while Wickson and Harrison are harvested later in
the season. So one would probably need to either freeze the VA Crab juice
and blend it later in the season, or ferment it separately and blend with
the other fermented juices later. This would probably be the best way to
play around with how much of each would be ideal.
Ben Watson
Francestown, NH
------------------------------
Subject: Cider book, 3rd edition
From: Ben Watson <BWatson@chelseagreen.com>
Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2012 20:48:10 -0500
Dear Cider Digesters,
Last month my publisher, Countryman Press/W.W. Norton, asked me if I'd be
interested in updating my book, Cider, Hard and Sweet, which was originally
published in 1999 and revised in a 2nd edition in 2008.
I think there is enough going on in the cider universe now to justify
a new edition, and I hope to improve the look of the book (design-wise,
plus better photos ? different trim size and maybe include color). But
beyond the format and design, I would like to invite suggestions and
constructive criticism ? as I did five years ago, from any of you who
would like to contact me off-list.
What am I missing? Which parts of the book are lacking, or no longer
relevant? For instance, I think that now is the time to add some more
material on Spanish ciders, since I have more tasting experience with them
and it is becoming more available in certain parts of the US. I also intend
to add more on taste descriptors.
It's fine to recommend technical information, but bear in mind that my
book was never intended to be the be-all and end-all for serious, advanced
cider makers. I wanted to introduce people to the history, culture, and
basics of cider, and not get too far beyond my own level of production
expertise. And although I think my own cider has gotten better, that has
little to do with sophisticated equipment or technical know-how.
Besides, that book for North America (for more serious amateur and
small-scale commercial cider makers) will be coming out late next year,
as readers of the Digest will already know. Our friend Claude Jolicoeur
will be turning in his manuscript to me in a few weeks time. (And Claude,
I promise not to steal anything from your book!)
However, if you've noticed any errors or misinformation in the 2nd edition
of my book, I'd appreciate a heads-up. Especially in the chapter on perry
and the final chapter on "beyond the basics." I did vet the information,
but it's entirely possible that I screwed something up.
Thanks in advance for any constructive criticism you might have. I need
to turn things over to Countryman by March 1, so please contact me before
Feb. 1 if you have any input.
Best wishes to all for the holidays,
Ben Watson
Francestown, NH
benwatson52@comcast.net
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Sharp, sweet, bitter?
From: Claude Jolicoeur <cjoliprsf@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 05 Dec 2012 10:18:33 -0500
In Cider Digest #1749, 3 December 2012
>Subject: Sharp, sweet, bitter?
>From: Richard Reeves <richardr1959@gmail.com>
>Hi all. Does anyone have experience with the American cider varieties
>Harrison, Virginia Crab and Wickson Crab, vis-a-vis where they lie on the
>bitter/sweet/sharp scale?
I don't yet have much experience with them and I hope someone else
will also step in...
Virginia - I had first fruit this year, but not enough to make a
juice test. It is high sugar, acidity rather high also, and some
astringency. Hence it would be classified as a bittersharp in the
English classification system.
Wickson - I never tasted it, but from reading, it would be somewhat
similar to Virginia with high sugar, high acidity and some tannin.
Harrison - I was able to taste a quarter of apple last month at
CiderDays. Its taste was rather like a mild bittersweet, with low
acidity and some tannin. Old reports mention a good richness in
sugar, but I wasn't able to confirm this.
And, in another post:
>Subject: Sharp Apple
>From: "Rich Anderson" <rhanderson@centurytel.net>
>I am looking for a bittersharp or sharp apple. Currently I have a number of
>Kingston Black's, Brown's and Porters. The Brown's are very biennial(80%)
>but do not think a very interesting apple.
Virginia and Wickson could possibly be 2 good bittersharps to try.
I agree with you that Brown's Apple isn't a very interesting apple as
grown in this continent. Somehow the qualities the English find in
this apple variety didn't cross the ocean! Or maybe it requires the
English climate to develop its qualities...
Claude Jolicoeur
------------------------------
Subject: Small cider startup, and Cidercon rooms.
From: Jim Lord <magnusjager@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 5 Dec 2012 10:47:19 -0500
Also interested in this. I went to the site about booking a room and it
seems they are either out of rooms at the reduced rate or something is
wrong with the code. Anyone got any input on this?
> Subject: Re: Small Cidery Start-up
> From: Nat West <natjwest@gmail.com>
> Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2012 11:04:31 -0800
>
> Hi Corey -
>
> Good timing... I will be presenting on this very topic at the upcoming
> CiderCon in Chicago in Feb: http://ciderconference.com/
>
> Specifically, my talk will focus on low-capital input cidermaking. It's not
> too hard to start up a small cidery if you have a lot of money. I'll cover
> equipment, processes, some business considerations, marketing, etc. Hope to
> see you there.
>
> Nat West
> Reverend Nat's Hard Cider, Portland Oregon
------------------------------
Subject: Sharp, sweet, bitter?
From: Andrew Lea <andrew@harphill.co.uk>
Date: Wed, 05 Dec 2012 17:02:37 +0000
On 04/12/2012 02:14, Richard Reeves wrote:
>
> Hi all. Does anyone have experience with the American cider varieties
> Harrison, Virginia Crab and Wickson Crab, vis-a-vis where they lie on the
> bitter/sweet/sharp scale?
Coming from the wrong side of the pond, I don't. Though Ian Merwin has
done some work on Wickson (which is a 20th century cross) and classes it
as a Sharp with Tannin of 0.03% and Acid of 0.98% (Journal of the
American Pomological Society 60(3):113-128 2006).
Harrison and (Hewes) Virginia Crab are much older varieties from
colonial times. So the real purpose of this note is to remind American
readers that two classic early 19th century fruit books which mention
both those varieties and their cider making qualities are available
online for all to read. (I would guess from their descriptions that they
are likely to be sharps or mild bittersharps)
They are by William Coxe
http://archive.org/details/viewofcultivatio00coxerich and James Thacher
http://archive.org/details/americanorchardi00thacrich
Andrew Lea
nr Oxford, UK
www.cider.org.uk
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Sharp Apple
From: Charles McGonegal <cpm@appletrue.com>
Date: Thu, 6 Dec 2012 08:04:30 -0600
Rich,
I've got a Crimson King tree or two, but I don't know if it's true to type.
I don't think much of it. Lots of fruit damage, boring taste and a very
different ripening time. I'd rather have something like Roxbury Russet.
Some of the French bitters are interesting and seems to bear okay. Frequin
LaCaille. Mattais. St. Martin. I don't know that they are especially
sharp. I lean to the bittersweets.
Subject: Sharp Apple
From: "Rich Anderson" <rhanderson@centurytel.net>
Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2012 11:24:12 -0800
I am looking for a bittersharp or sharp apple. Currently I have a number of
Kingston Black's, Brown's and Porters. The Brown's are very biennial(80%)
but do not think a very interesting apple. The Kingston are fine but have
irregular cropping(50%) and find the Porter's a good and consistent cropper.
I would be interested if anyone has tried Crimson King and perhaps some bud
wood to that I might purchase?
Sent from my iPhone
Charles McGonegal
AEppelTreow Winery
Artisan Cider & Spirits
(262)496-7508=
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End of Cider Digest #1750
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