Cider Digest #1638

eZine lover (@eZine)

Published in 

Cider Digest

 · 7 months ago

Subject: Cider Digest #1638, 18 June 2011 
From: cider-request@talisman.com 

 
Cider Digest #1638                                         18 June 2011 

                 Cider and Perry Discussion Forum 

Contents: 
  Re: Cider Digest #1637, 13 June 2011 (Carl LeClair) 
  North American cider fruit & juice map (Alan Yelvington) 
  Pumps ("Rich Anderson") 
  More on Brett and Mouse (Andrew Lea) 

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Digest Janitor: Dick Dunn 
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Subject: Re: Cider Digest #1637, 13 June 2011 
From: Carl LeClair <werksind@gmail.com> 
Date: Tue, 14 Jun 2011 05:31:27 -0400 

Small Pump Request: 

Dick, 

I to have pondered this issue as to what pump I should purchase. 
I have not found anything either, yet am growing in volume and haven't 
a clue to where I may end up as to production! The most interesting 
products to date have been the Enoitalia product line offered by St. 
Patrick's. 
The Euro 20 or 30 comes to mind. 

http://www.stpats.com/index.htm 

Regards, 

Carl 

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Subject: North American cider fruit & juice map 
From: Alan Yelvington <alany@semparpac.org> 
Date: Tue, 14 Jun 2011 10:28:46 -0400 

Just a reminder that the North American fruit 
and juice provider map is a continuing work 
in progress. 

http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UTF8&hl=en&msa=0&msid=213649397178149661892.00 
048513ade770cc6b56a&ll=40.713956,-96.152344&spn=33.698948,90&z=4 

If you sell either cider variety fruit, or 
fresh pressed juice, then feel free to send 
me a note so that I can include you on the 
map.  Autumn will be here before we know it, 
and there are thirsty people out there 
looking for you! 

Al Yelvington 

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Subject: Pumps 
From: "Rich Anderson" <rhanderson@centurytel.net> 
Date: Tue, 14 Jun 2011 15:04:39 -0700 

I hear the pain Dick, pumps are a major item. In my humble experience get 
the right equipment. I tried to go cheap, plastic tanks, small pumps and 
hose, odd fittings etc. After several years it was all replaced with little 
resale value. Next to investing in variable capacity stainless tanks, the 
next best purchase was a small winery pump, 23-24 gallons per minute, self 
priming plus hose and tri-clamp fittings. Consider that even at 1000 gallons 
you are going to move that product least 3 times. We do use other pumps, a 
small and cheap rotary pump for the juice tray and a stainless centrifugal 
pump that came with the filter unit. For bottling we use CO2 to move the 
product from the chiller tank to the filler.  One thing to consider is if 
you get good equipment it likely has a decent resale value should you decide 
to close up shop. Consider that I paid a outrageous $1000 for the winery 
pump, today I think it would sell for the same used since a similar pump is 
$1500 new. 

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Subject: More on Brett and Mouse 
From: Andrew Lea <andrew@harphill.co.uk> 
Date: Thu, 16 Jun 2011 19:44:47 +0100 

On 10/06/2011 Ben Watson wrote: 
> 
> Jancis Robinson (and others) assert that Americans in general are more 
> sensitive to "brett" than others. 

I suspect that is a cultural sensitivity ("zero-tolerance") rather than 
a true organoleptic sensitivity. Here in Europe we are not so fussy ;-) 
Indeed it has been shown that 4-ethyl phenol (the most frequently 
measured Brett metabolite) at a level of 2 ppm actually enhances the 
flavour of Beaujolais wine. Above 4 ppm it might start to be regarded as 
a problem. People might be interested in this paper which attempts to 
define the threshold at which it becomes a problem for Europeans in 
French cider. The levels determined were 3 ppm for 4-ethyl phenol and 12 
ppm for 4-ethyl catechol. Below that threshold it is welcomed. You need 
to pay to read the paper I'm afraid. 
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0308814610011192 

> Perhaps Andrew Lea can explain -- probably for the umpteenth time -- 
> what's behind the difference in ability to perceive mousiness. 

Here goes ....  the compounds responsible for mousiness are 'bases' in 
chemical terms (especially the tetrahydropyridines). At the pH of cider 
say 3.5 they exist as the non-volatile malate salts. When they get in to 
your mouth (higher pH) it takes a finite time for the free bases to be 
dissociated and liberated from the salt so they can be detected 
sensorially. That is why mousiness takes a few seconds to develop in the 
mouth. Further, the pH of your mouth will differ depending on your 
genetics and your diet, time of day etc. So different people will have 
different sensitivities. 

Here in the UK a couple of cider judges I know always take a small pot 
of sodium bicarbonate with them to competitions. If they suspect a cider 
to be mousy, they drop in a pinch of the bicarb, which raises the pH and 
the mousiness can then actually be smelled in the headspace. 

There is a good review on mouse from Australia here. Again you need to 
pay to read it. http://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/jf0528613 

Andrew Lea 
nr Oxford, UK 
www.cider.org.uk 

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End of Cider Digest #1638 
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