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Cider Digest #1552
Subject: Cider Digest #1552, 24 February 2010
From: cider-request@talisman.com
Cider Digest #1552 24 February 2010
Cider and Perry Discussion Forum
Contents:
Perry and Cherry Cider Experiences (cal1advise@aol.com)
brass ("Trudy Davis")
RE: Cider Digest #1551, 17 February 2010 ("Julian Temperley")
posting (Bill Barton)
Cider and Brass (lotic@juno.com)
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Subject: Perry and Cherry Cider Experiences
From: cal1advise@aol.com
Date: Wed, 17 Feb 2010 20:15:56 -0500
I'm a novice cider maker who wishes to expand my skills & experience?into
other hard ciders. I have a small "hobby orchard" with nineteen apple
trees? (comprised of sixteen varieties, including?three trees?noted
somewhat?for cider making from Europe; Ashmeads Kernel, Harry Master's
Jersey, and the Muscadet de Dieppe, as well as, three from the "colonies";
Esopus Spitzenberg, Golden Russet and the Newtown Pippin).? I also have
three varieties of cherries, two each?of the "sweet varieties";?Lapin
and Van, and six trees?of the sour/pie cherry variety-Montmorency. I have
obtained various varieties of sweet pears from friends and nearby orchards.
My little orchard lies in the middle of apple, cherry?and pear orchards
in central Washington State so acquiring additional fruit is no problem.
My hard apple cider is?resonably good, and last year I tried my hand at
making Perry. Unfortunately, I could not find any cider pears and had to
use cider-type apples for the acid & tannin. I kept the apple percentage
under 20% in my blend, but found?the resulting Perry to have a very mild
flavor, rather bland overall.? Now, ?I'm planning on trying my hand at
making hard cherry cider next fall.
Are there any digest members out there that have experience with either Perry
or hard cherry cider that they could share. I'm especially interested if it
is possible to improve the Perry flavor and complexity?without cider pears
(change the yeast and/or the percentage/varieties of pears/apples), and for
the hard cherry cider; what would be a good mix, should?I try adding some
cider apples to the blend and what would be some good yeasts to consider?
Thank you!
Carl Lindberg, Manson, WA
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Subject: brass
From: "Trudy Davis" <trudydavis@embarqmail.com>
Date: Wed, 17 Feb 2010 19:30:59 -0800
I can't remember where I heard or read this but the acid in alcoholic
beverages will pit the brass. First use no problem but sanitation becomes a
concern with subsequent use. Bacteria can take up residence in the pits and
attempts to sanitize may not be effective.
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Subject: RE: Cider Digest #1551, 17 February 2010
From: "Julian Temperley" <somcb@globalnet.co.uk>
Date: Thu, 18 Feb 2010 08:23:18 -0000
The biggest, oldest show case for cider in the UK can be found at the
Royal Bath and West Agricultural show in the homeland of traditional
cidermaking, Somerset, England at the end of May. The cider competition
has classes for 'farmhouse cider', uncarbonated in gallon containers,
bottle fermented ciders, more commercial ciders and perrys, as well as an
international class.
The winners over the years against all comers have often been the smaller
makers. Last year our overall champion was Rosie Grant a retired lady
very small cider maker from Dorset, before that the Perry family from
Somerset.
Our judges are a balance of cider experts and food and drink writers.
This year our main classes will be judged by Nick Bradstock a very
respected cider palate and Tom Parker Bowles a writer on food. These two
maybe helped by the chairman of the South West of England Cidermakers
Association.
I too am a small cidermaker and if anybody would like to enter I am happy
to help with the entry, there is a very small fee, and if you send your
ciders or perrys to me I can arrange that they get to the right place on
the day. Best wishes to you all Julian Temperley www.ciderbrandy.co.uk
email apples@ciderbrandy.co.uk
------------------------------
Subject: posting
From: Bill Barton <info@cidery.com>
Date: Thu, 18 Feb 2010 13:10:49 -0500
Cidermakers (Almost) Annual Get Together Sunday, March 28, 2010, 3PM -- ????
All cidermakers ? home or commercial, cider fans, or even the mildly
curious are invited. If you have cider or spirits, bring them. We?ll
take over the tasting bar mid-afternoon and eat, drink and swap lies
about how we made whatever it is that we made. Bring some food to share
for a potluck dinner. Hopefully this will soak up the excess cider that
you probably are going to consume.
Bellwether Hard Cider
9070 Route 89
Trumansburg, NY 14886
Call for more details (although there really aren't any): 607-387-9464
or 888-862-4337
Bill Barton, Bellwether
------------------------------
Subject: Cider and Brass
From: lotic@juno.com
Date: Sat, 20 Feb 2010 08:47:47 -0500
The Jabsco pommace pump I use is made of brass, and it gets very "bright"
after use, and is the only bit of brass in the mill. The low pH of the
pommace / cider (~pH3) does have an effect upon it. However, I wash it
after every day of use, and give it a final cleaning with baking soda at
the end of the season. I do not use brass tanks or fittings, and (I
imagine) that extended contact with brass would add some less than
desirable flavors and tend to pit the brass (making it a real pain to
sterilize).
Stainless steel (or glass lined tanks) are still the best option.
However, as you note, they are hideously expensive. Also, even SS will be
effected (eventually) by cider. Most dairy tanks (milk is not anywhere
near as acidic a cider) are 304 SS. I have heard that a 304 SS tank
should last you (with constant use as a cider fermenter) about 20-25
years. The "Cadillac" of SS is 316 SS. This is also known as
"surgical-grade" steel. If you out live a tank of 316, then you are
probably too young to read this e-mail, and if you can afford a new 316
tank, then congratulations on winning the lottery.
If you can't afford new SS, then there are some sources for used SS
tanks, you MUST ask a lot of questions about their previous use, and give
them a visual inspection. Only consider used tanks that were used in the
food industry!!! You do NOT want a tank that was used to store
"metyl-ethyl-death". Also, you're going to want to see if the inside is
smooth and polished, and that it's airtight and has the right sanitary
fittings. Be prepared to search long and hard for these, and don't forget
the cost of shipping, and the cost of new fittings.
"Plastic tanks"? I dunno. While tolerant of low-pH, most plastics
transmit oxygen. There are some high-density plastics that are air tight
(nothing like SS or glass - but good enough for a few months). But, I
hear (perhaps unfounded) concerns about BPA in plastics. Also, I have not
seen any larger than 5-6 (US) gallons.
All-in-all, I'd bite the bullet and get some stainless. The tanks don't
depreciate much over time. So, when you upgrade to larger tanks, you can
get a pretty good price for your used tank.
Peter Mitchell
Headwater Cider
Hawley, MA
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End of Cider Digest #1552
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