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Cider Digest #1508
Subject: Cider Digest #1508, 5 June 2009
From: cider-request@talisman.com
Cider Digest #1508 5 June 2009
Cider and Perry Discussion Forum
Contents:
biennial bearing (Jack O Feil)
Biennialism and thinning - and cider making (David Pickering)
Cider Tasting event - Adelaide, Australia (David Pickering)
TTB Expo 2009 ("Jaime Schier")
Additional Ingredients? (DirkBlaze@aol.com)
Dabinett Leaves Curl, Trees Die Over Winter ("Kevin Luke")
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Digest Janitor: Dick Dunn
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Subject: biennial bearing
From: Jack O Feil <feilorchards@juno.com>
Date: Mon, 1 Jun 2009 11:17:48 -0700
Chemical thinning with NAA plus Seven is the standard for
chemical thinning of our commercial orchards here in Central Washington,
it works, but on some varieties it's not the answer to break biennial
bearing. Here, Baldwin is an example of that. I've heard, but not used
blossom thinning by hand using a hand nipper or heavy duty scissors,I
have used that technique on Rainier Cherries but only for size. One thing
I have noticed is not give up on chemical thinning if you don't get
results the first year or two. From my personal experience, it appears
that there is a cumulative thinning effect. Years ago we used a material
called Elgitol, I sprayed the trees twice in the same year, I knocked of
all the fruit that year and the next year as well. The thinning chemicals
will be hard to come by as most states have restrictions of who can buy
them.
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Subject: Biennialism and thinning - and cider making
From: David Pickering <davidp@cideroz.com>
Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 20:18:42 +1000
A very interesting area to explore - there are some good contributions at
http://www.pollinator.com/apple_pollinks.htm
including some words from at least one well known Cider Digest contributor.
Unfortunately the process of chemical thinning is not necessarily easy
nor for that matter conducive to "organic" certification.
The genetics of apples means that there are significant differences in
responses of varieties to thinning chemicals. Again, because of the
genetics, these differences are confounded by differences in the
appropriate timing of sprays in relation to phenology - commonly in
relation to full bloom. Australian recommendations for instance
indicate:
Ammonium thiosulphate - apply at 80% full bloom (specifically for Royal Gala)
NAA - 10-14 days after full bloom, to the top 2/3 of the tree
Benzyladenine - 10-22 after full bloom, depending on variety
Carbaryl - 7-28 days after full bloom: notes toxicity to Typhlodromus
occidentalis and bees
Working through the matrix of cider variety, chemical, timing, and
then prevailing environmental conditions is a major undertaking.
Anybody for a PhD project?
Then start to consider your tree planting pattern and figure out
whether you can spray variety X without hitting your pollinating
variety in that row, or the trees in the next row over etc etc. It's
not easy.
The other aspect which has probably come up on CD in the past is the
topic of fruit size. If you accept the premise that apples have a
substantial part of their flavour compounds in the outer few mms of
skin/flesh, then perceived wisdom says that small apples with a higher
surface to volume ratio contribute more flavour to cider than do
larger apples. This being the case then there is arguably a case for
letting your trees be biennial, or more specifically, letting half of
your trees of any one variety fruit in alternate years so that you as
the grower have some fruit of each variety each year. But try and
avoid breaking branches in the "on" or "heavy" year!
- --
David Pickering
"Linden Lea" Huntley Road, ORANGE NSW 2800 Australia
------------------------------
Subject: Cider Tasting event - Adelaide, Australia
From: David Pickering <davidp@cideroz.com>
Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 20:34:37 +1000
A long range warning that the cider tasting event that took place in
Adelaide in November 2007 will be held again in May 2010. Being
six-months out with your northern hemisphere seasons and cider making
you'll have to decide whether this will mean entering last summer's
cider or the coming summer's cider.
The 2007 event attracted not only Australian entries but also so far
as I am aware, French and US entrants. Well done Gary.
Enter the link below in your Favorites/Bookmarks so you'll be able to
get details
http://www.cideraustralia.com.au
or contact John Jeffs via
info@cideraustralia.com.au
to be notified when the competition opens.
- --
David Pickering
"Linden Lea" Huntley Road, ORANGE NSW 2800 Australia
------------------------------
Subject: TTB Expo 2009
From: "Jaime Schier" <jschier@harpoonbrewery.com>
Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 14:33:29 -0400
For any who may be interested, the Alcohol and Tobacco Tax and Trade
Bureau (fondly referred to as the TTB) is presenting a free
informational Expo June 24-26 in Covington KY, just outside Cincinnati.
My understanding is the goal of the Expo is to de-mystify the regulatory
relationship between producers and the government. In perusing the
session listing there are tracks specific to wineries, breweries, and
distilleries. Some of the sessions look quite interesting and valuable
beyond the scope of filling out your tax paperwork: determination of
total acidity in wine for example. Others would be useful for staying
on the good side of your local TTB or IRS representative.
As I said it's free. More information can be found at
http://www.ttb.gov/expo09/index.html
Cheers,
Jaime
Jaime Schier
QA/QC Manager
Harpoon Brewery
Boston, MA
617.574.9551
------------------------------
Subject: Additional Ingredients?
From: DirkBlaze@aol.com
Date: Fri, 5 Jun 2009 06:36:09 EDT
Confessions of an Adulterer
I would like to know what ingredients (besides apple juice) do people add
to their hard cider, and which have been most interesting.
I'll start: I mostly use sweet cider from my local orchard, not cider
apples, so I try to compensate by adding tannic acid and malic acid. I do not
use "acid blend," which I find unpleasant. But some malic acid increases
the sharpness nicely, and tanic acid gives "body" and character.
I mostly, but not always, kill the live yeast with sulfite, then add my own
yeast.
I also often add cane sugar, to kick up the alcohol content a little,
sometimes a little malt extract powder, which add body and a little creamy head
retention.
Lately I've been adding spices, just a little, almost too little to notice,
but I find a little cinnamon or cardamom made into a tea by boiling in a
little water can add a delicious aroma or tang to my cider.
Also, I've added orange, usually just a quarter orange in about 5 gallons,
which provides a subtle aroma.
Sometimes before serving I add a little sugar, just enough so the product
isn't bone dry, not so much that it seems sweet. As I usually keg and not
bottle my cider additional fermentation is not a problem.
Bruce Kahn
West Chester, PA
------------------------------
Subject: Dabinett Leaves Curl, Trees Die Over Winter
From: "Kevin Luke" <kluke@amerytel.net>
Date: Thu, 4 Jun 2009 17:13:54 -0500
2 years ago, I planted a couple Dabinett trees (and others). The leaves
on both Dabinett trees curled and the trees did not look particularly
healthy, but they survived the summer. Both trees died their first winter.
I'm about an hour north of the Twin Cities, so Zone 3 maybe, 4 probably.
Just for fun, I planted one Dabinett this spring from another supplier,
because I'm a glutton for punishment. So far, it seems to be showing the
same behavior I saw with the first attempt - the leaves are already curling.
I noticed that Andrew Lea's Science of Cidermaking article mentions that
Dabinett needs lots of Potash. Does anyone (Andrew?) know if the behavior
I'm seeing is consistent with Potash deficiency? If it is safe, I would
like to just add some without having the soil tested. If not, I can take the
plunge and see about getting a soil sample (I've never had it done before).
Any thoughts are much appreciated.
Kevin
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End of Cider Digest #1508
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