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Cider Digest #1432
Subject: Cider Digest #1432, 16 January 2008
From: cider-request@talisman.com
Cider Digest #1432 16 January 2008
Forum for Discussion of Cider Issues
Dick Dunn, Digest Janitor
Contents:
Oxygenating cider ("Gary Smith")
Fermentation Speed and Fruit Age (Andrew Lea)
composting spent pomace (Alistair Bell)
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Subject: Oxygenating cider
From: "Gary Smith" <Gary@doctorgary.net>
Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2008 17:39:43 -0500
Hi,
I'm running a batch of local cider which measured nearly 8% potential
alcohol on the hygrometer. I'm using Wyeast sweet cider yeast. I am
brewing this batch in a 5 gallon carboy.
I haven't had great luck with ciders as my first ones I made last
spring came out less than great. A 12 gal batch was ruined by a
defective seal on the stainless conical fermenter; it was my first
time use of the fermenter and did not realize the seal had failed
until much too late to rectify it. I now have a seal that mates
properly for it and will use it next weekend.
I brewed a 2nd 5 gal batch at the same time but added a quart of
Pomegranate juice to it and it's a bit too tart for easy drinking.
Living by my own rule though If I made it, I'll drink it if tolerable
& that one just barely passes...
I'm a beer brewer, have been since 1977 and have that art down pretty
well and have also made quite a few meads over the years but Cider is
new. I just discovered a local source of really good cider with no
preservatives added that will be available year round.
I'm wondering if it's an asset to oxygenate the wort (if it's called
wort when making cider) and if so, are there any guidelines unique to
cider I should follow? I use a .5 micron oxygenator at the bottom of
the fermenter & a tank of O2.
I did a search on cider oxygenation but didn't find anything.
Thanks!
Gary
KA1J
Connecticut
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Subject: Fermentation Speed and Fruit Age
From: Andrew Lea <andrew_lea@compuserve.com>
Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2008 09:39:14 +0000
Claude and Con wrote:
>> You then suggested that changing N levels in the fruit might be a
>> factor. While I am reluctant to ascribe any change in fermentation
>> speed to factors other than temperature and yeast load,
> I would tend to agree with you when there is sufficient nutrients to
> sustain yeast activity, but if the juice has very low level of
> Nitrogen and other yeast nutrients, the fermentation will be very
> slow, whatever the temperature, because the yeast population will
> have difficulty to build itself and be active.
>
Claude is right. Fermentation speed *is* proportional to juice nitrogen
content (other things being equal). For instance, I published a paper
which shows this back in 1978, and it was well known to all at Long
Ashton from the 1940's onwards. See www.cider.org.uk/vitax.pdf (Table 1)
> You wrote:
>> I can at least confirm that in tests that I conducted over 36 weeks
>> storage of apples, that the Nitrogen levels in fruits changed only
>> as a result of water loss from the fruit, and therefore increased
>> marginally over the period. I am afraid that you need to look
>> elsewhere for an explanation.
I think we need to look *within* the N content for the explanation. It
has been known since the 1930's that stored apples and other pome fruit
tend surprisingly to accumulate protein at the expense of free amino
acids. Only the free amino acids (not the protein) are available as
nutrient for the yeast, and if this level falls during storage then
fermentation of stored fruit will indeed be slower. The total N of the
apple does not change but the distribution within the N-containing
species does. I think this is a possible explanation for Claude's
observation (which I must admit I've never heard before but may be
buried deep in old literature).
Andrew
- --
Wittenham Hill Cider Page
http://www.cider.org.uk
------------------------------
Subject: composting spent pomace
From: Alistair Bell <albell@shaw.ca>
Date: Mon, 14 Jan 2008 21:36:41 -0800
Hi,
I am curious about other's experience in composting spent pomace. We
are planning on improving our composting facilities to handle approx
20,000 kg/yr of pomace. I am wondering about additions (apart from
lime) that will aid the decomposition and create a usable by-product.
Alistair Bell
Sea Cider
www.seacider.ca
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End of Cider Digest #1432
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