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Cider Digest #1458
Subject: Cider Digest #1458, 14 August 2008
From: cider-request@talisman.com
Cider Digest #1458 14 August 2008
Forum for Discussion of Cider Issues
Dick Dunn, Digest Janitor
Contents:
Re: Cider Digest #1457, 7 August 2008 (jpullum127@aol.com)
Wine snobs vs cider populists? (mark@thealchemystudio.com)
Re: cider magazine (Ben Watson)
bentonite ("Howard, John")
cider magazine (Alan Yelvington)
Re: More Vintage Cider Books Online (and Lulu) (Dick Dunn)
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Subject: Re: Cider Digest #1457, 7 August 2008
From: jpullum127@aol.com
Date: Thu, 07 Aug 2008 11:41:46 -0400
Back around may or june there was a guy heading for normandy, asking for
advice. i'd love to hear how the trip was
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Subject: Wine snobs vs cider populists?
From: mark@thealchemystudio.com
Date: Thu, 7 Aug 2008 12:00:59 -0400 (EDT)
http://www.valleytable.com/article.php?article=2+By+the+Glass%2F2+Judgment+day
Reading the above article this weekend illustrates Dick's comments about
'wine snobs' vs cider drinkers. In it, the reviewer offers his take on the
wines of the region, comments on 'why is hard cider in a wine
competition?' and then the judges offer one of the medals to a hard cider!
Mark
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Subject: Re: cider magazine
From: Ben Watson <BWatson@chelseagreen.com>
Date: Thu, 7 Aug 2008 12:37:49 -0400
Good comments in the last CD from both Tim Steury and Dick Dunn on the
issue of a print cider magazine/journal.
As another publishing professional, I could see it being one of three
models, none of which would be the same high-gloss general trade format of
Wine Spectator -- I agree that cider is insignificant enough compared to
wine or beer to attract a huge subscriber base.
Models I could see working would be:
1. Newsletter format, as is done with the HortIdeas newsletter. This would
essentially be a somewhat more elaborated version of the Cider Digest,
printed and maybe with three-hole punch already done, so that it's easy to
save back issues in a notebook -- which might be easier in some ways than
searching through the CD electronic archives.
2. Quarterly magazine -- high subscription price, very specialized. I
subscribe to Ed Behr's newsletter, "The Art of Eating" and like it -- it has
no advertising, is very dense, pithy, and informative. It costs $40 or more
for a year's subscription, but I feel that I get my money's worth. There
are longer, more involved articles, not as many "short subjects" as
HortIdeas. And of course someone would have to write all those pieces -- Ed
Behr, the editor, does much of his own writing and editing himself, and
really uses the magazine as a means to finance his food research, travel,
and activity.
3. Color quqrterly/cider trade magazine. I have been receiving complimentary
issues of "Sicera," a Spanish cider quarterly for a few years. It's put out
by the Asturian cider producers, and is pretty interesting, with profiles
and interviews of producers, but also occasionally on Spanish apple
varieties and other items of cultural interest. It gets a lot of advertising
support from the larger Asturian cider producers, and has color photographs,
glossy format, etc. The problem is, in the US we don't really have cider
trade associations as yet -- the production is spread out, and "real cider"
is mainly made by a couple dozen, mainly artisanal producers. So I doubt
this sort of thing would work here -- and Sicera doesn't really have a lot
of information for the hobbyist or home cidermaker, which is one (useful)
function of the Cider Digest.
Please don't let the CD disappear! I know there are challenges, but I have
also plugged it shamelessly in the new edition of my book, "Cider, Hard and
Sweet," which will be published in October. (Incidentally, our friend and
mentor Andrew Lea's book will also be coming out this fall.)
Ben Watson
Francestown, NH
------------------------------
Subject: bentonite
From: "Howard, John" <jhoward@beckerfrondorf.com>
Date: Thu, 7 Aug 2008 12:51:13 -0400
Andrew wrote:
"Since bentonite is negatively charged, and the key nutrients in apple
juice are positively charged (asparagine and thiamine), my guess is that
it's taken them out hence the slow fermentation."
Hmmm... Could bentonite be used as another technique toward the goal of
creating a slow fermentation by starving the yeast, along the lines of
keeving and using apples from unfertilized orchards?
John Howard
------------------------------
Subject: cider magazine
From: Alan Yelvington <alany@semparpac.org>
Date: Fri, 08 Aug 2008 06:13:28 -0400
Friends
I thank Tim Steury and Diane Noel for their comments and shared
experience, but I'm more inclined to follow the path that Dick Dunn
mentioned in his response to Rosalind Rogoff.
I prefer to drink cider still from a cup, and I want a magazine of the
same ilk. For folks that knew Home Power magazine from 20 years ago, it
was a newsprint rag that was a joy to read and very affordable. Karen
and Richard Perez sold the publication after many years, and it has
matured to a glossy news stand periodical ($25/year) with a full time
production staff. On a plus note, it still has the appeal of cool still
cider from a cup.
I see the magazine as a balance between suppliers, producers, and
consumers. Cider is like alternative energy in that a lot of education
goes into the population. And the population is hungry for information
on how to do things right, where to get supplies, and opportunities to
network with other producers and drinkers. 20+ years ago there was only
one (1) alternative energy fair each year in the country. Now I can't
keep track of them. One can only hope cider would see more cider
festivals from this.
I'm not in a hurry to go broke, or ruin what appears to be an enjoyable
retirement. I'll probably call Karen and Richard for some "war stories"
before going forward. I thank all the folks that have contacted me
directly with offers of support.
To give folks an idea of my schedule, my request to retire (you have to
ask in the military) was approved yesterday for June 1, 2009. I'll be
collecting ideas for content and the like until then, and probably
working on a layout style to have ready for content.
Best regards to all!
Al Yelvington
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Subject: Re: More Vintage Cider Books Online (and Lulu)
From: Dick Dunn <rcd@talisman.com>
Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2008 15:10:10 -0600
In CD 1456, Andrew Lea mentioned that the Internet Archive (archive.org)
has additional antiquarian-but-significant cider texts; Andrew has
mentioned others in the past and overall it's quite an impressive
collection.
Andrew also mentioned something I've puzzled over a bit, but never quite
been able to grasp: Online publishers will print and bind copies of these
old texts. I had a look at Lulu.com, and it seemed like the bridge from
archive.org was -almost- obvious, for having a copy printed and being able
to buy it.
I also read into what is stated by Lulu that, once one person has arranged
the copy from archive.org and the setup for the proper format of the book,
others can order copies without the initial overhead--they'd just point at
the item(s) in Lulu's online base and say "I want to buy one of these, and
one of those..."
As a none-too-subtle hint: There's a useful project for a few cidernauts
here...to gather the available antiquarian cider texts from archive.org
and arrange for them to be available via Lulu (or some other similar online
printer/publisher), then announce it here with simple instructions for the
rest of us. I'm just a bit short on time and somewhat clue-impaired, else
I'd take my own hint.
- --
Dick Dunn rcd@talisman.com Hygiene, Colorado USA
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End of Cider Digest #1458
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