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Cider Digest #1334
Subject: Cider Digest #1334, 31 August 2006
From: cider-request@talisman.com
Cider Digest #1334 31 August 2006
Forum for Discussion of Cider Issues
Dick Dunn, Digest Janitor
Contents:
"commercial" postings (Cider Digest)
Re: cider character and off-tastes (or not) (Jeff Renner)
Re: Ground cover ("Charles McGonegal")
Cider character and off-tastes (Andrew Lea)
Split Rock 2006 HB Competition ()
Cider available this fall, Central Vermont (Terry and Julie Bradshaw)
cider apples (Stephen Wood)
Send ONLY articles for the digest to cider@talisman.com.
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Archives of the Digest are available at www.talisman.com/cider
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: "commercial" postings
From: cider-request@talisman.com (Cider Digest)
Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 10:58:57 -0600 (MDT)
There are a couple of postings in this digest which will look like
"advertising" to some readers. I want to point out that the folks
who sent these contacted me ahead of time to see if they'd be OK.
I specifically encouraged them because I felt that they represented
exceptional opportunities for right-coast US cidermakers to be
able to work with true cider apple varieties. The benefit to the
digest readership seems to me to far outweigh any concern about
commercial content, and anyway these guys are going out of their
way to help cidermakers.
Nevertheless, if you think I've overstepped the bounds of the digest
policies, complain to ME at
cider-request@talisman.com
Please don't complain to Steve or Terry. As I said, they checked with
me and it was my decision to OK the postings.
- -the janitor
------------------------------
Subject: Re: cider character and off-tastes (or not)
From: Jeff Renner <jsrenner@umich.edu>
Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 22:16:41 -0400
Dick Dunn <rcd@talisman.com> wrote about Tim Rose's <ROSET@si.edu>
off flavors:
> The band-aid and bad socks sound like faults, although I'm having to guess
> your tastes against mine. Band-aid -can- be a characterization of tannin,
> although more often not, more often a fault.
Band-aid and similar phenolic, medicinal, burnt electric tastes can
come from yeast. Cultured yeasts have ordinarily been selected for
the absence of these flavors, but some notable exceptions are many
Belgian ale yeasts and Bavarian wheat beer (hefeweizen) yeasts.
I made a cider two years ago using the wild yeasts present in the
unpasteurized (hallelujah) cider (late season run-of-the-mill from
the Dexter Cider Mill in nearby Dexter, Michigan). I sulfited it,
then allowed it to ferment. It had some nasty phenolic aromas, as
well as sulfur compound aromas. They reminded me of when my mother
used to give my grandmother home perms.
This aroma and similar flavor eventually subsided to a rather
pleasant, nutty flavor, although I can still find enough of the
former flavor to sometimes find it somewhat off-putting. People who
didn't smell it fermenting don't have a problem with it.
Bad socks sounds like pseudomonas bacteria. They can form biofilms,
which present as ropiness. But this is just a guess.
Jeff
- ---
Jeff Renner in Ann Arbor, Michigan USA, jsrennerATumichDOTedu
"One never knows, do one?" Fats Waller, American Musician, 1904-1943
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Ground cover
From: "Charles McGonegal" <cpm@appletrue.com>
Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 07:21:09 -0500 (CDT)
Our orchard practices IPM, and has reduced spraying a lot in recent years.
But we still specifically avoid a flowering ground cover - I think at the
request of the beekeepers who put hives near the orchard. They don't want
a flora that will attract bees into the orchard (and thus into spray
exposure) once the orchard is done blooming.
I like the idea for diversity reasons, though.
Charles
AEppelTreow Winery
Andrew writes:
<> People here who plant new standard orchards (M111 is semi-standard) are
> now tending to incorporate woodland wildflower seed mixes too. This
> improves biodiversity and attracts pollinating insects, apart from just
> looking very nice around blossom time! However the species have to be
> true woodland species i.e. those which complete their flowering and
> seeding cycle before the tree canopy closes over in mid-summer, and
> before you need to mow your first cut. In this country (generally damp
> summers!), mowing the sward is typically required once or twice a
> season. Generally the mowings are left in situ to recycle.
------------------------------
Subject: Cider character and off-tastes
From: Andrew Lea <andrew_lea@compuserve.com>
Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 09:59:46 +0100
Dick (in answer to Tim Rose) wrote:
>>.........found an old digest entry by Dick Dunn that
>>said the strong effervescence was a clear indication the stuff had gone
>>bad, never mind the horrific smell and yes, we did taste it...
>
> all in the name of science, I guess. The incredible effervescence (I call
> it "self-decanting":-) is surely a bad sign because it wasn't meant to be
> in that condition when opened. But there's a bit of caution on the other
> tasting notes; read on.
The strong effervesence may well be 'cider sickness'. This is caused by
a bacterium *Zymomonas* metabolising the remaining sugar and generating
gas even when the yeast is unable to do so. It is so rare in England now
that I have never seen it but was common in the UK in bulk sweet cider
up to the 1950's and I understand is still quite widespread in France
(because many of their ciders are stored naturally sweet). In France
the fault is known as 'framboise' since there is apparently a
raspberry-like odour associated with it.
>>had an ugly looking kinda stringy sediment but I bought it and we opened
>>it up. It didn't have the impressive effervescence as the previous but
>>it had the same off smell and taste...
>
> The "stringy sediment" could be either the cider fault called "ropiness"
> (which also gives a viscous character and a sharp taste) or a vinegar
> bacterium.
I would think most likely this is 'ropiness' caused by an unwanted
strain of lactic acid bacterium. It's the same mechanism that gives the
desirable thickening of yoghurt (formation of a glucose polymer -
'glucan' aka 'dextran'). Vinegar bacteria only proliferate when there is
lots of air.
> [Re Barnyard flavours] The higher level comes from
> Brettanomyces-- At a low level there's another process (I forget - sorry -
> Help! Andrew!) that creates a small amount of the same flavor component
> in cider.
The same mechanism operates in both cases. It is the metabolism of the
non-volatile phenolic acids (loosely, part of the cider "tannin") which
yields volatile eugenols such as vinyl and ethyl catechol. The low level
metabolism is by lactic acid bacteria and as Dick says is generally
regarded as desirable and characteristic of ciders made from bittersweet
fruit.
A key issue here is "lactic acid bacteria". We use the term loosely to
cover a whole range of organisms which convert malic to lactic acid.
Along the way they do a whole host of other things (eg they can cause
ropinesss or mousiness or....). There are many different species and
strains of organisms which do this. Some have been specially selected
(eg strains of Oenococcus) and are used daily by winemakers in cooler
climates where acidity reduction and generation of often "buttery"
flavours is desirable. Others such as Lactobacillus plantarum may occur
wild in ciders but are typically regarded as beneficial. Others such as
Pediococcus are generally associated with off flavours. All may occur
together. But remember that hard analytical microbiological data is
lacking in 99.9% of cases! They are often difficult to grow in culture
and what we know about them in cider stems from a limited amount of
past research in a limited number of under-funded institutes. Generally
SO2 added after fermentation will keep all these organisms under control
but that may then compromise bottle conditioning by yeasts.
Andrew Lea,
nr Oxford UK
Wittenham Hill Cider Page
www.cider.org.uk
------------------------------
Subject: Split Rock 2006 HB Competition
From: <hazan@ptd.net>
Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 12:05:28 -0000
Subject: Split Rock 2006 HB Competition - Great Brews of America
This is the first announcement for the homebrew competition to be held on
Saturday, November 18th, at the Split Rock Resort in Pennsylvania?s Pocono
Mountains, which is held in conjunction with their annual Great Brews of
America - Micro Brew Festival.
This is a sanctioned competition judging all beer, mead and cider styles.
Entries should be shipped to The Resort at Split Rock, One Lake Drive, Lake
Harmony, PA 18624, Attention: Shelly Kalins Lutz, for receipt from November
6th to November 17th.
Entry fees of $5.00 per entry will be donated to the Make-A-Wish Foundation.
By simply entering, you will be helping this charitable organization help
others. Checks should be made out to: The Resort At Split Rock.
Two (2) brown or green bottles with no markings are required. Please use
rubber bands to attach bottle labels. No tape, please. Any standard homebrew
competition entry and bottle identification forms, identifying the
brewer/brewers and the appropriate entry category/subcategory are
acceptable. The 2004 BJCP Style Guidelines will be used for this
competition. Get this from the BJCP web site at www.bjcp.org.
Judges and stewards are needed and they should contact me to secure a
position. Judges and Stewards can hand carry their entries if they pre-
register with payment. All judges and stewards are required to be present by
8:30, so we can get started promptly at 9am. Judges will receive an entry to
the beer festival or entry to the beer dinner for their efforts and need to
indicate which they wish when they commit to participate.
The BOS winner will receive a complementary weekend for two at next year's
Split Rock Beer Fest, as well.
More information is available at the Split Rock web site:
http://www.splitrockresort.com/beerfest/.
Al Hazan
Competition Organizer
hazan@ptd.net
------------------------------
Subject: Cider available this fall, Central Vermont
From: Terry and Julie Bradshaw <bradshaw@pshift.com>
Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 07:04:26 -0400
This fall I finally am in a setup where I feel I can source and squeeze
enough juice to offer to the public. Details here:
http://www.lostmeadowvt.com/juice/06squeezings.htm
The last squeeze day, October 29, is really where I'm aiming at cidermakers.
If anyone is interested, please contact me off-list.
Thanks,
Terry B
------------------------------
Subject: cider apples
From: Stephen Wood <swood@farnumhillciders.com>
Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 09:31:27 -0700
Jason's spots are probably a result of the extraordinarily wet growing
season. We stop applying fungicide to the cider fruit after the
primary scab season, and have seen a lot more of these fruit rots than
usual this year. You are probably looking at black rot (Botryosphaeria
obtusa), or a wet version of blossom end rot (Sclerotinia sclerotiorum).
Just pick around it, and hope for more sun next year.
On another subject, we will have 1000+ bushels of bittersweet cider
apples available for purchase this harvest season from our cider
orchards in Lebanon and Plainfield, NH. We will give preference to
cidermakers who have bought apples from us in the past; thereafter, the
apples will be sold first come, first served. As with all of our
crops, we will only pick what we need, and what we are fairly certain
of being able to sell, so cidermakers who want some of this fruit
should contact me soon -- we will honor reservations. The most
abundant early varieties this year are Major and Ellis Bitter
(mid-September); late are Dabinett and Yarlington Mill (October).
We'll have moderate volumes of other varieties, as well. We follow
the English and French practice of letting the fruit hang until most of
it is dropping, then gently shaking the trees and harvesting the fruit
from the ground. Unlike commercial European operations, we often
harvest more than once, depending on regularity of ripening, and we
pick from the ground by hand, to try to leave as much rot as possible
behind. In my experience, this is the best way to achieve the highest
possible degree of ripeness. That said, these are drops, and need to be
milled and pressed pretty quickly after harvest (Yarlington Mill in
particular); they sometimes need to be washed at the press, depending
on the muddiness of the harvest season. If any of you prefers
hand-picks, we coulld probably do that to order, but would need to know
well in advance of the day of harvest; the price would change a bit,
too. We will also consider (with sufficient volumes) pressing the
fruit for you -- in this case, we would need your tanks here in
advance. We pick the fruit into 15-bushel bins; the prices are F.O.B.
Lebanon, assuming they leave in your containers. We are occasionally
willing to let our bins out, but only if we can be assured of a speedy
return.
Prices: <15 bu. $20/bushel
1-3 bins $225/bin (15-45 bu)
4-6 bins $200/bin
7-10 bins $175/bin
11-30 bins $150/bin
30+ bins call for price and availability
Steve Wood
swood@farnumhillciders.com
(603) 448-1511
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End of Cider Digest #1334
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