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Cider Digest #1257
Subject: Cider Digest #1257, 14 September 2005
From: cider-request@talisman.com
Cider Digest #1257 14 September 2005
Forum for Discussion of Cider Issues
Dick Dunn, Digest Janitor
Contents:
lifting demijohns (Carboys) ("Mark Johnson")
Re:2004 vintage (Mike Faul)
Italian grinders ("John C. Campbell III")
Muscat deBernay ("John C. Campbell III")
Re: Availability of PME Samples ("Gary Awdey")
RE: Need help identifying possible perry pear - Jenkin's Red? ("chris horn")
Re: grinders (Bill)
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Subject: lifting demijohns (Carboys)
From: "Mark Johnson" <friendlypool@astound.net>
Date: Mon, 12 Sep 2005 10:17:39 -0700
In reply to below:
Subject: demijon lifting avoidance
From: "mporch@frontiernet.net" <mporch@frontiernet.net>
Date: Mon, 12 Sep 2005 13:21:58 +0000
does anyone use a pump of some sort to rack or transfer their cider and
juice? all my containers are on the floor. i know there are electric
transfer pumps- i'm thinking of some thing slow and manual, preferably
with some stainless steel. i think something like this would be in
great demand. doug fincke annandale n.y.
The home brew folks and lots of wine makers use CO2 or an inertgas
under pressure to move liquid. It is very easy to do with a racking
cane and tubing. It can be don with very little introduction of air
(oxygen) if one uses tubing tat goes to the bottomof the receiving
vessel. We usually purge the air from the receiving vessel with the gas
prior to the transfer.
Mark (Ciderman) jOHNSON
------------------------------
Subject: Re:2004 vintage
From: Mike Faul <carraig@earthlink.net>
Date: Mon, 12 Sep 2005 10:24:01 -0700
Time, even though the liquid 'looked' crystal clear, there is probably
still alot of 'stuff' floating around in there that can cause the
sediment. The only way to avoid that is to filter the product through a
pretty fine filter (.45 micron) +-
What I ued to do as home maker was to use an acquarium pump and a small
water filter from home depot.
Bring it down to my place and I'll filter it for ya even though you need
to be prepared to lose at least a gallon in my smallest filter. My
regular filtration equipment will lose 15 gals of one batch., but then
I'm amking 1000 gal batches these days.
Mike
Rabbit's Foot Meadery & Red Branch Cider Company
>
> Subject: 2004 vintage
> From: Tim Bray <tbray@mcn.org>
> Date: Sat, 10 Sep 2005 09:38:24 -0700
> One thing all of the batches seem to have in common: they threw a sediment
> in the bottle, even though they were crystal-clear in the carboy and done
> fermenting. The sediment is fine and soft, light yellow to reddish-brown,
> stirs up easily, and tastes nasty. I have to decant off very
> carefully. I'm not excited about degorging all those bottles!
------------------------------
Subject: Italian grinders
From: "John C. Campbell III" <jccampb@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 12 Sep 2005 13:48:14 -0400
Interesting Derek .... I have just bought (for about $650 U.S.) an italian
grinder on a different principle (saw it down at Charlotte Shelton's last
year) I've seen the ones you're talking about, looks like some kind of yard
device? Mine hasn't quite reached me yet a friend will be bringing in up
from Mt. Vernon soon.
jccampb
Subject: apple grinders
From: Derek Bisset <derek_bisset@shaw.ca>
Date: Sat, 10 Sep 2005 09:11:09 -0700
Michael Arighi reports on a commercial food processor for apple
grinding. I have used an Italian apple grinder which used the food
processor principal ie. a set of blades spinning at the base of a feed
chute .
This was a commercial product fabricated with stainless powered by a 1hp
electric motor.
The chute was wide enough to accommodate any apple size . There were
three blades , blender - like , at the bottom of the chute which chopped
the apples . The lowest blade had a sweep action which ejected the pulp
through a screen . I worked very well to crush the apples , too well in
fact since it rended to produce puree which was hard to press .
I visited Normandy about the time and heard it dismissed as "too mushy".
It seemed to me that the problem could be solved by increasing the size
of the screen holes since it was the screen which retained the pulp to
be crushed too much .These were anout a half inch in the model I used .
In the experiments I have tried the principle appears to work.
------------------------------
Subject: Muscat deBernay
From: "John C. Campbell III" <jccampb@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 12 Sep 2005 13:51:58 -0400
O.K. Tim; "Muscat deBernay" Wot's this? I hate to show my stupidity
(although it gets easier the older I get) ... but I've never heard of that
strain of apples ....
jccampb
Subject: 2004 vintage
From: Tim Bray <tbray@mcn.org>
Date: Sat, 10 Sep 2005 09:38:24 -0700
(snip)
The very best batch - probably the best cider I've made yet - was about 60%
King David and 40% Muscat deBernay, fermented with D47. With several
rackings I was able to finish it with a trace of residual sweetness, loads
of apple aroma, and it even has apple flavor - almost like a Norman cider!
(snip)
Cheers,
Tim Bray
Albion, CA
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Availability of PME Samples
From: "Gary Awdey" <gawdey@att.net>
Date: Mon, 12 Sep 2005 17:54:52 -0400
In CD #1256 Roy Bailey wrote:
> I use a crystalline form of calcium chloride; the formula for which is
> CaCl2 6H20. Following advice from Andrew Lea, I use 6 ounces of this in
> 50 gallons of apple juice and this seems to be the optimum amount.
This is the almost precisely the dosage recommended when last year's samples
of PME were distributed. Apparently the more water-saturated form is
commonly available in the UK and France. In the US the dihyrate form seems
to be more prevalent. If I've performed the stoichiometry correctly the
CaCl2 6H2O form has a molecular weight (if you include the water) of 114,
while the dihydrate form has a weight of 74. I suppose each varies somewhat
depending on storage conditions but if you assume little variation in degree
of hydration then subsituting the same weight of CaCl2 2H20 for a recomended
dosage of CaCl2 6H2O would result in about 54% more CaCl2 being delivered to
the cider. Not every homebrew shop even specifies which form is sold. To
avoid confusion the CaCl2 will be included with the samples this year. As I
understand it, the Klercidre kits also include the CaCl2 to minimize the
chances of errors.
For anyone who didn't read CD # 1255 I'll include a final reminder that
free samples of PME will be sent out shortly. Refer back to CD#1255 in the
archives (http://www.talisman.com/cider/curyr/index.html) for details.
Gary Awdey
Eden, New York
------------------------------
Subject: RE: Need help identifying possible perry pear - Jenkin's Red?
From: "chris horn" <agent_strangelove@hotmail.com>
Date: Tue, 13 Sep 2005 07:57:39 -0700
I don't know that it's any better of a source of info but the 'Directory of
Pear Cultivars' seems to hold a very similar description in terms of dates
(flowering, picking and milling) that Luckwill & Pollard has. The overal
description reads 'Fruit: elliptical, small greenish-yellow with heavy flush
and some russet. Vintage: no information. Tree: Medium to large with
numerous upright limbs carry perndulous branches. Cropping quite good' It
is also listed as being 'very resistant' to scab.
Hope this helps...
Chris Horn
Scappoose Oregon
'When the bee comes to your house, let her have beer; you may want to visit
the bee's house some day.'
~Congo Proverb
------------------------------
Subject: Re: grinders
From: Bill <squeeze@mars.ark.com>
Date: Wed, 14 Sep 2005 10:38:52 -0700
Derek is correct in the the observation that too fine a screen makes for
"mush" as the Normandy folks say - my experience with a rack and cloth
press is that it takes a particular coarseness of pomace to get maximum
yields, and a 'hammer mill shredder' [sometimes called a 'breaker']
gives the best results - I've added a couple pictures towards the bottom
of my page about pressing, of my breaker based on the design in the
Agriculture Canada booklet on my site and Andrews:
http://mars.ark.com/~squeeze/pressing/
yields are around 12# per US gallon, or just over 3#/liter, and over
time there was a lessening of yield as the 'hammers' rounded with wear,
and the pulp became somewhat finer - when I made a new set at the
beginning of last season, the change was quite noticeable - the hammers
need to be hammers, not knives!
Bill <http://mars.ark.com/~squeeze/>
------------------------------
End of Cider Digest #1257
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