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Cider Digest #1286
Subject: Cider Digest #1286, 22 December 2005
From: cider-request@talisman.com
Cider Digest #1286 22 December 2005
Forum for Discussion of Cider Issues
Dick Dunn, Digest Janitor
Contents:
apple brandy as topic (Cider Digest Admin)
Harrison at Vintage VA Apples ("McGonegal, Charles")
Press Construction ("drcath@tiac.net")
Re: Cider Digest #1285, 20 December 2005 ("Rosalind Rogoff")
Somerset Cider Brandy. ("Julian Temperley")
Re: Harrison scionwood .... ("John C. Campbell III")
past articles (terry mayne)
using honey in bottle fermentation (seth jones)
Cider article in the Los Angeles Times (Nick Gunn)
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----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: apple brandy as topic
From: cider-request@talisman.com (Cider Digest Admin)
Date: Thu, 22 Dec 2005 22:40:21 -0700 (MST)
I realized (rather belatedly...sorry, I'm kinda slow these days) that the
posting from Peter Angus and the reply from Charles McGonegal on cider
brandy might have been seeking an opinion, janitorial or better, on the
appropriateness of "cider brandy" as a topic.
Keep in mind that the digest is -not- moderated. Once in a great while I
will give a gentle nudge, but mostly all I do is clean out the garbage
(spam and bad-mailer-barfback) that doesn't belong at all.
My take on distilling or distilled-cider topics is essentially "Why not?"
As Charles said, there are only a few folks doing it. Thus it's not likely
to become an overbearing topic. But on the other side, where else are you
going to get any information or discussion on distilled cider? It's a
wondrous substance, worthy of -some- discussion -somewhere-. (Apropos
Andrew's comments, my electronic alter-ego brings back a bottle or two
of Somerset Cider Brandy every time he makes a pilgrimage to England.)
I would only step in if the discussion diverged into illegal activity like
home distillation or how not to get caught or whatever. Home distillation
is--again as Charles said--not just illegal, but HIGHLY illegal (large
penalties) in the countries which account for most of the readership of the
digest (US, UK, AU), so that's right out.
If anybody objects strongly to some (probably small) amount of discussion
on distilled cider, please tell me off-list at cider-request@talisman.com
- -the janitor
------------------------------
Subject: Harrison at Vintage VA Apples
From: "McGonegal, Charles" <Charles.McGonegal@uop.com>
Date: Tue, 20 Dec 2005 10:55:56 -0600
Tom Burford spent some time talking about the recovery of Harrison
during this year's Cidermaker's Forum. (Even more interesting, he
described other recovery missions involving sneakiness, cunning,
trespass and hounds. What some people will go through for the sake of
an apple.) Harrison apples and [sweet] cider were both tasted. =20
The Harrison presented were middling size and heavily sooty-blotched,
but otherwise unblemished. (Tom noted that a candidtate tree was found
in New England (I think) several years before the announced recovery.
But it was in a managed orchard and had no sooty-blotch - it looked out
of character without it, and Tom was hesitant to make the call on the
ID.) The Harrison juice was brightly fruity, with subtle berry notes,
great sweet/sharp character and great bouquet. It was also one of the
most pectic/viscous juices I've ever seen. At least as much as my
English Golden Russet. I'd recommend it without hesitation. We can
hope it holds its character in a wide range of climates/soils.
I don't believe VVA sells scionwood any longer, but a number of folks
have it planted, including Blue Ridge Cider in western VA. (And myself -
but the trees are young :-(
Charles McGonegal
AEppelTreow Winery
------------------------------
Subject: Press Construction
From: "drcath@tiac.net" <drcath@tiac.net>
Date: Tue, 20 Dec 2005 12:43:40 -0500
For a welded steel press frame, what is an acceptable rating for a
hydraulic bottle jack that will maximize juice extraction efficiency from a
small rack and cloth set but will not place excessive stress on the frame
welds?
The frame is 2 inch square tube with fillet welds and the racks are
approximately 20 x 20 in. I'm planning on 4 cloths per cheese in this small
backyarder.
I suppose the resulting pressure is a relative thing since I'd have control
over the amount of force applied (based on how much I actually pump up the
jack) and any jack between 4 and 12-ton rating would probably suffice.
However, being the detail-oriented scientist that I am, I can't resist
posing the question to the more experienced cider makers in the group in
hopes of gaining some technical specs if possible. In that vein, I'd love
to put a pressure transducer in there to see the real psi attained, plus a
thermocouple to see if the pomace heats up but that's putting the cart
before the horse.
Thank you for your expertise!
Dave
drcath@tiac.net
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Cider Digest #1285, 20 December 2005
From: "Rosalind Rogoff" <contact@sanramonobserver.org>
Date: Tue, 20 Dec 2005 10:38:20 -0800
Is Cider Brandy the same as Apple Jack?
Roz Rogoff
------------------------------
Subject: Somerset Cider Brandy.
From: "Julian Temperley" <somcb@globalnet.co.uk>
Date: Tue, 20 Dec 2005 18:46:51 -0000
Dear Dick , I was flattered by Andrew Lea's comments about our
apple distillery. However contrary to his views we are always very
happy to show cider makers around our modest distillery in Somerset,
England. We have received a huge amount of hospitality in Calvados in
the past and hope that we all have a common interest in spreading the
word about apples and orchards. Julian Temperley www.ciderbrandy.co.uk
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Harrison scionwood ....
From: "John C. Campbell III" <jccampb@tseassoc.com>
Date: Tue, 20 Dec 2005 18:27:03 -0500
Dick's absolutely right on with this one .... I have no experience with
Nick at all, so I can't and wouldn't venture an opinion ... but the
first question I would ask him is did Tom Burford have anything to do
with the identification of the scionwood origins? Tom rediscovered it,
and both he and Jim Cummins will tell you that mis-identification of
apple varieties is a much larger curse than anyone would care to admit.
Same goes for it's historical blending companion the Campfield. Getting
it 'right' on this variety is (I think) very important for all of us
concerned with a north American cider industry's future. I wish I had a
couple more acres to devote to cider ... they'd all be Harrison's after
tasting the juice at Vintage Virginia Apples last month.
jccampb
>
> Subject: Harrison, Botner
> From: Dick Dunn <rcd@talisman.com <mailto:rcd@talisman.com>>
> Date: Sun, 18 Dec 2005 13:55:10 -0700
>
> Nick Botner (Spearheart Farm) lists scionwood available for Harrison.
> Anybody know if this is the same as the re-discovered Harrison on the
> east coast?
>
> (I'm not questioning Botner's integrity, rather asking because apple names
> are so often duplicated and confounded.)
> - --
> Dick Dunn rcd@talisman.com <mailto:rcd@talisman.com>
> Hygiene, Colorado USA
------------------------------
Subject: past articles
From: terry mayne <tmgrommit@yahoo.com>
Date: Tue, 20 Dec 2005 16:29:00 -0800 (PST)
I am fairly new to this site. I have questions on freezing cider, before
and after fermentation to remove water. Before I post my questions is
there a way to look up old postings to see if it has been discussed?
Thanks
Terry
------------------------------
Subject: using honey in bottle fermentation
From: seth jones <sethjones@earthlink.net>
Date: Wed, 21 Dec 2005 16:29:14 -0500
After three years restoring an old orchard on my property I had my
first crop this year. At least enough for a couple carboys. I want to
bottle ferment some sparkling cider and am interested in using honey
rather than sugar for taste and "mouth feel". Should I use the same
amount as sugar (2 tsp per bottle) or should I use more? Anyone have
other advice? Should I use something other than honey? How does that
taste come out? I have a blend of baldwins, northern spys and rhode
island greening. It's pretty tart after the first ferment. Thanks for
the advice. You guys are pretty impressive, I tried a lot of your
ciders at Cider Day this year...
seth jones
------------------------------
Subject: Cider article in the Los Angeles Times
From: Nick Gunn <nnugkcin@yahoo.com>
Date: Thu, 22 Dec 2005 18:34:02 -0800 (PST)
In case anyone's interested...A good article on the
west coast cider movement. Not entirely complete, but
a rather good story about the folks out here. Hope
everyone is having a happy holidays and taking time
out for a good wassail.
Cheers,
Nick Gunn
Wandering Aengus Ciderworks
Salem, OR
http://www.latimes.com/features/food/la-fo-cider21dec21,0,6326129,full.story?col
l=la-home-food
------------------------------
End of Cider Digest #1286
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