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Cider Digest #1285
Subject: Cider Digest #1285, 20 December 2005
From: cider-request@talisman.com
Cider Digest #1285 20 December 2005
Forum for Discussion of Cider Issues
Dick Dunn, Digest Janitor
Contents:
Cider Brandy (Andrew Lea)
Season's Greetings (Andrew Lea)
Cidermaking review (Andrew Lea)
Re: Harrison (Benjamin Watson)
Re: Harrison ("Dyer, Jonathan A.")
Harrison, Botner (Dick Dunn)
Re: Cider Digest #1284, 17 December 2005 (Bill Rhyne)
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Subject: Cider Brandy
From: Andrew Lea <andrew_lea@compuserve.com>
Date: Sat, 17 Dec 2005 18:56:50 +0000
Peter Angus wrote:
> Is the discussion of apple brandy regarded as off-topic?
and Charles McGonegal replied:
>
> There are a couple distillers lurking on Digest. (Even some legal
> ones, of which I'm in the waiting for the permits in the mail
> category). Cider makers usually have some interest in cider
> brandy/calvados and pommeau - but it doesn't come up often on this
> Digest. Most of the readership lives in the US, where distilling at
> home is highly illegal, and distilling as a business requires pounds
> (literally) of paperwork.
It's just the same in the UK too, which is why you won't find much
discussion. If you can make cider brandy in Australia at home or
commercially without worrying about a visit from the Excise Man, you are
fortunate indeed! I think in the UK there are only 3 extant licences
for cider brandy production, all hard-won. One of them is held by
Julian Temperley, the foremost exponent and producer of cider brandy in
the English speaking world (see http://www.ciderbrandy.co.uk/) but he's
not going to give away his trade secrets on this Digest, I think!
> The basics of calvados 'mash' are essentially those of cider making.
> Most of the important factors are the same. Cultivar selection is a
> little different, since you're after aromatics and not tannins. And
> distillers don't practice some of the pectin manipulations that
> cider makers try: 1) they result in low alcohol ciders, and 2) they
> make extra methanol.
In France at least, sulphite may not legally be used in the fermentation
of ciders used for distillation. This also leaves the cider more prone
to spoilage by non-benign strains of malo-lactic bacteria. A side effect
of this is the formation of acrolein (propenal) which is nasty and
bitter and which also breaks down in the brandy to give equally
unpleasant degradation products. Hence most cider brandy makers distill
their product (as I understand it) as soon as possible after the yeast
fermentation is finished to avoid any influence from unwanted MLF.
There is next to no information on modern cider brandy production in the
open literature. One of the experts in the field (J-F Drilleau from the
Cider Research Institute in Rennes, France) is shortly retiring and his
colleagues have been trying to persuade him to write the definitive
modern book on the topic as a retirement project. Whether this will
ever happen remains to be seen!
Andrew Lea
- --
Wittenham Hill Cider Page
http://www.cider.org.uk
------------------------------
Subject: Season's Greetings
From: Andrew Lea <andrew_lea@compuserve.com>
Date: Sat, 17 Dec 2005 19:11:19 +0000
Those of us making cider in the Northern Hemisphere will just about have
finished or be coming to the end of our pressing season, and
fermentations will be under way. So 'tis a good time to take stock,
wish a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year to everyone, and especially
to 'Der Janitron' (aka Dick Dunn). For it is he who pilots the Digest
through the seas of spam and past the bergs of unwanted HTML, enlivening
the conversation occasionally with his own observations too. Thank you
Dick!
Andrew
- --
Wittenham Hill Cider Page
http://www.cider.org.uk
------------------------------
Subject: Cidermaking review
From: Andrew Lea <andrew_lea@compuserve.com>
Date: Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:36:20 +0000
While searching for something completely different, I came upon this
very interesting Danish review of current cidermaking in France and England
<http://www.pomona.dk/Artikel.pdf>.
It was published in 2000 and as far as I know is pretty accurate -
although the ownership of various companies has changed, the processes
they use are probably much the same as 5 years ago. It's particularly
useful to have a description of some of the French operations. The
author hasn't quite picked up on the high gravity 'glucose wine' process
operated by the two biggest UK manufacturers (perhaps they didn't tell
him!) although ironically he does note it for our smaller companies.
The 'pectinase' added by Volcler in France will be a special PME, not a
regular pectinase. Apart from these minor caveats, it's well worth
reading. The parent site itself <www.pomona.dk> looks interesting but
since it's all in Danish it's something of an intellectual challenge for
those of us who are not fluent in Scandinavian languages!
Andrew Lea
- --
Wittenham Hill Cider Page
http://www.cider.org.uk
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Harrison
From: Benjamin Watson <bwatson@worldpath.net>
Date: Sun, 18 Dec 2005 07:19:32 -0500
John Bunker asks about availability of the Harrison apple.
I encountered this apple a couple of years ago at the Cider Makers
Forum in Virginia, where it is once again being grown at the Sheltons'
orchard (www.vintagevirginiaapples.com). Tom Burford spent a long time
searching for this long-lost variety, and finally was contacted by
someone in New Jersey who still had a tree.
The Sheltons would either be able to sell scionwood, or be able to
identify other people in VA who are growing the variety. I believe
there is an orchardist down on the coast, near Roanoke, who is growing
it (his name, at the moment escapes me).
Up here in southwest N.H., we are plotting a new "preservation orchard"
in cooperation with a local cidermaker, and we will definitely consider
Harrison because of the need to grow it more widely, to see what it can
do in more northerly climates. I'm assuming that it must be rather fire
blight resistant if it grows well down south. But Tom Burford and the
Sheltons probably have the most experience with this apple.
I have seen and tasted it, and two years ago spread it around among a
few orchardists here in N.H. It's a small, flattish apple, yellow with
a bit of russeting. It's quite juicy; sweet, with a good acid balance
- -- quite sugary and high-flavored. Not the greatest eating apple
because of its size and the fact that it's less "refined" than a
Spitzenburg or other dessert variety. But any cidermaker can tell
immediately why it was so well regarded as a cider fruit. If we had it
in quantity up in these parts, I would use it as much or more than
Wickson, which is another one of my personal favorites for cider.
Ben Watson
Francestown, NH
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Harrison
From: "Dyer, Jonathan A." <dyerja@health.missouri.edu>
Date: Sun, 18 Dec 2005 12:28:52 -0600
John,
It is believed to be the original Harrison apple from New Jersey and
mentioned by the old authors. I am not aware of exactly how it was
rediscovered, but "Late Harrison" is another name for the Harrison and
this has been available in past years (Nick Botner was the source of my
scions). I have not had enough fruit from my trees to press cider yet,
but I'm hoping, assuming the deer permit me, to have enough fruit in the
next year or two.
Jon Dyer
_ ________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Harrison
From: John Bunker <jbunker@gwi.net>
Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 10:22:23 -0500
In Cider Digest #1281, 3 December 2005, John Campbell mentioned Harrison
juice. Is that the old New Jersey Harrison apple mentioned by Downing
and
others? Would it be possible for me to obtain scionwood from you?
Thanks,
John Bunker
Fedco
P.O. Box 520
Waterville ME 04903
------------------------------
Subject: Harrison, Botner
From: Dick Dunn <rcd@talisman.com>
Date: Sun, 18 Dec 2005 13:55:10 -0700
Nick Botner (Spearheart Farm) lists scionwood available for Harrison.
Anybody know if this is the same as the re-discovered Harrison on the
east coast?
(I'm not questioning Botner's integrity, rather asking because apple names
are so often duplicated and confounded.)
- --
Dick Dunn rcd@talisman.com Hygiene, Colorado USA
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Cider Digest #1284, 17 December 2005
From: Bill Rhyne <bill_rhyne@yahoo.com>
Date: Mon, 19 Dec 2005 23:06:01 -0800 (PST)
RE:Calvados
Hubert Robin of Germain-Robin makes excellent brandy in Ukiah, California.
He comes from a French family that has made brandy for generations in
France. When we were first making our cider, he was interested in buying some
cider from us as he wanted to make some calvados. We were at such a small
production level though that it didn't make sense for us. The reduction
was like 9 gallons to make 1 gallon or something. For him, he said that
our cider had too much flavor. He was looking for a more neutral flavor as
his flavors come from his process and barrel aging. Anyway, he might have
some clues for those that are interested in the process or legal paperwork.
Take care!
Bill Rhyne
------------------------------
End of Cider Digest #1285
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