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Cider Digest #1260
Subject: Cider Digest #1260, 21 September 2005
From: cider-request@talisman.com
Cider Digest #1260 21 September 2005
Forum for Discussion of Cider Issues
Dick Dunn, Digest Janitor
Contents:
Fauxwelp ("Richard & Susan Anderson")
counter-pressure bottle filler ("Dave Halliday")
Bottle-Pasteurisation (The Grant Family)
Fauxwhelp ("McGonegal, Charles")
Whoops! (Tim Bray)
Cider Making Courses ("Drew Zimmerman")
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Subject: Fauxwelp
From: "Richard & Susan Anderson" <baylonanderson@rockisland.com>
Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 20:51:36 -0700
This does not really address Charles question regarding his apples but the
Foxwelp true-to-type question has come up before on the Digest. I am not
sure any of us has a true-to-type Foxwelp. Our West Coast version, which was
obtained from the Mt. Vernon Research Station who may have gotten it from
Geneva does not seem to match any of the descriptions of the English
Foxwelps or Foxwelp sports that I have seen. They are an early apple, they
are bittersharp but do not have a distinctive "foxy" flavor. Ours ripen in
early September, are oblate, have thick woody stem are yellow green which
flushes to about 90% to a dark red. The trees bear annually but are not
heavy bearers, seem to be self thinning with large fruit typically being 80+
mm. They are not good keepers and must be pressed fairly quickly. Does
anyone have a true-to-type Foxwelp?
------------------------------
Subject: counter-pressure bottle filler
From: "Dave Halliday" <dh@synthstuff.com>
Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 21:22:03 -0700
> I finished the day driving up and down Cayuga and Seneca Lakes and
> visiting with Bill Barton of Bellwether Cider. He has a new tasting
> room, which was packed with wine tourists -- it's good to see this kind
> of interest in well-made hard cider. The pride of Bill's operation is
> his very unique and expensive counter-pressure bottle filler, purchased
> from a company in California that is now apparently building tabletop
> models, which would be great for cidermakers, who have to deal with a
> low-alcohol product and want to ensure that their is minimal oxidation
> in bottling. Bill says this machine greatly extends the bottle and
> shelf life and quality of his cider.
Any word as to the name of this company? We are waiting on Federal
permits but plan to start building our tasting room/cidery early spring
2006. Still looking at small-scale bottling equipment.
Thanks!
Dave and Jennifer Halliday
Brown Snout Farm and Cidery
http://www.brownsnout.com
------------------------------
Subject: Bottle-Pasteurisation
From: The Grant Family <grants@netspace.net.au>
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 16:05:04 +1000
Hi all,
Well my first keeving attempt with PME was a failure - but at least I know
why (need more pectin in the juice - ie. I need to macerate with the PME
next time). In the hope of artificially making some medium-sweet cider, I'm
planning on bottle-pasteurising 20L of cider at about 1.010 SG.
The method I've read about is to bottle (in my case, in heavy
champagne-style bottles), allow to carbonate to ~2 vol. CO2 (lowish
carbonation), then place the bottles in a saucepan full of water and heat
to 75C for 30min. Leaving one of the bottles uncapped with a thermometer in
it will most easily gauge the temperature inside the bottles.
Is this dangerous given that I will pre-carbonate? Is there a better
method? What else should I think about?
Thanks for any advice.
Cheers
Stuart Grant.
Hobart, Tasmania, Australia.
------------------------------
Subject: Fauxwhelp
From: "McGonegal, Charles" <Charles.McGonegal@uop.com>
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 07:31:38 -0500
The 'Fauxwhelp' I've got makes a medium sized, round fruit, lightly
streaked with a 'burnt' red (not a bright color) against a green so pale
it tends to grey. I'd call it a bittersharp of no particular note.
Some of the pale color might be climate, but my Coat Jersey and
Dabinettes color up beautifully.
This 'Fauxwhelp' matches the sample I got from Herb Teichman in SE
Michigan in shape, color and taste. It seems to be ready about the 2nd
week of September - though we're early here this year'. I've heard
folks in the Midwest Fruit Explorers club talk about a 'Foxwhelp' apple
that is very early season. They didn't describe it beyond that.
I had asked about 'White Jersey' on the thought that it could also be a
pale bittersharp. But if all the Jerseys are conical - then it won't be
that. By the way, I got one single Twistbody Jersy this year. Slightly
conical with a very unusual eye - not much basin and no sepals.
Beautiful orange blush with no streaks. Great nose, but I haven't cut
it up yet to taste it.
On thoughts of cultivar and terroir, I wholeheartedly agree that we
should make the best cider we can with the best apples we can lay our
hands on - whether they are heirloom or not. I can already see that
some of my cider collection will turn out blah at best. And I can
readily see the impact of climate. For instance, Haralson grown in
central WI have a lot more character than the ho-hum apples we get down
in the Milwaukee-Chicago corridor.
But it's just so much fun to try the old cultivars to see _which_ ones
will work out where. And other questions like; do they do better in hot
or cool summers? Really cold autumns? Picked early or left to hang?
Sweated or not? So I may end up pulling the 'Fauxwhelp' some day in
favor of more Domaine (which comes out slightly tannic and what I can
only call 'densely fruity' for me). Or maybe some great Jersey-type.
Or this 'Toussaint Chevalier' I've got. It's a good thing I'm young.
These types of experiments take a while :-)
Charles McGonegal
AEppelTreow Winery and 'Stillery
------------------------------
Subject: Whoops!
From: Tim Bray <tbray@mcn.org>
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 10:05:02 -0700
Now I have to face up to careless _thinking_, much worse than simply
careless spelling... Dick pointed out that Muscat deBernay is NOT listed in
Morgan & Richards, at all! So now I wonder if I found it listed somewhere
else, or if my treacherous brain supplied an entirely false "memory" of a
citation. I should know better than to cite something without verifying
the citation.... that's my bad.
A quick Googling did reveal several other citations of MdB, so at least
there's that.
Anyway, the apple itself does quite well for me. It's not only a good
cropper, but scab-resistant as well, which is huge here. (We always get a
lot of damp days in summer, but this year was especially bad, and it really
spotlighted the varieties that are resistant.) I just wish I'd known how
upright it grows; I'd have pruned the whip off lower at planting, to force
a better shape. (Same for Lady and Court Pendu.) Also MdB keeps quite
well, for a low-acid apple. (A lot better than my Kingston Black, which is
supposed to be a bittersharp!)
Cheers,
Tim
Albion, CA
------------------------------
Subject: Cider Making Courses
From: "Drew Zimmerman" <drewzimmer@comcast.net>
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 11:44:15 -0700
With the cider community gearing up for the fall cider and apple events I?d
like to remind folks again of the cider making courses being offered by the
WSU Learning Center for Skagit, Island and San Juan counties along with the
Northwestern Washington Research and Extension Center in Mt. Vernon.
Washington. The dates are Dec. 12-16 for the Cider Making Principles and
Practice course and Dec. 17 for the new Cider Sensory Evaluation Seminar.
There will also be a celebration dinner the evening of the 17th featuring a
5 course meal with two ciders paired with each course. For details, info.
and registration, please see the website at: HYPERLINK
"http://learningcenters.wsu.edu/skagit/ciderworkshops.html#info"http://learn
ingcenters.wsu.edu/skagit/ciderworkshops.html#info
Drew Zimmerman
Red Barn Cider
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End of Cider Digest #1260
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