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Cider Digest #1197
Subject: Cider Digest #1197, 5 February 2005
From: cider-request@talisman.com
Cider Digest #1197 5 February 2005
Forum for Discussion of Cider Issues
Dick Dunn, Digest Janitor
Contents:
RE: Article-budwood search (Larry Gianakis)
Re: Hogg and Bull Herefordshire Pomona (Dick Dunn)
Re: Basque cider article in NYT ("T. J. Higgins ")
A Silver Medal from the Upper Mississippi Mash-Out ("J. K. Davis")
bag-in-box for small producers? (Dick Dunn)
Basque cider and MLF (Andrew Lea)
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Subject: RE: Article-budwood search
From: Larry Gianakis <lgianakis@yahoo.com>
Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2005 18:29:42 -0800 (PST)
Eric
Ford Farm Cyderworks sells scion wood from their cider varieties. They are
out of Portland, OR and their website is:
http://www.cyderworks.com/ourapples.htm
Hope this helps
Larry Gianakis
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Hogg and Bull Herefordshire Pomona
From: rcd@talisman.com (Dick Dunn)
Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2005 22:29:56 -0700 (MST)
The info about being able to get a CD with material from the Hogg and Bull
Pomona (CD 1196, note from Andrew) is exciting...there's more to it than
you'll realize if you haven't seen the book.
We were lucky enough to see one (and even touch the pages) on our last trip
to the UK. It is a huge, thick book. (I'd guess the size but I'd be accused
of telling a fish story.) If you appreciate fine printing and antiquarian
books, you'd go nuts over this one. Each plate is a work of art. It's an
incredible resource.
There were only 600 copies printed. I've heard estimates of what recent
copies have fetched in sales, generally close to five figures ($US). Few
of us will ever get to see one, let alone own one...so the Marcher effort
is important. (And no, I don't think it's detrimental to the originals,
any more than would be the case with prints of a piece of fine art.)
I'm also hoping that if the Marcher project succeeds, there will be similar
efforts to produce digital facsimile editions of some of the less imposing
but still significant works for cider...Knight, Worlidge, and such.
- ---
Dick Dunn rcd@talisman.com Hygiene, Colorado USA
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Basque cider article in NYT
From: "T. J. Higgins " <tjhiggin@hiwaay.net>
Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2005 09:08:46 -0600
In the Globe Trekker (aka Lonely Planet) TV show, the episode
about northern Spain shows a few minutes inside a cider house,
including the feast, the huge casks, and using a glass to
catch the cider stream from the cask. Watch for it on your
local American PBS station. Details of the show are at
http://www.pilotguides.com/tv_shows/globe_trekker/shows/europe/northern_spain.ph
p
T.J. Higgins
Huntsville, Alabama
------------------------------
Subject: A Silver Medal from the Upper Mississippi Mash-Out
From: "J. K. Davis" <andiroba@hotmail.com>
Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2005 17:38:20 -0500
Gentle Cider People:
I am pleased to tell you that my partner and I are were awarded a silver
medal from the Upper Mississippi Mash-Out for my cyser (fruit melomel).
This is the second year we've made it, so I'm extremely pleased with our
progress. We have many of you to thank for providing excellent counsel and
advice over the last year. I, personally, also commend Washington State
University for holding their exceptional cider course with wise instructor
Peter Mitchell, who taught me everything I know about fermentation
chemistry.
Who knows? In a few years, maybe you'll see my cyser, with its weasel on
the label, at your local wine store!
Yours in cider excitement,
Jan Davis and George Farrar
Weasel Hill Farm Cider
Amissville, Virginia
------------------------------
Subject: bag-in-box for small producers?
From: rcd@talisman.com (Dick Dunn)
Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 22:48:14 -0700 (MST)
Wine in a bag-in-a-box is an effective way to keep wine on hand and serve
it as desired, small or large servings, and because the bag collapses the
wine doesn't oxidize even if the container has been in use for quite a
while. I understand that this packaging has been in use outside the US
for years. It's been available in the US for a long time also, but only
on the cheapest wines...it's finally showing up for the mid-quality wines
only in the past couple years.
Looking at the packages on store shelves, it almost seems like each one is
a special item--the box, the bag, the little spigot arrangement all seem to
be slightly different. This doesn't quite make sense to me; I wonder if
the number of suppliers of this packaging must not be smaller than the
number of commercial customers.
Is some form of this packaging available for a sort of end-user or very
small producer purchase? I knew of breweries using a heavy sort of bag-
in-box packaging for take-away some years ago, but I haven't seen it
recently. The newer style seems ideal for a still cider. I wonder why
one wouldn't use such a package if it were available.
- ---
Dick Dunn rcd@talisman.com Hygiene, Colorado USA
------------------------------
Subject: Basque cider and MLF
From: Andrew Lea <andrew_lea@compuserve.com>
Date: Sat, 05 Feb 2005 19:44:32 +0000
Tim Bray wrote:
>
> Among all the other fascinating bits in that article was the
> assertion that the MLF is completed by the end of January! Must be
> pretty warm winters in Basque country, or else they have a
> cold-active strain of MLF bacteria.
>
Although I have never visited the Basque cider region myself, I am given
to understand by those who have and who work there that the MLF occurs
pretty much coincident with or at least immediately after the yeast
fermentation. This rather flies against the received wisdom on these
things in other parts of the world, but this is what they say and I have
no reason to doubt it. I believe both fermentations are completed
during their mild autumns and the cider is deemed ready to drink early
in the spring.
There are several scientific papers on MLF coming out of the Basque
country just now. Some of them deal with experimental inoculation with
yeast and MLB simultaneously, intended to duplicate normal commercial
practice in that area. Temperatures for those studies are 15, 22 and
27C, so I can only imagine that the bottom end of that range does indeed
represent their normal MLF 'autummn/winter' temperature.
Andrew Lea
- --
Wittenham Hill Cider Page
http://www.cider.org.uk
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End of Cider Digest #1197
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