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Cider Digest #1080
From: cider-request@talisman.com
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To: cider-list@talisman.com
Subject: Cider Digest #1080, 1 October 2003
Cider Digest #1080 1 October 2003
Forum for Discussion of Cider Issues
Dick Dunn, Digest Janitor
Contents:
A few questions from a beginner (Nick Gunn)
RE: Chisel Jersey ("Richard & Susan Anderson")
ID of Chisel Jersey (Andrew Lea)
other fruit /apple combo ("Darlene Hanson/Darcy Wardrop")
Press Basket Construction (mohrstrom@core.com)
Re: Cider Digest #1079, 27 September 2003 (John Bunker)
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Subject: A few questions from a beginner
From: Nick Gunn <nnugkcin@yahoo.com>
Date: Sat, 27 Sep 2003 12:01:11 -0700 (PDT)
Hi all,
I've read many a posting from you guys but I have yet to send one myself. Now
that I have sequestered some land in the Willamette Valley and am anxious to
get something started, I need some advice. My partner and I are interested
in producing our own commercial cider a few years down the road but first
we would like to start trellising some semi-dwarf varieties and get them
growing. We would like to sell our apples to any interested cideries,
until we build up enough capital start producing our own product. We have
had a lot of folks interested in golden russets in the Pacific Northwest
and would like to use those for our own presses. So I guess I can only
narrow it down to three questions:
1. What other apples would folks recommend for good english cider?
2. Is anybody out there interested in purchasing organic golden russets
and/or other varities? (Understandebly these wouldn't be ready till three
years down the road).
3. What are some good reading materials for the beginner? (Interested
in books on trellising, general growing info, and a good how-to book on
making my first batches of cider).
My apologies if these questions are redundant or have already been
answered. I love cider and I am really excited about getting something
started, let me know what y'all think. Thanks,
Nick Gunn
------------------------------
Subject: RE: Chisel Jersey
From: "Richard & Susan Anderson" <baylonanderson@rockisland.com>
Date: Sat, 27 Sep 2003 12:19:10 -0700
Liz Copas in "Somerset Pomona" describes Chisel Jersey as "broad based and
conical with a dark brownish-pink flush, striped red". We obtained some
Chisel Jersey bud stock which turned out to be a Browns Apple, this became
very apparent when we tested the apples for acidity. It all turned out OK,
we like the Brown's except they are strong biennials. See if you can find a
copy of a "Somerset Pomona" it has excellent, extensive descriptions and
color photographs of each variety. It is really a must have to establish
true-to-type on English Cider Apples.
------------------------------
Subject: ID of Chisel Jersey
From: Andrew Lea <andrew_lea@compuserve.com>
Date: Sat, 27 Sep 2003 21:07:14 +0100
Charles wrote:
> Chisel Jersey - sweet, very perfumed, scent and flavor like a sweet resinous
> wood. Maybe a but citrusy, like broken lime leaves. This is the one that I
> wonder about the ID. Morgan and Richards says conical. Ours are fairly
> oblate, dead solid red and have a pretty pink stain under the skin to about
> .5cm. Otherwise very creamy, fine grained, but dense flesh. Does this
> sound like Chisel to folks who have it?
>
My first thought was this wasn't like the Chisel Jersey I knew growing
in the Bulmers orchards in the 1970s which was oblate-conical and just
flushed, not solid red. But then I read further in the Bulmers Pomona
(text by Ray Williams) and Liz Copas' Somerset Pomona, and I realized
this is yet another example of a cider apple being distributed by the
wrong name (probably a nursery cock-up). Chisel Jersey is a Somerset
apple - apparently the Chisel Jersey distributed and grown in the
English West Midlands was actually Sandford Jersey. This is now
referred to as Hereford Chisel Jersey. Complicated, ain't it!
I scanned in Liz's picture and you'll find it (a bit degraded!) at
http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/andrew_lea/chisel.jpg
Nonetheless I'm not convinced Charles has a Chisel Jersey of either
description. Liz says the two can be difficult to distinguish, but
neither are any more than just flushed red and I don't believe
the red stain under the skin nor the sweet perfumed taste are at all
characteristic. Also I remember it being really quite tannic - though I
think there's been enough discussion on CD in recent years to make us
realise that English bittersweets grown outside of their home area often
come up with far less tannin than they do here.
That's my six penn'orth!
Andrew Lea, Oxford, UK
- --
Wittenham Hill Cider Page
http://www.cider.org.uk
------------------------------
Subject: other fruit /apple combo
From: "Darlene Hanson/Darcy Wardrop" <d_hanson@oberon.ark.com>
Date: Sun, 28 Sep 2003 19:49:45 -0700
Hello , I am new to tis page and to cider making. Under the principle of
working with what you have . I am using the apples that grow in my 1/2 acre
here on North central Vancouver Island . I have Spartan ,a King that does
not produce more than a few apples and a Boskoop that produces very heavy. I
realize that they are not cider apples ,but when mixed with wild crabs and
apples from abandoned orchards I have made a very drinkable cider all but
very dry.I also have pears ,grapes plums and figs and kiwisand Raspberries.
My interest is, is there any precedent for mixing other fruit in with the
cider. Plums , Grapes , Pears , Kiwis or even Rhubarb. My main interest is
in the kiwis as this has made a very fine wine. I have searched the internet
and read books, but have found no information. Beer and Mead would seem to
have a long history of being mixed with fruit. I am considering 10 lbs of
other fruit mixed to 100 lbs of apples at time of grinding and pressing.
Any information would be helpful. Thanks Darcy
------------------------------
Subject: Press Basket Construction
From: mohrstrom@core.com
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2003 13:00:28 -0400
Because I'm a Luddite! (although a computer-savvy one ;-])
Being a member of the local Antique Engine and Machinery club, I
typically try to put things together so that they look "right".
One of the best-ever events that we put on for my local homebrew club
was to invite a buddy to bring his 120 year-old press out. We powered
the grinder with a John Deere "E" hit 'n' miss engine (via a flat belt). We
went through 52 bushels of apples, a few steaks, and a bit of freshly-
pressed cider that day.
>>>
Mark Ohrstrom (mohrstrom@core.com) wrote...some digests back...
> B) I only have one tub. I'd like to find a source for long flat-head rivets
> to build a second. McMaster-Carr's aren't long enough.
Something about this finally clicked in my head. Why do you need rivets?
The typical tub or basket has a couple of metal hoops to which the
wooden staves are attached. I gather that in your case they're attached
with rivets through the staves. But why not attach them with screws
instead?
<<<
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Cider Digest #1079, 27 September 2003
From: John Bunker <jbunker@gwi.net>
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2003 07:25:47 -0400
To John Howard:
John,
There are three apple species native to North America. M. coronaria
'Sweet' crab native to eastern US), M. ioensis ('Prairie' or 'Iowa' crab
native to the midwest) and M. fusca ('Oregon' crab native to the Northwest.)
I've eaten one M. cononaria selection that was quite decent. The ioensis
I've tried were inedible. M. fusca also didn't impress me as I recall. I
have no experience making cider with them. I know this won't be much help,
but perhaps at least of moderate interest!
John Bunker
Palermo Maine
------------------------------
End of Cider Digest #1080
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