Copy Link
Add to Bookmark
Report
Cider Digest #0877
Subject: Cider Digest #877, 2 October 2000
From: cider-request@talisman.com
Cider Digest #877 2 October 2000
Forum for Discussion of Cider Issues
Dick Dunn, Digest Janitor
Contents:
Perry! (Chad Petersen)
Re: No smart remarks please (Marc Shapiro)
pH and acidity (Andrew Lea)
cider apple book request. ("Mark Ellis")
PET bottles vs glass (Andrew Lea)
re: confused apple tree? (Dick Dunn)
Send ONLY articles for the digest to cider@talisman.com.
Use cider-request@talisman.com for subscribe/unsubscribe/admin requests.
When subscribing, please include your name and a good address in the
message body unless you're sure your mailer generates them.
Archives of the Digest are available at www.talisman.com/cider
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Perry!
From: Chad Petersen <Chad.Petersen@wwu.edu>
Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 11:27:20 -0700
Hello all! The season is upon us in the great northwest. I ground and
pressed a couple gallons of pear the other day, but they were just a nice
sweet mellow yellow pear. I dont even know the variety. The juice tasted
fine and is happily fermenting away. I had to add acid and tannins to make
it have a bit of pucker to it. My question is this, are there any growers
in the US that I could purchase some varieties more suited to cider
production. Our local nurseries are flabbergasted and ask why would you
want a bitter pear? It is the old Home Depot mentality I suppose. Andrew,
do you do perry at your orchard? Any input would be much appreciated.
Chad
------------------------------
Subject: Re: No smart remarks please
From: Marc Shapiro <m_shapiro@bigfoot.com>
Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 23:30:02 -0400
> Subject: No smart remarks please
> From: Booth <kbooth@waverly.k12.mi.us>
> Date: Wed, 13 Sep 2000 14:43:16 -0400
>
> OK....OK....I was lazy and didn't get my cider bottled, and one plastic
> pail had a split in the top and after two years, well, I have a
> wonderful 5 gallons of beautiful vinegar.
<SNIP>
> Finally, is there any special sanitation procedures I should follow, or,
> should I toss my plastic pail and airlock.
Not if you really want to make more cider vinegar. Otherwise, I would
get rid of them ASAP and clean around them and anywhere that the cider
may have spilled with bleach. Acetobacter will hang in there,
otherwise.
Marc Shapiro
m_shapiro@bigfoot.com
http://www.bigfoot.com/~m_shapiro/index.html
------------------------------
Subject: pH and acidity
From: Andrew Lea <andrew_lea@compuserve.com>
Date: Sat, 23 Sep 2000 11:15:54 +0100
In answer to Jim Booth, a vinegar has a pH of about 3.3 which is not
very different from a cider, so this is a pretty unhelpful measurement
for judging vinegar strength. The titratable acidity is however ten
times higher in vinegar, more in the region of 5% compared to 0.5% for a
cider. So the simplest procedure (to avoid consuming all your test
kit!) is to take your vinegar, dilute it accurately tenfold with
distilled or demineralised water, and then measure the acidity in the
normal way you would for a wine or cider. When you get the figure,just
multiply it back up by 10 to get the true acid value in the
vinegar. To be picky, if this value is in tartaric acid units, you
should then multiply it by 0.8 to express it in acetic acid units (or by
0.9 to convert from malic units to acetic).
Regarding Jim's other question about a 'translation' between pH and
titratable acidity (TA), this is unfortunately not possible as may be
obvious from the example above. They measure two quite different things
and all one can say is that as the pH goes up the titratable acidity
generally falls, and vice-versa. There is no direct correlation between
the two
because the 'buffering capacity' of the product also comes into play -
it takes heavy chemistry to explain this further so I shan't! Another
problem is that titratable acid is a linear scale but pH is a
logarithmic one - so a pH of 3 is ten times the hydrogen ion
concentration of a pH of 4 (oh, it's also an *inverse* scale!).
Empirically, take it like this. pH relates more to microbial stability
of the product so a range of 3.3 - 4 is OK to ensure that ciders are not
too prone to infection. TA relates much more closely to the acid taste
of a cider and a range of 0. 4 - 0.7% is usually found to be hedonically
acceptable for drinking. Both measurements are useful but for different
things!
Andrew Lea. nr Oxford, UK
- --------------------------------------
Visit the Wittenham Hill Cider Page at
http://www.cider.org.uk OR
http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/andrew_lea
------------------------------
Subject: cider apple book request.
From: "Mark Ellis" <mark@glacierdesign.net>
Date: Sun, 24 Sep 2000 19:52:12 +1000
Hi All,
My father is a orchardist and is seeking some reference
material before chasing down some varieties and
planting out a experimental cider plot. What books
titles would you recommend.
Many Thanks
Mark E. from OZ
------------------------------
Subject: PET bottles vs glass
From: Andrew Lea <andrew_lea@compuserve.com>
Date: Sun, 24 Sep 2000 10:49:35 +0100
I had some interesting experiences last season comparing both PET and
Glass bottles for sweet naturally conditioned ciders. Glass is Good,
PET is Poor! Since the write up is a bit long winded I've posted it on
my website not here. People who are thinking in advance what bottles
they need might like to take a look!
See http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/andrew_lea/frameset.htm
and choose 'PET bottles vs glass' from the left hand menu bar about
two-thirds the way down.
Andrew Lea nr Oxford UK
------------------------------
Subject: re: confused apple tree?
From: rcd@raven.talisman.com (Dick Dunn)
Date: 29 Sep 00 18:26:02 MDT (Fri)
Thanks for the various bits of advice on my tree that decided to bloom very
late in the summer. I'll be nice to the tree and otherwise not worry.
Regarding some of the suggestions: I won't make cider from this, as it was
only one blossom. I don't think I have to worry about more blossoms since
we've already had our first snow. Yes, we did have drought--one of the
driest years on record and it's normally dry here anyway--but I did what I
could to keep adequate water to the trees. (I realize that it can some-
times be hard to get enough water to a tree--if it's hot and dry enough
above ground, it seems like the roots just can't deliver enough water no
matter how much is available...and you don't want to flood the tree.) I
later saw some odd second blooms on other plants--e.g., lavender blooming
right now.
- ---
Dick Dunn rcd@talisman.com Hygiene, Colorado USA
...Simpler is better.
------------------------------
End of Cider Digest #877
*************************
