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Cider Digest #0658
Subject: Cider Digest #658, 16 April 1997
From: cider-request@talisman.com
Cider Digest #658 16 April 1997
Forum for Discussion of Cider Issues
Dick Dunn, Digest Janitor
Contents:
Re: White 'mould' in cider (Steve Daughhetee)
Re: Cider Digest #657, 11 April 1997 (Eric Allan Hines)
Elderflower extract (Andrew LEA)
Perry Pears (Richard Anderson)
More about Perry Pears ("Keith Robertson")
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Subject: Re: White 'mould' in cider
From: Steve Daughhetee <sdd6@cornell.edu>
Date: Fri, 11 Apr 1997 16:20:24 -0800
> Unless I'm mistaken, what you are describing is called "flower". I know
>because I dumped two batches 2 years ago because of it. It's pretty much a
>terminal infection.
I'd be patient before dumping (unless carboys are at a premium). A couple
years ago, one carboy of cider developed a somewhat oily scum and became
noticably cloudy about six months after transfer to the secondary
fermenter. I'd given it up for lost, but didn't get around to doing
anything with it for another six months. By then it had fallen bright. It
tasted remarkably good and had even lost a nasty hydrogen sulfide aroma
which had lingered for quite some time. One of the best carboys from that
pressing!
The bottom line is that you can't be sure which bugs you're dealing with
based solely on the appearance of the wine.
> It's described in a book I've got (but it's at home and cant remember the
>title or authors -- it is, however a large paperback with a red cover).
That would be Acton and Duncan, "Sweet and Hard Cider."
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Subject: Re: Cider Digest #657, 11 April 1997
From: Eric Allan Hines <ehines@WPI.EDU>
Date: Fri, 11 Apr 1997 20:29:09 -0400 (EDT)
Please take me off your e-mailing list. Thank you very much.
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Subject: Elderflower extract
From: Andrew LEA <andrew_lea@compuserve.com>
Date: Sun, 13 Apr 1997 16:54:42 -0400
>>Subject: elder flower extract From: dpk1@nysaes.cornell.edu
>>(Dave Kain) Date: Fri, 11 Apr 1997 09:38:48 -0400 (EDT)
>>Has anyone ever heard of/worked with elder flower extract? I'm
>>told that it's used in a number of applications as a food and
>>drink additive, including addition to perry (don't know the
>>reason) in Europe.
I think this all begins with elderflower 'champagne' which is a beverage
made over here by steeping elderflower heads for a couple of days in a
sugar / water/ lemon juice mix, straining, and then allowing to ferment in
bottle by the action of the wild yeasts from the elder florets themselves.
It's light and refereshing - just what you need in May / June when the
elder is flowering! It doesn't keep more than a couple of weeks.
The key is that the elder flowers themselves have a pleasant floral terpene
aroma which adds a nice flavour to a light beverage. Commercially, elder
flower extracts are made by steeping the flower heads in strong acidified
sugar syrup (60 - 70% by weight) for a few days and then keeping the syrup
(which is too strong to ferment) in bulk until used for blending off into
carbonated juices or even into light alcoholic beverages such as cider and
perry (or custom-made carbonated alcoholic bases usually prepared from
imported grape-juice). There are several commercial products on the UK
market which now contain these extracts, but I don't know who trades in
these extracts, if anybody (I would guess perhaps William Ransom Ltd). I
know at least one major UK user makes his own.
You have to be careful though to select a strain of elderflower which is
fragrant rather than 'catty'. All are collected from the wild, so far as I
know, and are not cultivated (at least in the UK, though elder is
cultivated in other parts of Europe principally for the dark black berries
which are used for food colouring). This is all from the European elder
(Sambucus nigra) - I've been told that the North American species of elder
(e.g. S. canadensis) are poisonous in flower and fruit but that may just be
an old wives tale! I think the European elder leaves contain cyanide in
quite high levels and were used by Victorian entomologists to kill
butterflies in the field before taking them home and mounting them!
Andrew Lea, nr Oxford, UK
------------------------------
Subject: Perry Pears
From: Richard Anderson <BaylonAnderson@compuserve.com>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 01:03:21 -0400
One place to start is Dr. Graftons "Cider and Perry Page" at:
http://sun1.bham.ac.uk/GraftonG/cider/homepage.htm
There is a fairly extensive list of perry pears. Getting these pears may be
more difficult .
A cross reference Grafton's perry varieties with the Fruit, Berry and Nut
Inventory, Second Edition, edited by Kent Whealy and Steve Demuth for US
sources. Alan Foster, White Oak Cider, Oregon is making some perry and
putting in some trees. He does his own nursery work, so must have or know
where to get bud wood for some varieties, maybe Corvallis.
------------------------------
Subject: More about Perry Pears
From: "Keith Robertson" <apples@cbl.com.au>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 20:24:07 +0000
I thought it might be helpful to give you the accession numbers and
cultivar names of the Perry Pears held at Corvallis.
PI 231806 Normannischen
PI 506378 R 9
PI 541123 Barland
PI 541124 Barnet
PI 541151 Bakeney Red
PI 541156 Butt
PI 541195 Gin
PI 541205 Hendre Huffcap
PI 541271 Taynton Squash
PI 541273 Thorn
PI 541287 Yellow Huffcap
PI 541305 Brandy
PI 541317 Red Pear
Barland. A favourite perry pear with a peculiar flavour of its own.
Butt. A medium-sized, conical, gren fruit which makes a strong rough
perry. Mid-season to late flowering. Hardy and prolific. Fruit ready
mid-season.
Taynton Squash. Another good perry-making pear, small, russeted over
dull yellow with rosey cheek. Hardy and prolific. Flowers early and
fruit is ready early in September.
Descriptions taken from Fruit Growing N. B. Bagenal 1946.
There are collections of Perry Pears in Australia in the hands of
private collectors and I myself have some that I have collected from
an old Orchard near where I live from Pear trees 150 years old. I
have yet to identify which varieties they are however I am fairly
certain one of them is the Red Pear and one day I hope to make my
first batch of real Perry.
Best wishes
Keith Robertson
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End of Cider Digest #658
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