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Cider Digest #0473
Subject: Cider Digest #473 Wed Oct 5 18:00:06 EDT 1994
Date: Wed, 5 Oct 94 18:00:07 -0400
From: cider-request@x.org (Are you SURE you want to send it HERE?)
Cider Digest #473 Wed Oct 5 18:00:06 EDT 1994
Forum for Discussion of Cider Issues
Jay Hersh, Digest Coordinator
Contents:
Grape press for cider?? ("M.A. MCClelland")
Experimenting. (Hair)
re: Cider Apples (Dick Dunn)
Plans for Presses? (Chuck Stringer)
yeasty aftertaste??? (leisenman)
My First Cider (Bob McDonald )
dark gray cider?? (Dick Dunn)
Tis the season (brewing chemist Mitch)
Fall '94 (Stephen J Butts)
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Date: Sun, 18 Sep 1994 11:14:50 -0400 (EDT)
From: "M.A. MCClelland" <u9319320@muss.cis.mcmaster.ca>
Subject: Grape press for cider??
I recently bought a huge old grape press (for grapes), and am now
wondering if I can also use it to press apples for cider, too. It has the
traditional design - a round basket made of slats about 1/4 " apart. It has
great squishing potential, with a ball bearing/giant spring mechanism for
ease of use (or so said the guy selling it to me - don't know yet as the
grapes haven't tested it out yet).
Has anyone tried something like this? Should I line the basket
with something so the apple pulp doesn't escape? Any ideas greatly
appreciated.
Maureen McClelland - McMaster Midwifery '96
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 94 23:03:49 EDT
From: Hair@aol.com
Subject: Experimenting.
Cider season has arrived here in Virginia and I'm ready to try some
experiments. I will continue to make cider as I normally have for the past
few years with good results. But I have decided to try some flavoring. I
have discussed making a holiday cider by adding cinnamin, cloves, allspice
and the like with another cider maker who says she had added mulling spices
to hers with good results. I am also considering making a cider flavored
with ginger. I thought I'd throw a few questions out to any of you that
have tried such experiments or just have opinions.
Basically what ingredients do you think are appropriate and in what amounts?
With the ginger flavored cider I am considering adding some unfermentable
sugars to leave it somewhat sweeter, any ideas on what would be the best?
Like I said any experiences or opinions would be appreciated. I will also
remember to report back a few times with my results.
Thanks. :)
------------------------------
Date: 20 Sep 94 20:11:56 MDT (Tue)
From: rcd@raven.eklektix.com (Dick Dunn)
Subject: re: Cider Apples
A while back, Greg Appleyard <gappleya@uoguelph.ca> chastised me for an
incomplete report on cider in Somerset...
> What! You go all that way, tasting all those great ciders and you can't
> remember what types of apples they use?? How could you keep us hanging on
> by our finger nails to your post like that and not tell us the secret of
> good cider?
Sorry; I write about what I understand. I understand drinking, so that's
what I wrote about.
Really, there isn't all that much I can say about specific varieties. I
heard some names bandied about, but with zero background, I couldn't put
them in perspective. Thanks for writing what you did on your results.
One name that I heard several times was "Kingston Black", which is reputed
to be an ideal cider apple because it's got enough acid and tannin along
with the needed sugar...it's said to be close enough to balanced that it
will make a good cider all on its own. I heard one cider maker mention
that he'd seen some photos from the US of Kingston Black, and he doubted,
based on what he'd seen, that they were the same as the English apples of
the same name. Take it for whatever (if anything) it might be worth...
Again, the book by Proulx and Nichols is recommended for info. It does
contain a fair bit of discussion of apple varieties.
Lastly, rdevine@microsoft.com answered my plaint,
> > (Finally, the problem: Now that I've got this new addiction to a style of
> > cider I'd never imagined before, how do I feed it?)
...with a note:
> There was a case a few years ago where a British lottery winner
> was discovered to have spent all of his considerable winnings.
> When asked how he became broke, he blamed it on the good cider!
I can imagine getting drunk enough on the good cider to blow my money on
dumb things. I have a hard time imagining drinking enough cider to spend
it all on the cider itself! As I said, it's amazingly cheap...spending a
thousand pounds a year should buy enough to keep you bladder-limited even
if it weren't intoxicating.
- ---
Dick Dunn rcd@eklektix.com -or- raven!rcd Boulder, Colorado USA
...Simpler is better.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 22 Sep 1994 10:56:17 -0500 (EST)
From: Chuck Stringer <cstringe@nickel.ucs.indiana.edu>
Subject: Plans for Presses?
I'd like to build a small cider press, but haven't been able to locate
plans for one. Does anyone know of a place that sells them or maybe a
good book on the subject?
Thanks,
Chuck Stringer
cstringe@indiana.edu
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 23 Sep 1994 13:05:32 -0600
From: leisenman@nwu.edu
Subject: yeasty aftertaste???
Hi,
I just finished my second batch of cider (recipe below). The initial taste
is quite pleasant. However, there is a very strong yeast aftertaste that
builds up within a few sips. Any suggestions on how to eliminate this
problem would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.
Larry
leisenman@nwu.edu
Recipe: I added 1/2 can of applejuice concentrate to 64 oz. of apple juice
and put 8 oz. of the mixture into the 'fridge. I pitched 1/4 packet of Red
Star Ale yeast into the remainder. It finished fermenting in two weeks. I
filtered through a coffee filter and added the 8 oz. of applejuice mixture
back to the cider.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 26 Sep 94 09:26:22 EST
From: Bob McDonald <rmcdonald@ansremote.com>
Subject: My First Cider
I made my first last fall and thought someone might like to see it. I got the
last 6 gallons of apple juice from a farmer down the street and decided to go
for it. Here is the recipe:
5 gal. apple juice
5.25 lb. honey
3/4 t. tannin
2-1/2 t pectic enzyme
5 t acid blend
2 t citric acid
1-1/4 t yeast superfood
1-1/4 t yeast nutrient
6 campden tablets
Combine apple juice and honey. Check acid levels and adjust as necessary.
add tannin and nutrients. The amount of honey here was to get to 10% potential
alcohol. Add crushed campden tablets and allow to sit overnight. Add pectic
enzyme and yeast. I used a combination of Montrachet and Epernay II. This
fermanted well into the winter and I bottled on 02/26/94. Half sparkling, half
still. Nice dry cider.
Cheers,
Bob
- ----------------------------------------------------------------------
Anyone can give credit for doing a great job. It requires someone
really special to take all the credit for everyone else involved.
- ----------------------------------------------------------------------
Robert E. McDonald, Jr. (rmcdonald@ansremote.com)
Sr. Telecom Software Analyst Tel: (616) 376-6081
First of America Services - Technology
K-A12-3F
One First of America Parkway
Kalamazoo, MI 49009-8002
------------------------------
Date: 2 Oct 94 14:28:49 MDT (Sun)
From: rcd@raven.eklektix.com (Dick Dunn)
Subject: dark gray cider??
Yesterday I found a place selling good fresh sweet cider at a reasonable
price, and it seemed like it might have enough substance to ferment to a
reasonable hard cider, so I bought a little to try out. I know that
experiments are best understood when there's only one variable involved,
but I've never been one to follow my own advice, so I also decided to try
adding some oak chips to the fermentation (in a gallon glass jug).
I added about 1/2 oz of the oak chips, boiled before adding, and a wine-
yeast starter. The fermentation took off nicely, but the cider darkened,
and as the foam built up above the cider, part of it took on an ugly dark
gray color. As the fermentation went on, the gray crud built up. There
was no particular odd taste to the cider thus far, although I didn't taste
it too carefully since it seems too early to tell much from taste.
So, to the obvious question: What is this gray bletch? I've got one
hypothesis: My guess is that among the oak chips there was some wood
that had been in contact with metal (perhaps one of the barrel hoops),
and what I'm seeing is a reaction between a bit of iron and the juice.
Does this make sense--can anyone help test, confirm, or deny my guess?
(Then, if I'm off-base, I'm back to the original question: What *IS*
this gargh?)
- ---
Dick Dunn rcd@eklektix.com -or- raven!rcd Boulder, Colorado USA
...Simpler is better.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 3 Oct 1994 09:36:48 -0500 (CDT)
From: gellym@aviion.persoft.com (brewing chemist Mitch)
Subject: Tis the season
Well, this years batch of cyser is on the way, as well as a couple of ciders.
We had our (3rd annual) club cider pressing out at our friend Mark Kessenichs
place, Moen Creek Homestead near Mt. Horeb (WI). It was the 125th annual
pressing for the press itself, a beautifully restored "Improved Buckeye"
press from 1869. It's one of those big old two stage deals, with a hopper
and grinder at one end and the screw press at the other end. It will press
almost two bushels (ground) at a time.
Anyway, the apples that my friend Bryan and myself used were all wild, about
half a dozen varieties found on local farms. The only one we could name were
some Wolf River apples. The rest, who knows. Some were small and green, like
limes almost. Some really small red tart ones (big crabapples?) some yellow,
some red, some mixed. All were wild, untreated, unsprayed, and just great. I
do not recall where it was, but at some point we saw some examples of another
Wisconsin crop, wild hemp (Wisc was a large producer of hemp back in WWI and
WWII, and apparently has proliferated throughout the years. Apparently, at
some time recently inmates at a local minimal security work farm were
discovered cultivating and drying it out ;-> ). And no, we did not harvest
any for ourselves.
Back to the cider. I have two batches going, a cider and a cyser. The syrup
that I mention was two gallons of cider cooked down to about a quart or so.
Took about two and a half hours.
The cider - 3.5 gallons
3 gallons wild cider
4 pounds light clover honey
1 cup syrup
This is fermenting under it's own power. Nothing was heated. Honey was added
raw. This one is an experiment for me, so I do not know how it will come out.
Should be nice, though.
The cyser - 6.5 gallons
5 gallons wild cider
12 pounds light clover honey
Honey was added to about 2 quarts of water to heat with. Heated to almost
simmering, skimmed, chilled, then added to the cider. I *do* have a mead
yeast culture that I was planning on pitching, but I may just let it 'go
wild' like the other cider.
Well, there's my report on cider season.
Cheers,
Mitch
- --
| - Mitch Gelly - | Zack Norman |
|software QA specialist, unix systems administrator, zymurgist,| is |
| AHA/HWBTA beer judge, & president of the Madison Homebrewers | Sammy in |
| - gellym@aviion.persoft.com - gelly@persoft.com - | Chief Zabu |
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 03 Oct 1994 15:26:14 -0500 (CDT)
From: Stephen J Butts <BUTTS@AC.GRIN.EDU>
Subject: Fall '94
Folks --
Fall is a bit early this year here in the nation's heartland, and the
apple harvest is at least two weeks ahead of schedule. Thus I've had to
get going a bit earlier than I would like to and begin fermentation at
higher temperatures than I feel is ideal. Nevertheless, I now have on
hand the must of 6 bushels of prime Wisconsin fruit, one each of Cort-
land, Melrose, Davey, Spartan, Wolf River and Cornell Sour, and will
pitch as soon as the starter quarts are going well.
The yield was 20.5 gallons from 6 bushels. The raw juice seems to have
much promise: it is intensely, even achingly sweet, which is a great im-
provement over last year's weather-induced low-sugar must (in fact, it is
far too sweet to drink as "apple juice"); it has a full, appley aroma, gobs
of apricot-like fruit flavor in addition to the basic apple taste and
substantial body. Tannin levels seem to be high, thanks to the Cornell
Sours and the Daveys, and there is a spicey, peppery edge to the flavor
that I hope will be preserved through fermentation and aging. I plan to
pitch one ale and two champagne yeast batches of 5 gallons each, saving
the rest for topping-up and perhaps some experimentation with cyser blends.
(A note to the budget-conscious: juice of this quality does not come
cheap: even buying by the bushel and filling my carboys directly at
the press, the cost of the raw juice was $5.20/gallon. On the other hand,
with some luck, at winter's end I'll have 6+ cases of a wine that cannot
be purchased in this country at any price -- at less than $1.50 per bottle.
You may not always get what you pay for, but you nearly always have to
pay for what you get.)
I would like very much to hear of blends and local conditions from others
of you who are in process at this point. So what's good this year in your
areas, and what are you doing about it?
- -- Steve Butts
BUTTS@AC.GRIN.EDU
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End of Cider Digest
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