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Info-ParaNet Newsletters Volume 1 Number 580
Info-ParaNet Newsletters Volume I Number 580
Thursday, August 13th 1992
(C) Copyright 1992 Paranet Information Service. All Rights Reserved.
Today's Topics:
Re: "OGDEN OBJECTS"
Re: "the Dancing Lights"
Phoenix Lib. Investigation
Gulf Breeze Six In The Ne
Out of DC
Let The Truth Be Told!
"The Dancing Lights"
Phoenix Project Report
Re: "The Dancing Lights"
Gulf Breeze 6
Air&space article
Roswell questionaire
DEEP THROAT?
Stanton Friedman
crop circle request
Reply from Phoenix Project
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Pete.Porro@f414.n154.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Pete Porro)
Subject: Re: "OGDEN OBJECTS"
Date: 6 Aug 92 14:58:25 GMT
You can get VUGIF and GIFDOT which are both shareware. If you have any
problems drop me a note and I'll mail you a disk full of "stuff" for viewing.
Gifdot is a shareware that allows you to print GIFs on a standard dot matrix
printer. They both will work with your setup.
--
Pete Porro - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Pete.Porro@f414.n154.z1.FIDONET.ORG
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From: Linda.Bird@f8.n1012.z9.FIDONET.ORG (Linda Bird)
Subject: Re: "the Dancing Lights"
Date: 9 Aug 92 01:01:35 GMT
Hi John,
Glad you liked the UFO story in the students' reading book. I gave the
book to someone to look at, so I don't know who the publisher is --
exactly -- but I think it was an company called "Media Publishers."
Will keep you posted. Actually, there are a couple of other UFO stories
in other reading books which I could type up, too.
Regards,
Linda
--
Linda Bird - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Linda.Bird@f8.n1012.z9.FIDONET.ORG
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From: Linda.Bird@f8.n1012.z9.FIDONET.ORG (Linda Bird)
Subject: Phoenix Lib. Investigation
Date: 9 Aug 92 01:24:17 GMT
Hi Mike,
Congrats to you and all the folks who helped to track down Hatoon and the
folks in this Phoenix Liberator organization. That was very interesting.
It also is commendable how Paranet readers helped to shed some light on
this obviously hokey group.
Everyone, please keep up the good work, and help spare ufology from the
cranks out there.
Linda
--
Linda Bird - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Linda.Bird@f8.n1012.z9.FIDONET.ORG
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From: John.Hicks@f29.n363.z1.FIDONET.ORG (John Hicks)
Subject: Gulf Breeze Six In The Ne
Date: 8 Aug 92 17:18:00 GMT
> Something's rotten in Denmark.
Rex Salisberry was talking with some of the principals back during the
incident...he's probably the best source of info.
He expressed amazement about the honorable discharges and also said he'd
never heard of anyone being discharged so quickly...
jbh
--
John Hicks - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: John.Hicks@f29.n363.z1.FIDONET.ORG
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From: Peggy.Noonan@p0.f150.n30163.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Peggy Noonan)
Subject: Out of DC
Date: 9 Aug 92 22:20:00 GMT
>Names: just be glad you're not in Washington right now; you'd
>probably be out of work in November anyway. (hehe)
That's for sure! But I wondered when I heard Sir George of Bush
speaking on the news recently -- he used that great line about the
KGB -- if my alter-ego is in fact writing punchy witticisms for him
after all. Well, maybe she needs to cash in on the $$ while it's
still possible!
--
Peggy Noonan - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Peggy.Noonan@p0.f150.n30163.z1.FIDONET.ORG
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From: Brent.Wilcox@f100.n1010.z9.FIDONET.ORG (Brent Wilcox)
Subject: Let The Truth Be Told!
Date: 9 Aug 92 13:34:00 GMT
>>Well, you really have to read the whole thing to get the full
>>impact of it. It starts with Friedman defending Anderson against
>>charges (that Anderson is full of BS) articulated by Thomas J. Carey
>>in a previous issue of _IUR_:
Thanks. I get the picture. Unfortunately, it's an oft-duplicated
picture.
* JABBER v1.1 #55 *
--
Brent Wilcox - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Brent.Wilcox@f100.n1010.z9.FIDONET.ORG
--------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Brent.Wilcox@f100.n1010.z9.FIDONET.ORG (Brent Wilcox)
Subject: "The Dancing Lights"
Date: 9 Aug 92 13:34:00 GMT
>> Anyway, I think it is interesting that stories of UFO's are
>>popping up in literature for children.
It is interesting that it's in children's literature. On the other
hand, I'd read a couple of Adamski's books and a whole slew of Frank
Edwards' "Stranger Than Fiction" stuff by the time I was in 7th
Grade.
* JABBER v1.1 #55 *
--
Brent Wilcox - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Brent.Wilcox@f100.n1010.z9.FIDONET.ORG
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From: Jim.Speiser@f100.n1010.z9.FIDONET.ORG (Jim Speiser)
Subject: Phoenix Project Report
Date: 9 Aug 92 21:03:00 GMT
Mike (or whoever uploaded the Phoenix Project Report):
Nice job, gang. But my copy of the report seems to have been cut short. I missed
whatever happened after you traced it back to Richard Miller. Am I the only one
on the net who got short-changed?
Jim
* OLX 2.1 TD * Vote for Clinton - Advanced Civilizations Can't be Wrong
--
Jim Speiser - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Jim.Speiser@f100.n1010.z9.FIDONET.ORG
--------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Linda.Bird@f100.n1010.z9.FIDONET.ORG (Linda Bird)
Subject: Re: "The Dancing Lights"
Date: 10 Aug 92 06:43:00 GMT
HI Brent,
Thanks for reply on my posted story, "The Dancing Lights." Funny how
kids are: I also read some books by Frank Edwards when I was in about
the 7th grade, and some of them scared the bejeepers out of me. Of
course, I didn't know if they were really true or not, but I liked the
books anyway.
Then I forgot all about the paranormal for Y E A R S, until just a
couple of years ago. Maybe I'm having my second childhood....
Take care, and watch out for that Moving Earth over there.
Linda
--
Linda Bird - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Linda.Bird@f100.n1010.z9.FIDONET.ORG
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From: Michael.Corbin@p0.f428.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Michael Corbin)
Subject: Gulf Breeze 6
Date: 10 Aug 92 07:52:01 GMT
* Forwarded from "Fidonet UFO Conference"
* Originally from Bob Dunn
* Originally dated 08-01-92 04:15
JH> They were moved from Pensacola to another Army base, then rather quickly
JH>discharged from the Army with no charges. At least a couple of them returned
JH>to Gulf Breeze.
JH> One of the group, a self-appointed spokesman, said that the reason they
JH>went AWOL had nothing at all to do with UFOs.
JH> The message was published in local newspapers, and while it may have been
JH>for real, it just as well may have been a hoax and really meaningless.
JH> The group _appears_ to have been sort of an end-of-the-world cult and
JH>believed that the end was near and that there was no reason for them to
JH>remain at their posts. No real connection with UFOs has been established
JH>other than the fact that they went to Gulf Breeze. Supposedly they'd
JH>intended to go out west but got arrested before they could leave.
(Sorry for the late reply) Vallee said they were heading for New
Mexico for a "rendezvous with a spaceship". And according to the
Tacoma News Tribune article of 06/08/92 entitled "Amid denials,
Pentagon still is riding herd on some UFOs", two of the men stopped in
Tennessee and borrowed a van from their friend Stan Johnson and told
him they were heading to Gulf Breeze to "meet their friends and
witness the landing of a spaceship."
The article goes on to say that the newspaper filed an FOIA request
for the files on the case and were told by the Pentagon that they
"couldn't find the records". They filed another FOIA and this time the
Pentagon admitted to having hundreds of pages of documents on the
case - but they're all classified. They finally managed to track down
one of the men involved and asked him if Pentagon UFO secrets led him
to go AWOL, he told them, "I'm not going to answer anything".
Personally, I think the "end-of-the-world cult" thing was a cover
story. These men saw something in Augsburg that caused them to believe
that a UFO was going to land in Gulf Breeze.
* OLX 2.1 TD * "I'll be Bach!" -- Johann Sebastian Schwarzenegger
--
Michael Corbin - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Michael.Corbin@p0.f428.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG
--------------------------------------------------------------------
From: John.Powell@f601.n109.z1.FIDONET.ORG (John Powell)
Subject: Air&space article
Date: 9 Aug 92 11:00:10 GMT
-=> Quoting Ncar!violet.berkeley.edu! to All <=-
Nc> The August/September 1992 issue of AIR&SPACE magazine, published
Nc> by the Smithsonian Aerospace Museum, carries an article called
Nc> 'Aliens in the Basement' about Wright-Patterson Air Force Base
Nc> and the legend that captured EBE's and UFO's have been stored and
Nc> studied there (pp 34-49). The author is Frank Kuznik and the
Nc> photographer, Lee Battaglia.
I saw it, cute article, see below.
Did you also, same magazine, see this tiny bit:
"From 'Suggestions for Anticipating Requests Under the Freedom
of Information Act,' an undated and unsigned NASA document obtained by
Congressman Howard Wolpe of Michigan last winter (...):
"At the conclusion of meetings or at the end of the day review
your notes and consider whether you really need to retain them. If you
do, take time to rewrite them in such a way as to minimize any adverse
impact should they be publically disclosed. Then destroy your old
notes.
"...since there is no obligation under [FOIA] to provide
documents in any particular order or relationship to each other,
furnishing out of context copies of stick-ons [...] can render any
information released significantly less meaningful. In this regard,
printing rather than writing in script also generally makes it harder to
assign authorship (and context) to a particular note or document.
"Attempt to make each document... stand alone. Avoid cross
references to other documents that can lend context to a document and
thereby enhance its informational value should it ultimately be
disclosed."
Nc> There are no surprises in this piece, but it's interesting
Nc> reading, especially about the 'super-secret Foreign Technology
Nc> center.' The author also speculates that what may have been
Nc> covered up in New Mexico in 1947 was the crash of B-29 carrying
Nc> an atomic bomb.
Your comments here are interesting for two reasons. First, the crash of
a B-52 carrying an atomic bomb might have, only just maybe, required the
suffocating secrecy that was implemented _at the time_, but this type of
event _would not_ have required that exact same secrecy to remain in
place without alteration for 45 years _after the fact_.
Secondly, it is _not_ the author who speculates on the possibility of a
crash of a B-29, which _may_ have had onboard as _cargo_ an atomic bomb,
(which, _as cargo_, could not possibly have created a thermonuclear
explosion, or a significant explosion of any variety), it is in fact,
"an anonymous high-placed military source..." This "retired Air Force
officer I met while touring Wright-Patterson who is, alas, still in a
position too sensitive to allow his name to be used" was the alleged
individual who suggested that "knowing Air Force history like I do, and
how hush-hush the 509th was, I just set it in my mind that they must
have crashed one with a nuke that came close to going off..."
Of course, this is patently absurd. There is no such thing as "close to
going off" - it was either armed or it wasn't. If it was armed then it
would have reduced the habitable acreage of our country by almost one
state and if it wasn't armed then it would have done no more damage than
that of an ordinary airplane crash in the desert. Except for, at least,
one small detail - the crash site would still be clearly and easily
detectable with a geiger counter, and it isn't.
"Aliens in the Basement" by Frank Kuznik, Air &
Space/Smithsonian, ISSN 0886-2257, Smithsonian Institution,
900 Jefferson Drive, Washington, DC 20560. $18/yr.
Thanks, take care.
John.
-
<Absence of Evidence is not Evidence of Absence>
___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.10
--
John Powell - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: John.Powell@f601.n109.z1.FIDONET.ORG
--------------------------------------------------------------------
From: John.Powell@f601.n109.z1.FIDONET.ORG (John Powell)
Subject: Roswell questionaire
Date: 9 Aug 92 06:54:12 GMT
I got this survey with some recent stuff from FUFOR. If you want to
save 29 cents then reply it back to me and I'll forward it anonymously
to FUFOR.
___--------------------------------------------------------------------------
ROSWELL SURVEY
I have read or viewed the following (check whichever applies):
______ _The Roswell Incident_ by Charles Berlitz and William L. Moore.
______ _UFO Crash at Roswell_ by Kevin D. Randle and Donald R. Schmitt.
______ "Recollections of Roswell" (25-minute videotape released in
October 1990); Fred Whiting (ed.)
______ _The Roswell Report: A Historical Perspective_; George
Eberhart (ed.)
______ "Recollections of Roswell - Part 2" (105-minute videotape
released in April 1992); Fred Whiting (ed.)
______ _The Plains of San Agustin Controversy_; George Eberhart (ed.)
______ _Crash at Corona_ by Stanton Friedman and Don Berliner.
Please check the appropriate column which most closely matches
your attitude about the following statements:
DON'T
TRUE FALSE KNOW
At Least one UFO crashed in New Mexico
in 1947. ______ ______ ______
A UFO crashed near Corona in July 1947. ______ ______ ______
Alien bodies were recovered from the
Corona crash. ______ ______ ______
A UFO crashed on the Plains of San
Agustin in July 1947. ______ ______ ______
Alien bodies were recovered from the
crash on the Plains. ______ ______ ______
Gerald Anderson witnessed a crashed
UFO and alien bodied on the Plains. ______ ______ ______
(FUFOR, Fund for UFO Research, PO Box 277, Mt. Rainier, MD 20712)
___--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Thanks, take care.
John.
-
<Absence of Evidence is not Evidence of Absence>
___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.10
--
John Powell - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: John.Powell@f601.n109.z1.FIDONET.ORG
--------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Jim.Speiser@f100.n1010.z9.FIDONET.ORG (Jim Speiser)
Subject: DEEP THROAT?
Date: 10 Aug 92 07:58:00 GMT
I am interested in any information regarding an individual code-named
"GREY GHOST," said to be a renegade disinformation agent-turned-Deep Throat.
Reputed to be operating out of the Albuquerque area. Any information or
anecdotes regarding this individual would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks,
Jim
* OLX 2.1 TD * A ParaNet Point System - Excellence in Ufology since 1986
--
Jim Speiser - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Jim.Speiser@f100.n1010.z9.FIDONET.ORG
--------------------------------------------------------------------
From: bcstec.ca.boeing.com!kuryakin
Subject: Stanton Friedman
Date: 10 Aug 92 17:30:23 GMT
From: kuryakin@bcstec.ca.boeing.com (Rick Pavek)
It sounds like John Burke has a personal axe to grind. Is that true
John?
One article does not necessarily make the world turn upside down...
I listened to Stanton in Portland last year and he quite methodically
went through the documents, their claims of authenticity, their claims of
forgery, and went on to debunk the claims of forgery.
+From what I hear, attacks on Stanton are the result of a personal difference
of opinion.
I think everyone has a right to be heard and the bickering like this
only detracts from the field as a whole. At least he doesn't 'channel'
or do other dubious performance art.
Rick
--------------------------------------------------------------------
From: bcstec.ca.boeing.com!kuryakin
Subject: crop circle request
Date: 10 Aug 92 23:18:00 GMT
From: kuryakin@bcstec.ca.boeing.com (Rick Pavek)
It's a long shot, but...
Does anyone remember when the two gentlemen confessed to creating the
crop circles that there was a posting that detailed why these two
gentlemen did NOT create all the crop circles? While they may (and likely
did) create some of them the physical signs on their circles and other
circles were different? Primarily, the difference was that on the
circles they created the stalks were broken and on others they weren't.
I'm looking for the refutation and the posting thread that both detailed
why they were probably government plants and the thread where the physical
effects of 'authentic' crop circles were distinguished from the 'hoax'
circles.
Of course, if someone could simply address this as an original question,
that would be fine, also.
Thanks, Rick
Rick Pavek | Never ask a droid to outdo its program.
kuryakin@bcstec.boeing.com |
AppleLink: kuryakin | It wastes your time
r.pavek1@GENIE | and annoys the droid.
--------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Michael.Corbin@p0.f428.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Michael Corbin)
Subject: Reply from Phoenix Project
Date: 11 Aug 92 04:03:01 GMT
Below is a three-part response from the Phoenix Project responding to our
recent report on an investigation of that group. We are re-printing it for
everyone's perusal. In the meantime, we are preparing a response to the
material, as everyone will notice, it is verbose and does not address any of
the issues raised in our report. Enjoy!!
(1054) Mon 10 Aug 92 3:32p Rcvd: Mon 10 Aug 7:43p
By: Uucp, ParaNet(sm) Information Servi (104/422)
To: Michael Corbin
Re: Phoenix Project Response
St: Pvt Kill Rcvd
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
* Original: TO ... Michael Corbin of 1:104/422
* ReDirected Using ReDirect Version 1.00 (C)1989 David Nugent
>From scicom!ncar!compuserve.com!72730.3636
From: 72730.3636@CompuServe.COM (Jack L Mathias)
To: ">INTERNET:Michael.Corbin@f428.n104.z1.fidonet.org"
<Michael.Corbin@f428.n104.z1.fidonet.org>
Date: 10 Aug 92 13:51:01 EDT
Distribution: To All
To: Michael Corbin - ParaNet Information Service
From: The Phoenix Project
Via Jack Mathias
Date: 08/10/92
Re: Your recent message concerning the Phoenix Project
Until your initial response to our release of the Dulce and K2
Reports this organization would have treated you and ParaNet with
the common courtesy and respect due any serious researcher.
However, your spontaneous and instant negative reaction to our
reports caused us to reconsider.
Let us review the facts. You reacted by issuing a public warning
to the members of ParaNet, which was also widely distributed via
other BBS's nation-wide. That warning contained language which
implied the information, and the source, were highly suspect.
Thus, single-handedly, you created a strong impression throughout
the UFO community, that our information was false. Many sincere
people, trusting your qualifications, accepted your warning.
Tell us Mr. Corbin, how did you arrive at that almost instantaneous
conclusion? The conclusion that the information contained in the
Dulce Report was highly suspect and possibly false? At the time,
all you had in your possession was the first part of the Report
that we released to various BBS's. You did not have any of the
exhibits or supporting documents contained in the second part of
the Report - information, that was only available in printed form.
You had not seen or had any opportunity to review the support
documents.
Let's face it, Michael - you blew it. The sequence of events, and
the timing of your response, are the facts. The rest is self-
evident. You took it upon yourself to make a snap judgement
without examining the evidence. Is this the way that you evaluate
all new information? It is difficult for us to believe that the
ParaNet Organization would approve or condone such behavior on your
part. Your actions are not what one would expect from an
individual occupying a leadership position in the UFO research
community, or ParaNet. You abused your position of trust and
responsibility.
In your message, you mention that you wrote to the Phoenix Project,
after the fact and your preliminary judgement, requesting further
information. You made the same comment in other BBS messages. You
state that we did not respond to your request. You also imply, by
insinuation, that this is a mark against us and a further
indication that we are suspect. Let us give this further
clarification. After being informed that you had written us, we
checked our mail daily, looking for your letter. To date we have
not received your letter of inquiry. Apparently, of all the mail
we receive, your letter is the only one that has gone astray. We
can only conclude that is was either lost in the mail or you didn't
mail it. Did it ever occur to you to mail us a second request,
when you did not receive a response to your first inquiry? Most
people would do so.
But, this was not the end of your attitude problem regarding the
Phoenix Project. You did the same thing, again, issuing warnings,
etc., with our release of the K-2 and the Ultimate Secret Reports.
And, again, you had not seen or examined the supporting documents
at the time you issued those warnings to ParaNet and the public.
The first time was inexcusable, but the second and third time?
Are you trying to set a new record for prejudice? Again, long
after the fact, you admit that someone provided you with the
supporting documents concerning K-2 and the Ultimate Secret. You
also state, that you didn't notice anything of significance in
those documents - and, you continue to issue messages containing
warnings. Would we be out of line in concluding that your mind was
already made-up? Fortunately, for the UFO Movement, other
investigators and researchers don't share your opinion.
You state in your initial message that "much of the information in
the Dulce Report about Dulce and the Archuleta Mesa contradicts
information already provided to ParaNet by other capable
investigators." What information? Who provided it? How did you
determine its validity? We formally request access to that
information. We'd like to examine it ourselves. Can we obtain
copies of "that" information?
Now, let us get to the main thrust of your message - your
investigation to reveal the personnel of the Phoenix Project.
Congratulations Mr. Corbin. You've just won the Golden Fleece
Award for outstanding ineptness in your investigation of the
Phoenix Project. Your efforts thus far indicate a degree of
amateur sleuthing more in line with that of a Cub Reporter trying
to get a job on the staff of The Daily Sentinel. True to form
(notable in many self-centered and Godly UFO Organizations) and
lacking any real expertise, let alone concrete evidence, your
message reveals what purports to be the results of your
investigation into the Phoenix Project. The result: a conclusion
based on quote - "coincidences that are striking and suggestive."
That's it? -- Come now, do you expect us, or anyone else with a
sound mind, to be impressed?
How could anyone fail to note that there is no mention of any hard
evidence or anything resembling same. Could we all be wrong as to
what constitutes legitimate evidence? Or do you make that
determination, as well?
Seated upon your starry throne you seem to have elected yourself to
be the final arbiter of the truth concerning the information
revealed by the Phoenix Project, assuming the role of Judge, Jury
and Executioner in a Kangaroo Court Proceeding of your own
fashioning and design. Somewhere out there, there must be others
that are just as impressed by this demonstration of arm-chair
expertise and power, as we are. The results of your "so-called"
investigation would be laughable if anyone ignored the tragic
implications of what it reveals.
What, if anything, is the Phoenix Project guilty of? Is it the
fact that we dared to question and investigate two of the sacred
cows of UFO-dom namely the ones you mentioned, i.e., "underground
alien bases, and the cluster of government projects referred to
collectively as Operation Majestic Twelve?" Where did we ever get
the silly idea that revealing the truth about these topics was the
objective we are all seeking? Did we miss an important briefing?
According to our sources within the intelligence community, the
Dulce Scam, perpetrated by the disinformation specialists of MAJI,
better known to you as Majestic Twelve with help from the CIA and
NSA, is considered one of their most brilliant success stories.
Only Project Redlight comes close to achieving the same degree of
success.
--
Michael Corbin - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Michael.Corbin@p0.f428.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG
*******************************************************************************
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*********************End**of**the**InfoPara**Newsletter************************
