Copy Link
Add to Bookmark
Report
Info-ParaNet Newsletters Volume 1 Number 118
Info-ParaNet Newsletters, Number 118
Monday, January 1st 1990
Today's Topics:
Re: Lazar And His Amazing Saucers
Re: Lazar And His Amazing Saucers
Re: Elders
UFO1 photo
A few questions
Re: Elders
UFO Mark Jose
Re: A few questions
Re: elders
Re: Elders??
Re: Elders
HAPPY NEW YEAR!
Congressional Amnesty
Star of Bethlehem
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: paranet!p0.f422.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG!Robert.Lee
Subject: Re: Lazar And His Amazing Saucers
Date: 30 Dec 89 22:26:00 GMT
Jim,
You may have hit on something here with just what "kind" of scientist
would cover this UFO phenomenon and "what kind" of discipline the
individual should be in (and which subset of which discipline, too).
You bring up a good point about funding. It would appear that it is
not likely that federal funding for such a study would be very easily
gotten and, if the funding were private, then much could be said about
bias, etc. This is the problem of the "Catch 22" in the area. It is
not "real" until it is "real" and it is not studied until it is "real"
and it is not "real" until it is studied. Even if "a crashed saucer"
were discovered, it would be likely the case that it would not initiate
a new discipline as the finding would not fit into the current general
framework of the scientific zeitgeist/weltanschaung; hence the thing
would be "invisible" (not studied well) because it could not be
perceived (not fitted into the weltanschaung).
Very good points. It could be a problem not ammenable to scientific
investigation unless or until someone with a very highly repsected
scientific background blazes a new trail. Thus the area of UFOlogy is
more one of epistemology at this time; what might (MIGHT) help to open
the door is to have a number of scientists (probably in Astrophysics or
Extra Terrestrial Biology) establish a "paradigm" in which the
phenomenon could be subsumed into some current scientific area.
--
Robert Lee - via FidoNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Robert.Lee@p0.f422.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG
--------------------------------------------------------------------
From: paranet!p0.f422.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG!Robert.Lee
Subject: Re: Lazar And His Amazing Saucers
Date: 30 Dec 89 22:40:00 GMT
I, again, think Bryon that a good solid researched-based foundation is
critical to this type of pursuit. Specifically, what is needed (if
there is such to be found) is either valid scientific reports of
recovery of giants (in numbers so as to exclude the possibility of a
mutant) OR the actual recovery of the remains of said giant. Once
recovered then a number of scientific tests could be conducted on the
genetic code of such remains. I believe it is important, critical,
that evidence (if any there is (which is unknown)) must be objective,
physical, and observable. That is science.
--
Robert Lee - via FidoNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Robert.Lee@p0.f422.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG
--------------------------------------------------------------------
From: paranet!p0.f422.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG!Robert.Lee
Subject: Re: Elders
Date: 30 Dec 89 22:55:00 GMT
Thank you, Ray, for your reply to my questions. I will be looking
forward to any more information you can give me. I am particularly
interested in these Elders. Can you tell me how it is that you have
come to know about these Elders? Thanks.
--
Robert Lee - via FidoNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Robert.Lee@p0.f422.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG
--------------------------------------------------------------------
From: paranet!p0.f422.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG!Paul.Carr
Subject: UFO1 photo
Date: 31 Dec 89 04:05:00 GMT
I recently downloaded a GIF format file from
the Paranet Archives library called UFO1. This
strikes me as a good image of the classic
'flying saucer' or 'daylight disk'. Can anyone give
me some background on this photograph - i.e. who,
where, when, and results of analyses? I am always
hearing that there's not one decent photograph of a
UFO. Is this the counterexample I was looking for?
"Carr@Astro.DNet.GE.com"
--
Paul Carr - via FidoNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Paul.Carr@p0.f422.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG
--------------------------------------------------------------------
From: paranet!f37.n114.z1.FIDONET.ORG!Jim.Speiser
Subject: A few questions
Date: 30 Dec 89 09:32:00 GMT
Gene:
You raise some good points. My main problems with Lazar are: 1) He is
conveniently fuzzy on such important details as the atomic weight of
115, the frequency of the gravity-wave mechanism, etc. 2) He mentions a
badge with MAJ-12 on it, and says his clearance was MAJESTIC. First,
MJ-12 has been thoroughly discredited in my mind (but then, maybe that
was the point...!) Second, even if its real, I just don't think the
clearances work that way. Why would a grunt scientist have the same
clearance level as the head of the NSC, and other higher-ups? There
would most assuredly be super-compartmentalization at Lazar's level. 3)
Although he talks SOMETHING like a scientist, I'm not overly impressed
with his grasp of basic scientific concepts. Don't ask me why...I'm no
scientist myself, but I know what they sound like. 4) He says they
showed the flask of 115 on the KLAS interview, and a couple of days
later it was stolen. Well, isn't that special. What would YOU have done
after showing Uncle Sam and untold thousands of people that you are in
possession of the rarest, most secret, and most dangerous substance on
earth? The words "Safety Deposit Box" come to mind....
Still, this is the damnedest UFO story yet, and I'm loving every minute
of it. I'm also wondering who's behind it. I strongly doubt your idea
that its just fantasy-fulfillment for Lazar. There's just too much to
it.
Jim
--
Jim Speiser - via FidoNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Jim.Speiser@f37.n114.z1.FIDONET.ORG
--------------------------------------------------------------------
From: paranet!p0.f422.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG!Clark.Matthews
Subject: Re: Elders
Date: 31 Dec 89 07:02:00 GMT
Hello, Ray, and Happy New Year!
If you don't mind and interjection here, I wonder if you've read Jacques
Vallee's book "Dimensions"? If so (or even if "no"), how would you compare
the "Elders" you write of with similar beings described by Vallee in his
historical section. A few examples of the "Elementals" who have figured in
alchemy and prophesy in the last 3000 years:
*Sylphs, as described by Paracelsus (ca. 1250 AD)
*Nymphs & Sprites (preclassical Southern Europe)
*Nostradamus' "Visitors" (ca. 1370 AD)
*Trolls/Niebelungs -- Germano-Celtic, preclassical
*The "Shee" -- Britano-Celtic, preclassical
*D'jinn -- Arabic & Persian (?), classical
I wonder if you've read any of Erica Cheetham's excellent translations of
Nostradamus' "Centuries"? He claimed to be able to summon these beings by
staring into a kettle of water set under a tripod.
The 64-dollar question: Can you do so likewise?
Best,
Clark
--
Clark Matthews - via FidoNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Clark.Matthews@p0.f422.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG
--------------------------------------------------------------------
From: paranet!f401.n30163.z1.FIDONET.ORG!Mark.Jose
Subject: UFO Mark Jose
Date: 31 Dec 89 18:32:00 GMT
Hello all.
I have a few questions that, maybe, someone can answer.
1. There was a matron from a Gippsland (a geographical region of
South-Eastern Victoria, Aust.) hospital who was on one of the highways
when she noticed a light behind her. Eventually the light caught her,
her car stalled and she was held in a shaft of light for a few minutes
before the light disappeared (along with the craft).
2. There was a multiple sighting of ufo(s) in Boianai, New Guinea.
This sighting involved an Anglican priest and various natives that
were at the mission. It lasted quite a while with the "aliens"
actually coming out and standing on top of their crafts.
I would say most people have heard of it, but has anybody got any
detailed accounts of what went on.
3. An encounter occurred between a pilot flying from Canberra (Aust's
Capital) to Nowra (coastal town of New South Wales). The pilot was
passing over Goulburn when two "objects" approached him. These were
"identified" as unidentified objects. He informed the Nowra radar
operator who also saw them. He stated that they approached the
aircraft then stayed with it before going north and disappearing off
the screen in seconds.
If anybody has heard of these accounts or can direct me to some reference
material concerning them, I would be much appreciative.
Regards,
Mark.
--
Mark Jose - via FidoNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Mark.Jose@f401.n30163.z1.FIDONET.ORG
--------------------------------------------------------------------
From: paranet!p0.f37.n114.z1.FIDONET.ORG!Jim.Delton
Subject: Re: A few questions
Date: 31 Dec 89 08:15:00 GMT
You echoed my sentiments almost exactly. Who in their right mind would
go to the trouble to steal a bit of the most important material in the
WORLD (115) and then just leave it lying around for someone to steal?
How could he possibly not recall the atomic weight or the frequency,
even approximately? Just for kicks I took a quick stroll thru my old
intro to physics book from many years ago. It was an eye opener
looking thru all the rather detailed and complicated integral and
differentiation equations required to just put together an intro text
yet Lazar gives me the impression he barely has even that much of a
background. I am getting the distinct impression that we are dealing
with a deluded technician trying to pass himself off as something more.
I also was amazed at the references to MJ12 and majestic, made almost
in passing. Hard to imagine that in his discussions to date with the
likes of Lear, that he hadn't heard of the MJ 12 business and become
much more aware of the potential significance of it. I was also
confused (maybe I read it too fast) by him saying at one point how he
got down under the saucer and as a result he was away for the guards
that were always around but later when aske what the bottom of the
saucer looked like he said he didn't know, he'sd never seen one from
the bottom. He seems to be exceoptionally carefull not to be very
specific about anything that could be checked up on.
--
Jim Delton - via FidoNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Jim.Delton@p0.f37.n114.z1.FIDONET.ORG
--------------------------------------------------------------------
From: paranet!p0.f37.n114.z1.FIDONET.ORG!Jim.Delton
Subject: Re: elders
Date: 31 Dec 89 08:19:00 GMT
Still at your little game I see. Wouldn't do to make any predictions
of national events would it; might actually pin you down to something
checkable.
--
Jim Delton - via FidoNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Jim.Delton@p0.f37.n114.z1.FIDONET.ORG
--------------------------------------------------------------------
From: paranet!p0.f19.n19.z1.FIDONET.ORG!Ray.Griffin
Subject: Re: Elders??
Date: 31 Dec 89 21:26:00 GMT
It seems that I have a mysterious programmer in my system. I saw some
messages that were garbled to you and Jim Delton, and I didn't send one
to him. As for you, I sent another message later. Let me know if you
don't get it.
--
Ray Griffin - via FidoNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Ray.Griffin@p0.f19.n19.z1.FIDONET.ORG
--------------------------------------------------------------------
From: paranet!p0.f19.n19.z1.FIDONET.ORG!Ray.Griffin
Subject: Re: Elders
Date: 1 Jan 90 01:37:00 GMT
Thanks and Happy New year to you. To answer your questions Yes- to
Nostr' and Vallee. No to the other author. As to the Elders, I used
that term many years ago, and did not know that it had been prev
previously used. The term came about because of personal experience
which best fit my understanding at the time, not because they
introduced themselves as such. For many years, I considered them to be
a figment of my imagination. What's real anyway? It is the reason that
I do some of the experiments which I do. I need an outside observer. As
to the Vallee possibilities, if they are Ultra-intelligent enery, they
wouldn't have to be from another Universe. As to what I can and can't
do, let's say I wouldn't be sticking my neck out if there wasn't some
possibility of success. Before, someone asks, let me tell you this. For
almost twenty years, I was a field engineer for Hewlett-Packard. The
Gulf Breeze UFO flap plus other strange stories over the years, and
some shoddy checking ( investigating ) by some investigators , I
believe, cost me my job. I have no interest in money, and haven't given
references so it doesn't matter to a lot who should be interested. I
ask only one question. The intentions of the Ultra-intelligence? I know
it exists and have proved it to my satisfaction, and many others, but
this isn't a political campaign. Sometimes the best solution is to
observe not vote. In addition, I'll share this with you. Since, I
believe that my personal life has had a mysterious guiding over the
years, I believe that some recent happenings weren't chance happenings.
Therefore, unless the Ultra-whatever's want me to cooperate in the
future they had better not leave me out on a limb, otherwise I will
have an excuse to bail-out. I believe the problem is just working out
the details however. So don't just accept what I'm saying, if I can't
produce that's the way it should be, but remember we are playing by
their rules. RG
--
Ray Griffin - via FidoNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Ray.Griffin@p0.f19.n19.z1.FIDONET.ORG
--------------------------------------------------------------------
From: paranet!p0.f26.n123.z1.FIDONET.ORG!John.Komar
Subject: HAPPY NEW YEAR!
Date: 1 Jan 90 02:53:00 GMT
I wish everyone a HAPPY NEW YEAR!.
May the UFO situation be resolved!
Regards, John Komar
--
John Komar - via FidoNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: John.Komar@p0.f26.n123.z1.FIDONET.ORG
--------------------------------------------------------------------
From: paranet!f1.n304.z1.FIDONET.ORG!T.s..Bennett
Subject: Congressional Amnesty
Date: 31 Dec 89 23:32:34 GMT
I dont blame anyone for sticking with known theory,
known books, playing it safe, etc. This is standard
skeptical procedure for people who dont want to take
chances. Dont get me wrong, this is not a flame, just an
explanation of the state of the inquiry. There are always
"conservatives", and "liberals" in any discussion.
I'm willing to take risks, my mind goes toward the more
sketchy scenario of NEW PHYSICS. This allows for new forms
of propulsion, i.e. drive systems in new vehicles that
permit them to "fly"
There is enough circumstantial evidence surrounding UFOs
today, that if we could get it into a court of law, subpoena
witnesses, gather evidence that is currently withheld, we
could definitely "PROVE" it!
I find it foolish in the extreme to enter into "red
herring" discussions about Lazar's pay stubs, educational
background, ad infinitum! Such straw dogs keep us from the
REAL POINT which is coming up at the bottom of this message.
It doesn't really matter if Lazar is authentic or not,
if one has an open mind and follows his line of reasoning,
it becomes obvious that either he is telling the truth and
cant prove it, or has projected his own scientific thinking
into the future in a logical and straightforward way.
The configuration of the saucer "drive system" and the
possible existence on this Earth of "heavy element 115" that
is said to fuel it are no more science fiction today than a
transistor radio would have been to somebody in 1931. If
saucers and element 115 exist on Earth at this time, the
people need to be informed. If the people are informed, that
will effectively stifle the current research being done
trying to create horrific killing weapons with this material
and open the discussion to a more positive direction helpful
to man.
BOTTOM LINE: If Lazar is telling the truth, the people
in charge think that they can stifle him, and/or he will
fade into UFO mythology as some have said, and there
certainly would be no point and it would be STUPID in the
extreme for the government to prosecute him for telling
secrets! Cause then we would know wouldn't we?
With Lazar telling the truth, that means there are
others who would come forward backing up his story, and
telling stories of their own if there was a ground swell of
support from the public, and PROTECTION FROM PROSECUTION BY
WAY OF CONGRESSIONAL AMNESTY! Lazar was subjected to fear
tactics, and serious brain washing to keep him from coming
forward with any story. We can assume that there are others
who know and have "seen things", that are seriously afraid
for their lives, or generally fearful of doing jail time.
There is a movement afoot that will emanate from the
January 7th "Special VIP Panel" in Las Vegas, put together
by Billy Goodman. A guy who's name escapes me will pass out
petition forms to be taken to everybody's home towns and
signed by members of the public, and then gathered together
and presented to Congress that will provide amnesty for
anyone in government employ to come forward with anecdotal
or material evidence of technology from another
civilization/star system that is currently being held
secret!
--
T.s. Bennett - via FidoNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: T.s..Bennett@f1.n304.z1.FIDONET.ORG
--------------------------------------------------------------------
From: paranet!p0.f102.n268.z1.FIDONET.ORG!Paul.Faeder
Subject: Star of Bethlehem
Date: 31 Dec 89 19:38:22 GMT
Christmas star: Close encounter of planetary kind?
Penn State U. News Bureau
Was the star that led the three Wise Men to Christ's birthplace a myth,
a planetary close encounter, a comet, a nova, or an actual new star?
Although astronomers don't agree and theories exist to support each
answer, Dr. Louis Winkler assistant professor of astronomy at Penn State,
thinks one theory shines above the rest.
Winkler, who has an interest in the history of astronomy, said the theory
offered by David Hughes of the University of Sheffield about a decade ago
"satisfies the biblical data much better than any other."
That theory maintains that the Christmas Star was actually a series of
three close encounters, or conjunctions, of Saturn and Jupiter in which
those planets appeared to be moving backward for several weeks simultaneously
in the sky.
Winkler said single conjunctions of Saturn and Jupiter occur about
every 20 years and have, historically, been considered important events
by astrologers who believe that they portend significant events in human
existence.
However triple conjunctions are exceedingly rare, said Winkler, although
one did occur in 7 B.C., the year many historians believe was the actual
year of Christ's birth.
If the Wise Men were following the triple conjunction of 7 B.C., what
they would have seen in the night sky was Saturn and Jupiter shining
brightly together much closer than usual. The planets would have risen
in the East and gradually made their way across the vault of the sky to
set in the West over a six month period. However, for weeks during
their progress toward the West, the planets would have appeared to
temporarily go backward. Winkler says, "The planets were not actually
going in a backward direction, but their unusual position opposite the
sun would have made it appear that way to the Wise Men as they looked
relative to the background stars."
Winkler says the conjunction satisfies the biblical data that the star
was seen in the East and appeared to stand over Jerusalem as the Wise Men
followed it West.
"Many people think the Star of Bethlehem was a comet. However, if it
were a comet the astrologers of 2000 years ago would not have been able to
anticipate it and the comet would not have been perceived as returning.
The astrologers would have been able to predict a conjunction of Saturn
and Jupiter and the Bible says the Star was "anticipated" and that it
"returned"."
--
Paul Faeder - via FidoNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Paul.Faeder@p0.f102.n268.z1.FIDONET.ORG
********To have your comments in the next issue, send electronic mail to********
'infopara' at the following address:
UUCP {ncar,isis,boulder}!scicom!infopara
DOMAIN infopara@scicom.alphacdc.com
ADMIN Address infopara-request@scicom.alphacdc.com
{ncar,isis,boulder}!scicom!infopara-request
******************The**End**of**Info-ParaNet**Newsletter************************
