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Info-ParaNet Newsletters Volume 1 Number 102
Info-ParaNet Newsletters, Number 102
Friday, December 15th 1989
Today's Topics:
Lazar/115
Re: Project Blue Book - Aka A Govt Coverup
Re: The State Of Events
Some comments on Info-ParaNet
Re: Klass *has* visited UFO sites!
CUFORN NEWSLETTER
Re: The Closest Encounter
Lazar/Area51
Information
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From: chalmers@violet.berkeley.edu (John H. Chalmers Jr.)
Subject: Lazar/115
Date: 14 Dec 89 16:41:19 GMT
Is there any independent confirmation that a nuclear explosion occurred
in the atmosphere in 1986 as Lazar claims? The signature of such a blast
if due to 115 would be completly different from a fission or fusion
explosion. there would be no fission products from an antimatter explosion
an dprobably much less induced radioactivity. Is athere any data on this
supposed event in Nevada. Try the anti-nuke or environmetal groups.
--John
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From: paranet!f630.n283.z1.FIDONET.ORG!James.Nannemann
Subject: Re: Project Blue Book - Aka A Govt Coverup
Date: 13 Dec 89 15:57:01 GMT
Thanks Marc,
Although this is related, this is sort of a little off the subject too,
what I'm talking about is the possible relationship between: 1) the UFOs,
2) the secret government, 3) the trilateral, 4) the computer nicknamed
"the Beast" over in Brussles, 5) the sudden flip flop of the socialist
world in how they are handling their affairs, suddenly becoming so sweet
and co-operative, all of a sudden, 6) the undercover operations now going
on in Southeast Asia, where the US is STILL working to achieve a status of
MAJOR influence, in Vietnam (with the current regime), in Cambodia (where
they are trying to re-install Prince Sihanouk back into power without the
Khmer Rouge, and in Laos.
This may all seem to be disconnected to many people, but I think that they
are all inter-related, and it seems that all of a sudden things are
developing in a way that just seems too good to be true. And When
something APPEARS too good to be true, it often is..... ESPECIALLY when
politicians of all different stripes SUDDENLY start co-operating TOO
willingly. Something smells fishy to me. VERY fishy. When is the OTHER
boot going to fall?
--
James Nannemann - via FidoNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: James.Nannemann@f630.n283.z1.FIDONET.ORG
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From: paranet!p0.f19.n19.z1.FIDONET.ORG!Bryon.Smith
Subject: Re: The State Of Events
Date: 13 Dec 89 17:02:00 GMT
In a message to Bryon Smith <12-10-89 20:28> Mac Druaidh wrote:
MD> BS} 10-4 on that. It's Witch's Sabath starting sundown the
MD> BS} 20th and lasting until sunrise on the 21st.
MD>
MD> What's the connection between Witchcraft and Satanism?
MD> From where I hail from, they're two entirely different
MD> systems. A lot of peace-loving, non-baby-killing Wiccans I
MD> know would take severe offense at such a connection.
I don't think there is any "connection" between them, other than perhaps
having some of the meetings on the same days.
I understood they didn't like each other, not even a little bit, and there
are major differences between witches and satanists, even in this area.
But I am here to tell you the Satanists do some really bizzar disgusting
things in this area and they are very active.
I don't even know what a "Wiccan" is so I certanly don't intend to
intentionally offend any of them.
...Bryon
--
Bryon Smith - via FidoNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Bryon.Smith@p0.f19.n19.z1.FIDONET.ORG
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From: boulder!utah-cs!thomson
Subject: Some comments on Info-ParaNet
Date: 14 Dec 89 20:34:19 GMT
I started reading this because I happened across a reference to it
in the Usenet newsgroup sci.space; I had been interested in UFO
phenomenon as a curiosity until Robert Hastings came to the University
of Utah to talk about UFO phenomenon from the viewpoint of government
collusion and cover-up. Taking this point of view, i.e. even if you
think "aliens" don't exist the CIA/NSA/FBI does, is much more credible
than talking about the existence of alien craft, etc. (Of course the
latter is much more interesting in a sensational way, but tends to
turn away most skeptics).
I have some comments in general on Info-ParaNet. Is this newsletter
dedicated specifically to UFO phenomenon, or are all "paranormal"
experiences under consideration. From the amount of talk on witchcraft,
satanism, etc., I'm led to believe the latter. If this is the case,
I think its important to adopt a seriously skeptical attitude towards
any "paranormal" phenomenon (in fact, I don't consider UFOlogy anything
to do with the "paranormal" [i.e. mysticism]; I think it belongs with
the unexplained more than the supernatural). If the study of UFOs is
going to be accepted seriously by anyone of a skeptical bent, then
the UFO community must do something to distance itself from the fraud-
ulently bogus events that are passed off as being "paranormal". The UFO
community, I believe, should concentrate its efforts on extracting
information out of government bureaus via FOI requests based on known
authenticated documents or USG employee testimony.
Given that the USG is bound by law to release such documents (with
certain caveats), I believe this is the best way to obtain evidence to
support the existence claim. With the accounts of people like Lazar,
one should be able to come up with a specific enough request to get
more information. Even if you can't convince people (i.e. the public)
that UFOs exist or alien technology remnants are in Area 51, etc, you
can prove through government documents that AT LEAST they aren't telling
us the whole story (or even a substantial part). I think this is the
best way to proceed. Has anyone out there done some kind of grass-roots
organizational plan for obtaining info via FOI requests? I know the
fund for UFO research has managed to obtain documents after threatening
to go to court. On the other hand, isn't there the possibility that
agencies may release information to a relatively unknown individual
more readily than to a known UFO research organization?
(as an aside, are most of the readers of this list on FidoNet?)
In issue 101, Mark Jose writes:
-+ My initial observation concerning UFO sitings seems to point to the
-+ majority of these sitings occurring in the USA.
My guess is that the USA is simply a country where this kind of
information is readily available. Remember that the US is the only
country that has a law requiring the government to release information
to the public (FOI).
-+ Why doesn't the USSR experience the same amount of sitings. [sic]
An important thing to remember is that reported sightings are not
necessarily the same as actual sightings. While Glasnost may be
providing some political freedoms in terms of free speech, I don't
think they have progressed to the point of letting people claim the
existence of UFOs loudly in public.
-+ Lastly, the idea/inference was made by Lazar that monies destined for SDI
-+ were in fact being used to fund this "secret base" in the desert. [...]
-+ [...] I fail to see how enough money could be diverted away from
-+ public scrutiny (taken off the books so to speak) and placed into the "care"
-+ of the "Uniforms".
Its called the "Black Budget". It is reserved for military items that
are so "classified" that even most of the Congress does not know what
the money is spent on. (By contrast, the stealth bomber was known in
Congress and the developmental funding was approved). The black budget
grew tremendously under Reagan (to a trillion dollars? perhaps it was A
billion, but the sum is enourmous) and hasn't been cut under Bush as far
as I know. I'd like to see an analysis of black budget contents and a
comparison of estimated costs for a program similar to what Lazar asserts
is happening at Area 51.
------
Mentioned by Hastings in his talk were stories of "alien treaties" and
technology pacts between the USA and the aliens. According to Hastings,
these reports have been traced down to "disinformation agents" -- people
that have been responsible for dissemminating UFO disinformation in
the past, possibly with some government connection (I can't remember the
details). Has this been discussed on this list? It sounds similar to
some of the things being talked about by Lazar, but different enough
that I think I'm confusing two different events.
-- Rich
Rich Thomson thomson@cs.utah.edu {bellcore,hplabs,uunet}!utah-cs!thomson
"Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered; yet we have this consolation with
us, that the harder the conflict, the more glorious the triumph. What we obtain
too cheap, we esteem too lightly." Thomas Paine, _The Crisis_, Dec. 23rd, 1776
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From: paranet!f1.n304.z1.FIDONET.ORG!Jim.Delton
Subject: Re: Klass *has* visited UFO sites!
Date: 14 Dec 89 22:40:00 GMT
In some way the debunkers have it easier true, but they are also
swimming upstream against all those who simply "want to believe" and
who refuse to consider the evidence that doesn't support the ETH. The
pro-ufo camp has merely to whisper "gvt coverup" and many simply accept
that view as a proven fact while the debunkers have to provide minute
details to try and rebutt such allegations.
--
Jim Delton - via FidoNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Jim.Delton@f1.n304.z1.FIDONET.ORG
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From: paranet!f22.n30163.z1.FIDONET.ORG!Don.Ecker
Subject: CUFORN NEWSLETTER
Date: 15 Dec 89 06:41:00 GMT
Usually I will not jump into the echo unless I have something to
report, or someone addresses a message to me. I also as a rule
refuse to jump into the various "pissing contests" that infest
the National UFO Echo. To me, this shows a rampant immaturity
on the part of the participants, on top of the fact that nothing
is every accomplished except to show the reading public whom the
jackasses are. To paraphrase a famous quote taken from some
historical figure that presently escapes me, he said that it is
much better to keep your mouth shut and people will only be able
to guess how stupid you are, than to open it and prove to them
how stupid you are. This sadly is a lesson that has escaped
many a man and women, and I am sure that you all know someone
that has proven the above homily.
I recently wrote a message in reference to an editorial that the
editor of the MUFON Journel wrote in reference to my appearence
on a CNN news show, where I attributed a quote to a famous
historical figure in connection to the UFO question. As is now
much more widely known, the above mentioned editor did not do
his homework and showed the international UFO Community that he
failed to check his facts. This diatribe is leading somewhere
so please hang in for a moment.
If I write something for national print, or if I am on the tv or
radio, you may make damn sure that if I say something, then I
know it to be fact. Not conjecture, nor a guess, but fact.
Like in the recent issue of UFO Magazine Volume 4 Number 3 with
my story in reference to mutilations involving human beings. As
anyone knows that read my first report < hummut.txt > I
documented the research that I had conducted to that point, and
other than the news story I have not put anything else in print.
The reason? Because I have not been able to document enough to
put it to the research community. However, in the news story I
referenced some information from a New York researcher, Mr.
William Knell, a well known UFO researcher that has been in the
field for over 20 years. During Knells research he has
documented a great number of missing kids in his area, and the
information has come through various police contacts that Knell
has. Now you may ask just what am I getting at? OK, fair
question. Here we go.
I just finished reading the latest issue of the CUFORN BULLETIN
published by the Canadian UFO Research Network. This is an
organization Co-Directed by amoung others, Larry Fenwick, and
Harry Tokarz. This amateurishly and overpriced newsletter is
written for the most part by Tom Mickus, a former ParaNet Sysop
that quit the ParaNet Group after some infighting, and he has
started his own UFO computer service, UFONet. For quite some
time Tom has harbored a ill-concealed grudge with ParaNet, and I
am sure he will deny it. However, to make sure he sees this
message, I am going to send it to the ET echo, as I know he has
a feed from it. I want Tom to see this, because it is time that
someone confronts him and the way he conducts business. Tom is
one of the battling particpants on the national UFO echo, and as
I once told him, this activity does nothing but damage the
field.
You see, in the CUFORN NEWSLETTER Mickus defended the recent
admissions by Wm Moore, which of course he can do. But wait,
there is more. I quote: "HE ( MOORE ) IS A REMARKABLE
INDIVIDUAL, AND ONE WHOM WE SHOULDN'T IGNORE. HE HAS MADE MORE
PROGRESS IN THIS FIELD THAN MOST OF HIS DETRACTORS COMBINED.
SURE, HIS CARDS AREN'T ALL ON THE TABLE JUST YET, BUT HE IS
GETTING CLOSER TO THE TRUTH ALL THE TIME. TOWARDS THIS END,
BILL MOORE DESERVES OUR SUPPORT, BUT THIS , OF COURSE IS MY OWN
HUMBLE OPINION, AND ONE WHICH I REALIZE IS NOT WIDELY APPLAUDED,
* * * "
Yep, Tom is right, not too many applauded Moores speech when the
implications of what he admitted to were realized. Illegal
breakins on Benewitz, Moore acting as an agent of Military
Intelligence, an agent that was taking Benewitz's friendship,
while he reported back to MI on how their efforts were as far as
Benewitz's deterioration went. But then, I would think that
this type of activity would not bother Mickus, after all, while
he was a ParaNet Sysop, he admitted to Mike Corbin that he used
to tape record Corbin, AFTER CORBIN CAUGHT HIM IN THE ACT, and
would play the tape back to other people that Mike and Mickus
had discussed. Ask Mike, he can give the details. By
implication, I can only suppose that Corbin was not the only one
recorded without their consent, but I do not know this for a
fact.
I realize that this message will not win any friends, but
dammit, I am tired of this infighting and backbiting. Nothing
is accomplished but BS while this proceeds.
Now to get back to the CUFORN letter, Mickus remarked on Whitley
Striebers tirade at the OMEGA Conference. Part of Striebers
temper tantrum was directed at journelists in general because
his flick was bombing, and part at UFO Magazine for some bad
reviews that Whitley got. Then Strieber ranted about MY news
story in reference to the mutilations. Well sorry 'bout that
Whitley, after over ten years as a cop, I know facts and reports
when I see it. For any of you that may be interested, I have a
dozen cases of mutilations involving humans on file. NOW, IF
MICKUS HAD CHECKED MY INFORMATION, I WOULD HAVE BEEN HAPPY TO
GIVE HIM THE FACTS. However, as in the past, Tom found it more
convienent to just go ahead and slam dunk, instead of checking.
As he stated in his newsletter: "IF I REMEMBERR CORRECTLY, THE
WESTCHESTER REMARK WAS REPEATED IN AN ARTICLE BY DON ECKER WITH
REGARD TO HUMAN MUTILATIONS AT THE HANDS OF ALIENS, A SUBJECT
DISCREDITED BY MOST SERIOUS UFO RESEARCHERS."
The problem with responsible journelism, is to get the facts
correct. In this case as in many of Toms other messages that
infest the computer networks, he did not get his facts straight,
or just didn't care enough to take the time. I suppose he thinks
it is easier to just slam ahead, damn the torpeados. Well Tom,
maybe you better read my texts again, I never once said that
these things were caused by UFOs, but the wounds were VERY
similar, and the deaths took place in areas with wide UFO
activity. But wait, as Mickus said approx. a week ago to
another user on the UFO echo, he is not a UFOlogist or
researcher, he is just an observer. . . . Okay Tom, then get
out of the way and let us get back to work. I mentioned to Tom
several months ago in a message where he was spreading rumors
about another UFOlogist, that if you can't help solve the
problem, why contribute to it? I fully expect a nasty little
note in the next few days, but in the mean time think about
this, I don't state it unless I can prove it.
--
Don Ecker - via FidoNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Don.Ecker@f22.n30163.z1.FIDONET.ORG
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From: paranet!f18.n30163.z1.FIDONET.ORG!Mac.Druaidh
Subject: Re: The Closest Encounter
Date: 13 Dec 89 17:24:00 GMT
BS} There appears to be a connection, almost as if people are
BS} seeing things that may relate to their own "fears" or
BS} "expectations." Almost as if the things they "see" are
BS} designed just for them.
Naturally. The mind does major filtering of the raw senses before the brain
gets to play with the data; something inexplicible will be shunted into an
understandable form, whether real or imaginary. Brain don't care.
--
Mac Druaidh - via FidoNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Mac.Druaidh@f18.n30163.z1.FIDONET.ORG
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From: paranet!Don.Allen
Subject: Lazar/Area51
Date: 14 Dec 89 06:53:00 GMT
This is a note of THANKS to you for all the work and time you put into
typing and putting online all the Lazar material.
After reading this echo for some weeks now,and reading your last
few posts on the "missing" subjects and the inconsistencies of
the KLAS-TV material..I have a rather obvious question..
Has anyone from Paranet attempted to interview Lazar directly????
Or at least contact him (if possible)?
I do realize that Lazar has probably shunned other interviewers and
is perhaps "drained" from the events of the last few weeks,but (I feel)
this is quite possibly the most significant "lead" we've had in the
last few years. Let's face it..the MJ-12 docs have detoured alot of
time and energy...I see this Lazar interview as more substantive.
(IMHO) I've already "written off" Lear,Cooper and others as agents
of mis-information and (apparently) they've done their job quite well.
It may well be that "uncle sugar" has gotten to KLAS-TV and bullied
them,I don't know.
I'm more * disturbed * by all the implications of this than anything
else..especially when I see a Dr Teller at the most recent Malta
summit.
I'd just hate to see any more data on Lazar/area51 "fizzle out"
and "get buried" by the NSA and their goons.
A question to Robert Klinn: With all of your past political/Govt
experience and your knowledge on how these agencies work,do *you*
see a connection between the happenings in Eastern Europe,the
summit in Malta,the Area51 goings on and Bush's capitulation
to the Chinese??
Maybe I'm paranoid,but I smell a RAT here..
--
Don Allen - via FidoNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Don.Allen@paranet.FIDONET.ORG
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From: Michael.Corbin@f428.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Michael Corbin)
Subject: Information
Date: 15 Dec 89 19:10:56 GMT
The ParaNet digest has grown considerably. I am interested to
see what the opinion is on the Usenet side of things are. We are
considering making this conference available as a backbone echo,
providing that the vote gets approved. I would like a show of
hands as to who would favor this or oppose this. I am also
interested in seeing if anyone out there has experience with
this type of thing and would know the procedure for accomplishing
this.
Please reply to the address listed below and not in the digest
itself.
Thanks,
Michael Corbin
mcorbin@paranet.fidonet.org
mcorbin@scicom.alphacdc.com
--
Michael Corbin - via FidoNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Michael.Corbin@f428.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG
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******************The**End**of**Info-ParaNet**Newsletter************************
