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The Charlatans Digest Volume 02 Issue 10
The Charlatans Digest Tue May 14, 1996 Volume 2 : Issue 10
There are 46 messages totalling 1179 lines in this issue.
Topics of the day:
1. Jon Brookes (5)
2. be my sally cinnamon (2)
3. Do you want to get off this list? (4)
4. iNFORMED CHAT
5. RTFM.
6. Stop talking out yer ars.....
7. Inspiral Carpets.
8. Mailinglist
9. Goodies For Trade
10. Ispirals & Tim Burgess' fav football team!
11. Footy (6)
12. New single? (8)
13. A little encouragement ...
14. (Fwd) A Very Serious Message . . . (fwd) (11)
15. A pilgrimage!! (2)
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sat, 27 Apr 1996 06:36:50 -0400
From: HEISEI6692@aol.com
Subject: Re: Jon Brookes
The Charlies use a drum machine? I fookin hope not. That'd be too Nine inch
fer me. Jon's a fookin brilliant drummer, so why use that shite?
--------------------------
Date: Sat, 27 Apr 1996 09:46:35 -0500 (CDT)
From: The Swede <mode1@csd.uwm.edu>
Subject: Re: Jon Brookes
I don't know about opportunity, but my guess would be machine.
A related question: I was just listening to hot licks and thinking about
when I saw the band an the 10th and 11th tour, and it really sounds like
there is a drum machine in there on a lot of the songs...not doing 'big
stuff' like kick drum and snare, but just little percussive noises.
Can anyone varify this?
When I saw them in Chicago for the last album, it didn't sound like they
had a machine...which would make sense considering the newer material...
-john
-----------------------------
Date: Sat, 27 Apr 1996 12:35:35 -0400 (EDT)
From: Deborah <ae94af@badger.ac.BrockU.CA>
Subject: Re: Jon Brookes
> A related question: I was just listening to hot licks and thinking about
> when I saw the band an the 10th and 11th tour, and it really sounds like
> there is a drum machine in there on a lot of the songs...not doing 'big
> stuff' like kick drum and snare, but just little percussive noises.
>
> Can anyone varify this?
as far as i can remember, going back that far, there was not a drum
machine on the between 10th and 11th tour. they played toronto, and
area, twice for that show and i thought it was all played live by jon
brookes. although, you are right that with the show for the last album
there was no drum machine. that i know for a fact.
on a somewhat realated note, for the most recent show someone phoned in
the local radio show to ask rob collins why he didn't do that much
playing on the new album? let's just say rob collins was a little less
than impressed saying what an idiot he though the person phoning was.
well, not on air of course!
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 27 Apr 1996 12:33:26 -0400
From: Martin Lacasse <martin@cs.mcgill.ca>
Subject: RE: Jon Brookes
> The Charlies use a drum machine? I fookin hope not. That'd be too Nine
> inch fer me. Jon's a fookin brilliant drummer, so why use that shite?
Actually I remember reading an interview with Tim, and he said he loves
the combination of both. Drums & Drum machine... I think there is
quite a bit of drum machines on some friendly and Between 10th and 11th.
But also a few songs they use extensive echo boxes on the drums, which
make them sound drum machine like, ie. Weirdo...
Like Tim said, it gives the song a more dance feel. I agree... Girls &
Boys from Blur is not as good live, cause they use the drums...
-----------------------------
Date: Sun, 28 Apr 1996 00:25:35 EDT
From: BJWP28A@prodigy.com (MR MARK PARK)
Subject: be my sally cinnamon
when i am sad and weary
when all my hopes are gone
i walk around my house and think of you with nothing on...
--------------------------
Date: Sun, 28 Apr 1996 05:29:05 -0400
From: HEISEI6692@aol.com
Subject: Re: be my sally cinnamon
okay let's keep the tones to the tones list. Although it was a great line.
:D I'm glad you feel that way about me. :D
Cheers
Trav
---------------------------
Date: Mon, 29 Apr 1996 09:26:54 +0100
From: Tobermory <H.A.Price@sheffield.ac.uk>
Subject: RE: Jon Brookes
I reckon you must be talking about the end of Noone not even the
rain, which they use a drum machine for in the last minute or so, and
it's also on the end of Between 10th and 11th. As far as the rest of
the album goes, they used a lot of extra percussion anyway, because
it was the Height of Baggy, but I don't think any extensive use of a
drum machine INSTEAD of Jon was used.
"Another happy lad, with dirty pictures plastered on the wall."
Tob
---------------------------
Date: Mon, 29 Apr 1996 11:11:30 +0100
From: jpt5@aber.ac.uk (JIM THOMPSON)
Subject: Re: Do you want to get off this list?
>Just an Idea,
> Lets make a list of everyone who wants to get off this list, then
>whenever we think the list is complete, i can give the list to a comsci
>who will put it on a machine so that it send the mail to Whoever
>maintains this list, every 30 minutes until the machine is shut down :)
>
>If you know the maintainers name and Email, mail it with subject MAINTAINER
>
>Add your name to this, then reply it to the list.
>
> List:
>
>Richard Hewes, rmh105@york.ac.uk
>Colin Rattray, 9504525r@student.gla.ac.uk
Jim Thompson, jpt5@aber.ac,uk
Cheers, Jim.
----------------------------
Date: Mon, 29 Apr 1996 13:54:48 GMT0BST
From: "ringo" <S.D.Jobling@newcastle.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: iNFORMED CHAT
>> mani is not a man u fan - he simply has bit of regional pride thats
>> all, cos if you've got none of that, well...................
>
> I THINK YOU WILL FIND THAT MANI IS ACTUALLY
> A MAN UTD FAN , IF YOU HAVE READ ANY REPORTS
> AT ALL ABOUT THE ROSES YOU SHOULD KNOW
> THAT MANI WENT TO THE CUP WINNERS CUP
> TO SUPPORT UTD , A FEW YEARS BACK, HE ALSO
> GOES FREQUENTLY TO GOLD TRAFFORD , AND WAS
> SEEN OUT CELEBRATING THE LEAGUE TITLE IN
> A MANCHESTER PUB A COUPLE OF YEARS BACK.
because he has regional pride you see, if you read the article about
the roses from q magazine when they were in stockholm in 1990 ( i
think ) he's runnin about like a loony cos man u won, and when
everyone reminds him that he's a city fan, he goes off on atangent
concerning regional pride and that, i think........
----------------------------
Date: Mon, 29 Apr 1996 15:07:48 +0200 (MET DST)
From: Christian Andersson <it95cha@Minsk.DoCS.UU.SE>
Subject: Re: RTFM.
Please get me off the list!!!
it95cha@minsk.docs.uu.se
Thanx!!!
--------------------------
Date: Mon, 29 Apr 1996 15:29:30 +0200 (MET DST)
From: Christian Andersson <it95cha@Minsk.DoCS.UU.SE>
Subject: Re: Do you want to get off this list?
On Mon, 29 Apr 1996, JIM THOMPSON wrote:
>>Just an Idea,
>> Lets make a list of everyone who wants to get off this list, then
>>whenever we think the list is complete, i can give the list to a comsci
>>who will put it on a machine so that it send the mail to Whoever
>>maintains this list, every 30 minutes until the machine is shut down :)
>>
>>If you know the maintainers name and Email, mail it with subject MAINTAINER
>>
>>Add your name to this, then reply it to the list.
>>
>> List:
>>
>>Richard Hewes, rmh105@york.ac.uk
>>Colin Rattray, 9504525r@student.gla.ac.uk
>>Jim Thompson, jpt5@aber.ac,uk
Christian Andersson it95cha@minsk.docs.uu
-----------------------------
Date: Mon, 29 Apr 96 15:30:16 BST
From: MD Bridger <M.D.Bridger-95@lboro.ac.uk>
Subject: Stop talking out yer ars.....
Dear People,
None of the Stone Roses are footie fans, well not proper footie fans anyhow.
Do you wanna know how I know how, well it goes a little something like this...
There was that mix up in Wales where Ian Brown put on a Fottie shirt, Cardiff
I thinks and there was a near riot between the Cardiff and Swansea supporters
at their gig.
It is thus clear that they not very little about football.
Thank you ,Keith.
----------------------------
Date: Mon, 29 Apr 1996 13:36:15 +0100
From: spritch2@glam.ac.uk (RICHARD HELL)
Subject: Re: Do you want to get off this list?
I want to get off this list, it's crap.
-----------------------------
Date: Mon, 29 Apr 1996 17:16:17 BST
From: CHRISTIAN HORSFIELD <S.Taylor@uea.ac.uk>
Subject: Do you want to get off this list?
>>Just an Idea,
>> Lets make a list of everyone who wants to get off this list, then
>>whenever we think the list is complete, i can give the list to a comsci
>>who will put it on a machine so that it send the mail to Whoever
>>maintains this list, every 30 minutes until the machine is shut down :)
>>
>>If you know the maintainers name and Email, mail it with subject MAINTAINER
>>
>>Add your name to this, then reply it to the list.
>>
>> List:
>>
>>Richard Hewes, rmh105@york.ac.uk
>>Colin Rattray, 9504525r@student.gla.ac.uk
>>Jim Thompson, jpt5@aber.ac,uk
>Christian Andersson it95cha@minsk.docs.uu
Sam Taylor s.taylor@uea.ac.uk
-----------------------------
Date: Mon, 29 Apr 1996 18:21:14 PDT
From: Robert Harrison <j9564871@wlv.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Inspiral Carpets.
On Thu, 25 Apr 1996 03:45:29 -0500 shane brown wrote:
> >>But will anyone admit to liking Northside, or
> >>even Flowered Up?
>
> Hey, I still throw "Weekender" in every so often. There's still a fond
> place in my heart for Flowered Up. Northside is another matter, though...
> Just to throw a few other old school names into the midst, what about The
> High? The New FADS (who I still LOVE and will proudly admit)? The Wendys
> (crap album but Pulling My Fingers Off is an ace song)? Wonder what that
> guy who used to dress up as a daisy for Flowered Up is doing these days?
> Probably hanging out with Bez, Cressa, and Jon Beast...
My word, someone else who appreciates the 1990's bands like Flowered up,
New fads, Curve, Carter Usm ( when they used to be good ), Cud, James in
their hay day and other such bands, but what are most of them doing now.
They have either split up ( Curve ) or gone very crap and commercial
( Carter ) but I belive that the years of 1990, 1991 and 1992 where the
best Indie years and this brit pop scene is absolutley crap in comparison.
I mean bands like the charlies started up, the carpets, happy mondays
where going strong and music was good and original unlike today's
efforts ( Oasis )
Rob
Madchester RAVE ON !!!
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 2 May 1996 19:45:54 +0200 (MET DST)
From: root <root@stud2.misjonshs.no>
Subject: Mailinglist
Due to hardware & software upgrade, the list has NOT been working this
past week..
All of you who have tried to get off the list during this period, please
try again before you start to spam the mailinglist with stupid 'get me
off' messages.
For those of you who don't remember how to get off the list, take a look
at this:
http://www2.misjonshs.no/~eirikg/109/rtfm.html
---------------------------
Date: Thu, 02 May 1996 21:57:49 -0400
From: Chris Steinmetz <cstein@sava.gulfnet.com>
Subject: Goodies For Trade
OK Folks -
I recently picked up some primo Charlies' rare stuff, and I am offering
these items for TRADE ONLY:
1. Diversions - LP - Mint/Never Played Promo Live LP on Dead Dead
Good from 26.4.90
2. Indian Rope - 12" - UK Issue on Dead Dead Good - Mint / Never
Played
3. Hot Licks - CD - Live from Between 10th & 11th tour
These are tough items that are next to impossible to find, and you
wonder why I am offering them up for trade? I am a Charlies' collector,
but I am a bigger Roses collector! For the right Roses' item(s), I may
swap. I am looking for a So Young / Tell Me 12" by the Stone Roses on
Thin Line Records. Find it and I'll swap you the lot!
Finally, I am not on the Charlies' list because of all the mess that
went down a while back, so if you folks (and I guess this is more
directed to UK folks, but all replies are welcome) have some rare Roses
vinyl, Boot CDs, posters, etc., e-mail me at cstein@sava.gulfnet.com,
and we will deal. Travis, feel free to contact me as I lost yer address
in a power failure.
Peace, Chris
----------------------------
Date: Sun, 5 May 1996 14:07:42 +0700
From: wolsmr@hg.uleth.ca (Merrilee Wolsey)
Subject: Re: Ispirals & Tim Burgess' fav football team!
>I like their music. Especially the albums 'life' and 'Revenge Of The GoldFish'.
>I didn't like their last album too much though except from three songs. But,
>Rob Collins and other band members, they know the guys and say that they are
>fake and stupid and so on. I've heard that from Noel Gallagher's mouth as
>well, and those things I can believe.
But then again, Noel has an ego bigger than Brazil and he slags anyone off
he can get the chance.
----------------------------
Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 14:27:52 +0100
From: nay01@students.stir.ac.uk (nils young)
Subject: Re: Footy
hello, good to see another person sharing my two passions in life - the
charlatans and Arsenal. we're all going on a european tour. keep up the
good work.
-------------------------
Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 20:13:45 +0100 (BST)
From: "H.Ismail" <hi195@soton.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Footy
Dear Nils!!
Send me your email address and we can discuss the Charlatans and Arsenal to our
hearts' content without annoying everyone else! It's cool to see the Scum
languishing in 8th place isn't it!!
My address is:
hi195@soton.ac.uk
Han
P.S. Sorry everyone else!
--------------------------------
Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 11:27:23 BST
From: CHRISTIAN HORSFIELD <S.Taylor@uea.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Footy
FUCK OFF YOU NON-FOOTY SUPPORTING TWAT
On Tue, 7 May 1996 20:13:45 +0100 (BST) H.Ismail wrote:
> From: H.Ismail <hi195@soton.ac.uk>
> Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 20:13:45 +0100 (BST)
> Subject: Re: Footy
> To: charlatans@stud2.misjonshs.no
>
> Dear Nils!!
> Send me your email address and we can discuss the Charlatans and Arsenal to
> our hearts' content without annoying everyone else! It's cool to see the Scum
> languishing in 8th place isn't it!!
> My address is:
>
> hi195@soton.ac.uk
>
> Han
>
> P.S. Sorry everyone else!
-------------------------------
Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 13:09:17 +0100 (BST)
From: "T.E. McGrath" <tem2@leicester.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Footy
> FUCK OFF YOU NON-FOOTY SUPPORTING TWAT
bleedin ell don't wet yerself................
-------------------------------
Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 18:16:58 BST
From: CHRISTIAN HORSFIELD <S.Taylor@uea.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Footy
Sorry mate. I got a bit carried away there. It's hard to lose out on
Europe cos of two goals.
-----------------------------
Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 23:28:00 +0100 (BST)
From: "H.Ismail" <hi195@soton.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Footy
Dear Christian!
Thanks for the apology. I'm sorry I slagged your team but I've been a red and
white North Londoner forever and have been indoctrinated in Spurs hatred. It's
as natural as breathing.
Han
P.S. Does anyone know about the new Charlies single? I heard the end of it and
am dying to know more!
----------------------------
Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 01:21:52 -0400
From: HEISEI6692@aol.com
Subject: New single?
> Does anyone know about the new Charlies single? I heard the end of it and
> am dying to know more!
what new single?
---------------------------
Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 13:43:18 +0100
From: ????@students.stir.ac.uk (nils young)
Subject: Re: New single?
>Does anyone know about the new Charlies single? I heard the end of it and
>am dying to know more!
>
>what new single?
yeah what new single?
-----------------------------
Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 09:54:09 -0400 (EDT)
From: bluetonic <kgreen@dcs.uga.edu>
Subject: Re: New single?
what new single?
laterz,
kevin
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 13:29:42 -0400
From: kangela@DAX.CC.UAKRON.EDU (thymiane)
Subject: Re: New single?
>what new single?
>
>laterz,
>kevin
>
>i think it's an american cheese single.
plastic wrapped for your convenience.
bye,
angela
kangela@uakron.edu
-----------------------------
Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 10:41:55 +0930 (GMT+0930)
From: "P.D" <9408427b@ntx.City.UniSA.edu.au>
Subject: Re: New single?
Maybe he/she means 'time for livin', time for givin''
PD
-----------------------------
Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 20:51:07 -0500 (CDT)
From: jasper@inlink.com (SmilingJudy)
Subject: Re: New single?
i don't know anything about this new single either, but seeing how the
charlies and the chemical brothers are so closely related.......anyone else
see the microsoft commercial with 'life is sweet'?
:)
------------------------
Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 10:27:16 BST
From: The Soul Saver <MBCX5RMC@mh2.mcc.ac.uk>
Subject: A little encouragement ...
---------------------------I-WILL-REVISE!!!!----------------------------------
At first I was afraid, I was petrified!
Kept thinking I could never pass with no revision guide,
But then I spent so many nights, getting all the questions wrong, And I
grew strong,
And I learned I could scrape along,
I won't look back, to any place,
When I can swallow 15 cans and get completely off my face, I would have
revised by the clock,
I would have had no spare time free,
If I'd thought for just one second my exams would bother me,
So all my notes, are on the floor,
Don't even matter... that there's no rock night anymore... Weren't you the
one who tried to get me to revise?
You think I'd crumble? You think I'd work towards the skies?
Oh no, not I!
I won't revise!
Unless I die of beer stains, I know I'll stay alive, Though my money's at
an end,
I've my overdraft to spend,
I won't revise,
I won't revise!!
It took all the strength I had, not to act the part,
But in the end my real revision didn't even start.
I used to sit at home at night, feeling guilty to myself, I used to try,
but now I hold my head up high,
And you see me! Somebody new!
I'm not that mixed up wierd bloke who wants a good 2:2
So if you feel like dropping in, chances are that I'll be free, Coz I've
done sod all revision, and I'm failing my degree,
Oh no, not I!
I won't revise,
I think that I may scrape a third, but I could be telling lies! Let the
lecturers all storm,
My bed's far too nice and warm,
I won't revise,
I won't revise,
oh dear!!
'He who laughs last ...
... is a bit slow'
Quote courtesy of The Ant Man.
mbcx5rmc@stud.man.ac.uk Tel:(0161) 224 7982
Ha ha!
---------------------------
Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 10:34:29 BST
From: The Soul Saver <MBCX5RMC@mh2.mcc.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: New single?
Speaking of things Chemical ... did you know that the 'bros sent a
track to Noel Gallager, and noel has provided a vocal track and a bit
of acoustic guitar. It seems this will be released when the record
companies have cleared it.
This track was premiered, minus Noel's contribution, at a recent
Chemical Brothers one off gig at Sankey's Soap here in Manchester.
-----------------------------
Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 12:23:45 PDT
From: Simon Amor <j9556622@wlv.ac.uk>
Subject: (Fwd) A Very Serious Message . . . (fwd)
Forwarded Message:
From: Maff <mie100@unix.york.ac.uk>
Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 23:22:32 BST
Subject: (Fwd) A Very Serious Message . . . (fwd)
* To: Simon Amor <j9556622@wlv.ac.uk>,
suzanne blackburn <s.m.blackburn@mcs.salford.ac.uk>,
Tanya <tlj.a@mailgate.cardinalnewman.ac.uk>,
vicki telfer <c9556016@wlv.ac.uk>, jason newman <jpn5@aberystwyth.ac.uk>,
Jeanette <j.m.asquith@exeter.ac.uk>, Judith tyson <j.e.tyson@hull.ac.uk>,
katherine roo <kar101@unix.york.ac.uk>,
domanic anderson <ida101@unix.york.ac.uk>,
Annie <AM_Vanaskie@acad.fandm.edu>, craig mars <cam103@unix.york.ac.uk>
Forwarded Message:
From: Lickle Fluffy Animal <hmw101@unix.york.ac.uk>
Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 09:27:18 BST
Subject: (Fwd) A Very Serious Message . . . (fwd)
* To: Aidan Jones <pt0u5042@liverpool.ac.uk>,
"Andrew J. Kitchen" <A.J.Kitchen@sms.ed.ac.uk>,
Andy Coupe <A.R.COUPE@ncl.ac.uk>, Anna Rogerson <alr103@unix.york.ac.uk>,
Aron <A.P.STUBBINS@ncl.ac.uk>,
Chris Stockdale <lwa95cjs@sheffield.ac.uk>,
Claire Downey <cjd102@unix.york.ac.uk>,
Claire Taylor <9539057@sms.ed.ac.uk>,
Claire Vogeli <eng5cev@leeds.ac.uk>, Dusch <9256405@sms.ed.ac.uk>,
Grace Lawrence <ghl100@unix.york.ac.uk>,
Greg B-M <gpbm100@unix.york.ac.uk>,
"Heather D. Barnes" <hdb03@whale.students.stir.ac.uk>,
James Morphet <ha5jmo@orac.sunderland.ac.uk>,
"Joe A. Gaunt" <jag101@unix.york.ac.uk>,
John Bradbury <J.P.Bradbury@sms.ed.ac.uk>,
Jonathan Pilkington <95986936@mmu.ac.uk>,
Karen Pidd <cbs5kep@leeds.ac.uk>,
Kirsty Rhodes <kalr100@unix.york.ac.uk>,
"Mark G. Day" <mgd565@novell3.bham.ac.uk>,
Natasha Rollins <nar101@unix.york.ac.uk>,
Nigel Artis <ugm5nja@leeds.ac.uk>, Norm <ndn1@ukc.ac.uk>,
Paul Mason <pgm103@unix.york.ac.uk>, Peter Howe <prh100@unix.york.ac.uk>,
Phil Coates <P.J.Coates@durham.ac.uk>, Phoebe Clapham <pec21@cam.ac.uk>,
Raf <C9251094@hud.ac.uk>, Rich Spencer <RJS541@novell3.bham.ac.uk>,
Richard Johnstone <rdj104@unix.york.ac.uk>,
Rob Grundy <radg100@unix.york.ac.uk>, Rob Strange <enprs@bath.ac.uk>,
Sally Springett <sjs103@unix.york.ac.uk>,
Sam Al-Hamdani <sah104@unix.york.ac.uk>, Sam Jordison <sdj20@cam.ac.uk>,
Sarah Legon <S.A.Legon@durham.ac.uk>, Sex God? <mie100@unix.york.ac.uk>,
Sexier God <cbs5bo@leeds.ac.uk>, Tim Peugniez <tjp102@unix.york.ac.uk>,
Tristan <tfk100@unix.york.ac.uk>, Vicky Clark <vjc101@unix.york.ac.uk>,
William Damerell <wnd100@unix.york.ac.uk>
Please can everyone who receives this take it VERY seriously and respond accordingly.
Thanks
>TAKE TIME TO READ...
>
mm>--------- FORWARDED MESSAGE --------
>>Hey everyone...Please just take two minutes of your time to read this
>>thing...
>> THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT SO DON'T DELETE, just read and vote NO..
>> AND, pass it on...
>>
>> A group of neo-Nazis are trying to form a newsgroup on Usenet
>>called "rec.music.white-power", so that they can get their message of
>>hate out to young people using the Internet. Newsgroups are public
>>discussions on the Internet and their formation requires enough support
>>from the Internet community.
>> EACH AND EVERY ONE OF YOU HAS ONE VOTE when it comes to creating
>>a new Usenet group. I hope you will vote NO and thereby tell these Nazis
>>we don't want their stuff on the net. Below is the procedure; please
>>repost my plea and get the NO vote out. This is my personal opinion. If
>>you want to see the official call for votes, you can read news.group.
>> DO NOT VOTE TWICE - that would constitute voting fraud.
>>
>> HOW TO VOTE:
>>
>> Send e-mail (posts to newsgroups are invalid) to:
>>
>> music-vote@sub-rosa.com
>>
>> This is an impartial, third party vote taker.
>> Please check the address before you mail your vote. Your mail
>>message should contain only one statement:
>>
>> I vote NO on rec.music.white-power
>>
>> Vote counting is automated. Failure to follow these directions
>>may mean that your vote does not get counted. If you do not receive an
>>acknowledgment of your vote within three days contact the votetaker about
>>the problem. It's your responsibility to make sure your vote is
>>registered correctly.
>
>> Here's what Canada's George Burdi, of the neo-Nazi Heritage
>>Front, had to say about this vote, on February 21, on his RESISTANCE
>>mailing list:
>>
>> "There is a call for votes coming on rec.music.white-power
>> in the next week or so, and you will be notified in a special
>> issue of RREN exactly what to do. FOLLOW THE INSTRUCTIONS
>> TO THE LETTER. Let me be perfectly blunt and state that we
>> have more than enough net-nazis to win this thing hands-down.\
>> But every one of you must vote YES! And just voting
>> yes means nothing unless you do it properly. So you have
>> been forewarned. The instructions are coming to your email
>> box soon, and they are not complicated. Just follow them
>> as told, and we will have a WP music newsgroup finally!"
>>
>>If Mr. Burdi's confidence disturbs you, please give this letter the
>widest possible distribution, and help us deliver the largest NO vote
>>in the history of the UseNet."
>
>
>
>
>...Fred.....
>Email:een3fk@electeng.leeds.ac.uk
> (@ @)
> !
> ~~~
> U
>
>
>
---------------------------------------------------
Jason Nuwa DUNGU [Undergraduate 95] (j.dungu@ic.ac.uk)
St.Mary's Hospital Medical School, Imperial College
Norfolk Place, LONDON W2 1PG
---------------------------------------------------
---------------------------------
Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 12:25:36 +0100 (BST)
From: "H.Ismail" <hi195@soton.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: New single?
Everyone calm down!! I mentioned the idea of a new single because a few weeks
ago I walked into HMV and heard them announcing over the radio that the Charlies
had a new single planned. I'm as keen to find out what's going on as you are!
Sorry to cause a mass panic!
Han
P.S. I'm a SHE!!!
--------------------------------
Date: Sat, 11 May 1996 06:04:39 -0400
From: HEISEI6692@aol.com
Subject: Re: (Fwd) A Very Serious Message . . . (fwd)
We had this same discussion on another list I was on. I personally am not a
racist. But by taking this news group away from these "people" isn't that
violating their right to freedom of speech? Which, no matter how stupid it
is, is a basic human right. I don't agree with what these "people" have to
say, but then again they might not agree with me wanting to talk about me
heritage, the Charlies, etc. It's my right to discuss these topics as freely
as I want, as it is theirs. Unfortunately that's the breaks.
Please excuse my babbling, and poor spelling.
Cheers
Travis
Live it like you love it
-----------------------------------
Date: Sat, 11 May 1996 14:12:30 +0100 (BST)
From: "H.Ismail" <hi195@soton.ac.uk>
Subject: A pilgrimage!!
Here's a little story for all of you who care!! When I met the Charlatans for
the second time last October I was just preparing to come to University. When
I was talking to Tim I told him I was going to see them playing here and asked
if they'd ever played in Southampton before. He said they had, at the Joiner's
Arms and just kept saying "It was really funny!" and laughing. I've been dying
to go there ever since I got here and I finally got my chance last night when
I decided to go there for my birthday (19 tomorrow!!) so my friends had no
choice. It was an indie night so it was pretty cool. It is REALLY small which
is why they were there on their first tour.
They've got loads of pictures around the bar of bands who have played there
(including Ride, Lush, Suede and Gene amongst others) so I went in search of the
Charlies. I found one advert of the gig where Tim had really short hair and
looked really different (but nice!!) and then I saw a picture of them on stage!
I'm not surprised Tim said it was so funny when I saw what they were wearing.
Tim had a black leather jacket with what, at first, looked like a long white
skirt on underneath. I stood there in amazement trying to figure out what the
hell it was! I THINK they were trousers but talk about FLARES! For some reason
Martin was wearing exactly the same. I was just laughing. At least my mystery
was solved. If you're ever in the area check it out.
That's all for now.
Han
P.S. My friend requested the Charlatans for me but they never played them. The
closest was the Chemical Brothers which the band came on stage to when I saw
them here in November.
-------------------------------
Date: Sun, 12 May 96 00:14:13 csd
From: Jim.Parks@corp.anixter.com
Subject: Re: (Fwd) A Very Serious Message . . . (fwd)
I think skinheads are..... knuckleheads, but something tells me that
there probably is a black-power group somewhere. I wonder whether the
author of this message is as adamantly against this form of racism
also. I won't vote yes or no for the "white-power" group. What scares
me more than the skinheads is this notion that the internet
"community" (made up of whom?) makes "decisions" concerning freedom of
speech.
Skinheads make me laugh becuase they're dumb. So part of me wants the
group so I can be amused. What the hell does this have_with the
rockin' funky jams the charlatans put out?
--------------------------
Date: Sun, 12 May 1996 04:33:09 -0400
From: derek_f@alcor.concordia.ca (Derek Fong)
Subject: Re: (Fwd) A Very Serious Message . . . (fwd)
Travis,
True, but then again, we get back to the whole notion of who really
controls the Internet. Here in Canada, hate literature is not protected by
freedom of speech. In fact, it's a federal offence to even _possess_ hate
literature. In Germany, it's even more stringent with regard to neo-Nazi
crap. But in America, I guess one could argue the First Amendment.
Anyway, my point is how far do you go to protect free speech? Here on this
mailing list, we're not advocating hatred to anyone or even anything, so
there's no reason to question its existence (rationally). A white power
newsgroup would do just that--spread hatred against segments of the world
population. I think most people are too quick to pull the trigger of
freedom of speech, but are even quicker to neglect the fact that with
rights come responsibilities...
Anyway, I'm babbling and this is off-topic... the Charlies are the
best band in the world!!! I can't wait until their new album comes out. I
just wish Back Room Window were on their latest album instead of Crashin'
In. Not to say Crashin' In ain't a wicked tune, but Back Room Window HAS
to be one of THE best songs they've ever done.
---------------------------
Date: Sun, 12 May 1996 06:16:39 -0400
From: HEISEI6692@aol.com
Subject: Re: (Fwd) A Very Serious Message . . . (fwd)
Derek and all,
Here in Canada, hate literature is not protected by
freedom of speech. In fact, it's a federal offence to even _possess_ hate
literature. In Germany, it's even more stringent with regard to neo-Nazi
crap. But in America, I guess one could argue the First Amendment.
Point taken.
A white power newsgroup would do just that--spread hatred against segments
of the world population.
True, but that's the breaks. They'll still be doing it by some other means.
Maybe, a mailing list under a disguised name? Why not just let them spread
their shit talking to people who are interested in it in an open manner
instead of them becoming subversive about it. I know i wouldn't subscribe to
it, not only because I don't want to hear their bile, but also because it
would clearly state what kind of list it was. I know I'd be a little more
pissed off if I found a list that talked about the great illustrators of our
time, signed on, and was bombarded with letters of hate and ignorance. If
what you say is true about all the illegalities in canada and germany, then
why do people still have this propaganda in their homes? Why do they still
bomb foreign housing? Just because it is illegal doesn't mean that people
will listen or follow that rule. In some states here in America it's illegal
to "commit" oral sex. Are people going to stop, and go this is illegal.
Sorry luv but the law is more important than you? HELL NO.
I'm not slagging you off, although it may seem that way. You're opinion is a
valid one as I feel mine is also. True it's easy to pull the 1st ammendment
bullshit, but I do feel that EVERY HUMAN on the face of this earth has a
right by birth to an opinon, and a right to voice it. No matter how vile or
putrid it is. Now I'm sorry if I started all this non Charlies ramblings, I
would like to end it also. On the other list it got way out of hand. I'm
just hoping it won't do that on this one.
Everyone I will be leaving my e-mail service TOMARROW, but will try and be
back later in the summer. Until my return.
but are even quicker to neglect the fact that with
rights come responsibilities... ALSO VERY TRUE.
Cheers
Travis
Come in 5 different flavors
------------------------------------
Date: Sun, 12 May 1996 16:55:40 +0200
From: Eirik Gudmundsen <eirikg@ifi.uio.no>
Subject: Re: (Fwd) A Very Serious Message . . . (fwd)
Hi all!
I'm sorry to keep this topic on. But since it's quiet around The Charlatans
right now, and this is a very serious subject, I feel I have to say something.
In my opinion, freedom of speach isn't a very good argument for why we
shouldn't vote no the the white power list. I believe in freedom to speach,
but in my terms freedom to speach also means freedom to protest. The freedom
to speach shouldn't make people apathic to what's going around them. Racism
and neo nazism are dangerous and stupid, and should be terminated. It
definetely doesn't amuse me seeing that sorry people are getting to believe
in those ideas. I feel sorry for them, and I also feel sorry for those whom
are violated by it. They don't believe in freedom to speach. They nearly
accept races to exist at all. They think they are fucking better than coloured
because of their own race! This isn't some tea party where people discuss
matters which we don't agree with. They discuss things that totally coolide
with human respect and human accept.
To react and protest means a lot more than just knowing by your self what you
mean. Apathy is the worst thing. We must try to stop nazism and racism, and
letting them spread hatred around the internet. If noone cares, they will go
a step further next time.
VOTE NO FOR GOD'S SAKE!
Sorry! Anyway, I've been listening alot to Up To Our Hips lately, and I'm
amazed how it still give me new experiences. And I must say Easy Life is one
of the best songs they have ever made. I was also wondering if someone has
got a new issue of 109, or if those who sendt irc coupons to the record
store in Northwich have got any answers?
OK!
---------------------------------
Date: Sun, 12 May 96 23:12:39 csd
From: Jim.Parks@corp.anixter.com
Subject: Re[2]: (Fwd) A Very Serious Message . . . (fwd)
Again, I make the point: You say racists and neo-nazis should be
"terminated". Isn't this the language that the nazis used about the
jews (and other groups they did not particularly care for....). If you
want to protest, fine, no argument against that, it is your right
(unless you want to push your right to censor). And I would agree that
neo-nazi activity should be watched if it is endangering the public,
and any criminal act commited by a skinhead/neo-nazis should be
prosecuted to the full extent of the law (1).
Also, I would like to explain why skinheads make me laugh. They
"amuse" me because, being a rational person, I cannot believe that
someone can actually believe that if another person has a different
skin color, they somehow are below "human". I have seen some of their
rantings, and I just can't believe anyone would take what they say
seriously.
I take offense to your implication that somehow because I feel that
skinheads should have the right to say what they want publicly, that
somehow I'm apathetic to race issues. I have friends of many races,
and seen racism first hand, and I hate to inform you that racists will
always exist, because it is inate in humans to find differences about
one another and attempt to use these differences for leverage
socially, economically, etc.... All that we can do as individuals is
treat all human beings with respect, and make sure that persons civil
rights are violated, otherwise, see (1).
It is your "speech" that frightens me more than the skinheads.
Somehow, if speech YOU deem is "hate" speech, it should be "stopped".
Maybe your definition of "hate" speech is different that other
persons. If a fat woman is walking down the street and a teenager
makes a comment, should they be prosecuted? Fat people are humans too,
maybe "hate" speech should apply to them, and the elderly, disabled,
etc...
But then again, maybe you're right, maybe we should terminate speech
rights. To help our cause, maybe we can burn all neo-nazi books we
find repulsive or don't suit our agenda. Going further, maybe we
should build "re-education" camps to put the skinheads in. Better than
that, since the skinheads probably will be resistant to
"re-education", let's build cremetoriums and just dispose of them,
since they offer nothing to society anyway....
Any of this sound familiar.....
---------------------------------
Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 11:21:28 +0200
From: Eirik Gudmundsen <eirikg@ifi.uio.no>
Subject: Re: Re[2]: (Fwd) A Very Serious Message . . . (fwd)
> Again, I make the point: You say racists and neo-nazis should be
> "terminated". Isn't this the language that the nazis used about the
> jews (and other groups they did not particularly care for....).
The nazis wanted to terminate people. I said I wanted to 'terminate' racism and
neonazism (I'm against all kinds of violence, also against racists and neonazis).
Terminating an ideology isn't quite the same as terminating people.
> If you want to protest, fine, no argument against that, it is your right
> (unless you want to push your right to censor). And I would agree that
> neo-nazi activity should be watched if it is endangering the public,
> and any criminal act commited by a skinhead/neo-nazis should be
> prosecuted to the full extent of the law (1).
I don't know what you mean by the full extent of the law, but I'm more concerned
about what makes people think like the nazis. It is often unknowledge and insecurity.
I don't want these people to aggetate eachother until some of them start to violate
other people. I want to stop it before that point, before people get hurt by it and
before these neonazis become real criminal. And I mean protesting against their
idea is a step.
> Also, I would like to explain why skinheads make me laugh......
I'm sorry you felt I was offending you on that one. I can understand why it makes you
laugh. I'm just a bit sensetive on this subject. It rather makes me cry.
> I take offense to your implication that somehow because I feel that
> skinheads should have the right to say what they want publicly, that
> somehow I'm apathetic to race issues. I have friends of many races,
> and seen racism first hand, and I hate to inform you that racists will
> always exist, because it is inate in humans to find differences about
> one another and attempt to use these differences for leverage
> socially, economically, etc.... All that we can do as individuals is
> treat all human beings with respect, and make sure that persons civil
> rights are violated, otherwise, see (1).
Sorry to offend you again. I hate offending people, especially Charlatans fans. But by
my means of 'apathetic', it means taking no action. I understand that you are anti-racist
and that you have taken a stand. I just can't understand why you don't want to fight more
against this, if you've seen so much yourself. I'm not fighting against people, and I don't
want to hurt anyone, especially not physicly, I'm trying to fight against a terrible ideology.
> It is your "speech" that frightens me more than the skinheads.
> Somehow, if speech YOU deem is "hate" speech, it should be "stopped".
> Maybe your definition of "hate" speech is different that other
> persons. If a fat woman is walking down the street and a teenager
> makes a comment, should they be prosecuted? Fat people are humans too,
> maybe "hate" speech should apply to them, and the elderly, disabled,
> etc...
Like I've said before, I hate the ideology, but I don't hate the people. I'm very sad to see
that you're thinking of my "speech" that way. I can't understand why you can't seperate
people from people's ideas. Maybe I used the wrong words, so you maybe misunderstood me. I hope
so, 'cause if my 'speech' still is more frightening than the skinheads, I am becomming
frightened.
Ok, I don't want us to be pissed off and slagging each otheroff. I understand that
I was a bit offending, and I'm very sorry if you and others got offended.
I'm an idealist. My rational views may be pessimistic, but I'd like to believe that it
helps fighting for your ideas, even if the contribution seems worthless. I want to
have peace in this world and between people. So voting no to that list may seem not to
help at all. I believe it will, so again, please vote no!
God, I understand that this babbling maybe should stop on this list. Sorry. I love The
charlatans, I love Some Friendly, I love Between 10th and 11th, I love Up To Our Hips,
and I love The Charlatans. Can't get enough, wont get enough (did that help?).
Cheers, Eirik
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 15:53:48 +0100 (BST)
From: "M.E. Ellis" <mee3@leicester.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: (Fwd) A Very Serious Message . . . (fwd)
Cheers for your messages about racism.good to hear some people care
about what goes on and the plight of others.I for one respect other
peoples views whatever they are but it seems wrong to say this if it
means justifying the maltreatment of others and their persecution.why
can't everyone just love one another ....it may sound cheesy but
then the world would be such a happy place!!!!!.
I love between the 10th and the 11th. can't even be bothered is magic.
hope to hear froma fellow charlatan admirer again soon
****marie***
---------------------------
Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 16:05:05 +0100 (BST)
From: "M.E. Ellis" <mee3@leicester.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: A pilgrimage!!
so impressed by your pilgrimage!!!!!!!I would love to meet the
charlatans.a dream come true.perhaps (and I hope) it will come troe someday.
will definately have to check this place out to see tim in his
flares!!!have to rush off.my fiend and I are having a chrlatans night
tonightuntil the early hours.what could be better?.
lots of love
marie
---------------------------
Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 15:58:57 +0100 (BST)
From: "M.E. Ellis" <mee3@leicester.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: (Fwd) A Very Serious Message . . . (fwd)
Like your views ....I believe in individual freedom,freedom of
expression etc. for who is to say who is right and who is wrong.All
we must do perhaps is prevent an anarchical society from emerging
whereby everyone has the freedom to annihilate everyone else and
things should be cool.
moving swiftly on to the charlatans..a great and worthy topic of
discussion.I love between the 10th and the 11th. can't even be
bothered is my favourite...it's magic.
love
***marie***
-----------------------------
Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 18:35:50 +0200
From: Eirik Gudmundsen <eirikg@ifi.uio.no>
Subject: Re: (Fwd) A Very Serious Message . . . (fwd)
> Cheers for your messages about racism.good to hear some people care
> about what goes on and the plight of others.I for one respect other
> peoples views whatever they are but it seems wrong to say this if it
> means justifying the maltreatment of others and their persecution.why
> can't everyone just love one another ....it may sound cheesy but
> then the world would be such a happy place!!!!!.
> I love between the 10th and the 11th. can't even be bothered is magic.
> hope to hear froma fellow charlatan admirer again soon
> ****marie***
Hi Marie!
Thanks of your mail. I am a bit worried though, since I made this Jim Parks guy
a bit offended. I hate it when we have to argue about things, especially when
me and Jim seem to agree on the main issues. I agree with you, why can't we
all love eachother. It shouldn't be that difficult, should it?
Each time I write something trying to put out a view and I get slagged off, I
remember I shouldn't do that stuff. It's not in me arguing in English.
blahblahblah...
Enough of that. I have to agree that Can't Even Be Bothered is a great song
from that album. I have a special feeling for Between 10th and 11th, because
back then I was waiting for their new album for the first time (I discovered
Some Friendly when it was released), reading interviews and getting big
expectations to their album. It came and I loved it, and when Rob was arrested
i was so afraid they would split, I went to see The Charlatans on their joint
dates with Ride in Brighton (daytripper). I love all the other album as well,
but Between 10th & 11th IS SPECIAL!
I love 'Page One' very much as well. So cool and poppy. Have you ever heard
about the band Poppy Factory? Don't know why cause the connection isn't too
big, but I can recall that Page One mood in Poppy Factory's songs (especially
'Fabulous Beast')
Well, nice to hear from you. I must go no, but hope to hear from you again.
Sorry me babbling in the beginning of this mail.
Ciao, Eirik
----------------------------
End of The Charlatans Digest #2.10
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